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Old 03-19-2015, 08:25 AM   #26
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As someone who is finally reading Dune and is about half way through, this is freaking me out.
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Old 03-19-2015, 08:28 AM   #27
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Can someone tell me how the **** we don't have mass desalination capabilities?

I want to know the conspiracies or reasons why it can't be done.
It's just super expensive and inefficient, which is why it's really only done on a large scale by oil producing states in the Middle East like the UAE, where money is no issue.
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Old 03-19-2015, 08:36 AM   #28
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All things point to a continued real estate boom in the Colorado front range. Come get your piece before millions more Californians come. They are coming....
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Old 03-19-2015, 08:52 AM   #29
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Had they invested in desalination plants 30 years ago, this would be a non-issue. Hell, California commits money to boondoggles like high speed trains rather than addressing simple and obvious limitations of possessing large swaths of arid landscape. Is desalination costly? Yes, but compared to running out of water, it is dirt cheap. Of course, the California state government has never been known for sensible spending or practical solutions to any problems, let alone the competency it would take to do a project efficiently.

As for the high energy use, I'm sure California's investment in wind and solar can provide the required energy, right? Uh, no. Fossil fuels, however, along with nuclear could, however. Of course, that would also require environmentalists taking a rational position, which just doesn't happen in the People's Republic of California.

Will it raise water prices statewide? Initially, it certainly would. The effect of that will be reflected in higher prices for most things--so get to Disneyland soon, folks. Right now, California's averaging the construction of one new desalination plant per year. It's too little too late at this point, though. But unlike wind and solar in the energy field, the desalination option would not be unreliable or intermittent but would be a reliable source, albeit never a stand alone solution to lack of natural water sources. As for its use in agriculture, the technology is being developed to use desalinated water for crops but again, too little too late in the game. Treated sewage for crops can work, as Israel has shown--50% of water used for ag is fro treated sewage there.

I hope California somehow gets it together, as the drought ain't going anywhere.
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Old 03-19-2015, 09:01 AM   #30
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The scientist is FOS and is obviously looking to grab headlines from his editorial.

There is a major aquifer in the Central Valley that USGS experts estimate to hold 800 million acres of water. That's from centuries of runoff water from the sierras and rivers. It's massive and makes Lake Mead look like a pond. The problem is that water is becoming an increasingly more expensive venture. People are suggesting desalination, which costs untold billions and drilling for water is becoming more expensive the deeper for farmers to drill along with filtering it to make it clean enough for farming.

These farmers used to be supported by locals years ago and now you have hedge fund managers and other wealthy types moving in to invest in these lands.

Water is going to be the next gold rush, IF the trends continue.
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Old 03-19-2015, 09:03 AM   #31
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Too many people living in places with far too few resources... That's the modern human way alright...
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Old 03-19-2015, 09:09 AM   #32
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Too many people living in places with far too few resources... That's the modern human way alright...
And that's the issue facing the Western states, not just California. It's hard to manage water when the population is growing at a rapid rate during times where the climate is arid.
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Old 03-19-2015, 09:10 AM   #33
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It's unreal how different this winter has been for the Northeast and everyone else.

I've still got over 2 freakin feet of packed snow and ice in my yard....and I have acreage and get direct sunlight all day. Enormous snow banks anywhere with a parking lot. Wind chills have been in the single digits all week.

Out of the 80 odd days of 2015, we've literally had 4 "nice" days and none went over 50 degrees.
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Old 03-19-2015, 09:15 AM   #34
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Originally Posted by Meck77 View Post
All things point to a continued real estate boom in the Colorado front range. Come get your piece before millions more Californians come. They are coming....
****y comment first. Second I'm way more worried about the food supply then I am about were people will move to.


California produces a sizable majority of many American fruits, vegetables, and nuts: 99 percent of artichokes, 99 percent of walnuts, 97 percent of kiwis, 97 percent of plums, 95 percent of celery, 95 percent of garlic, 89 percent of cauliflower, 71 percent of spinach, and 69 percent of carrots (and the list goes on and on).

On its own, California would be the world’s ninth-largest agricultural economy, according to a University of California at Davis study. Shifts in its production reverberate globally, said Dan Sumner, another agricultural economist at the school.

Last edited by Quoydogs; 03-19-2015 at 09:24 AM..
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Old 03-19-2015, 09:16 AM   #35
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I am not seeing anyone refute this.
That our water is going to run out in 12 months? We would be in panic mode right now. We are in trouble just not that fast. I think Mormons have started hoarding 2 years worth of water.
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Old 03-19-2015, 09:23 AM   #36
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Originally Posted by Quoydogs View Post
****y comment first. Second I'm way more worried about the food supply then I am about were people will move to.


California produces a sizable majority of many American fruits, vegetables, and nuts: 99 percent of artichokes, 99 percent of walnuts, 97 percent of kiwis, 97 percent of plums, 95 percent of celery, 95 percent of garlic, 89 percent of cauliflower, 71 percent of spinach, and 69 percent of carrots (and the list goes on and on).
Well I happen to be in real estate and farming so don't worry some of us are working towards your food security.

It's been a steady flow of Californians for decades. I do think the pace is going to accelerate. The growth in the front range is unreal and likely to accelerate. Not sure what's so ****ty about that comment. It's just a fact. I think I recall you said you were looking to move to the front range. You might take my advice and get here sooner than later. If it wasn't you disregard.

Last edited by Meck77; 03-19-2015 at 09:25 AM..
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Old 03-19-2015, 09:24 AM   #37
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California does have a water issue. That said, they will not "run out" of water in one year. I was watching the Robert Redford movie "Three Days of the Condor" a little while ago. This movie came out in 1975. This was at the height of the energy crisis and the cold war, mind you. During the last part of movie, Turner is speaking with Higgins and he goes on about how they're totally out of energy in a few years and in a decade the country will be out of food.

There were actually people in 1975 that were saying and really believed this. That by 1985 America was going to be out of food.

It never happens that way. Nothing just stops. You'll see the price go up and governments start doing things to save. It's not like on March 18th in 2016 all of California's water will disappear like the rapture.
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Old 03-19-2015, 09:26 AM   #38
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Originally Posted by Meck77 View Post
Well I happen to be in real estate and farming so don't worry some of us are working towards your food security.

It's been a steady flow of Californians for decades. I do think the pace is going to accelerate. The growth in the front range is unreal and likely to accelerate. Not sure what's so ****ty about that comment. It's just a fact.
I posted this after you quoted me. It's a notable thing.

On its own, California would be the world’s ninth-largest agricultural economy, according to a University of California at Davis study. Shifts in its production reverberate globally, said Dan Sumner, another agricultural economist at the school.

As far as the ****y comment. People are people and we need to start caring for one and another again. That is what made Merica so great to begin with.
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Old 03-19-2015, 09:28 AM   #39
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If more people move east to Colorado, won't that mean less water for people downstream along the Colorado River in UT, NV, CA, and AZ?

I know some of the water that would normally flow west is siphoned off and fed east.

Last edited by WolfpackGuy; 03-19-2015 at 09:34 AM..
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Old 03-19-2015, 09:38 AM   #40
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And that's the issue facing the Western states, not just California. It's hard to manage water when the population is growing at a rapid rate during times where the climate is arid.
yep, I kind of feel implicit. We have a huge garden at our house, very little of it xeric or food producing. It is well established with well amended soil and mulch, so we don't use that much water... But it's wasteful and a creature comfort.
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Old 03-19-2015, 09:46 AM   #41
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http://nation.foxnews.com/2014/02/17...fornia-drought

President’s Day: Obama Plays at Water-Guzzling Desert Golf Courses Amid California Drought.

Quote:
The 124 golf courses in the Coachella Valley consume roughly 17 percent of all water there, and one quarter of the water pumped out of the region’s at-risk groundwater aquifer, according to the Coachella Valley Water District. Statewide, roughly one percent of water goes to keep golf courses green. Each of the 124 Coachella Valley courses, on average, uses nearly 1 million gallons a day due to the hot and dry climate, 3-4 times more water per day than the average American golf course.
And no, I am not a Fox News nut. I read another article headline and thought how insane this is.
And that's how I got to this article.
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Old 03-19-2015, 09:50 AM   #42
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Water is obviously a major issue with the droughts the west has experienced, but it isn't going to just ****ing disappear in one year. Yes, Californian's need to conserve, conserve, conserve as we all do in the west. Unfortunately the prior appropriation system, which is primarily used in the west, is a use it or lose it system that does not reward conservation; thus, an entire overhaul of how we legally deal with water needs to happen. Good luck with that....
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Old 03-19-2015, 09:52 AM   #43
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As someone who is finally reading Dune and is about half way through, this is freaking me out.


We'll all be wearing stillsuits before long.
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Old 03-19-2015, 10:05 AM   #44
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Alot of the fishing lakes & reservoirs are down to very low level where you cant get boat out. A couple has dried up. thank God the one 15 mins from me is stil going, but it will now get more boating/fishing pressure.
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Old 03-19-2015, 10:08 AM   #45
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Well I happen to be in real estate and farming so don't worry some of us are working towards your food security.

I think I recall you said you were looking to move to the front range. You might take my advice and get here sooner than later. If it wasn't you disregard.
I would love to move to CO. I almost had it done. Are deal fell through unfortunately
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Old 03-19-2015, 10:41 AM   #46
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and the mass exodus of CA will continue. Get ready for it UT and AZ. If anyone wants to invest in good real estate now, forget CO, it's over priced and already over populated (sorry Meck). Buy property in UT, that's where I'd go... just say'n.
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Old 03-19-2015, 11:06 AM   #47
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GMO plants grow well with little effort
Well, minus the poor soil health that actually increases the demand for water (in monoculture AG principles anyway).
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Old 03-19-2015, 11:21 AM   #48
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Yep we are going thru the same thing in Utah. Have had only two snow storms this winter with any measurable snow and that was only about an inch each time and melted within 4 hours. Last year was much the same. While I've enjoyed the spring like temperatures throughout the winter, we do need water. However, the weather people here cry wolf about our water supply every year even when we get dumped on.
Amen on the weather people. Two years ago we had record snow and they were all lamenting that it wasn't doing any good. All the lakes and reservoirs were at or over capacity and it just wasn't enough. This summer and fall were some of the wettest on record and it just wasn't enough.

Now we aren't getting ANY precip and I finally believe the weather guys that it JUST ISN'T ENOUGH!

They can't accurately predict the weather 2 days out so I trust them as much as ManRam trusts a kicker.

Having grown up on a farm, I saw how big a deal weather is to those who make their living off the land and I still tend to look at it through the agricultural eye (even though I'm solidly a suburbanite these days) and the absence of a decent winter worries me a lot. You would think that a blocking high pressure would eventually move but it's been in place for months.

I blame John Fox.
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Old 03-19-2015, 11:21 AM   #49
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São Paulo may be out of water in two months.

The city is now using the second of its three reserves.

http://www.theguardian.com/cities/20...isis-rationing
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Old 03-19-2015, 11:27 AM   #50
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and the mass exodus of CA will continue. Get ready for it UT and AZ. If anyone wants to invest in good real estate now, forget CO, it's over priced and already over populated (sorry Meck). Buy property in UT, that's where I'd go... just say'n.
SHUT UP!!

The Californication of Utah is well under way with dumb asses who want to live the country life and then call animal control when their neighbors horses poop in the pasture next door and the neighbors don't bag it (true story)!

So stay away from Utah! YOU HEAR ME!!

It's full of Mormons!! Ohhh!! Scary!! We will invite you to church and do other strange **** like bring you cookies and say "hello" when we see you outside!! We have goofy liquor laws and rude drivers!!

Also, it snows and we let white guys play for our NBA team!!

(Is any of this scaring you away yet?)
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