The Orange Mane -  a Denver Broncos Fan Community  

Go Back   The Orange Mane - a Denver Broncos Fan Community > Jibba Jabba > War, Religion and Politics Thread
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Chat Room Mark Forums Read



Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 11-04-2013, 07:02 PM   #26
UltimateHoboW/Shotgun
Don't piss off Manning.
 
UltimateHoboW/Shotgun's Avatar
 
Time to believe!

Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Gensis Planet
Posts: 6,544

Adopt-a-Bronco:
C.J. Anderson
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Garcia Bronco View Post
While single payer has numerous issues, it would be better than this nonsense.
http://news.heartland.org/newspaper-...us-health-care
Really? Canada has Single payer a top Canadian politician traveled here to get his heart looked at.
UltimateHoboW/Shotgun is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2013, 07:55 PM   #27
houghtam
Ring of Famer
 

Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 6,396
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by UltimateHoboW/Shotgun View Post
http://news.heartland.org/newspaper-...us-health-care
Really? Canada has Single payer a top Canadian politician traveled here to get his heart looked at.
Myths vs. Reality. Post #13. Maybe your dumb ass can start a new thread about that.

http://www.aarp.org/politics-society...alth-care.html

Stuff it, clown.
houghtam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2013, 08:22 PM   #28
Bronco Yoda
.
 
Bronco Yoda's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 8,848
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by UltimateHoboW/Shotgun View Post
http://news.heartland.org/newspaper-...us-health-care
Really? Canada has Single payer a top Canadian politician traveled here to get his heart looked at.
BFD. We go single payer too what then? All the doctors leave North America? Me no think so.
Bronco Yoda is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2013, 08:26 PM   #29
houghtam
Ring of Famer
 

Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 6,396
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronco Yoda View Post
BFD. We go single payer too what then? All the doctors leave North America? Me no think so.
Even if they did all leave North America, where would they go? Please, UltimateMonkeyW/Keyboard, list for me all the developed nations without single payer healthcare that these doctors would go to...
houghtam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2013, 09:37 PM   #30
BroncoBeavis
Ring of Famer
 
BroncoBeavis's Avatar
 
New to the Forum

Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 3,216

Adopt-a-Bronco:
None
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by houghtam View Post
Even if they did all leave North America, where would they go? Please, UltimateMonkeyW/Keyboard, list for me all the developed nations without single payer healthcare that these doctors would go to...
The best ones wouldn't accept government-pay. Or they'd severely restrict how much of it they do.
BroncoBeavis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2013, 09:41 PM   #31
UltimateHoboW/Shotgun
Don't piss off Manning.
 
UltimateHoboW/Shotgun's Avatar
 
Time to believe!

Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Gensis Planet
Posts: 6,544

Adopt-a-Bronco:
C.J. Anderson
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronco Yoda View Post
BFD. We go single payer too what then? All the doctors leave North America? Me no think so.
No. It'll They retire and stop going to med school. There is a reason America has the best health care. And its not because of government.
UltimateHoboW/Shotgun is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2013, 09:43 PM   #32
DenverBrit
Just hanging out.
 
DenverBrit's Avatar
 
Got a breath mint??

Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Denver
Posts: 12,483

Adopt-a-Bronco:
The Team
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by UltimateHoboW/Shotgun View Post
http://news.heartland.org/newspaper-...us-health-care
Really? Canada has Single payer a top Canadian politician traveled here to get his heart looked at.
And nearly 1 million US citizens went overseas for surgery and other healthcare treatments.

What's your point??
DenverBrit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2013, 09:48 PM   #33
UltimateHoboW/Shotgun
Don't piss off Manning.
 
UltimateHoboW/Shotgun's Avatar
 
Time to believe!

Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Gensis Planet
Posts: 6,544

Adopt-a-Bronco:
C.J. Anderson
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by houghtam View Post
Myths vs. Reality. Post #13. Maybe your dumb ass can start a new thread about that.

http://www.aarp.org/politics-society...alth-care.html

Stuff it, clown.
/ That article address nothing. Deflect all you want. Canada, England health care system sucks and you know it. Why would I or anybody believe you. You beieve obama's "You like it, you can keep it!" line.
UltimateHoboW/Shotgun is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2013, 09:50 PM   #34
UltimateHoboW/Shotgun
Don't piss off Manning.
 
UltimateHoboW/Shotgun's Avatar
 
Time to believe!

Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Gensis Planet
Posts: 6,544

Adopt-a-Bronco:
C.J. Anderson
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DenverBrit View Post
And nearly 1 million US citizens went overseas for surgery and other healthcare treatments.

What's your point??
You got a 1 million? . I got 10 million from China, Canada, England, Mexico coming here for the free ER care.
UltimateHoboW/Shotgun is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2013, 10:00 PM   #35
houghtam
Ring of Famer
 

Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 6,396
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by UltimateHoboW/Shotgun View Post
/ That article address nothing. Deflect all you want. Canada, England health care system sucks and you know it. Why would I or anybody believe you. You beieve obama's "You like it, you can keep it!" line.
There you have it, folks.

They let anyone on the internets these days.

houghtam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2013, 12:21 AM   #36
peacepipe
Ring of Famer
 
New to the Forum

Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 7,042

Adopt-a-Bronco:
None
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by houghtam View Post
There you have it, folks.

They let anyone on the internets these days.

You can't waste your time dealing with the crap ultimatebobow/****4brains spews. That idiot wouldn't understand what the truth/facts are if it were drawn in crayon.
peacepipe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2013, 06:51 AM   #37
DenverBrit
Just hanging out.
 
DenverBrit's Avatar
 
Got a breath mint??

Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Denver
Posts: 12,483

Adopt-a-Bronco:
The Team
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by UltimateHoboW/Shotgun View Post
You got a 1 million? . I got 10 million from China, Canada, England, Mexico coming here for the free ER care.
As usual, you have no point, you're just a Troll.
DenverBrit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2013, 07:24 AM   #38
cutthemdown
A verbis ad verbera
 
cutthemdown's Avatar
 
Zimm to HOF

Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Long Beach
Posts: 36,851
Default

Also any delay of the mandate could be problematic for Obamacare. If they delay the healthy having to sign up then the system won't have enough money coming in, only going out. All the sick sign up, the healthy do not etc. Insurance companies could lose a ton of money then next yr raise rates to make up for it.
cutthemdown is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2013, 07:29 AM   #39
cutthemdown
A verbis ad verbera
 
cutthemdown's Avatar
 
Zimm to HOF

Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Long Beach
Posts: 36,851
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronco Yoda View Post
BFD. We go single payer too what then? All the doctors leave North America? Me no think so.
Probably just older ones retire and then not as many young people decide to be doctors.
cutthemdown is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2013, 08:05 AM   #40
UltimateHoboW/Shotgun
Don't piss off Manning.
 
UltimateHoboW/Shotgun's Avatar
 
Time to believe!

Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Gensis Planet
Posts: 6,544

Adopt-a-Bronco:
C.J. Anderson
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cutthemdown View Post
Probably just older ones retire and then not as many young people decide to be doctors.
There are a shortage of doctors already.
UltimateHoboW/Shotgun is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2013, 08:06 AM   #41
Pony Boy
"Whoa Nellie"
 
Pony Boy's Avatar
 
Omaha !!!

Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 7,649

Adopt-a-Bronco:
mellon head
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cutthemdown View Post
Probably just older ones retire and then not as many young people decide to be doctors.
You won't see a Doctor on the front line of your medical care, all of those duties will be performed by a Physician Assistant or a Nurse Practitioner.

Doctor’s fresh out of Medical School will go on to specialize in areas that will pay them for the time and money they have invested. There will not be Doctors willing to except Obama care fees unless they are doing payback for government student loans.
Pony Boy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2013, 08:11 AM   #42
Garcia Bronco
Hokie since 1993
 

Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 46,919

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Tom Jackson
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by UltimateHoboW/Shotgun View Post
There are a shortage of doctors already.
That's the hard part to understand in all this is we haven't really incentivized adding Doctors to the system.
Garcia Bronco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2013, 08:12 AM   #43
Garcia Bronco
Hokie since 1993
 

Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 46,919

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Tom Jackson
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pony Boy View Post
You won't see a Doctor on the front line of your medical care, all of those duties will be performed by a Physician Assistant or a Nurse Practitioner.

Doctor’s fresh out of Medical School will go on to specialize in areas that will pay them for the time and money they have invested. There will not be Doctors willing to except Obama care fees unless they are doing payback for government student loans.
NP's can handle most problems people have
Garcia Bronco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2013, 08:41 AM   #44
Pony Boy
"Whoa Nellie"
 
Pony Boy's Avatar
 
Omaha !!!

Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 7,649

Adopt-a-Bronco:
mellon head
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Garcia Bronco View Post
NP's can handle most problems people have
You're right most that are selected to attend NP school are the cream from the top of the nursing field but with the huge demand for NP's that will probably diminish somewhat. The worry is they are not trained to diagnose a major health issue that may not show any symptoms.

What I see coming would be similar to the military, where a Doctor fresh out of Medical school will be offered a student loan payback if they work 5 years in the Obama care system. I also see Obama care stepping in to offer them protection from any malpractice action as long as they work for the government.
Pony Boy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2013, 08:43 AM   #45
BroncoBeavis
Ring of Famer
 
BroncoBeavis's Avatar
 
New to the Forum

Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 3,216

Adopt-a-Bronco:
None
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cutthemdown View Post
Also any delay of the mandate could be problematic for Obamacare. If they delay the healthy having to sign up then the system won't have enough money coming in, only going out. All the sick sign up, the healthy do not etc. Insurance companies could lose a ton of money then next yr raise rates to make up for it.
Yeah, the more I think about it, the more they're going to have to keep up the mandate charade as long as possible. But there's no way they actually enforce it with the penalty after next year.

How they're going to deal politically with more people losing their insurance under Obamacare than signing up for new policies is anyone's guess.

They're so fundamentally screwed I'm not even sure what the right move is at this point.
BroncoBeavis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2013, 09:59 AM   #46
UltimateHoboW/Shotgun
Don't piss off Manning.
 
UltimateHoboW/Shotgun's Avatar
 
Time to believe!

Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Gensis Planet
Posts: 6,544

Adopt-a-Bronco:
C.J. Anderson
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Garcia Bronco View Post
That's the hard part to understand in all this is we haven't really incentivized adding Doctors to the system.
Part of it is: why the hell does a doctor need a $1 million dollar insurance policy for malpractise?
UltimateHoboW/Shotgun is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2013, 09:59 AM   #47
DenverBrit
Just hanging out.
 
DenverBrit's Avatar
 
Got a breath mint??

Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Denver
Posts: 12,483

Adopt-a-Bronco:
The Team
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BroncoBeavis View Post
Yeah, the more I think about it, the more they're going to have to keep up the mandate charade as long as possible. But there's no way they actually enforce it with the penalty after next year.

How they're going to deal politically with more people losing their insurance under Obamacare than signing up for new policies is anyone's guess.

They're so fundamentally screwed I'm not even sure what the right move is at this point.
Bi-partisan cooperation to modify/overhaul the ACA is what should happen.

Constant whining about 'repealing' or 'de-funding' isn't going to work. The American public want sustainable and affordable healthcare for all, so trying to kill the bill instead of making it work is not the way forward.

The ACA in a sustainable bill is long overdue and so far has been handled miserably by both parties.
DenverBrit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2013, 10:10 AM   #48
DenverBrit
Just hanging out.
 
DenverBrit's Avatar
 
Got a breath mint??

Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Denver
Posts: 12,483

Adopt-a-Bronco:
The Team
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by UltimateHoboW/Shotgun View Post
Part of it is: why the hell does a doctor need a $1 million dollar insurance policy for malpractise?
Why not?? It's dirt cheap and has little impact on healthcare costs....despite the myths. Get rid of the frivolous law suits and the costs will go down further.

Malpractice a Tiny Percentage of Health Care Costs

Quote:
One of the principal myths surrounding medical malpractice is its effect on overall health care costs. Medical malpractice is actually a tiny percentage of health care costs, in part because medical malpractice claims are far less frequent than many people believe.
In 2004, the CBO calculated malpractice costs amounted to “less than 2 percent of overall health care spending. Thus, even a reduction of 25 percent to 30 percent in malpractice costs would lower health care costs by only about 0.4 percent to 0.5 percent, and the likely effect on health insurance premiums would be comparably small.” i

Five years later, the CBO revisited the issue of medical negligence costs. This time, they attempted to account for the indirect costs of medical negligence, mainly the idea that doctors order extra tests to avoid liability. Again, the CBO found that tort reform would only save 0.5 percent of all health care costs.ii

Other authorities have also found that the direct costs associated with medical negligence are a tiny fraction of health care costs. According to the National Association of Insurance Commissioners (NAIC), the total amount of money spent defending claims and compensating victims of medical negligence in 2010 was $5.8 billion, or just 0.3 percent of the $2.6 trillion spent on health care in the U.S. that same year.iii
http://www.justice.org/cps/rde/justice/hs.xsl/8686.htm
DenverBrit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2013, 10:20 AM   #49
BroncoBeavis
Ring of Famer
 
BroncoBeavis's Avatar
 
New to the Forum

Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 3,216

Adopt-a-Bronco:
None
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DenverBrit View Post
Why not?? It's dirt cheap and has little impact on healthcare costs....despite the myths. Get rid of the frivolous law suits and the costs will go down further.

Malpractice a Tiny Percentage of Health Care Costs


http://www.justice.org/cps/rde/justice/hs.xsl/8686.htm
Quote:
In 2004, the CBO calculated malpractice costs amounted to “less than 2 percent of overall health care spending.
Funny, that's pretty close to what the estimated cost of services for "The Uninsured" are.

Yet we needed world-changing, market-distorting federal intervention for that part.
BroncoBeavis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2013, 10:34 AM   #50
DenverBrit
Just hanging out.
 
DenverBrit's Avatar
 
Got a breath mint??

Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Denver
Posts: 12,483

Adopt-a-Bronco:
The Team
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BroncoBeavis View Post
Funny, that's pretty close to what the estimated cost of services for "The Uninsured" are.

Yet we needed world-changing, market-distorting federal intervention for that part.
The ACA has to have more impact on lowering costs and universal coverage of healthcare for it to work.

It is interesting that malpractice costs are almost identical to the uninsured costs.
DenverBrit is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes



Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 11:22 PM.


Denver Broncos