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Old 08-28-2014, 01:16 AM   #1
L.A. BRONCOS FAN
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Default Dude, Where's My Religion?

What's a "War, Religion and Politics" forum without a religion thread?

This is the place to show your team colors and pitch your gods, demi-gods, and goddesses (or lack thereof.)

Or, on the other hand, it could be a place from whence to launch your own virtual crusade or holy war.

Try to be respectful, keep it clean and above the belt.

Have at it, boys and girls...
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Old 08-28-2014, 03:52 AM   #2
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This is not going to turn out well. You need to explain why you selected "other"
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Old 08-28-2014, 04:15 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by Guess Who View Post
This is not going to turn out well. You need to explain why you selected "other"
Heh!

Since when does anything ever turn out well on this forum?

I selected "other" because I'm sort of an eclectic and/or syncretist where religions are concerned.

That is, I sort of take those aspects that ring true - from all traditions - and leave the rest.

If I had to define my religious beliefs, I guess I would have to call them a blend of "experiential quantum physics" and "spiritual atheism" or something along those lines.
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Old 08-28-2014, 04:45 AM   #4
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I have seen no empirical evidence for or against a supreme being....
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Old 08-28-2014, 06:02 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by L.A. BRONCOS FAN View Post
Heh!

Since when does anything ever turn out well on this forum?

I selected "other" because I'm sort of an eclectic and/or syncretist where religions are concerned.

That is, I sort of take those aspects that ring true - from all traditions - and leave the rest.

If I had to define my religious beliefs, I guess I would have to call them a blend of "experiential quantum physics" and "spiritual atheism" or something along those lines.
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Old 08-28-2014, 06:03 AM   #6
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I have seen no empirical evidence for or against a supreme being....
You don't consider the fossil record empirical evidence...
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Old 08-28-2014, 07:14 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by Guess Who View Post
You don't consider the fossil record empirical evidence...
An argument can made made that Evolution and a Supreme Being are not mutually exclusive. The bible says 6,000 years, but not too many empiricists take that document seriously.
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Old 08-28-2014, 07:28 AM   #8
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I have seen no empirical evidence for or against a supreme being....
"Supreme being" sounds like the dude with the white beard sitting on a throne beyond the stars.

I wonder if even religious people believe in that image anymore?
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Old 08-28-2014, 07:31 AM   #9
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An argument can made made that Evolution and a Supreme Being are not mutually exclusive. The bible says 6,000 years, but not too many empiricists take that document seriously.
Trouble is, there is no empirical evidence for the existence of a supreme being, and all the logical "proofs" are unsound.
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Old 08-28-2014, 10:16 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by L.A. BRONCOS FAN View Post
Trouble is, there is no empirical evidence for the existence of a supreme being, and all the logical "proofs" are unsound.
A God, or supreme being will on be proven upon ones death... Makes is hard to solidify theories in the living...
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Old 08-28-2014, 10:48 AM   #11
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I like the poll, other than the fact its not public.

I fall squarely in the Christian category.
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Old 08-28-2014, 10:48 AM   #12
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You don't consider the fossil record empirical evidence...
Fossils just prove that man-made religions are wrong. The infinite cosmos is beyond our comprehension. Einstein was a smart guy, and even he can't begin to grasp the meaning of the universe.

Your question is the most difficult in the world. It is not a question I can answer simply with yes or no. I am not an Atheist. I do not know if I can define myself as a Pantheist. The problem involved is too vast for our limited minds. May I not reply with a parable? The human mind, no matter how highly trained, cannot grasp the universe. We are in the position of a little child, entering a huge library whose walls are covered to the ceiling with books in many different tongues. The child knows that someone must have written those books. It does not know who or how. It does not understand the languages in which they are written. The child notes a definite plan in the arrangement of the books, a mysterious order, which it does not comprehend, but only dimly suspects. That, it seems to me, is the attitude of the human mind, even the greatest and most cultured, toward God. We see a universe marvelously arranged, obeying certain laws, but we understand the laws only dimly. Our limited minds cannot grasp the mysterious force that sways the constellations. I am fascinated by Spinoza's Pantheism. I admire even more his contributions to modern thought. Spinoza is the greatest of modern philosophers, because he is the first philosopher who deals with the soul and the body as one, not as two separate things.
― Albert Einstein
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Old 08-28-2014, 10:55 AM   #13
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I like the poll, other than the fact its not public.

I fall squarely in the Christian category.
I made it anonymous because I thought some members might want to keep their votes private.
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Old 08-28-2014, 11:02 AM   #14
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Fossils just prove that man-made religions are wrong. The infinite cosmos is beyond our comprehension. Einstein was a smart guy, and even he can't begin to grasp the meaning of the universe.

Your question is the most difficult in the world. It is not a question I can answer simply with yes or no. I am not an Atheist. I do not know if I can define myself as a Pantheist. The problem involved is too vast for our limited minds. May I not reply with a parable? The human mind, no matter how highly trained, cannot grasp the universe. We are in the position of a little child, entering a huge library whose walls are covered to the ceiling with books in many different tongues. The child knows that someone must have written those books. It does not know who or how. It does not understand the languages in which they are written. The child notes a definite plan in the arrangement of the books, a mysterious order, which it does not comprehend, but only dimly suspects. That, it seems to me, is the attitude of the human mind, even the greatest and most cultured, toward God. We see a universe marvelously arranged, obeying certain laws, but we understand the laws only dimly. Our limited minds cannot grasp the mysterious force that sways the constellations. I am fascinated by Spinoza's Pantheism. I admire even more his contributions to modern thought. Spinoza is the greatest of modern philosophers, because he is the first philosopher who deals with the soul and the body as one, not as two separate things.
― Albert Einstein
That's a great quote.

In the end, even the guy whose work in physics facilitated the development of the atomic bomb had to acknowledge the limits of rationalism.

As for the meaning of the universe, perhaps there is none.

"What is the meaning of a flower?" as some Buddhist sage or other once asked.
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Old 08-28-2014, 11:16 AM   #15
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An argument can made made that Evolution and a Supreme Being are not mutually exclusive. The bible says 6,000 years, but not too many empiricists take that document seriously.
In what part of the bible does it say 6000 yrs?
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Old 08-28-2014, 11:40 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by cutthemdown View Post
In what part of the bible does it say 6000 yrs?
Biblical scholars added it up, but why is the Bible the only truth? What about these other sacred writings?

Adi Dam[edit]
The writings of Franklin Albert Jones aka Adi Da Love-Ananda Samraj
Aletheon
The Companions of the True Dawn Horse
The Dawn Horse Testament
Gnosticon
The Heart of the Adi Dam Revelation
Not-Two IS Peace
Pneumaton
Transcendental Realism
satr[edit]
Havamal
Eddas
Atenism[edit]
Great Hymn to the Aten
Ayyavazhi[edit]
The Akilathirattu Ammanai
The Arul Nool
Aztec religion[edit]
The Borgia Group codices
Bah' Faith[edit]
Main article: Bah' literature
Books by Bah'u'llh

The Four Valleys (1857 version)
The Seven Valleys (1860 version)
The Hidden Words of Bahullh (in Arabic 1857)
The Hidden Words of Bahullh (in Persian 1857)
Gems of Divine Mysteries (ca 1859)
The Book of Certitude (partly in Persian and partly in Arabic 1861)
Summons of the Lord of Hosts (ca 1868)
Tabernacle of Unity (ca 1870)
The Aqdas /The Most Holy Book (Completed 1873)
Tablets of Bahullh Revealed After the Kitb-i-Aqdas (written until 1892)
Epistle to the Son of the Wolf (ca 1890)
Gleanings from the Writings of Bahullh (compilation chosen by Shoghi Effendi of Bah'u'llh's writings, 1853 to 1892)
Bn[edit]
Bon Kangyur and Tengyur
Buddhism[edit]


Ancient style of scripture used for the Pāli Canon
See also: Buddhist texts
Theravada Buddhism
The Tipitaka or Pāli Canon
Vinaya Pitaka
Sutta Pitaka
Digha Nikaya, the "long" discourses.
Majjhima Nikaya, the "middle-length" discourses.
Samyutta Nikaya, the "connected" discourses.
Anguttara Nikaya, the "numerical" discourses.
Khuddaka Nikaya, the "minor collection".
Abhidhamma Pitaka
East Asian Mahayana


The Chinese Diamond Sutra, the oldest known dated printed book in the world, printed in the 9th year of Xiantong Era of the Tang Dynasty, or 868 CE. British Library.
The Chinese Buddhist Tripiṭaka, including
Diamond Sutra and the Heart Sutra
Shurangama Sutra and its Shurangama Mantra
Pure Land Buddhism
Infinite Life Sutra
Amitabha Sutra
Contemplation Sutra
other Pure Land Sutras
Tiantai, Tendai, and Nichiren
Lotus Sutra
Shingon
Mahavairocana Sutra
Vajrasekhara Sutra
Tibetan Buddhism
Tibetan Kangyur and Tengyur
Cheondoism[edit]
The Donghak Scripture
The Songs of Yongdam
The Sermons of Master Haeweol
The Sermons of Revered Teacher Euiam[7]
Christianity[edit]
Further information: Biblical canon, Christian biblical canons and Books of the Bible


Christian Bible, 1407 handwritten copy
Traditional Christendom
The Bible (the Old Testament and New Testament)
For Protestantism, this is the 66-book canon - the Jewish Tanakh of 24 books divided differently (into 39 books) and the universal 27-book New Testament.
For Catholicism, this includes seven deuterocanonical books in the Old Testament for a total of 73 books, called the Canon of Trent (in versions of the Latin Vulgate, 3 Esdras and 4 Esdras are included in an appendix, but considered non-canonical).
For the Eastern Orthodox Church, this includes the anagignoskomena, which consist of the Catholic deuterocanon, plus 3 Maccabees, Psalm 151, the Prayer of Manasseh, and 3 Esdras. 4 Maccabees is considered to be canonical by the Georgian Orthodox Church.[8]
The Ethiopian Orthodox Tewahedo Church (and its offspring, the Eritrean Orthodox Church) adds various additional books depending on the specific enumeration of the canon (see Ethiopian Biblical canon), but always includes 4 Esdras, the Book of Jubilees, 1 Enoch, 4 Baruch, and 1, 2, and 3 Meqabyan (no relation to the Books of Maccabees).
Some Syriac churches accept the Letter of Baruch as scripture.
Christian Scientists
The Bible
Science and Health with Key to the Scriptures by Mary Baker Eddy. This textbook, along with the Bible, serves as the permanent "impersonal pastor" of the church.
Gnosticism
Nag Hammadi library and other Gnostic texts (not from the Bible)
Some books of the Old Testament and New Testament
Cerdonianism and Marcionism
Only the Gospel of Marcion and selected Pauline epistles accepted


Cover page of The Book of Mormon from an original 1830 edition, by Joseph Smith, Jr.
(Image from the U.S. Library of Congress Rare Book and Special Collections Division.)
Jehovah's Witnesses
The Bible (The New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures is their preferred translation.)
Latter Day Saint movement
Further information: Standard Works and Biblical canon Latter Day Saint canons
The Bible
The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church) uses the LDS edition of the King James Bible for English-speaking members; other versions are used in non-English speaking countries.
The Community of Christ (RLDS) uses the Joseph Smith Translation, which it calls the Inspired Version, as well as updated modern translations.
The Book of Mormon
The Pearl of Great Price
The Doctrine and Covenants
There are significant differences in content and section numbering between the Doctrine and Covenants used by the Community of Christ (RLDS) and the LDS Church.
Other, smaller branches of Latter Day Saints include other scriptures, such as the Book of the Law of the Lord used by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints (Strangite) or The Word of the Lord used by Fettingite branches.
Native American Church (Christian-leaning factions)
See below.
Rastafari movement
See below.
Seventh-day Adventists
The Bible
The writings of Ellen White are held to an elevated status, though not equal with the Bible, as she is considered to have been an inspired prophetess.
Swedenborgianism
See below.
Unification Church
See below.
Confucianism[edit]
The Five Classics
The Four Books
The Thirteen Classics
Discordianism[edit]
The Principia Discordia
Druidism[edit]
The Mabinogion
Lebor Gabla renn (The Book of Invasions)
Druze[edit]
Rasa'il al-hikmah (Epistles of Wisdom)
Ancient Egyptian religion[edit]


Pyramid texts from Teti I's pyramid.
Old Kingdom
Pyramid Texts
First Intermediate Period & Middle Kingdom
Coffin Texts
Second Intermediate Period
The Book of the Dead
Book of Caverns
Book of Gates
Amduat
Book of the Heavenly Cow
Litany of Re
Etruscan religion[edit]


The Cippus of Perugia, 3rd or 2nd century BCE
Liber Linteus
Pyrgi Tablets
Ancient Greece[edit]
Homeric Hymns
Theogony
Golden Verses of Pythagoras
Hermeticism[edit]
Hermetica, Kybalion, Emerald Tablet and associated writings
Hinduism[edit]
Main article: Hindu texts
Śruti
Vedas
Rig Veda
Sama Veda
Yajur Veda
Atharva Veda
Brahmanas
Aranyakas
Upanishads


The Bhagavad Gita is Lord Krishna's counsel to Arjuna on the battlefield of the Kurukshetra.
Smriti
Itihāsas
Mahābhārata (including the Bhagavad Gita)
Bhagavad Gita
Ramayana
Puranas (List)
Bhagavata Purana
Tantras
Sutras (List)
Stotras
Ashtavakra Gita
Gherand Samhita
Gita Govinda
Hatha Yoga Pradipika
Yoga Vasistha
In Purva Mimamsa
Purva Mimamsa Sutras
In Vedanta (Uttar Mimamsa)
Brahma Sutras of Vyasa
In Yoga
Yoga Sutras of Patanjali
In Samkhya
Samkhya Sutras of Kapila
In Nyaya
Nyāya Sūtras of Gautama
In Vaisheshika
Vaisheshika Sutras of Kanada
In Vaishnavism
Vaikhanasa Samhitas
Pancaratra Samhitas
In Saktism
Sakta Tantras
In Kashmir Saivism
64 Bhairavagamas
28 Shaiva Agamas
Shiva Sutras of Vasugupta
Vijnana Bhairava Tantra
In Pashupata Shaivism
Pashupata Sutras of Lakulish
Panchartha-bhashya of Kaundinya (a commentary on the Pashupata Sutras)
Ganakarika
Ratnatika of Bhasarvajna
In Shaiva Siddhanta
28 Saiva Agamas
Tirumurai (canon of 12 works)
Meykandar Shastras (canon of 14 works)
In Gaudiya Vaishnavism
Brahma Samhita
Jayadeva's Gita Govinda
Krishna-karnamrita
Chaitanya Bhagavata
Chaitanya Charitamrita
Prema-bhakti-candrika
Hari-bhakti-vilasa
In Lingayatism
Siddhanta Shikhamani
Vachana sahitya
Mantra Gopya
Shoonya Sampadane
28 Agamas
Karana Hasuge
Basava purana
In Kabir Panth
poems of Kabir
In Dadu Panth
poems of Dadu
Islam[edit]


11th Century North African Qur'an in the British Museum
Main article: Islamic holy books
Quran (also referred to as Kuran, Koran, Qurān, Coran or al-Qurān) Four books considered to be revealed and mentioned by name in the Qur'an are the Quran (revealed to Muhammad), Tawrat (revealed to Moses), the Zabur (revealed to David) and the Injil (Gospel) (revealed to Jesus).
Hadith, reports of the deeds and sayings of Muhammad.
Jainism[edit]
Main article: Jain Agamas
Svetambara
11 Angas
Secondary
12 Upangas, 4 Mula-sutras, 6 Cheda-sutras, 2 Culika-sutras, 10 Prakirnakas
Digambara
Karmaprabhrita, also called Satkhandagama
Kashayaprabhrita
Nonsectarian/Nonspecific
Jina Vijaya
Tattvartha Sutra
GandhaHasti Mahabhashya (authoritative and oldest commentary on the Tattvartha Sutra)
Judaism[edit]


A Sefer Torah opened for liturgical use in a synagogue service
Rabbinic Judaism
See also: Rabbinic literature
The Tanakh i.e. Hebrew Bible
Torah (teachings)
Nevi'im (prophets)
Ketuvim (writings)
The Talmud
Mishnah
Gemara
Kabbalism
Kabbalah
Zohar
Karaite Judaism
The Tanakh
Beta Israel
The Tanakh with several Jewish apocrypha
LaVeyan Satanism[edit]
The Satanic Bible (primary text)
The Satanic Rituals (contains additional rituals)
Mandaeanism[edit]
The Ginza Rba
Book of the Zodiac
Qolusta, Canonical Prayerbook
Book of John the Baptizer
Diwan Abatur, Purgatories
1012 Questions
Coronation of Shislam Rba
Baptism of Hibil Ziwa
Haran Gawaita
Manichaeism[edit]
The Evangelion (Greek, Coptic: Ευαγγελιον, meaning roughly "good news"). Also known as the Gospel of Mani and The Living Gospel
the Treasure of Life
the Pragmateia (Coptic: πραγματεία)
the Book of Mysteries
the Book of Giants
the Epistles
the Psalms and Prayers. A Coptic Manichaean Psalter, discovered in Egypt in the early 1900s, was edited and published by Charles Allberry from Manichaean manuscripts in the Chester Beatty collection and in the Berlin Academy, 1938-9.
The Shabuhragan
The Arzhang
The Kephalaia (Κεφαλαια), "Discourses", found in Coptic translation.
Maya religion[edit]
The Popol Vuh
the Dresden Codex
the Madrid Codex
the Paris Codex
countless destroyed codices
Meher Baba[edit]


Cover of God Speaks
Discourses (Meher Baba)
God Speaks
Native American Church[edit]
The Bible (among Christian-leaning factions only)
New Age religions[edit]
Various New Age religions may regard any of the following texts as inspired:

A Course in Miracles
Conversations with God
Oahspe
The Urantia Book
Isis Unveiled
Orphism[edit]
Orphic Poems
Ralism[edit]
The writings of Ral aka Claude Vorilhon
Geniocracy
Intelligent Design: Message from the Designers
Sensual Meditation
Yes to Human Cloning
Rastafari movement[edit]
The Bible (Ethiopian Orthodox canon)
the Holy Piby
the Kebra Negast
The speeches and writings of Haile Selassie I (including his autobiography My Life and Ethiopia's Progress)
Royal Parchment Scroll of Black Supremacy
Ravidassia[edit]


Amritbani Satguru Ravidass Ji Ki-Holy Book of Ravidassia Religion
The Amritbani Guru Ravidass Ji
Samaritanism[edit]
See also: Samaritan religious texts
The Samaritan Torah
Science of Mind[edit]
The Science of Mind by Ernest Holmes
Scientology[edit]
Dianetics: The Modern Science of Mental Health
List of Scientology texts
Shinto[edit]
The Kojiki
The Rikkokushi, which includes the Nihon Shoki and the Shoku Nihongi
The Fudoki
The Jinnō Shōtōki
The Kujiki
Sikhism[edit]


Illuminated Guru Granth folio with Mul Mantar(basic religion mantra) with signature of Guru Gobind Singh.
Main article: Sikh scriptures
The Guru Granth Sahib
The Dasven Padshah Da Granth
Spiritism[edit]
The Spirits Book
The Book on Mediums
The Gospel According to Spiritism
Heaven and Hell
The Genesis According to Spiritism
Sumerian[edit]
The Barton Cylinder
Swedenborgianism[edit]
The New Church
The Bible (several books omitted)
The works of Emanuel Swedenborg (not considered equal to the Bible)
The General Church
The Bible (several books omitted)
The works of Emanuel Swedenborg (considered equal to the Bible)
Taoism[edit]
Tao Te Ching
Zhuangzi (book)
Daozang
Tenrikyo[edit]
The Ofudesaki
The Mikagura-uta
The Osashizu
Thelema[edit]
Holy Books of Thelema especially The Book of the Law
Unification Church[edit]
Divine Principle
The Bible as illuminated by more recent revelation
Urantianism[edit]
Urantia Book
Wicca[edit]
Book of Shadows
Charge of the Goddess
Threefold Law
Wiccan Rede
Yrsn[edit]
Kalm-e Saranjm
Yazidi[edit]
Yazidi Black Book
Yazidi Book of Revelation
The true core texts of the Yazidi religion that exist today are the hymns, known as qawls.
Yorb[edit]
Od If
Jaap Verduijn's Odu Ifa Collection
Zoroastrianism[edit]


Yasna 28.1 (Bodleian MS J2)
Primary religious texts, that is, the Avesta collection:
The Yasna, the primary liturgical collection, includes the Gathas.
The Visperad, a collection of supplements to the Yasna.
The Yashts, hymns in honor of the divinities.
The Vendidad, describes the various forms of evil spirits and ways to confound them.
shorter texts and prayers, the Yashts the five Nyaishes ("worship, praise"), the Sirozeh and the Afringans (blessings).
There are some 60 secondary religious texts, none of which are considered scripture. The most important of these are:
The Denkard (middle Persian, 'Acts of Religion'),
The Bundahishn, (middle Persian, 'Primordial Creation')
The Menog-i Khrad, (middle Persian, 'Spirit of Wisdom')
The Arda Viraf Namak (middle Persian, 'The Book of Arda Viraf')
The Sad-dar (modern Persian, 'Hundred Doors', or 'Hundred Chapters')
The Rivayats, 15th-18th century correspondence on religious issues
For general use by the laity:
The Zend (lit. commentaries), various commentaries on and translations of the Avesta.
The Khordeh Avesta, Zoroastrian prayer book for lay people from the Avesta.
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Old 08-28-2014, 12:00 PM   #17
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^

Wow - quite the compilation.

If I were forced to "join" some religious order or other, it would probably be Buddhism.
You seldom see Buddhists launching crusades or holy wars, and the Buddhist view of the universe in which we live accords in many ways with the understanding of the world revealed to us by modern physics.

There is no Buddhist "God," and the Buddha told his disciples they should question all teachings - including his own!
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Old 08-28-2014, 12:32 PM   #18
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What about these other sacred writings?
What, no love for Archie Comics?
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Old 08-28-2014, 03:12 PM   #19
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The point is the bible doesn't spell out how old they think the Earth is. That was done by the people who read the bible. It's been translated over and over and I wouldn't worry too much about how old the stories seem to add up to. I certainly wouldn't use that as an argument about God. The whole bible could be wrong and there could still be a God.
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Old 08-28-2014, 03:14 PM   #20
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it doesn't matter what old books say because when Earth was formed nobody had a written language yet. So it's silly to try and date the Earth by any writings.

I'm sure science has it right.
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Old 08-28-2014, 04:39 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by cutthemdown View Post
it doesn't matter what old books say because when Earth was formed nobody had a written language yet. So it's silly to try and date the Earth by any writings.

I'm sure science has it right.

So there were humans when the earth was formed but they didn't know how to write?
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Old 08-28-2014, 04:40 PM   #22
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Nice try but I think people got my point. I never said there were people around lol. My point is there was no one around to say.
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Old 08-28-2014, 10:57 PM   #23
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Old 08-31-2014, 11:36 AM   #24
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A God, or supreme being will on be proven upon ones death... Makes is hard to solidify theories in the living...
Where is the empirical evidence to support the claim that we will encounter this supreme being, the existence of whom is unsupported by empirical evidence, after death?
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Old 08-31-2014, 11:52 AM   #25
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