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Old 07-28-2013, 11:16 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by nyuk nyuk View Post
One thing I would suggest here, folks, and this is something that happens ALL the time in the media.

They publish ONE study with a scary or semi-scary result and they act like it's unquestioned fact and the world is ending.

Don't blindly swallow it. It's one study, folks.
There have been dozens of studies published about these issues. The Right Wing has purely political reasons for ignoring, or discrediting them. Since the chief purveyors and supporters of the anti-scientific campaign are organizations like energy companies and the Koch Bros., their obvious reason for doing so is greed.
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Old 07-28-2013, 01:46 PM   #27
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There have been dozens of studies published about these issues. The Right Wing has purely political reasons for ignoring, or discrediting them. Since the chief purveyors and supporters of the anti-scientific campaign are organizations like energy companies and the Koch Bros., their obvious reason for doing so is greed.
The article in this thread is about "a study." I will not shoot wet brown gobs across the room over one study. This thread is about one topic, not "these issues." You're lumping in things not even on this thread. Note the article, "a first of it's kind study." There is no plural here. One study. Uno. Me no poopie in panic.
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Old 07-31-2013, 07:56 AM   #28
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Gulf of Mexico dead zone is the size of Connecticut

The dead zone that has formed in the Gulf of Mexico this summer is smaller than predicted, but is still larger than average, spanning an area roughly the size of Connecticut. This zone, an area without oxygen and almost completely devoid of life that crops up every summer, covers 5,840 square miles (15,125 square kilometers), according to the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA).


In June, NOAA predicted the dead zone would be at least 20 percent larger this summer, expecting it to take up at least 7,286 square miles (18,871 square km).

Dead zones are the indirect result of nutrients, largely from fertilizer use, running off into rivers and then into bodies of water such as the gulf. Once these excess nutrients reach the ocean, they fuel algae blooms. The algae then die and decompose in a process that consumes oxygen and creates oxygen-free areas where fish and other aquatic creatures can't survive. This zone can have serious impacts on commercial and recreational fisheries on the Gulf Coast, causing fish die-offs.

But the dead zone this summer, the time of year when the phenomenon occurs, is larger than average: Over the past five years, the average dead zone has covered 5,176 square miles (13,405 km), according to NOAA. That's more than twice the 1,900-square- mile (4,921 square km) goal set by the Gulf of Mexico / Mississippi River Watershed Nutrient Task Force, a group that seeks to reduce the size of this lifeless area, according to NOAA.

http://www.nbcnews.com/science/gulf-...ut-6C10798946#
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Old 07-31-2013, 08:05 AM   #29
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I was watching a Georgia peach farmer on the news yesterday talking about how last year the drought destroyed his crop and this year excessive rain is destroying his crop.

Still waiting for the Red Staters to figure out how to add it all up.
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Old 07-31-2013, 09:35 AM   #30
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Gulf of Mexico dead zone is the size of Connecticut

The dead zone that has formed in the Gulf of Mexico this summer is smaller than predicted, but is still larger than average, spanning an area roughly the size of Connecticut. This zone, an area without oxygen and almost completely devoid of life that crops up every summer, covers 5,840 square miles (15,125 square kilometers), according to the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA).


In June, NOAA predicted the dead zone would be at least 20 percent larger this summer, expecting it to take up at least 7,286 square miles (18,871 square km).

Dead zones are the indirect result of nutrients, largely from fertilizer use, running off into rivers and then into bodies of water such as the gulf. Once these excess nutrients reach the ocean, they fuel algae blooms. The algae then die and decompose in a process that consumes oxygen and creates oxygen-free areas where fish and other aquatic creatures can't survive. This zone can have serious impacts on commercial and recreational fisheries on the Gulf Coast, causing fish die-offs.

But the dead zone this summer, the time of year when the phenomenon occurs, is larger than average: Over the past five years, the average dead zone has covered 5,176 square miles (13,405 km), according to NOAA. That's more than twice the 1,900-square- mile (4,921 square km) goal set by the Gulf of Mexico / Mississippi River Watershed Nutrient Task Force, a group that seeks to reduce the size of this lifeless area, according to NOAA.

http://www.nbcnews.com/science/gulf-...ut-6C10798946#

All too often life is a catch-22. Things people use to help things grow and not be devoured by insects to feed people then cause an effect somewhere else.
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Old 07-31-2013, 09:40 AM   #31
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I was watching a Georgia peach farmer on the news yesterday talking about how last year the drought destroyed his crop and this year excessive rain is destroying his crop.

Still waiting for the Red Staters to figure out how to add it all up.
Blindly accept alarmism? If global warming is behind every fluctuation in climate, then I guess it also caused the drying up of the natural harbor near the Great Pyramids and the unusual wet years on the Great Plains in the 1910s and early 1920s that encouraged over-farming before the Dust Bowl and the unusual 10+ years of extreme drought and unusually hot temperatures after the unusually wet period which brought on Dust Bowl conditions and killed thousands from dust pneumonia.

Meh.
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Old 07-31-2013, 10:23 AM   #32
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All too often life is a catch-22. Things people use to help things grow and not be devoured by insects to feed people then cause an effect somewhere else.
No! There is a simple and perfect balance out there with no unintended side effects. Only progressives know what it is. And they can't show it to you until you give them control over every aspect of your life.
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Old 07-31-2013, 10:58 AM   #33
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No! There is a simple and perfect balance out there with no unintended side effects. Only progressives know what it is. And they can't show it to you until you give them control over every aspect of your life.
Is there some sort of competition to see how many strawmen can be crammed into a single post?
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Old 07-31-2013, 11:02 AM   #34
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Is there some sort of competition to see how many strawmen can be crammed into a single post?
It's hard to scarecrow a war on fungicides in the midst of an era of record-breaking agricultural production.

Some things speak for themselves.
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Old 07-31-2013, 11:10 AM   #35
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No! There is a simple and perfect balance out there with no unintended side effects. Only progressives know what it is. And they can't show it to you until you give them control over every aspect of your life.
It involves destruction of industry and return to "green" living which involves third world squalor and having a gathering-based food economy, amirite?!
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Old 07-31-2013, 11:14 AM   #36
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All too often life is a catch-22. Things people use to help things grow and not be devoured by insects to feed people then cause an effect somewhere else.
The great turning point in the modern history of corn, which in turn marks a key turning point in the industrialization of our food, can be dated with some precision to the day in 1947 when the huge munitions plant at Muscle Shoals, Alabama, switched over from making explosives to making chemical fertilizer. After World War II, the government had found itself with a tremendous surplus of ammonium nitrate, the principal ingredient in the making of explosives. Ammonium nitrate also happens to be an excellent source of nitrogen for plants. Serious thought was given to spraying America's forests with the surplus chemical, to help the timber industry. But agronomists in the Department of Agriculture had a better idea: spread the ammonium nitrate on farmland as fertilizer. The chemical fertilizer industry (along with that of pesticides, which are based on the poison gases developed for war) is the product of the government's effort to convert its war machine to peacetime purposes. As the Indian farmer activist Vandana Shiva says in her speeches, "We're still eating the leftovers of World War II."

Read more: http://www.smithsonianmag.com/people...#ixzz2aeEgKQvu


Yeah. There are no alternatives. We must destroy the land to save ourselves, even though destroying the land eventually will destroy us. We must destroy the oceans in order to survive even if, unfortunately, destroying the oceans eventually destroys us. But the oceans are far away. Who cares? We're just not clever enough to figure out some other way to do it, I guess. And we certainly wouldn't want to upset the profit models of Conagra and Archer Daniels Midland.
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Old 07-31-2013, 11:17 AM   #37
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^^ That didn't answer anything I said and is a false dichotomy. The point is that everything has a consequence of some kind. That we aren't using a different technique isn't necessarily the result of a grand corporate conspiracy. Perhaps it's just we don't have an affordable alternative yet. And for all we know, alternatives may prove to be even more destructive.
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Old 07-31-2013, 11:27 AM   #38
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^^ That didn't answer anything I said and is a false dichotomy. The point is that everything has a consequence of some kind. That we aren't using a different technique isn't necessarily the result of a grand corporate conspiracy. Perhaps it's just we don't have an affordable alternative yet. And for all we know, alternatives may prove to be even more destructive.
It's not complex. We don't explore alternatives because of greed. Simple.
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Old 07-31-2013, 12:26 PM   #39
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It involves destruction of industry and return to "green" living which involves third world squalor and having a gathering-based food economy, amirite?!
You didn't go into the millions of middle-class $80k a year solar-panel installers paying all the bills. Other than that, I think you probably fairly summed up the super-secret utopian blueprint.

Although only David Miscavige probably knows for sure.
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Old 08-02-2013, 08:10 AM   #40
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http://seedstock.com/2013/07/25/with...w-income-area/

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Heads of lettuce may not seem life changing, but when you grow 3 million of them each year, the result can reinvigorate an entire area.

Such is the idea behind Green City Growers Cooperative’s greenhouse in Cleveland. At three-and-a-quarter acres, the greenhouse spans the equivalent of three football fields.

“It’s one of the largest local food initiatives in the United States,” said Mary Donnell, Green City Growers’ chief executive officer. It also ranks as the nation’s largest food production greenhouse in a core urban area.

Green City Growers Cooperative is a for-profit, worker-owned company that operates under the umbrella of parent company Evergreen Cooperatives. Although working at a grass-roots level, the organization has a highly structured, corporate management system with boards of directors and layers of chief executive officers.

Evergreen, launched in 2008, operates two other green businesses besides Green City Growers — a laundry company and solar-energy company. It aims for “building businesses, hiring from the neighborhoods where they’re located and then distributing profits back to employee members over time, which would help build financial assets and help transform lives and transform neighborhoods,” said Donnell.

Each business operates independently, with its own financing and management.

The idea for the economic revitalization project began when local institutions, including the Cleveland Foundation, University Hospitals, the Cleveland Clinic and Case Western Reserve University, began meeting to discuss area poverty, said Donnell.

After realizing that the surrounding neighborhoods housed 43,000 residents with a median income under $18,500, the institutions came together to figure out how to use their buying power to create jobs. Cleveland is historically supportive of the local food movement, said Donnell, and founders saw opportunity in the ability to provide local food year round.
Contd on site
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Old 03-06-2014, 10:29 PM   #41
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Eugene, Oregon Passes Resolution Banning Neonicotinoids


Washington, DC--(ENEWSPF)--March 5, 2014. The City of Eugene, Oregon, became the first community in the nation to specifically ban from city property the use of neonicotinoid pesticides, which have scientifically linked to the decline of honey bee colonies. The passage of the resolution came just one week after the Oregon state legislature passed a pollinator protection bill that removed language requiring the restriction of neonicotinoid pesticides, and includes instead a weaker requirement to set up a task force that will examine the possibility of future restrictions. In addition to neonicotinoid restrictions, the Cityís resolution also expands Eugeneís pesticide-free parks program and now requires all departments to adopt integrated pest management (IPM) standards.

http://enewspf.com/latest-news/scien...cotinoids.html

Damn, I love Oregon. I need to move to a blue state in the worst way. Texas is horrible.
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Old 03-07-2014, 04:41 AM   #42
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I would argue that we have too much intelligence for our own good.
Vonnegut wrote a book about that called Galapagos where man eventually evolves beyond his "too big brain" because it's causing him so many problems. Here's a synopsis of part of it from Wiki:

GalŠpagos is the story of a small band of mismatched humans who are shipwrecked on the fictional island of Santa Rosalia in the GalŠpagos Islands after a global financial crisis cripples the world's economy. Shortly thereafter, a disease renders all humans on Earth infertile, with the exception of the people on Santa Rosalia, making them the last specimens of humankind. Over the next million years, their descendants, the only fertile humans left on the planet, eventually evolve into a furry species resembling seals: though possibly still able to walk upright (it is not explicitly mentioned, but it is stated that they occasionally catch land animals), they have a snout with teeth adapted for catching fish, a streamlined skull and flipper-like hands with rudimentary fingers (described as "nubbins").

Humans are a strange lot. We have the intelligence to put rovers on Mars and yet the lizard and primate parts of our brains are still fully operational.

Last edited by Rohirrim; 03-07-2014 at 04:44 AM..
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