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Old 08-25-2013, 01:30 PM   #76
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Originally Posted by mhgaffney View Post
Check out this video with Dr Chris Busby, an expert on health effects from radiation.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E4Kkuo-IK-A

It turns out that radioactive cesium 137 causes vascular disease -- in a matter of months. There has been an explosive increase in strokes and heart attacks -- in Japan since the event. Especially in children.
Uh, controversial theories from a showman who insists on making videos and taking pictures donning a beanie and carrying a pipe aren't particularly impressive.
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Old 08-26-2013, 10:01 AM   #77
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Show me the data that supports the above assertions, please.
Typical misrepresentation of data. You take a dataset, discard the actual explanation, find a new hypothesis and present it as fact.

Vascular diseases and stroke spiked following the 2011 earthquake and tsunami following well described evidence from previous disasters in Japan that earthquakes are always followed by short lived increases in cardiovascular diseases. The reasons are well described, it is caused by discontinuation of medication due to infrastructure disruptions, sympathetic nervous responses causing increases in blood pressure, changes to diets and exercise, ingestion and inhalation of toxins and infections.

The same thing happened during the Kobe earthquake, and this same response was seen immediately following the Tohoku quake and tsunami all over the region, even before ***ushima began leaking and also in seen in regions that were exposed to excess radiation.

People abusing scientific data by substituting their own irrational claims as explanatory are very dangerous. This is no different than the claim that fetuses can feel pain at 20 weeks.
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Old 08-26-2013, 11:11 AM   #78
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Typical misrepresentation of data. You take a dataset, discard the actual explanation, find a new hypothesis and present it as fact.

Vascular diseases and stroke spiked following the 2011 earthquake and tsunami following well described evidence from previous disasters in Japan that earthquakes are always followed by short lived increases in cardiovascular diseases. The reasons are well described, it is caused by discontinuation of medication due to infrastructure disruptions, sympathetic nervous responses causing increases in blood pressure, changes to diets and exercise, ingestion and inhalation of toxins and infections.

The same thing happened during the Kobe earthquake, and this same response was seen immediately following the Tohoku quake and tsunami all over the region, even before ***ushima began leaking and also in seen in regions that were exposed to excess radiation.

People abusing scientific data by substituting their own irrational claims as explanatory are very dangerous. This is no different than the claim that fetuses can feel pain at 20 weeks.
What a bunch of BS.

You are a good example of denial.

No, the same pattern was seen after Chernobyl -- as Dr Busby states in his interview.
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Old 08-26-2013, 11:33 AM   #79
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What a bunch of BS.

You are a good example of denial.

No, the same pattern was seen after Chernobyl -- as Dr Busby states in his interview.
What he is saying is any disaster will cause a spike and this does not have to involve radiation so saying Chernobyl has the same issues does not defeat his argument.
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Old 08-26-2013, 01:00 PM   #80
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Originally Posted by mhgaffney View Post
What a bunch of BS.

You are a good example of denial.

No, the same pattern was seen after Chernobyl -- as Dr Busby states in his interview.
Show me the data.
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Old 08-26-2013, 01:47 PM   #81
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What he is saying is any disaster will cause a spike and this does not have to involve radiation so saying Chernobyl has the same issues does not defeat his argument.
So after a tsunami -- there will be a spike in children having heart attacks? This is preposterous. In fact, it's so obviously ridiculous it does not rate a reply.

Such a spike in children is very unusual -- but given what is known about radiation it is not really surprising. Children are 1000 X more vulnerable to radiation because children are growing, hence, their DNA is undergoing rapid replication. It is well known that radiation causes damage during cell division.

I challenge Gyldenglove to present data showing such a pattern in children after tsunamis or hurricanes. MHG
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Old 08-26-2013, 10:47 PM   #82
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***ushima in freefall: radioactive water filters taken offline, Tepco in desperation as leaks just won't stop
Tuesday, August 27, 2013
by Mike Adams, the Health Ranger
Editor of NaturalNews.com (See all articles...)
Tags: ***ushima, radiation leaks, desperation


3,359
1

(NaturalNews) After a 29-month cover-up, the Tokyo Electric Power Co (Tepco) is now calling for international help and has all but admitted ***ushima's radiation leaks are spiraling out of control. In addition to the leaking water storage units that are unleashing hundreds of tons of radioactive water each day, Tepco now says 50% of its contaminated water filtration capability has been taken offline due to corrosion.

The result is that radiation leaks are escalating out of control and attempted remediation efforts are faltering. This is in addition to the fact the Japanese government's attempted brainwashing propaganda campaign has also been exposed. It attempted to convince people that if they drank beer or smiled, they would be immune to radiation poisoning. (Yes, this is how desperate they've become...)

From day one, the ***ushima fiasco has been all about denial: Deny the leaks, shut off the radiation sensors, black out the news and fudge the science. Yet more than two years later, the denials are colliding with the laws of physics, and Tepco's cover stories are increasingly being blown wide open.

As Businessweek.com now reports, Japan seems to have no practical interest in solving this problem:

Russia's nuclear company, Rosatom, of which Rosenergoatom is a unit, sent Japan a 5 kilogram (11 pound) sample of an absorbent that could be used at ***ushima almost three years ago, Asmolov said. It also formed working groups ready to help Japan on health effect assessment, decontamination, and fuel management, among others, Asmolov said. The assistance was never used, he said.

That's because for Tepco to welcome any assistance, it would first have to admit it has a problem. And that's unacceptable in a business culture where egos run rampant and the idea of taking responsibility for your actions is considered abhorrent.

To save their own careers, Tepco experts would gladly sacrifice the health of millions of Japanese citizens.

27 families file suit against TEPCO

The problem with denial in the face of a world-class radiation disaster is that sooner or later the body bags start to pile up. Now, 74 people from 27 families are filing suit in the Osaka District Court, seeking 15 million Yen each for psychological and physical damage. (And they are the lucky ones who are still living.)

As Japan Times reports:

The group will argue that Tepco should have taken stronger measures to protect the ***ushima No. 1 nuclear plant from earthquakes and tsunami after the government's Headquarters for Earthquake Research Promotion warned in 2002 that there was a 20 percent chance of a magnitude 8 or so quake occurring in the Japan Trench in the Pacific Ocean within 30 years.

Fishing ban reinstated

Part of the ***ushima denial was the claim that fish were somehow not being irradiated by the numerous leaks of highly radioactive water. This cover-up was further enforced by lifting a fishing ban that had been announced in the days following the original ***ushima meltdown event in 2011.

Now that fishing ban has been reinstated. Australian reporter Mark Willacy visited the fishermen to get their reaction to the news, and what he reported sounds right in line with what we're seeing, too:

[The fishermen] are very angry. They've obviously believed that Tepco has been lying to them for weeks, if not months. You know, they seem to suggest that that the cover-ups get worse... They believe Tepco's probably sitting on more secrets that they don't want anyone to know about. So there's a feeling that Tepco just cannot be trusted and that these fisherman probably don't really feel like they have a future anymore.


Learn more: http://www.naturalnews.com/041800_**...#ixzz2d95j59Db
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Old 08-27-2013, 01:18 AM   #83
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So after a tsunami -- there will be a spike in children having heart attacks? This is preposterous. In fact, it's so obviously ridiculous it does not rate a reply.

Such a spike in children is very unusual -- but given what is known about radiation it is not really surprising. Children are 1000 X more vulnerable to radiation because children are growing, hence, their DNA is undergoing rapid replication. It is well known that radiation causes damage during cell division.

I challenge Gyldenglove to present data showing such a pattern in children after tsunamis or hurricanes. MHG
I've got a challenge to you first - show me the data upon which you're basing all these assertions.

Get me the data, let me replicate the analysis that was made to verify that it correct, then we'll talk.

Where's the data?
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Old 08-27-2013, 08:01 AM   #84
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Originally Posted by mhgaffney View Post
So after a tsunami -- there will be a spike in children having heart attacks? This is preposterous. In fact, it's so obviously ridiculous it does not rate a reply.

Such a spike in children is very unusual -- but given what is known about radiation it is not really surprising. Children are 1000 X more vulnerable to radiation because children are growing, hence, their DNA is undergoing rapid replication. It is well known that radiation causes damage during cell division.

I challenge Gyldenglove to present data showing such a pattern in children after tsunamis or hurricanes. MHG
No, I wrote after an earthquake. Here is the data for the 1995 Kobe earthquake - stroke and cerebral infarcts were significantly elevated for all age groups in the impacted areas in the 1st year after the quake.

http://journals.cambridge.org/downlo...3a1a9fe14560df

A bit of the old googles could have told you that.
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Old 08-27-2013, 08:13 AM   #85
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***ushima in freefall: radioactive water filters taken offline, Tepco in desperation as leaks just won't stop
Tuesday, August 27, 2013
by Mike Adams, the Health Ranger
Editor of NaturalNews.com (See all articles...)
Tags: ***ushima, radiation leaks, desperation

The resource you are looking for has been removed, had its name changed, or is temporarily unavailable.
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Old 08-27-2013, 08:20 AM   #86
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What a bunch of BS.

You are a good example of denial.

No, the same pattern was seen after Chernobyl -- as Dr Busby states in his interview.
No, there is no evidence at all that stroke rates were elevated immediately following Chernobyl and the only group who have shown an increased rate of stroke and other cerebrovascular diseases are clean-up workers who were exposed to much more radiation, but this was a late effect and not seen until 10-15 years later.
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Old 08-27-2013, 08:20 AM   #87
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For some reason you have to go here;

http://www.naturalnews.com

and click on the story on the main page
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Old 08-27-2013, 03:10 PM   #88
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http://samuel-warde.com/2013/08/radi...ifornia-coast/

Radioactive Bluefin Tuna Caught Off California Coast
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Old 08-27-2013, 03:23 PM   #89
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No, there is no evidence at all that stroke rates were elevated immediately following Chernobyl and the only group who have shown an increased rate of stroke and other cerebrovascular diseases are clean-up workers who were exposed to much more radiation, but this was a late effect and not seen until 10-15 years later.

Check out this summary of the full range of health effects from Chernobyl. It was current as of 2006. The range of ill effects is shocking.
http://www.llrc.org/health/subtopic/...nesynopsis.htm

The affected human population -- Belarus was worst affected -- has been slammed. Human health has declined by every measurable factor, including IQ level.

You will notice that cardiovascular disease is one of the most prevalent issues. Children have clearly been hit the hardest. It appears that radiation vastly speeds up the aging process.

The overall picture is scary. The people of Belarus are basically doomed -- because it appears that there is no diminution with time. Things are getting worse -- in a word, regressing. The Japanese may face a similar bleak future. MHG


ECRR: Chernobyl 20 Years on. The Health Effects of the Chernobyl Accident


This is a summary of Chapter One of the ECRR book. It was prepared as part of LLRC's complaint to the BBC's Editorial Complaints Unit about a documentary, Nuclear Nightmares transmitted 13th July 2006 as part of the BBC's science output.

The following is not intended to be scientifically robust — it's just a guide to the contents. For detail please refer to the ECRR 2006 or the original researchers. The health conditions are listed in the order they appear in the book. The presence of a condition here indicates that the parameter has worsened since the accident and many of the studies report a dose dependent relationship.

Here is the list of health effects:

Stillbirths, miscarriages, infant mortality, general mortality, cancer mortality, sudden deaths.

Thyroid cancer.

The 40 % increase in all malignancies between 1990 and 2000 correlates with radioactive fallout levels. The list of cancer sites includes retinoblastoma, lung, intestines, colon, kidneys, female breast, bladder, respiratory organs, nervous system, pancreas, all cancers in children.

Psychological diseases correlate with levels of radioactive pollution. There is a steep and continuing increase in diseases of the nervous system, e.g. congenital convulsive syndrome, brain circulation pathology, general neurological diseases, short-term memory loss, deterioration of attention function in school-children.

In adults there is growing evidence of a syndrome marked by deteriorating memory and motor skills, occurrence of convulsions, and pulsing headaches. This is caused by the destruction of brain cells and in the region has been dubbed Chernobyl dementia.

In the Chernobyl territories cataracts have become a common disease.

Urogenital illnesses correlate with levels of radioactive pollution, and include interruption of pregnancy, gestosis, premature birth, inflammation of female genitals, ovarian cysts, uterine fibroma, menstrual irregularities, kidney infections, kidney stones, stones in urinary passages, infringements of sexual development, complications of pregnancy and births, failures of pregnancy, medical abortions, infertility, pathology of sperm, sclerocystosis, early impotence in men aged 25 - 30, structural changes of testiculus, spermatogenesis disturbances, lactation in 70- year old women, and delayed puberty as well as accelerated sexual development.

Diseases of the cardio-vascular system and blood are one of the most common consequences of the Chernobyl radioactive pollution:- anaemia, illnesses of the blood circulation system, arterial hypertensia or hypotensia, disturbances of heart rhythm and digestive systems, macrocitosis of lymphocytes, diseases of the blood and circulatory organs in adults, early atherosclerosis and ischemic heart disease, leucopenia, infringement of the blood supply in legs, changes in abundance and activity of leukocytes.

There is much evidence correlating fallout levels with endocrine/hormone diseases, e.g. incidence rate for Type 1 diabetes mellitus in Belarus.

Similarly thyroid gland diseases (autoimmune thyroiditis, thyrotoxicosis, diabetes etc.). In 1993 more than 40 % of the surveyed children in the Gomel area of Belarus had an enlarged thyroid gland. Experts think up to 1.5 million people in Belarus are at risk of pathology of the thyroid gland.

In some of the Chernobyl-polluted territories immune systems are compromised, with changes to cellular and humoral immunity, decreased maintenance T- and B- lymphocytes, reduced resistance to infections and other diseases, raised frequency and expressiveness of tonsillitis, lymphadenopathies and lowered resistance to cancer.

In the radioactively polluted territories the typical consequence of infringement of the immune system appears as an immuno-deficiency. An increase in frequency and intensity of both acute and chronic diseases is observed everywhere in the Chernobyl polluted territories. Sometimes the weakening of the immune system in these radioactively polluted territories is referred to as Chernobyl AIDS.

There is accelerated ageing among the people in radioactively polluted territories in the Ukraine: their biological age exceeds their actual age by 7 - 9 years. In highly polluted territories in Belarus the mean age of men and women who died from heart attacks was 8 years younger than the average across Belarus.

The array of diseases commonly considered exclusive to the elderly is now typical for children in all of the heavily polluted territories. The immune system activity of these children is similar to the type of immune system activity experienced in old age. The pathology of the digestive system epithelium in children from the polluted areas of Belarus also shows similarities with elderly people.

There are many studies showing a wide range of chromosomal aberrations in the Chernobyl radioactively polluted areas. Examples:- higher frequency of chromosomal aberrations in somatic cells, lowered mitotic index in polluted districts, increased mutation rates in satellite DNA, chromosomal aberrations and satellite DNA mutations increased in children with thyroid cancer, chromosomal mutations de novo higher in polluted territories.

In the polluted territories, compared with clean ones, there is increasing morbidity by intestinal toxicosis, gastro-enteritis, dysbacteriosis, sepses, respiratory viruses, herpes infections, trichocephalisis, pneumocistis, cryptosporidosis, tuberculosis, viral hepatitis, cytomegalovirus (CMV) infection. Microsporia occur in the radioactively polluted territories of the Bryansk areas (Russia) more frequently and in a more virulent form.

There are increases in children’s general morbidity, and increases in rare illnesses in the Chernobyl polluted territories of Ukraine, Belarus and Russia; It is clear that children in heavily radio-polluted territories really do suffer, to a much greater degree, from a variety of diseases.

Practically all forms of studied nosology are more prevalent […] [there is] a convincing picture of sharply worsening health in children from the polluted territories. Conditions listed under this heading are:- chronic gastritis, chronic duodenitis, chronic gastro-duodenitis, bilious dyskinesia, vegeto-vascular and cardiac syndrome, astheno-neurotic syndrome, chronic tonsillitis, caries, chronic periodontitis.

Total child morbidity in Ukraine increased by 2.9 times between 1986 and 2001, newborn morbidity in Belarus increases year-on-year at a rate of 9.5% with greatest increases in the most polluted Gomel area. The spectrum of children’s non-cancer illnesses in the polluted territories includes lowered birthweight in those irradiated in utero in Ukraine, reduced head circumference in newborns in the polluted territories of Ukraine and Belarus, (this is known from Hiroshima also and is recognised as a radiation teratogenic effect), infringements of the rate of physical development in those irradiated in utero, premature birth more common in the polluted territories of Belarus, delayed rate of growth in the radioactively polluted parts of Belarus.

Respiratory system diseases occurred everywhere in the polluted territories and tend to correlate with levels of radioactive pollution:- asphyxia was observed in half of the 345 surveyed newborns irradiated in utero in Ukraine (presumably this was a study of peri-natal mortality). Other pathologies were latent bronchospasm, bronchial asthma, chronic bronchitis, chronic nasopharyngeal pathology, acute respiratory diseases.

Cardiovascular system diseases in children occurred more frequently in the polluted territories, including infringements of cardiac rhythm, infringements of vegetative regulation of cardiac activity, arterial hypertension, reduced numbers of B- and T-lymphocytes, lymphopenia, brachycardia, lymphoid hyperplasia, haematological disease, heart conductivity, and reduced elasticity of arterial vessels even in apparently healthy children.

Dental diseases in children are more frequent in the Chernobyl radioactively polluted territories. The frequency of some dental diseases correlates with levels of radioactive pollution.

Congenital malformations. Increased rates of teratogenic effects reported all over Europe, with a dose dependent relationship found in a Bavarian study. In Europe there were also widespread increases in still birth, premature birth, low birth weight, Down's Syndrome, perinatal and neonatal deaths, and reduced birth rate. In Belarus, according to the Belarus National Genetic Monitoring Registry, there were post-Chernobyl increases in anencephaly, spina bifida, cleft lip, cleft palate, polydactyly, limb reduction, oesophageal atresia, anorectal atresia and multiple malformations. Many of the authors explicitly state that these phenomena are radiogenic. One, a researcher known for her caution, says only a third of congenital deformities of the face and jaw could be attributed to radiation. But it is a third, and those which are so attributed are said to be anomalously severe.

The proportion of children with impaired intellectual development is consistently greater in polluted areas. Irradiated children have not kept pace with other children. Disorders of intellectual development in children irradiated in utero in the polluted territories are described as the most tragic consequences of the Chernobyl catastrophe’s impact on health. The ECRR 2006 book has an entire chapter on the topic. Its author observes that the official French agency IRSN has recognised that the Central Nervous System is radiosensitive, while the Chernobyl Forum 2005 report has many gaps and even errors on mental, psychological and CNS effects, and even misrepresents WHO findings. Children irradiated in utero whose mothers had been evacuated or who lived in a zone contaminated with between 5 and 40 Ci/km2, suffered a greater frequency of neurotic disorders, CNS pathology and delay of mental development, compared with children in the less polluted areas of Belarus. The depression of intellectual development was massively greater in the irradiated group than in the controls; pathologies include neurotic disorders, asthenic syndrome, vegetative dystonia, CNS organic pathology, delayed mental development, EEG pathology, delayed development of speech, lowered psycho-emotional development, low IQ indices, deviations in mental development, memory impairment, immaturity for school, organic pathology of the brain, decreased and delayed psychomotor development, epilepsy and epilepsy-related conditions, and schizophrenia.

Last edited by mhgaffney; 08-27-2013 at 03:26 PM..
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Old 08-27-2013, 03:48 PM   #90
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Check out this summary of the full range of health effects from Chernobyl. It was current as of 2006. The range of ill effects is shocking.

The ECRR report isn't the final word.

http://www.hpa.org.uk/webw/HPAweb&HP...=1158945066127

I'm still waiting for the data that supports your assertions regarding Fookooshima.

Of course, you're one of those folks who pisses himself every time he hears "nuclear" or "radiation".

Probably "chemicals", too.
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Old 08-27-2013, 04:08 PM   #91
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http://samuel-warde.com/2013/08/radi...ifornia-coast/

Radioactive Bluefin Tuna Caught Off California Coast
Et tu, Charlie?
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Old 08-27-2013, 04:09 PM   #92
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Et tu, Charlie?
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Old 08-27-2013, 05:00 PM   #93
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Wags is not concerned with the immediate issue of radiation leaking into our oceans and showing up in the tuna caught off the shores of California yet he is fanatical about global warming that is decades away form doing serious harm in lock step with the globalest's position. Coincidence, I think not.
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Old 08-27-2013, 06:58 PM   #94
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Not good. http://www.scientificamerican.com/ar...rage-tank-leak
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Old 08-27-2013, 07:50 PM   #95
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http://samuel-warde.com/2013/08/radi...ifornia-coast/

Radioactive Bluefin Tuna Caught Off California Coast
OH NO, THE SKY IS FALLING!

"It is a compound that does occur naturally in nature, however, the levels of cesium found in the tuna in 2012 had levels 3 percent higher than is usual. Measurements for this year haven’t been made available, or at least none that I have been able to find. I went looking for the effects of ingesting cesium."

3% increase in a trace amount is still just a trace amount. Normal background activity of tuna is 1 becquerel. This means this is adding 0.03 becquerels of activity to the tuna.

Put in more understandable terms, the radioactivity of one banana is 500 times the activity added to these tuna . (On banana has an activity of about 15 bequerels)

In other words, eat one banana and you've ingested 500 times the radioactivity that has been added to these tuna (and, because it's cesium in the tuna, it will have a similar biological effect as well since cesium is a chemical analog to potassium).

"The half life of cesium 134 is 2.0652 years. For cesium 137, the half life is 30.17 years."

Ohhh.. I'm even more scared now. Look at that 30 year half life! Luckily the biological half life (the half life that actually matters in this case) is 70 days.

For reference, the half life of potassium-40 (the radioactive isotope found in bananas is 1.25 billion years). However, just like the cesium, the biological half-life is 70 days (again, because cesium is a chemical analog of potassium).

Put your thinking cap on guys. The sky is not falling.

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Old 08-27-2013, 08:03 PM   #96
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Oh, and for the scientifically literate:

The decay energy of k-40 is actually more than the decay energy of cs-137 (1.33MeV vs 1.176MeV) and both are beta radiation.

For the non scientifically literate, that means the potassium in your banana is actually slightly more dangerous (more tissue damaging energy released) than the cesium when both have the same activity (bequerels).
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Old 08-27-2013, 08:23 PM   #97
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We're sorry, the page you were looking for could not be found.
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Old 08-27-2013, 08:56 PM   #98
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We're sorry, the page you were looking for could not be found.
geeze, just quit whining and just correct the url in your browser address bar.
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Old 08-27-2013, 09:12 PM   #99
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Et tu, Charlie?
I won't eat food from the gulf either...crazy I know. Next thing ya know it be crazy to not eat it because it has electrolytes.
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Old 08-27-2013, 09:13 PM   #100
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Et tu, Charlie?
I won't eat food from the gulf either.
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