Defunding Obamacare - Can it happen?

[Taco John]

Originally Posted by frerottenextelway

http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/liv...se-republicans

Cruz has had a very bad day

Pshaw.... Talking points memo... Who cares.

It doesn't matter what these whiners are saying right now. Yelping like puppies just makes them look weak. The establishment is going to lash out agianst Cruz, but it won't matter. Cruz is playing the long game, and whether he wins or loses will be reflected by what happens at the mid terms in 2014.

[houghtam]

Originally Posted by frerottenextelway

Very bad day...

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/dc/cruz...utdown-debacle

Indeed.

He's a firebrand in the mold of Bachmann, and while he's more intelligent than she, he doesn't understand how Washington "works". That doesn't mean you need to go along with everything anyone says and business as usual, but when you go on nonsensical tirades, claim kinship with one of the great racists of the 20th Century, and call out fellow senators by name, flying in the face of all pre-established political mores of decorum, well...you're basically ****ed.

[frerottenextelway]

Originally Posted by Taco John

I think you underestimate how unpopular Obamacare is and will increasingly be as it goes into implementation over the election cycle.

I work for a Fortune 500 insurance company. It's not taking away jobs, period. It's covering 30 million people. The GOP has misrepresented it very well, but people support almost all the actual provisions in it (outside of mandate), and will eventually support it in great numbers.

[Bronco Yoda]

Originally Posted by Taco John

I don't think Christie has a prayer of winning it. He'll have establishment money backing him at a time when the base is trying to escape the establishment. I think what's going to happen is Christie will be perceived as too far left - Cruz will be perceived as too far right... and there in the center will be Rand Paul, who will walk away with the nomination after winning Iowa, New Hampshire, and Nevada. Cruz will win SC. Christie will win Florida. Eventually, Rand will be seen as the happy medium between the three.

Oh good grief TJ...With your anti-powers of political prognostication

I'd now put money on Christie

[houghtam]

Originally Posted by Taco John

I think you underestimate how unpopular Obamacare is and will increasingly be as it goes into implementation over the election cycle.

I think you underestimate how popular most of the individual tenets of Obamacare are with the country and how once they go into effect, people won't want to see them go away.

Except this time it will be angry old white men shouting at town halls "Take your government hands off my Obamacare!"

[houghtam]

Originally Posted by Bronco Yoda

Oh good grief TJ...With your anti-powers of political prognostication

I'd now put money on Christie

IKR

Just go look at the 2012 Election Thread.

Some real gems in there.

[Taco John]

Originally Posted by frerottenextelway

I work for a Fortune 500 insurance company. It's not taking away jobs, period. It's covering 30 million people. The GOP has misrepresented it very well, but people support almost all the actual provisions in it (outside of mandate), and will eventually support it in great numbers.

I work around small business. It's definitely taking away jobs, and causing small businesses to cut full time work forces into part time work forces except in mission critical positions. It's terrible legislation that will continue to do damage to the poor economically, and grow increasingly unpopular.

I'm not surprised that someone with an insurance agency favors the gravy train that they're on though. When you're riding easy money, it's the best thing in the world.

[frerottenextelway]

Originally Posted by houghtam

Indeed.

He's a firebrand in the mold of Bachmann, and while he's more intelligent than she, he doesn't understand how Washington "works". That doesn't mean you need to go along with everything anyone says and business as usual, but when you go on nonsensical tirades, claim kinship with one of the great racists of the 20th Century, and call out fellow senators by name, flying in the face of all pre-established political mores of decorum, well...you're basically ****ed.

Yeah. Plus his skin isn't the right shade of white for many GOP primary voters. Like Rubio.

[peacepipe]

Originally Posted by Taco John

Haha... Hillary is a mess. I welcome a Paul v. Hillary matchup knowing that Paul would pull a ton of Democrat voters if they run Neocon Hillary up there. The Democrats have huge cracks in their foundation right now, and those cracks are only going to become more pronounced the longer this lame duck presidency drones on...

The democrats have never been in a weaker position in my life time. In 2016, it is very likely that the Republicans will own all three branches of government.

based on what? what demographic is going to vote republican by such a wide margin that a republican wins the presidency? trust me once people realize how far to the right pauls policies are domesticly he'll be kicked out the door. I can agree with some of his policies on foreign issues but no way in hell is that going to outweigh his domestic policies. I would bet that you see more rethugs voting hillary then dems voting paul.

[Taco John]

Originally Posted by Bronco Yoda

Oh good grief TJ...With your anti-powers of political prognostication

I'd now put money on Christie

Not sure what you're talking about. I've got a great record of political prognostication, calling the Obama nomination years before it even happened. My track record is better than most.

[houghtam]

Originally Posted by Taco John

I work around small business. It's definitely taking away jobs, and causing small businesses to cut full time work forces into part time work forces except in mission critical positions. It's terrible legislation that will continue to do damage to the poor economically, and grow increasingly unpopular.

I'm not surprised that someone with an insurance agency favors the gravy train that they're on though. When you're riding easy money, it's the best thing in the world.

Businesses are always looking to do this. Now they just have something to blame it on other than greed.

[frerottenextelway]

Originally Posted by Taco John

I work around small business. It's definitely taking away jobs, and causing small businesses to cut full time work forces into part time work forces except in mission critical positions. It's terrible legislation that will continue to do damage to the poor economically, and grow increasingly unpopular.

I'm not surprised that someone with an insurance agency favors the gravy train that they're on though. When you're riding easy money, it's the best thing in the world.

Wish I made good money! I work for workers comp btw, so it's irrelevant to me, but I know the industry inside and out.

[houghtam]

Originally Posted by frerottenextelway

Yeah. Plus his skin isn't the right shade of white for many GOP primary voters. Like Rubio.

And he's Canadian.

*GASP*

[Taco John]

Originally Posted by houghtam

Businesses are always looking to do this. Now they just have something to blame it on other than greed.

Yes of course. Businesses are evil, yadda yadda yadda... That will be a great election message for people as they're losing their jobs.

[Taco John]

Gotta run. I've got a 30 mile ride I've got to do before it gets dark. Cycling is my health care strategy.

[frerottenextelway]

Originally Posted by Taco John

Gotta run. I've got a 30 mile ride I've got to do before it gets dark. Cycling is my health care strategy.

It was a good discussion. Not even any flames lol

[Rohirrim]

“Having practiced most of my career in the U.S., and now practicing in Canada, the contrast is quite evident. The U.S. health care system is not designed to get you the care you need, it is designed to get you the care that someone can make a profit giving you. If you're poor and uninsured, that's none - no matter how much you need it. If you're well-insured, it's a lot - including quite a bit you don't need, and even some that is harmful.”
Dr. Lee Green

[Rohirrim]

The US Government Accountability Office concluded that if we could get administrative costs of our medical system down to the Canadian level, the money saved would be enough to pay for health care for all the Americans who are uninsured.
http://www.theatlantic.com/business/...ensive/274425/

[Taco John]

Originally Posted by frerottenextelway

It was a good discussion. Not even any flames lol

Libertarians are actually pretty good at conversation if you give them a chance...

25 mile ride tonight, putting me over 550 miles for the ride season. Not too shabby...

[pricejj]

Originally Posted by Taco John

Mark my words - it'll come down to Paul, Cruz, and Christie, and in that equation Paul will walk away with the nomination.

^Marco Rubio by a landslide.


To all the Socialists, for all the crying you do about corporations, Obamacare is a HUGE cost shift away from corporations onto their employees and other taxpayers.

Congrats. The big, evil corporations couldn't have done a better job if they crafted the legislation themselves...oh wait....

You guys are such idiots.

[pricejj]

The most inexpensive, and efficient health care system will always be two party patient-doctor transactions where the individual takes responsibility for payment with pre-tax HSA's that can be used for education, healthcare, and retirement.

[Taco John]

Originally Posted by pricejj

^Marco Rubio by a landslide.


To all the Socialists, for all the crying you do about corporations, Obamacare is a HUGE cost shift away from corporations onto their employees and other taxpayers.

Congrats. The big, evil corporations couldn't have done a better job if they crafted the legislation themselves...oh wait....

You guys are such idiots.

Rubio doesn't have a snowball's chance. He's far too immature to be invested very heavily, and those that might are currently courting Christie. Rubio might be a worthwhile candidate in 2020 or 2024, but I have real doubts that he'd even carry Florida, which pretty well would be his finishing ground.

[Rohirrim]

I think the Republicans will do what they always do: Stand around in a circle and shoot each other in the feet.

[houghtam]

Rubio has been a no-go for months.

Get with the programs and follow some politics.

[pricejj]

Originally Posted by Taco John

Rubio doesn't have a snowball's chance. He's far too immature to be invested very heavily, and those that might are currently courting Christie. Rubio might be a worthwhile candidate in 2020 or 2024, but I have real doubts that he'd even carry Florida, which pretty well would be his finishing ground.

Rubio would be same age as Obama during entering 1st term (47). He would also have the support of the fiscal conservative base, he's extremely personable, smart, and photogenic.

Perfect candidate to beat Hillary Clinton.