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Old 02-10-2013, 09:41 AM   #101
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See post #15 on first page. This is the car Subaru is building for Toyota.
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Old 02-10-2013, 10:04 AM   #102
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See post #15 on first page. This is the car Subaru is building for Toyota.
I prefer the FRS to the BRZ
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Old 02-10-2013, 11:15 AM   #103
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He said it had to be under 40K
Oh! Nevermind then but he can definitely get a new Audi A4 premium plus package with Quattro for jus a hair under $40k and that is very much a fun car to drive with 260lbs of torque right in the right passing speeds and great handling/ nice ride balance its a pleasure to own and cruise with.

Later he can do a simple after market computer engine mod and get 5.4 seconds to 60mph out of it. Audi makes superb engines and the 4cyl 2.0 liter turbo is one of the best 4 cylinder engines you can buy with good mileage too for a very response and quick car. The exteriors are primo as well and their Quattro all wheel drive is legendary.

You'd be hard pressed to get more overall balance between fun, great engineering plus refined styling and design from your $40k budget overall.

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Old 02-10-2013, 12:38 PM   #104
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After some previous recs, the Audi S4 is definitely on the test drive list. I know the prices can vary, buy maybe finding an off-lease model would be a really good value.

I'm going to test drive a couple Mustangs today, and I'm going to the local Mitsubishi dealer to test drive the Evolution later this week. I think the Audi dealer is pretty close, so I'll hit the A4 then.
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Old 02-10-2013, 01:15 PM   #105
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After some previous recs, the Audi S4 is definitely on the test drive list. I know the prices can vary, buy maybe finding an off-lease model would be a really good value.

I'm going to test drive a couple Mustangs today, and I'm going to the local Mitsubishi dealer to test drive the Evolution later this week. I think the Audi dealer is pretty close, so I'll hit the A4 then.
I have a mustang GT. and the Audi. And frankly until I started driving the Audi the mustang was one hell of a car.

Now when I drive it just to keep the battery charged it is tinny and lots of road noise.

There is zero comparison between the two. ..
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Old 02-10-2013, 04:27 PM   #106
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Cmhargrove, how is your son doing in school? Is he on schedule to get his engineering degree? Also, he will be a junior this coming season, is he going to start at T or G for MUST? Also, again I wouldn't discount the BMW 335d if you can find a used one on a BMW lot at least give it a test drive. I'm also a fan of Audi.
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Old 02-10-2013, 04:47 PM   #107
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Cmhargrove, how is your son doing in school? Is he on schedule to get his engineering degree? Also, he will be a junior this coming season, is he going to start at T or G for MUST? Also, again I wouldn't discount the BMW 335d if you can find a used one on a BMW lot at least give it a test drive. I'm also a fan of Audi.
My son has been doing well, but honestly playing football and studying engineering has been a major hill to climb. He is one semester behind right now, but I consider that excellent for the load he has taken on.

Circumstances have changed for him, and I think next fall he will actually be transferring to Oklahoma State to be nearer his girlfriend (they have been seriously dating for more than 2 years). He is a two year letterman in football and has been starting at Right Guard. If you followed S&t this year, you know they went 10-1 and broke the school's all time points record (over 100 seasons at S&T). Anyway, the school is treating the head coach like dirt and he is actively pursuing other coaching jobs (which sucks for S&T football). So, my son feels like things are pointing to a change for him as well.

He is going to take his engineering study to Oklahoma State and walk on this fall. That way he gets to fulfill his childhood dream of playing "big school ball.". The good news is that he started right away freshman year, so he still has a redshirt year to burn while he learns the OSU system. Then, he still has 2 years of eligibility to fight for a starting job. The offense and talent level at Oklahoma State is pretty exciting right now, so I think he is in for a fun ride. He has already been offered jobs from 2 previous internships as long as he just completes his degree, so I think he won't miss too much from losing the S&T degree (we hope).

Anyway, thanks for asking and I'll try to give everyone updates if/when he makes the team at Oklahoma State.
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Old 02-10-2013, 04:53 PM   #108
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cars are for girls, dudes drive trucks. nuff said
Amen. I can haul stuff, pull stuff, and do stuff.
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Old 02-10-2013, 04:53 PM   #109
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After some previous recs, the Audi S4 is definitely on the test drive list. I know the prices can vary, buy maybe finding an off-lease model would be a really good value.

I'm going to test drive a couple Mustangs today, and I'm going to the local Mitsubishi dealer to test drive the Evolution later this week. I think the Audi dealer is pretty close, so I'll hit the A4 then.
Dunno about Audi's reliability, when I was researching a few years ago Consumer Report's stats didn't look so good.

Lexus and Acura are the reliability kings, and both make models that performance-wise are comparable or better than Audi.

If you're looking used or coming off a lease, I'd sure be test driving a Lexus IS or GS. Just the resale value on those is a BFD. They hold their value better than other cars. You can have fun with them for a few years, and get better resale value than an Audi.
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Old 02-11-2013, 12:26 AM   #110
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Hey Cito,
Audi reliability is fine. Particularly over the last decade . Consumer Reports is a very unreliable reporter in many of their surveys for a good while. It Wasnt always that way.

Audi used to have some issues until absorbed into VW group as the main flagship engineering arm of the conglomerate .. They then put big bucks into LeMans 24 hr endurance racing and the major effort there which had resulted in 11 wins over the last 13 years .. Amazing dominance in a race that demands reliability.

Most all of that engineering experience has trickled down directly into their passenger car line and majorly increased Audis performance, engineering , overall design and reliability.

Go talk to almost any top Indepedent German car mechanic outfit in most major cities and ask them who makes a better car these days BMW, Merc or Audi... I know of five highly respected such high end Euro car outfits Three of which are former head mechanics at BMW San Francisco, the largest BMW dealer in Houston and the third was head honcho at North Scottsdale BMW ... The other two I spoke with worked at Mercedes and Jaguar respectively for years but were not running those service depts,.

All five own their own independent shops now and each one of them said hands down they prefer working on Audis over BMWs and MBs.. Especially over more recent vintage BMW models which the former head of BMW Houston said has taken a real nose dive iin quality in the drivetrain and interior fit and finish in recent years... It's why he quit after 15 years rnning the whole service department there and opened his own shop.

The story from each of these men was essentially the same.. And all five strongly recommended Audi over the other two German makers for better bang and reliability for the buck all around...

I've previously owned three Audis the first the original Audi Quattro Coupe in 1980...and now have two, a '12 A4 for the wife and '12 S4 for me we got at the same time with a modest Twofer discount ... Have had three BMWs 1986 325e, '97 328i and 2002 330 soft-top and one Acura Legend in 1992 ranging ftom the mid 80s up to 2004 and I wouldn't think about buying another Beamer as long as Audi keeps making cars like they have been the last decade...

This steady increase in design, performance and reliability over the last decade is the main reason Audi has moved ahead of MB sales and has almost caught BMW as well in this market.

Lexus cars are way too mushy and Japanesey for my liking . They are okay reliability wise as are most Japanese cars, but for my taste their definition of what looks and feels luxurious has just too much shinny bling with too many bells and whistles... The Japanese haven't quite got the understated yet refined luxury look and feel down to date, though they are making some progress in that area.. They are nice and comfy for sure and plush, but still not in the German league overall in my book.

To each his own Cito, but go spend a little time in the new gen Audi's before you make your decision ... I think you'll be surprised.

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Old 02-11-2013, 01:53 AM   #111
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My father in law back in the early 80s had an Audi and every time I drove it something broke on it.

I had shied away from them when looking and then I got this A5 and love it. Have zero complaints other than the complexity of all the doodads..

May never figure our how everything works.
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Old 02-11-2013, 02:26 AM   #112
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Amen. I can haul stuff, pull stuff, and do stuff.
Oh yeah, these guys can tool around the city in their little sports cars. I'd take a Ford Raptor any day and head off road. I can tow anything, haul anything, still throw down on the highway as fast as I could really stand to go. Sports car might get me off the line by a few seconds but that's not enough to out weigh all the benefits of having a truck vs a car.



Isn't it a beauty?



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Old 02-11-2013, 04:04 AM   #113
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If you don't care about mileage, cornering, refinement, being able to go long haul (say over 1 hour) in comfort, an ugly pastic interior then yeah go for the mustang.
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Old 02-11-2013, 06:11 AM   #114
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If you don't care about mileage, cornering, refinement, being able to go long haul (say over 1 hour) in comfort, an ugly pastic interior then yeah go for the mustang.
Lol
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Old 02-11-2013, 06:36 AM   #115
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Oh yeah, these guys can tool around the city in their little sports cars. I'd take a Ford Raptor any day and head off road. I can tow anything, haul anything, still throw down on the highway as fast as I could really stand to go. Sports car might get me off the line by a few seconds but that's not enough to out weigh all the benefits of having a truck vs a car.



Isn't it a beauty?



The Raptor is a badass truck, but 65k for a truck? I dont think so. For that money id rather have a 650hp 200mph '13 GT500...and thats bone stock!
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Old 02-11-2013, 08:10 AM   #116
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Hey Cito,
Audi reliability is fine. Particularly over the last decade . Consumer Reports is a very unreliable reporter in many of their surveys for a good while. It Wasnt always that way.

Audi used to have some issues until absorbed into VW group as the main flagship engineering arm of the conglomerate .. They then put big bucks into LeMans 24 hr endurance racing and the major effort there which had resulted in 11 wins over the last 13 years .. Amazing dominance in a race that demands reliability.

Most all of that engineering experience has trickled down directly into their passenger car line and majorly increased Audis performance, engineering , overall design and reliability.

Go talk to almost any top Indepedent German car mechanic outfit in most major cities and ask them who makes a better car these days BMW, Merc or Audi... I know of five highly respected such high end Euro car outfits Three of which are former head mechanics at BMW San Francisco, the largest BMW dealer in Houston and the third was head honcho at North Scottsdale BMW ... The other two I spoke with worked at Mercedes and Jaguar respectively for years but were not running those service depts,.

All five own their own independent shops now and each one of them said hands down they prefer working on Audis over BMWs and MBs.. Especially over more recent vintage BMW models which the former head of BMW Houston said has taken a real nose dive iin quality in the drivetrain and interior fit and finish in recent years... It's why he quit after 15 years rnning the whole service department there and opened his own shop.

The story from each of these men was essentially the same.. And all five strongly recommended Audi over the other two German makers for better bang and reliability for the buck all around...

I've previously owned three Audis the first the original Audi Quattro Coupe in 1980...and now have two, a '12 A4 for the wife and '12 S4 for me we got at the same time with a modest Twofer discount ... Have had three BMWs 1986 325e, '97 328i and 2002 330 soft-top and one Acura Legend in 1992 ranging ftom the mid 80s up to 2004 and I wouldn't think about buying another Beamer as long as Audi keeps making cars like they have been the last decade...

This steady increase in design, performance and reliability over the last decade is the main reason Audi has moved ahead of MB sales and has almost caught BMW as well in this market.

Lexus cars are way too mushy and Japanesey for my liking . They are okay reliability wise as are most Japanese cars, but for my taste their definition of what looks and feels luxurious has just too much shinny bling with too many bells and whistles... The Japanese haven't quite got the understated yet refined luxury look and feel down to date, though they are making some progress in that area.. They are nice and comfy for sure and plush, but still not in the German league overall in my book.

To each his own Cito, but go spend a little time in the new gen Audi's before you make your decision ... I think you'll be surprised.
This about Audi and BMW reliability. I have had both and the newer Audi is everything the old BMW's used to be.

Couple of really important things though if you buy the german cars:

1. Repair and upkeep are much more than the american cars. Find a real good independent mechanic like Hulamau suggested above and make sure he looks at the car before you buy a used one.

2. German Cars feel better on the road, because they are designed to go 120+ on the AutoBahn. They are also designed to survive crashes at 120+ and several of my friends who are firefighters just talk about how much better people survive and are not as seriously injured driving German made cars.

3. The gas Mileage is not going to be as good as you want with the M or S class Cars, but the idea to get a A4 with the four cylinder is better if that really matters. If you have that good Mechanic in your pocket the upgrades are gauranteed and if anything goes wrong, you do not have to worry about the warranty being broken, the Mechanic will gaurantee his work especially if he checks the vehicle out before you buy it. Saved my ass once!

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Old 02-11-2013, 09:09 AM   #117
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Such an absurd about of $ for a car.
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Old 02-11-2013, 09:19 AM   #118
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Such an absurd about of $ for a car.
It can be, if you buy new. I have not bought a new car since I got out of college and wanted to Show off.

However, you get what you pay for with cars. I started with the German Cars about 15 years ago. Never bought a new one and keep them for 10 years or so. I leased the latest one through the company as it is the best use of money and cheapest way to drive. Wife has gone to the darkside though. Leased a Kia Optima for under $300 a month Brand spanking new with Everything on it. She absolutely loves the panoramic Sunroof and all the bells and whistles with the Iphone. Its a gorgeous car and cheap with excellent features and has a 200k warranty through the local dealer.

I get the badass car though
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Old 02-11-2013, 10:27 AM   #119
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It can be, if you buy new. I have not bought a new car since I got out of college and wanted to Show off.

However, you get what you pay for with cars. I started with the German Cars about 15 years ago. Never bought a new one and keep them for 10 years or so. I leased the latest one through the company as it is the best use of money and cheapest way to drive. Wife has gone to the darkside though. Leased a Kia Optima for under $300 a month Brand spanking new with Everything on it. She absolutely loves the panoramic Sunroof and all the bells and whistles with the Iphone. Its a gorgeous car and cheap with excellent features and has a 200k warranty through the local dealer.

I get the badass car though
I had a crappy car back in high school and ditched in in college when I decided to use public transportation because it got me everywhere I wanted to go for free. I ended up paying $40 a month after graduation to use the metro area transit system so I could get to work if I didn't feel like biking to my law office on the newer side of town about ~ 10 miles from my apartment.

From my apartment now I live about 7 blocks from my federal office where I work, so even in the winter time I just walk it. It makes for good exercise and I have Wanderlust really bad, so it helps me take my mind of things.

I've been saving up for a nice vehicle, but can't even imagine to spend money on a brand new vehicle. It just seems like it is a terrible investment. Pay $30,000 for it on the lot and the second you drive it off -- it depreciates a great deal.

I see a lot of good deals on used one's with relatively low miles, but I would like to get a truck or an SUV, especially if I move back to Colorado or stay in an area where there is snow. They tend to keep their value up in these parts. My cousin just got fleeced on buying a 2005 Mitsubishi SUV with over 100,000 miles and she paid $10,000 for it when Kelly Blue Book booked it out for several grand less. Plus, I like to hike, camp, fish, etc. and do a bunch of outdoor stuff, so I don't see why I'd get a car.

If I want to drive a fun car, I just hop in my dads Z06 and mash. He still sweats bullets when he is in the passenger seat and I'm manning it down, depsite me driving for almost 10 years.

People can do whatever they want with their money, but I've never understood why people go out and buy brand new cars. I think it is one of the worst investments you can possibly make. That Ford Raptor up there looks awesome as ****, but in the Dakota's you can get a nice middle-class home that is no more than 50 years old for the same price. It's a priority thing I guess. *shrug*

To each their own. I like being active, whether it's biking, skating or walking to work. I'm also a cheap ass and save every penny I can. I still put coins in a peanut butter jar like a five year old. After a while, it does add up.
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Old 02-11-2013, 10:52 AM   #120
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I had a crappy car back in high school and ditched in in college when I decided to use public transportation because it got me everywhere I wanted to go for free. I ended up paying $40 a month after graduation to use the metro area transit system so I could get to work if I didn't feel like biking to my law office on the newer side of town about ~ 10 miles from my apartment.

From my apartment now I live about 7 blocks from my federal office where I work, so even in the winter time I just walk it. It makes for good exercise and I have Wanderlust really bad, so it helps me take my mind of things.

I've been saving up for a nice vehicle, but can't even imagine to spend money on a brand new vehicle. It just seems like it is a terrible investment. Pay $30,000 for it on the lot and the second you drive it off -- it depreciates a great deal.

I see a lot of good deals on used one's with relatively low miles, but I would like to get a truck or an SUV, especially if I move back to Colorado or stay in an area where there is snow. They tend to keep their value up in these parts. My cousin just got fleeced on buying a 2005 Mitsubishi SUV with over 100,000 miles and she paid $10,000 for it when Kelly Blue Book booked it out for several grand less. Plus, I like to hike, camp, fish, etc. and do a bunch of outdoor stuff, so I don't see why I'd get a car.

If I want to drive a fun car, I just hop in my dads Z06 and mash. He still sweats bullets when he is in the passenger seat and I'm manning it down, depsite me driving for almost 10 years.

People can do whatever they want with their money, but I've never understood why people go out and buy brand new cars. I think it is one of the worst investments you can possibly make. That Ford Raptor up there looks awesome as ****, but in the Dakota's you can get a nice middle-class home that is no more than 50 years old for the same price. It's a priority thing I guess. *shrug*

To each their own. I like being active, whether it's biking, skating or walking to work. I'm also a cheap ass and save every penny I can. I still put coins in a peanut butter jar like a five year old. After a while, it does add up.
It also depends what you do. I am a consultant and when I drive clients around in a Car that they are a little intimidated in it helps! The Audi and BMW are an investment in My business. I hate to say it, but first impressions go a long way to getting New Clients. Most of these guys are decision makers as well and hard to impress.

That is why it makes long term financial sense for me to have a car like this, and also know what these guys like to drive. It makes me money and provides a great talking point with guys The women clients also like it too, just don't tell the Wife
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Old 02-11-2013, 11:14 AM   #121
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I've driven the hell out of my 6 cylinder honda accord. My wife has an acura tl that really moves, but it takes premium fuel. if you need a family sized car for kids, my vote is on an accord. Besides replacing the brakes/battery/tires/oil and naturally the timing belt I haven't done a thing to it and I've got 150K in 5 years.
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Old 02-11-2013, 11:19 AM   #122
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I've driven the hell out of my 6 cylinder honda accord. My wife has an acura tl that really moves, but it takes premium fuel. if you need a family sized car for kids, my vote is on an accord. Besides replacing the brakes/battery/tires/oil and naturally the timing belt I haven't done a thing to it and I've got 150K in 5 years.
I had an Accord before and its a solid car, hell the new one looks like the 335! I drove it to 150 as well and the cheaper gas is nice. The V6 engine does leave something to be desired. My wifes Optima has more juice and it does not require premium either.
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Old 02-11-2013, 11:26 AM   #123
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We had Audi's and Benz's. I liked them but get rid of them before 100K miles both cars began to fall apart at that time (I did mostly all the maintenance on them as well). I've had a Highlander Hybrid with almost 100K miles and other than hitting a deer, haven't had an issue.
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Old 02-11-2013, 11:58 AM   #124
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I've watched the evolution of German cars over the years and I gotta say, I'm not really impressed for the most part. Very homogenous, very cookie cutter, very plastic.

The best bang for the buck now is coming out of South Korea IMHO. Their target, of course, is to compete with the Japanese. I also think that bang for the buck, the Japs still do it the best, but Koreans are catching up.
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Old 02-11-2013, 01:13 PM   #125
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After some previous recs, the Audi S4 is definitely on the test drive list. I know the prices can vary, buy maybe finding an off-lease model would be a really good value.

I'm going to test drive a couple Mustangs today, and I'm going to the local Mitsubishi dealer to test drive the Evolution later this week. I think the Audi dealer is pretty close, so I'll hit the A4 then.
MAJOR depreciation hits on European luxury, so an off lease unit is going to be your best up front monetary value if you decide to go that route (there's a reason that more roughly 70% of the "new luxury" market is lease, not finance). Also, keep in mind that if you truly are the type of individual who drives it till the wheels fall off, the cost of ownership for that European engineering is going to be quite steep down the road. It's not that they break down more, but the cost of the parts/repairs is substantially more than American/Japanese/Korean. Audi's are incredible, but just be aware of what you're going to spending over the life of your ownership!
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