Will Michael Sam be the 1st Openly Gay NFL player?

[Pony Boy]

Originally Posted by Kid A

Being the coach/GM who helped break this barrier is going to be a feather in the cap of anyone with an open mind. 30 years from now that person and team will always get credit for helping take down that barrier.

I have a gut feeling that Elway could care less about breaking down that barrier or wearing a feather in his cap.

I promise that I will be the first in line to eat crow if Elway pulls the trigger on Sam. What do you think the odds are of Jerry Jones drafting him? In other words the kid has limited the list of teams that will give him a look.

[BroncoBeavis]

Originally Posted by TheElusiveKyleOrton

Right. The day after it was announced. That's hardly a "season-long" headline. Or do you not understand what "season-long" means?

You can Nostradamus it all you want. Fact of the matter is, people, including the media, will be talking about it all season. Non-sports media already salivating over it is only exhibit A.

[LiberalsRClueless]

I don't see why someone's sexual orientation is such big news.

[TheElusiveKyleOrton]

Originally Posted by BroncoBeavis

You can Nostradamus it all you want. Fact of the matter is, people, including the media, will be talking about it all season. Non-sports media already salivating over it is only exhibit A.

Thing of it is, it's not that big a deal. The reactions from a lot of high profile NFL players tells me that it will be dismissed as a topic rather quickly. Yes, when he's drafted, there will be a story. There will be a story in camp. And if his team makes the Super Bowl, there will be questions at media day. That's what media day is for, to ask stupid questions like "how long have you been a black quarterback, Doug Williams?"

But you're not going to hear about it week in and week out. You can stop clutching your pearls now.

[BroncoBeavis]

Originally Posted by TheElusiveKyleOrton

Thing of it is, it's not that big a deal. The reactions from a lot of high profile NFL players tells me that it will be dismissed as a topic rather quickly. Yes, when he's drafted, there will be a story. There will be a story in camp. And if his team makes the Super Bowl, there will be questions at media day. That's what media day is for, to ask stupid questions like "how long have you been a black quarterback, Doug Williams?"

But you're not going to hear about it week in and week out. You can stop clutching your pearls now.

Good chance he won't start. In which case you probably won't hear about it every game.

And I agree it's not that big a deal. Which is why the need for press announcements is more curious than anything.

From a team perspective, the bigger concern than his actual sexuality is whether you have someone with an oversized craving for media attention.

[Powderaddict]

Originally Posted by Shananahan

I love all the people in here defining normal human behavior by what society accepts and approves of.

I guess you don't know the definition of "normal"

nor·mal
ˈnôrməl/Submit
adjective
1.
conforming to a standard; usual, typical, or expected.
"it's quite normal for puppies to bolt their food"
synonyms: usual, standard, ordinary, customary, conventional, habitual, accustomed, expected, wonted; More
ordinary, average, typical, run-of-the-mill, middle-of-the-road, common, conventional, mainstream, unremarkable, unexceptional, garden-variety, a dime a dozen
antonyms: unusual
(of a person) free from physical or mental disorders.

noun: normal; plural noun: normals
1.
the usual, average, or typical state or condition.

By saying something is not "normal" is not saying that it is right or wrong, it's just by definition not the norm. If a very small percentage of the population acts in a way that the majority does not, it is not "normal", by definition.

It's not a moral judgement word, that would be saying something is "wrong". It's just a comparative word that compares an actions against what people usually do.

[TheElusiveKyleOrton]

Originally Posted by BroncoBeavis

Good chance he won't start. In which case you probably won't hear about it every game.

And I agree it's not that big a deal. Which is why the need for press announcements is more curious than anything.

From a team perspective, the bigger concern than his actual sexuality is whether you have someone with an oversized craving for media attention.

Jackie Robinson, when did you first choose to be a black baseball player?

[BroncoBeavis]

Originally Posted by TheElusiveKyleOrton

Jackie Robinson, when did you first choose to be a black baseball player?

Dumb comparisons are dumb.

When did Travis Henry have his first press conference informing us that he had Hoes in different area codes?

Some things you should just find out about organically (if at all) What color a guy is can't really be considered a private matter.

[swaiy]

I think some of you guys are equating "normal" with "social norm." Its not the same. Especially when you place that in conjunction with a subculture like the NFL.

[TheElusiveKyleOrton]

Originally Posted by BroncoBeavis

Dumb comparisons are dumb.

When did Travis Henry have his first press conference informing us that he had Hoes in different area codes?

Some things you should just find out about organically (if at all) What color a guy is can't really be considered a private matter.

See, and I think getting the cat out of the bag now -- specifically because it hasn't happened before -- goes a long way to combat the bull**** that would otherwise come with such a revelation. See Rhodes, Kerry.

He's a proud, gay man. Yell it at him. Try to insult him with it. He's not going to hide from who he is, and that's important.

Travis Henry is maybe the worst comparison you could make. Talk about a guy who chose his actions.

[SonOfLe-loLang]

Originally Posted by BroncoBeavis

Good chance he won't start. In which case you probably won't hear about it every game.

And I agree it's not that big a deal. Which is why the need for press announcements is more curious than anything.

From a team perspective, the bigger concern than his actual sexuality is whether you have someone with an oversized craving for media attention.

I get the press announcements, because it is a barrier that has to be broken down (because society can suck sometimes), but I really don't think it'll be a distraction. I think the media will be all about it in TC, but as long as players say the right thing (and i think they will), there will be nothing left to talk about and quick. Sam seems like he's been through a hell of a lot in his life and doesn't seem to be doing it for attention.

[BroncoBeavis]

Originally Posted by TheElusiveKyleOrton

See, and I think getting the cat out of the bag now -- specifically because it hasn't happened before -- goes a long way to combat the bull**** that would otherwise come with such a revelation. See Rhodes, Kerry.

He's a proud, gay man. Yell it at him. Try to insult him with it. He's not going to hide from who he is, and that's important.

Travis Henry is maybe the worst comparison you could make. Talk about a guy who chose his actions.

From his own personal perspective, you may be right. It might be what he feels he needs to do. And for him, that's fine.

But if I'm a GM, my guess is I might prefer a guy who answered honestly if asked, but didn't have any appearance of wanting any poster-child status. "Yes, I'm gay. But I consider that a private matter."

[BroncoBeavis]

Originally Posted by SonOfLe-loLang

I get the press announcements, because it is a barrier that has to be broken down (because society can suck sometimes), but I really don't think it'll be a distraction. I think the media will be all about it in TC, but as long as players say the right thing (and i think they will), there will be nothing left to talk about and quick. Sam seems like he's been through a hell of a lot in his life and doesn't seem to be doing it for attention.

Overall I agree with you. But if anything, the press release announcement hints at a situation where a player might be interested in more than just saying the right thing. That may not really be the case, and I hope it is. Unless he goes to Oakland.

[TheElusiveKyleOrton]

Originally Posted by BroncoBeavis

From his own personal perspective, you may be right. It might be what he feels he needs to do. And for him, that's fine.

But if I'm a GM, my guess is I might prefer a guy who answered honestly if asked, but didn't have any appearance of wanting any poster-child status. "Yes, I'm gay. But I consider that a private matter."

I don't see it as him wanting to be a "poster child" for anything. But I also don't think he feels the need to hide who he is or be ashamed of who he is. There's a lot to respect in that, IMO.

Hopefully, anyone else who comes out of the closet will be greeted with a "meh. So?" The kid can play ball; that should be the only consideration.

As for the GM who would rather ask and get the honest answer, first, I'm not sure how you cross that subject without crossing several lines of an employee/employer relationship, and second, if the GM suspects and the player answers "no," is the GM so strong in his suspicion that he thinks the player is lying?

[Kid A]

Originally Posted by Pony Boy

I have a gut feeling that Elway could care less about breaking down that barrier or wearing a feather in his cap.

I promise that I will be the first in line to eat crow if Elway pulls the trigger on Sam. What do you think the odds are of Jerry Jones drafting him? In other words the kid has limited the list of teams that will give him a look.

I'd be surprised if Elway did too. He's active politically for the GOP, which isn't to say he's necessarily anti-gay, but you also don't exactly see too many older Republicans leading the way on gay rights issues either. That's just a fact.

But there are plenty of teams and coaches in more liberal parts of the country. And younger people/players of all political persuasions tend to see this as a non-issue. The Jets, the Seahawks, The 49ers, the Patriots...those are a few that jump to mind as teams that would not surprise me at all.

[BroncoBeavis]

Originally Posted by TheElusiveKyleOrton

I don't see it as him wanting to be a "poster child" for anything. But I also don't think he feels the need to hide who he is or be ashamed of who he is. There's a lot to respect in that, IMO.

Hopefully, anyone else who comes out of the closet will be greeted with a "meh. So?" The kid can play ball; that should be the only consideration.

As for the GM who would rather ask and get the honest answer, first, I'm not sure how you cross that subject without crossing several lines of an employee/employer relationship, and second, if the GM suspects and the player answers "no," is the GM so strong in his suspicion that he thinks the player is lying?

I'm not saying the GM should ask. I'm saying, in his mind, if he had to find out, I'm not sure a press conference is how he'd wish to do so.

And my doubts would center far more around the media than about the player himself. You have far more faith in their restraint than most. As a fan, I'm not sure I really want every game to be a discussion about who one player has sex with, and why that matters (or doesn't)

It doesn't matter. Or at least that's the message I thought we were supposed to be selling.

[pricejj]

Originally Posted by TheElusiveKyleOrton

So you're more animal than human? Good to know, I guess.

Gays: unable to control themselves. Got it.

No, that's not what I said. I already said I would pick him in the 4th round.

I was just trying to imagine how I would act on a woman's volleyball team. I could succeed, but it would be difficult for me to suppress my feelings. It would be tough, but I think I could make it. However, if someone on the team was interested in me, I wouldn't shy away from it.

[Powderaddict]

Originally Posted by Shananahan

You wouldn't go around and say that it isn't normal to have red hair, or to be a big fan of horror movies, or to collect model trains, or to enjoy flying kites, or to not own a smartphone. Semantics, I know. Forgive me.

Just because something isn't "normal" doesn't mean there is something wrong with it.

I do some things people don't find "normal". No one is 100% "normal" in everything.

[Shananahan]

Originally Posted by Powderaddict

I guess you don't know the definition of "normal"

By saying something is not "normal" is not saying that it is right or wrong, it's just by definition not the norm. If a very small percentage of the population acts in a way that the majority does not, it is not "normal", by definition.

It's not a moral judgement word, that would be saying something is "wrong". It's just a comparative word that compares an actions against what people usually do.

If you were to apply that kind of logic to everything in the country there would be quite a bit of things and behaviors that you'd be calling abnormal. Like, 49% of stuff in some cases. Forgive me for not believing that the connotation to 'unnatural' isn't somewhat there in more than a few of the times it was used, even if innocently.

You wouldn't go around and say that it isn't normal to have red hair, or to be a big fan of horror movies, or to collect model trains, or to enjoy flying kites, or to not own a smartphone. Semantics, I know. Forgive me.

[SonOfLe-loLang]

Originally Posted by pricejj

No, that's not what I said. I already said I would pick him in the 4th round.

I was just trying to imagine how I would act on a woman's volleyball team. I could succeed, but it would be difficult for me to suppress my feelings.

If you've played sports in your life, you've played with someone who is gay. Life somehow has gone on.

[Powderaddict]

Weird, it put my quote above your post.

Now that, is NOT normal.

[Shananahan]

Originally Posted by Powderaddict

Just because something isn't "normal" doesn't mean there is something wrong with it.

I do some things people don't find "normal". No one is 100% "normal" in everything.

Ever seen a kid with red hair and thought, "That's not normal," or made a similar remark during a discussion of people with red hair?

I'm thinking not.

[Powderaddict]

Originally Posted by Shananahan

Ever seen a kid with red hair and thought, "That's not normal," or made a similar remark during a discussion of people with red hair?

I'm thinking not.

It's not normal to see black people in my town, but that doesn't mean there is anything wrong with it. It just means it's a rare occurrence.

[BroncoBeavis]

Originally Posted by Shananahan

Ever seen a kid with red hair and thought, "That's not normal," or made a similar remark during a discussion of people with red hair?

I'm thinking not.

I have. My wife dismisses any suggestion that he's also a stepchild, however.

[spiralism]

Should bring him in tbh, nearly our entire roster was caught sucking cock on national television just over a week ago so he'd fit right in.

Seriously though, as admirable as what he did is, he just made himself a sideshow. Should have waited till after the draft till he said it.