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Old 06-26-2014, 11:54 AM   #726
Rigs11
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Yeah. Clinton repeatedly Nostradamusing that Saddam was going to use weapons of mass destruction some day. Even used it in the name of launching military strikes. Then 9/11.

I'm sure he would've just let it go after the towers fell though.

Hindsight can be so blinding sometimes.
Clinton wasn't an idiot like your boy Dubya.
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Old 06-26-2014, 12:45 PM   #727
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Clinton had no problem when Bush invaded Iraq. He didn't come out against it. They both supported it. Also Bush got the same intell the dems got so you can't blame him for some of it being wrong. Doesn't matter anyways Saddam was on the list either way.
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Old 06-26-2014, 12:46 PM   #728
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Yeah. Clinton repeatedly Nostradamusing that Saddam was going to use weapons of mass destruction some day. Even used it in the name of launching military strikes. Then 9/11.

I'm sure he would've just let it go after the towers fell though.

Hindsight can be so blinding sometimes.
Yeah, but Clinton wasn't on a mission from God, unlike GW.


Was Bush on a mission from God?

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Bush, who turns 63 in July and was 54 when first sworn into office in 2001, has yet to comment on the reports. They include last week's GQ magazine exposé into the hawkish use of scripture in 2003, when then-defence secretary Donald Rumsfeld forwarded secret intelligence memos to Bush embroidered with biblical passages.

"Therefore, put on the full armour of God," a verse from Ephesians, and "Open the gates that the righteous nation may enter," from Isaiah, are among the messages that adorn reports prepared for Bush by Rumsfeld's Pentagon.

Stranger still are new accounts emerging from France describing how former president Jacques Chirac was utterly baffled by a 2003 telephone conversation in which Bush reportedly invoked fanatical Old Testament prophecy – including the Earth-ending battle with forces of evil, Gog and Magog – in his arguments to enlist France in the Coalition of the Willing.

"This confrontation is willed by God, who wants to use this conflict to erase his people's enemies before a New Age begins," Bush said to Chirac, according to Thomas Romer, a University of Lausanne theology professor who was later approached by French officials anxious to understand the biblical reference. Romer first revealed his account in a 2007 article for the university review, Allez savoir, which passed largely unnoticed.

Chirac, in a new book by French journalist Jean-Claude Maurice, is quoted as confirming the surreal conversation, saying he was stupefied by Bush's reference to biblical prophecy and "wondered how someone could be so superficial and fanatical in their beliefs."

"Speculating on what goes on inside George Bush's head is always a bold endeavour. But the sense one gets from this is that biblical prophecy somehow factored in the thinking," said Clive Hamilton, a visiting scholar at Yale University in a recent article for counterpunch.org.

"The most striking thing for me is in the real world, trying to get France to go to war on that basis is crazy. It is hard to imagine a better way to scare off a potential friend."
http://www.thestar.com/news/2009/05/..._from_god.html

U.S Defence Secretary used quotes from Bible to brief Bush on 'mission from God' war

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...n-God-war.html
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Old 06-26-2014, 12:47 PM   #729
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Saddam was happy about 9-11, that's enough for me. where are they now?
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Old 06-26-2014, 12:48 PM   #730
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if he was so bad at swaying countries how come Bush found support? Certainly more support then Obama gets when he wants to bomb.
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Old 06-26-2014, 01:10 PM   #731
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if he was so bad at swaying countries how come Bush found support? Certainly more support then Obama gets when he wants to bomb.
C'mon, everyone knows the French are godless socialists.
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Old 06-26-2014, 01:26 PM   #732
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Rand Paul Doesn’t Blame Obama For Iraq Crisis

http://time.com/?utm_source=feedburn...ck-obama-iraq/
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Old 06-26-2014, 02:10 PM   #733
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This is classic Gaff/Tony strategery. Find something virtually everyone supported in some fashion or another. Pick out the people you don't like. Blame it all on them.

Go look up some of the stuff Clinton said as he launched air raids in Iraq in 1998. It's a 90% certainty that Clinton would've invaded Iraq himself had he had another 4 years in office and watched 9/11 unfold.

But "it wasn't Clinton! Or the majority of Democrats in Congress who voted for war! It was whatever Neocon advisor I can find! They knew everything! Everyone else was just mistaken!"

Gafftastic.
Clinton served the Constitutional limit of two terms --

I disagree. Gore would not have invaded - - which, given that the war agenda was already set, explains why the Republican controlled Supreme Court selected Bush the winner of the 2000 presidential race, even though Gore won it.

Of course, we can't know for sure. This is speculation. MHG
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Old 06-26-2014, 02:36 PM   #734
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The war is escalating.

It is likely to get worse -- mabe much worse. So, why is the US assisting Al Qaeda in Syria -- even while supporting al Maliki in Iraq?

Are we supporting BOTH sides to create maximum mayhem and destruction? MHG

A few days ago Israel bombed Syria again.
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/06/23/wo...tack.html?_r=0

Syrian fighters also attacked inside Iraq.
http://www.thewire.com/global/2014/0...ttacks/373356/
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Old 06-26-2014, 02:40 PM   #735
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Clinton served the Constitutional limit of two terms --

I disagree. Gore would not have invaded - - which, given that the war agenda was already set, explains why the Republican controlled Supreme Court selected Bush the winner of the 2000 presidential race, even though Gore won it.

Of course, we can't know for sure. This is speculation. MHG
Gore criticized Bush Sr. for not sticking around to referee after the 1st Gulf War. Most of his criticisms going into the second had to do with not enough international coalition building or UN machinations first.

http://www.salon.com/2011/08/30/gore_president_iraq/

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The story of how Bush bought into this is well-known. His instinct after 9/11 was too think big and aggressively, and his inner circle was littered with neocons and other hawks who’d been waiting for just the right opening to push for an invasion of Iraq. This, supposedly, would not have been the case in a Gore White House.

But look a little closer and you’ll realize that President Gore would have been hearing the same pleas. His own vice president would have been Joe Lieberman, perhaps the most hawkish Democrat in Washington on Middle East issues. Marty Peretz, his old friend and confidante, would have had Gore’s ear and filled it with arguments for going into Iraq. Loud, influential, non-conservative media voices — like Tom Friedman and Peter Beinart — would have amplified these calls on the outside. Republicans would have been screaming for an invasion, and the public would have been on their side. Clinton could barely hold them all back in the ‘90s; after 9/11, would Gore have stood a chance?

Here it’s worth remembering Gore’s own history. In the 1980s, he made his name as a senator and presidential candidate by positioning himself as one of his party’s foremost hawks. One of the reasons, in fact, that Clinton put him on the Democratic ticket in 1992 was Gore’s vote for the Gulf War, which most Democrats had opposed. You could argue that Gore was a changed man by 2001 and 2002, and that he saw the world in a fundamentally different way, and maybe that’s true.

But it should be noted that when he announced his opposition to Bush’s war push in the fall of ’02, Gore endorsed the basic goal of removing Hussein and securing his (supposed) WMD stockpiles. What he objected to was more the go-it-alone nature of Bush’s approach. In other words, you could also argue that Gore, still stung by the 2000 election outcome, may have been motivated in some way by his desire to stage a big, principled fight with Bush — and that a different result in ’00 might have produced a different, more hawkish response from Gore, one that would have led to … an invasion of Iraq.
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Old 06-26-2014, 03:57 PM   #736
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Old 06-26-2014, 04:25 PM   #737
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The war is escalating.

It is likely to get worse -- mabe much worse. So, why is the US assisting Al Qaeda in Syria -- even while supporting al Maliki in Iraq?
Da Jooz, der gaffen-fuehrer.

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Old 06-26-2014, 05:46 PM   #738
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Why the hell is Obama pledging $500M to the Syrian extremists now? Is this guy completely bonkers or what?
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Old 06-26-2014, 05:49 PM   #739
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Why the hell is Obama pledging $500M to the Syrian extremists now? Is this guy completely bonkers or what?
Meanwhile, he's still trying to get the info about the VA from his favorite news channel.
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Old 06-26-2014, 06:59 PM   #740
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Why the hell is Obama pledging $500M to the Syrian extremists now? Is this guy completely bonkers or what?
When a President doesn't have a plan he gets blown in the wind. Even a bad plan is better then no plan.

He should have realized early on with Syria he can't win. Russia supports them and right now Obama doesn't have the will or power to take on Russia. Repubs like McCain crazy to think arming crazy rebels will beat back weapons from Russia. He probably should have left Mubarak in power, but go ahead and let Gaddaffi fall. Then with Syria he should have never talked tough if he wasn't willing to send in air power at the very least.

With Iraq he should have negotiated harder to get an agreement to leave troops.

The region would be more secure then it is now.
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Old 06-28-2014, 09:29 AM   #741
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Old 06-28-2014, 09:52 AM   #742
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When a President doesn't have a plan he gets blown in the wind. Even a bad plan is better then no plan.

He should have realized early on with Syria he can't win. Russia supports them and right now Obama doesn't have the will or power to take on Russia. Repubs like McCain crazy to think arming crazy rebels will beat back weapons from Russia. He probably should have left Mubarak in power, but go ahead and let Gaddaffi fall. Then with Syria he should have never talked tough if he wasn't willing to send in air power at the very least.

With Iraq he should have negotiated harder to get an agreement to leave troops.

The region would be more secure then it is now.

Not so crazy. The Soviets invaded Afghanistan in 1979. They ultimately lost because of American arms and money given to crazy rebels...of course 20 some odd years later we had the worst terrorist attack on the American homeland in our history.

ISIS makes Al Qaeda look like girl scouts in comparison. They captured one of Saddam's "sealed" chemical weapons plants. They control large chunks of Syria and Iraq. They are slaughtering Iraqi citizens and leaving the bodies for anyone to see. I doubt strongly worded comments and inspiring hashtags are gonna cut it this time.

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Old 06-28-2014, 09:57 AM   #743
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Yeah but in Syria Russia has a much more powerful govt it has partnered with then it did Afghanacrap.
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Old 06-28-2014, 10:00 AM   #744
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Clinton wasn't an idiot like your boy Dubya.

That's debatable.


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Old 06-28-2014, 10:00 AM   #745
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Not so crazy. The Soviets invaded Afghanistan in 1979. They ultimately lost because of American arms and money given to crazy rebels...of course 20 some odd years later we had the worst terrorist attack on the American homeland in our history.

ISIS makes Al Qaeda look like girl scouts in comparison. They captured one of Saddam's "sealed" chemical weapons plants. They control large chunks of Syria and Iraq. They are slaughtering Iraqi citizens and leaving the bodies for anyone to see. I doubt strongly worded comments and inspiring hashtags are gonna cut it this time.

At least all of this wasn't entirely predictable.... oh yes it was.
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Old 06-28-2014, 10:03 AM   #746
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This is classic Gaff/Tony strategery. Find something virtually everyone supported in some fashion or another. Pick out the people you don't like. Blame it all on them.

Go look up some of the stuff Clinton said as he launched air raids in Iraq in 1998. It's a 90% certainty that Clinton would've invaded Iraq himself had he had another 4 years in office and watched 9/11 unfold.

But "it wasn't Clinton! Or the majority of Democrats in Congress who voted for war! It was whatever Neocon advisor I can find! They knew everything! Everyone else was just mistaken!"

Gafftastic.
Absolute bull****. Sad that there are people out there so uninformed that they believe in garbage like this.
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Old 06-28-2014, 10:03 AM   #747
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Yeah but in Syria Russia has a much more powerful govt it has partnered with then it did Afghanacrap.
The world at large should just have shrugged when Al-Assad used chemical weapons. Other than a few extremist islamist countries nobody wants Al-Assad gone. The alternative is going to be what we have seen in every muslim country, religious and ethnic groups killing and raping each other creating a new generation of mujahideen who will go looking for another enemy to take on when they win or lose.
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Old 06-28-2014, 10:09 AM   #748
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Clinton had no problem when Bush invaded Iraq. He didn't come out against it. They both supported it. Also Bush got the same intell the dems got so you can't blame him for some of it being wrong. Doesn't matter anyways Saddam was on the list either way.
Amazing to watch Right Wing bubble-think in action. The neocons were planning to invade Iraq as soon as they got into power. They first mentioned their plan back in '93. They wrote a paper on it, how they would meddle in the ME, create a democracy in one of the ME countries they invaded, they would be greeted as liberators, and the new democracy, wherever it was, would stabilize the ME. They chose Iraq (a former ally) and used 911 as the catalyst to launch the invasion knowing full well that Saddam had nothing to do with it. They lied and manipulated the media to make it happen. They outed a CIA agent to make it happen.

And what is the Right Wing bubble-think? Clinton would have done the same thing.

It's like a ****ing fantasy world.
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Old 06-28-2014, 10:48 AM   #749
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Absolute bull****. Sad that there are people out there so uninformed that they believe in garbage like this.
No, YOU Ahhhhh!!!

Try harder.
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Old 06-28-2014, 11:18 AM   #750
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No, YOU Ahhhhh!!!

Try harder.
If Clinton WOULD have done it, why didn't he, Einstein?

Last edited by Rohirrim; 06-28-2014 at 12:34 PM..
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