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Old 06-30-2013, 02:29 PM   #201
cutthemdown
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How long before W*gs demands to know what a comet is?
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Old 07-01-2013, 05:59 AM   #202
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Originally Posted by Rohirrim View Post
So. You're making the argument that we should violate our own Constitution to protect ourselves, but we can't expect it to protect us? How far down the paranoia rabbit hole do you want to go?
It takes a special kind to watch them call monitoring, mail reading, surf patrolling, transaction watching, and then when tshtf, throw out a "well you can't expect them to know everything"
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Old 07-01-2013, 06:02 AM   #203
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Amazing the couldn't stop the boston bombers with all this eavesdropping added to the fact they were tipped off by Russia the brothers were terrorists
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Old 07-01-2013, 07:50 AM   #204
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I think there are only a very few "perfect" people in your eyes - You and Chomsky being two of them.
And of course.

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Old 07-01-2013, 07:51 AM   #205
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Amazing the couldn't stop the boston bombers with all this eavesdropping added to the fact they were tipped off by Russia the brothers were terrorists
Defense of Civil Liberties™ required that they only surveil the innocent, not the guilty.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/04/23/us...-tsarnaev.html

Mind blowing.
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Old 07-01-2013, 09:05 AM   #206
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Defense of Civil Liberties™ required that they only surveil the innocent, not the guilty.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/04/23/us...-tsarnaev.html

Mind blowing.
A secret court gives them carte blanche to search everybody's communications on Earth, but if we get a warning from a foreign government that somebody is actually dangerous, we need a warrant to investigate.
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Old 07-01-2013, 10:57 AM   #207
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It only makes sense if he was an America-hating lefty to begin with...

Or perhaps just yet another brain dead ignorant liberal.
He must be the latter. Why else would a liberal donate $500 to Ron Paul?
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Old 07-01-2013, 12:16 PM   #208
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He must be the latter. Why else would a liberal donate $500 to Ron Paul?
He's a libertarian, that's why he donated to Ron Paul.
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Old 07-01-2013, 03:18 PM   #209
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CEO and editor of Foreign Policy magazine sums it up:

Edward Snowden broke the law and if the United States can bring him in, he deserves to be prosecuted. But the ones who should be in their own hot seat are those who created, approved and rationalized into existence the sprawling, seemingly uncontainable global intelligence and cyberwarfare apparatus that is as much of a threat to the kind of country we want to be as any terrorist group.
The problem for us, of course, is the only people with the power to restore balance and common sense limitations to these programs are the ones who let them get so out of control in the first place.

http://www.cnn.com/2013/07/01/opinio...html?hpt=hp_t1
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Old 07-01-2013, 03:54 PM   #210
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I think there are only a very few "perfect" people in your eyes - You and Chomsky being two of them.
hahahahaha

you will be interested to know my next piece will be titled:
NOAM CHOMSKY IS IN DENIAL ABOUT 9/11

I kid you not.
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Old 07-01-2013, 04:03 PM   #211
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hahahahaha

you will be interested to know my next piece will be titled:
NOAM CHOMSKY IS IN DENIAL ABOUT 9/11

I kid you not.
Thus forever enshrining the No True Scotsman theory as inviolable rhetorical law.
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Old 07-02-2013, 07:19 AM   #212
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I have mixed feelings about Snowden. He did reveal secrets that could hurt our nation's security, but he did reveal how hypocritical this country is about that security, especially in the media. Do nothing about the border. Do not follow muslims around. But keep records of what grandma does after she leaves the Bingo game. Ridiculous. It would not surprise me if Islamists have already sneaked a nuke or 2 in this country waiting for the right time with the idiocy that has gone on for so many years. One thing is clear in all of this: None of this is about securing our nation. This is all about politics, especially if true the NSA has been using info. to blackmail people. It appears playing politics is going to get more people killed. This is what people are proud of. Those that were so against the Patriot Act before 2009 are sure silent today. But it's not about politics
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Old 07-02-2013, 07:29 AM   #213
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I have mixed feelings about Snowden. He did reveal secrets that could hurt our nation's security, but he did reveal how hypocritical this country is about that security, especially in the media. Do nothing about the border. Do not follow muslims around. But keep records of what grandma does after she leaves the Bingo game. Ridiculous. It would not surprise me if Islamists have already sneaked a nuke or 2 in this country waiting for the right time with the idiocy that has gone on for so many years. One thing is clear in all of this: None of this is about securing our nation. This is all about politics, especially if true the NSA has been using info. to blackmail people. It appears playing politics is going to get more people killed. This is what people are proud of. Those that were so against the Patriot Act before 2009 are sure silent today. But it's not about politics
So it's all 'clear' to you. Explain how the NSA eavesdropping is 'all about politics'.
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Old 07-02-2013, 07:32 AM   #214
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Originally Posted by barryr View Post
I have mixed feelings about Snowden. He did reveal secrets that could hurt our nation's security, but he did reveal how hypocritical this country is about that security, especially in the media. Do nothing about the border. Do not follow muslims around. But keep records of what grandma does after she leaves the Bingo game. Ridiculous. It would not surprise me if Islamists have already sneaked a nuke or 2 in this country waiting for the right time with the idiocy that has gone on for so many years. One thing is clear in all of this: None of this is about securing our nation. This is all about politics, especially if true the NSA has been using info. to blackmail people. It appears playing politics is going to get more people killed. This is what people are proud of. Those that were so against the Patriot Act before 2009 are sure silent today. But it's not about politics
On this board, at least, I've found more people who were for it but now against it now that there's a D in office.

Quote:
Originally Posted by barryr
whine about rights violations from the Patriot Act despite still unable to find one law abiding citizen whose rights have been violated
http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showpos...&postcount=152

Quote:
Originally Posted by barryr
The pissants complain about the Patriot Act, but have yet to offer even one, much less the countless people that claim whose rights would be violated from it. Forget it has actually saved lives. That's beside the point for the "smart" ones.
http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showpos...45&postcount=5

Quote:
Originally Posted by barryr
The Patriot Act was supposedly so bad and would take away everyone's rights, yet I have yet to see whose rights have been violated.
http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showpos...6&postcount=11

And none of these are even prior to Obama getting in office! Yep, it's not about politics, dummy. You've just been exposed as a fraud (again).

Last edited by houghtam; 07-02-2013 at 08:00 AM..
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Old 07-02-2013, 08:05 AM   #215
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^ @ barryr always complaining about hypocrites (even though he never gives any concrete examples) given his own hypocrisy (as demonstrated above). What a joke. As they say, he who smelt it, dealt it.
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Old 07-02-2013, 08:29 AM   #216
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^ @ barryr always complaining about hypocrites (even though he never gives any concrete examples) given his own hypocrisy (as demonstrated above). What a joke. As they say, he who smelt it, dealt it.
He was for it before he was against it.
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Old 07-02-2013, 09:54 AM   #217
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That's where I'm conflicted. The 9/11 hijackers were American. it would be great to catch them BEFORE something bad happens. I know that's spying on Americans, but I don't want another homegrown terrorist plot...
Found this gem, too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crushaholic
It appears little will change from the Bush administration anti-terrorist doctrine, based on his choices on the national security team. If he continues with the fundamental parts of the Patriot Act and coordinates a slow, but steady, policy towards the troops in Iraq, I have no problem coming back here and saying that I was wrong about Obama. It will be fantastic if he doesn't turn out to be the knee-jerk liberal I (and others) were fearing...
http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showpos...9&postcount=10

Where's Crush to tell us all how wrong he was?
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Old 07-02-2013, 01:35 PM   #218
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Let's face it this surveillance and eavesdropping issue has become a nightmare for the US gov't.

It does appear that the Snowden case has FINALLY awakened the world to the implications of what has in fact been going on for many years.
MHG

Germany Ready to Charge UK and US Intelligence over Alleged Bugging Operations

BY TONY PATERSON IN BERLIN

July 01, 2013 "Information Clearing House - "Belfast Telegraph"
--- Germany is preparing to bring charges against US and British intelligence amid fresh allegations that the services spied far more extensively than thought on German phone and internet traffic and bugged European Union offices in America.

A report alleging a major and continuous US National Security Agency spying operation in Germany was published by Der Spiegel magazine yesterday, prompting outrage from Berlin MPs still reeling from reports about extensive British surveillance in their country.

The German Justice Minister, Sabine Leutheusser-Schnarrenburger, demanded an immediate explanation and said the behaviour of the intelligence services was “reminiscent of the actions against enemies during the Cold War”. “It defies belief that our friends in the US see the Europeans as their enemies,” she said.

The leak, which Der Spiegel said came from fugitive ex-CIA analyst Edward Snowden, claimed that the NSA tapped into half a billion German phone calls, emails and SMS messages each month. Reports last week revealed extensive tapping of German phone and internet traffic by British intelligence under its so-called Tempora programme. The information was said to be shared with the NSA.

A spokesman for the Federal Prosecutor said the office was preparing to bring charges against “persons unknown” in relation to the reports.

There was also widespread and mounting anger at official European Union level yesterday following disclosures that the NSA had spied on EU computer networks at its offices in New York and Washington and that it had also bugged the premises. Martin Schulz, head of the European Parliament, demanded “full clarification” from the US and said that if the disclosures proved true they would have a severe impact on US-EU ties.

It also emerged that the UK Government had invited German MPs and justice officials to attend a video conference at British Embassy in Berlin today during which the issue of spying would be addressed.

Der Spiegel said the NSA’s German phone and internet surveillance operation was the biggest in the EU. On 7 January 2013 it tapped into some 60 million German phone calls in a single day.

The magazine said that Canada, Australia, Britain and New Zealand were exempt from NSA surveillance but Germany was regarded as a country open for “spy attacks”.

© Belfasttelegraph.co.uk
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Old 07-02-2013, 02:03 PM   #219
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On this board, at least, I've found more people who were for it but now against it now that there's a D in office.



http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showpos...&postcount=152



http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showpos...45&postcount=5



http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showpos...6&postcount=11

And none of these are even prior to Obama getting in office! Yep, it's not about politics, dummy. You've just been exposed as a fraud (again).
, figures the limp dick liberals change the subject. Spying on potential terrorists, you know the muslims that come here on Visas that Obama wants to be off limits by the way, is not the same as spying on EVERY single American. You were for the Patriot Act before 2009? Where?
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Old 07-02-2013, 02:04 PM   #220
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So it's all 'clear' to you. Explain how the NSA eavesdropping is 'all about politics'.
So you were for all of this before 2009? Where?
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Old 07-02-2013, 02:05 PM   #221
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Found this gem, too.



http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showpos...9&postcount=10

Where's Crush to tell us all how wrong he was?
You were for this before 2009? Where?
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Old 07-02-2013, 02:10 PM   #222
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You were for this before 2009? Where?
I was never for this, nor am I now, nor are many liberals on this board.

You need to learn how to read, and pull your head out of your ass.

Hit a little too close to home? Care to explain how YOUR opinion on the subject just magically changed from for to against once a D became the president?

Didn't think so. You're worthless.
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Old 07-02-2013, 02:19 PM   #223
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You were for this before 2009? Where?
Nice attempt at deflecting.....as usual.

Now back to my question. Explain how the NSA eavesdropping is 'all about politics'.

Are you going to deflect again, or substantiate your assertion with facts??
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Old 07-10-2013, 01:43 PM   #224
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Majority of Americans see Snowden as whistleblower, not traitor.
http://worldnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2...t-traitor?lite
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Old 07-10-2013, 01:54 PM   #225
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Do we want:

1. Unobstructed Civil Liberties, with the trade-off being security failures and domestic attacks we consider collateral damage of a free country.

2. High Security, a dragnet that perhaps catches the 9/11 conspirators or the Boston Brothers with the trade off not knowing where, when and for how long that data is used and stored.

To me a strong domestic defense comprises not only military might but also strong informatics that identify and diffuse threats.... perhaps the the question that needs to be asked is what is the spirit of the Constitution, the 4th Amendment as it applies to 2013?
I'll take door #1.

It's just too bad this guy couldn't have done this a little more tactfully without spitting the gut wide open.
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