The Orange Mane -  a Denver Broncos Fan Community  

Go Back   The Orange Mane - a Denver Broncos Fan Community > Jibba Jabba > War, Religion and Politics Thread
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Chat Room Mark Forums Read



Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 06-24-2014, 07:08 PM   #676
cutthemdown
A verbis ad verbera
 
cutthemdown's Avatar
 

Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 37,847
Default

Pulling out of Iraq was a stupid move. You wouldn't pull out of S Korea would you?
cutthemdown is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-24-2014, 08:36 PM   #677
Rohirrim
Partisan
 
Rohirrim's Avatar
 
And so it goes...

Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Trumpville
Posts: 68,683
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cutthemdown View Post
Pulling out of Iraq was a stupid move. You wouldn't pull out of S Korea would you?
You're joking. Right?
Rohirrim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-24-2014, 08:50 PM   #678
pricejj
jungle
 
pricejj's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 19,871
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DenverBrit View Post
Providing advisers to give the Iraqis 'backbone' is really the only sensible military
option, the real solution is political.

It always has been.
You think providing 575 "advisors" (Navy Seals and Marines), is going to solve Iraq's problems? Lol. I wouldn't bet on it. There is no more Iraq. Iran is just bigger now, and chaos is spreading.

The Iraqis will continue to fight until their time is due. The only US interest in the region make sure Iran is abiding by the anti-nuclear proliferation treaty.
pricejj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-24-2014, 09:27 PM   #679
cutthemdown
A verbis ad verbera
 
cutthemdown's Avatar
 

Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 37,847
Default

Why not bomb ISIS? Why not send in the navies jets? They can operate with very little risk. Obama seems afraid to make any decisions. He would rather do nothing then say what could I do? He's afraid.
cutthemdown is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 06:12 AM   #680
TonyR
Franchise Poster
 
TonyR's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Mid-Atlantic
Posts: 28,150
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pricejj View Post
You think providing 575 "advisors" (Navy Seals and Marines), is going to solve Iraq's problems? Lol. I wouldn't bet on it.
You think 20,000 troops is going to solve Iraq's problems? Lol. I wouldn't bet on it.
TonyR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 06:21 AM   #681
Rohirrim
Partisan
 
Rohirrim's Avatar
 
And so it goes...

Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Trumpville
Posts: 68,683
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kappys View Post
This point is really on the money. The question is knowing what you know about Iraq now, do you think we(Americans) would have been better off leaving a force of about 25,000 troops in US military bases in Iraq in perpetuity as compared to our withdrawal and the slow motion fracturing of the country?
We (in combination with other countries) kept over a hundred thousand troops in Iraq for ten years. I don't get the logic of sending more. Isn't it glaringly obvious by now that the problems of Iraq are much more than can be cured by the military solution?

I swear, some people, like many I hear on the Right (Cheney, Cut, etc.) are stupider than chimps. No matter how many times the hammer doesn't work, they keep banging away with the hammer. If you ask them what's wrong, they answer, "We need to hit it a few more times with the hammer."
Rohirrim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 06:26 AM   #682
cutthemdown
A verbis ad verbera
 
cutthemdown's Avatar
 

Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 37,847
Default

Syrian jets now attacking into Iraq. Congrats Obama you have a regional war. Make sure you lead from behind and stay out of it.
cutthemdown is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 06:27 AM   #683
cutthemdown
A verbis ad verbera
 
cutthemdown's Avatar
 

Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 37,847
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyR View Post
You think 20,000 troops is going to solve Iraq's problems? Lol. I wouldn't bet on it.
For sure 20 thousand with the green light to attack when needed, with air support, could have stopped all of this. No doubt about that.
cutthemdown is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 06:28 AM   #684
cutthemdown
A verbis ad verbera
 
cutthemdown's Avatar
 

Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 37,847
Default

@ watching liberals try and say this outcome was what we wanted and the only thing that ever could have happened. Obama had nothing he could do BS.
cutthemdown is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 06:59 AM   #685
kappys
Ring of Famer
 
kappys's Avatar
 
It will be of little avail to the

Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 5,496
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rohirrim View Post
We (in combination with other countries) kept over a hundred thousand troops in Iraq for ten years. I don't get the logic of sending more. Isn't it glaringly obvious by now that the problems of Iraq are much more than can be cured by the military solution?

I swear, some people, like many I hear on the Right (Cheney, Cut, etc.) are stupider than chimps. No matter how many times the hammer doesn't work, they keep banging away with the hammer. If you ask them what's wrong, they answer, "We need to hit it a few more times with the hammer."
The point is perpetuity - 20k troops forever in Iraq(at least 50 years). Would that have been better than the current situation? there are some like Cut who certainly seem to think so.
kappys is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 07:04 AM   #686
BroncoBeavis
Ring of Famer
 
BroncoBeavis's Avatar
 
Meh. Anyone can.

Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 22,192

Adopt-a-Bronco:
None
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyR View Post
You think 20,000 troops is going to solve Iraq's problems? Lol. I wouldn't bet on it.
It wouldn't solve many problems. Militaries rarely do.

It would only provide a ballast for some stability to see if it can work out some of its problems.
BroncoBeavis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 07:09 AM   #687
DenverBrit
Just hanging out.
 
DenverBrit's Avatar
 
Got a breath mint??

Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Denver
Posts: 15,182

Adopt-a-Bronco:
The Team
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pricejj View Post
You think providing 575 "advisors" (Navy Seals and Marines), is going to solve Iraq's problems? Lol. I wouldn't bet on it. There is no more Iraq. Iran is just bigger now, and chaos is spreading.

The Iraqis will continue to fight until their time is due. The only US interest in the region make sure Iran is abiding by the anti-nuclear proliferation treaty.
Which part of the "real solution is political" didn't you understand?

Iraq may well be finished as a nation, going back to natural ethnic borders could easily be the final play.

Again, the solution is political.
DenverBrit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 07:11 AM   #688
cutthemdown
A verbis ad verbera
 
cutthemdown's Avatar
 

Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 37,847
Default

You can't solve social and economic problems with a military by itself, but without security you have nothing. Tonyr is a joke who is making illogical arguments like a military can't make the ISIS rebels love Shia Islam. That is true but it doesn't mean that our military isn't needed to restore order and provide stability, just like it does in S Korea.
cutthemdown is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 07:12 AM   #689
cutthemdown
A verbis ad verbera
 
cutthemdown's Avatar
 

Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 37,847
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DenverBrit View Post
Which part of the "real solution is political" didn't you understand?

Iraq may well be finished as a nation, going back to natural ethnic borders could easily be the final play.

Again, the solution is political.
If the solution was an election Obama could give speeches for then we would be good.
cutthemdown is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 07:13 AM   #690
DenverBrit
Just hanging out.
 
DenverBrit's Avatar
 
Got a breath mint??

Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Denver
Posts: 15,182

Adopt-a-Bronco:
The Team
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cutthemdown View Post
For sure 20 thousand with the green light to attack when needed, with air support, could have stopped all of this. No doubt about that.
Being seen to be fighting for Shia vs Sunni and killing Sunni civilians would be a disaster.

DenverBrit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 07:14 AM   #691
DenverBrit
Just hanging out.
 
DenverBrit's Avatar
 
Got a breath mint??

Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Denver
Posts: 15,182

Adopt-a-Bronco:
The Team
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cutthemdown View Post
If the solution was an election Obama could give speeches for then we would be good.
He's the bestest at speeches.
DenverBrit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 07:44 AM   #692
TonyR
Franchise Poster
 
TonyR's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Mid-Atlantic
Posts: 28,150
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cutthemdown View Post
Tonyr is a joke who is making illogical arguments...
Fantastic stuff! The guy who relates the Iraq situation to when he played with little green, plastic army men when he was a kid calling other people "jokes"! cut, I thank you for the ongoing levity you bring here. Sincerely!
TonyR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 08:04 AM   #693
Rohirrim
Partisan
 
Rohirrim's Avatar
 
And so it goes...

Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Trumpville
Posts: 68,683
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cutthemdown View Post
You can't solve social and economic problems with a military by itself, but without security you have nothing. Tonyr is a joke who is making illogical arguments like a military can't make the ISIS rebels love Shia Islam. That is true but it doesn't mean that our military isn't needed to restore order and provide stability, just like it does in S Korea.
Hell, we had a hundred thousand troops in Iraq and couldn't even secure the Green Zone. Give me a ****ing break. Put twenty thousand Americans in Iraq and you know what you've got? Twenty thousand targets. Your entire argument is not only bull****, it is PROVEN bull****.

S. Korea is such an entirely different situation it's like comparing flamingos and oak trees. The differences between the two would require a list running to pages, not least of which is that S. Korea has one of the most capable militaries on Earth and doesn't even need us. Comparing Iraq to S. Korea is extraordinarily ignorant. There is zero comparison.
Rohirrim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 08:12 AM   #694
BroncoBeavis
Ring of Famer
 
BroncoBeavis's Avatar
 
Meh. Anyone can.

Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 22,192

Adopt-a-Bronco:
None
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rohirrim View Post
Hell, we had a hundred thousand troops in Iraq and couldn't even secure the Green Zone. Give me a ****ing break. Put twenty thousand Americans in Iraq and you know what you've got? Twenty thousand targets. Your entire argument is not only bull****, it is PROVEN bull****.

S. Korea is such an entirely different situation it's like comparing flamingos and oak trees. The differences between the two would require a list running to pages, not least of which is that S. Korea has one of the most capable militaries on Earth and doesn't even need us. Comparing Iraq to S. Korea is extraordinarily ignorant. There is zero comparison.
Nobody's comparing modern S. Korea to Iraq. The comparison was about when the DMZ was set a half-century ago, and how we never worked up any withdrawal schedules for election years. We said we'd leave when it made sense to leave. That's how you generate a sense of stability.

But we still have a reason for being there. Mostly as a deterrent to China and its puppet in the North.
BroncoBeavis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 08:31 AM   #695
Rigs11
Ring of Famer
 
Rigs11's Avatar
 

Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 8,817
Default

let them fight it out. for all your 'conservatives' out there, don't we have enough debt already? shouldn't you be more worried about denying food stamps to americans or stopping the evil gays?
Rigs11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 11:23 AM   #696
Rohirrim
Partisan
 
Rohirrim's Avatar
 
And so it goes...

Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Trumpville
Posts: 68,683
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BroncoBeavis View Post
Nobody's comparing modern S. Korea to Iraq. The comparison was about when the DMZ was set a half-century ago, and how we never worked up any withdrawal schedules for election years. We said we'd leave when it made sense to leave. That's how you generate a sense of stability.

But we still have a reason for being there. Mostly as a deterrent to China and its puppet in the North.
Here's the reality: George W. Bush created ISIS. George W. Bush installed Maliki who has been working for Iran ever since. George W. Bush, and his neocon revolution, in trying to hedge Iran, instead delivered for them, on a silver platter, their greatest victory.
Rohirrim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 12:15 PM   #697
pricejj
jungle
 
pricejj's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 19,871
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyR View Post
You think 20,000 troops is going to solve Iraq's problems? Lol. I wouldn't bet on it.
Please quit making things up, it just makes you look foolish.
pricejj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 12:18 PM   #698
cutthemdown
A verbis ad verbera
 
cutthemdown's Avatar
 

Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 37,847
Default

Obama and everything he does is a trainwreck. Listening to liberals try and make it out to not by any of his fault is amusing.

Prepare your anuses for a midterm raping lol.
cutthemdown is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 12:19 PM   #699
BroncoBeavis
Ring of Famer
 
BroncoBeavis's Avatar
 
Meh. Anyone can.

Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 22,192

Adopt-a-Bronco:
None
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rohirrim View Post
Here's the reality: George W. Bush created ISIS. George W. Bush installed Maliki who has been working for Iran ever since. George W. Bush, and his neocon revolution, in trying to hedge Iran, instead delivered for them, on a silver platter, their greatest victory.
Funny things happen when power vacuums are left behind.

Had we abandoned S Korea a few years later, we'd likely be looking at a unified Korean Chinese Puppet state today. And nobody ever accused Rhee of being a nice dude.

As Colin Powell said leading up to Iraq. Plink the tinpots and run is a disastrous way to deal with foreign affairs. If you want other, more recent examples, you need not look far.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...-in-libya.html
BroncoBeavis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 12:33 PM   #700
Rohirrim
Partisan
 
Rohirrim's Avatar
 
And so it goes...

Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Trumpville
Posts: 68,683
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BroncoBeavis View Post
Funny things happen when power vacuums are left behind.

Had we abandoned S Korea a few years later, we'd likely be looking at a unified Korean Chinese Puppet state today. And nobody ever accused Rhee of being a nice dude.

As Colin Powell said leading up to Iraq. Plink the tinpots and run is a disastrous way to deal with foreign affairs. If you want other, more recent examples, you need not look far.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...-in-libya.html
There is reality and then there is Right Wing bubble-speak. All you ever post is bubble-speak.
Rohirrim is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes



Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 03:38 PM.


Denver Broncos