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Old 02-07-2013, 02:21 PM   #101
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I bet whoever this guy is no longer has or works on a farm based on his work hours! This describes ZERO farmers I know. I don't think you know the extent of how demanding farming really is. The cattle, sheep or any other livestock you may have to keep an eye on year round. In North Dakota the summers can get into the 100's but generally in the mid 80's. While the winter can be very brutal with temps below 0 and ever colder with the wind. You almost gotta take care of these animals like their your kids. Every summer planting crops, cutting hay etc for said livestock. God for bid its a dry summer and don't get enough hay to last the winter. Or none of your crops turn out due to lack of rain or because a hail storm came through and wiped it all out. All that would be profit down the drain. Now that farmer needs to buy extra hay from an outside source etc. If you hear a farmer complaining its probably because his machinery is broke, coyotes or mountain lions got to his livestock, no rain, hail storm came through. It'd be kinda like someone stealing from you. Sorry but you're assessment of a REAL farmer is way off.

His assessment might be a little harsh (and could be offensive, but I wasn't offended and my ancestors have been farmers since Christ had a crew-cut, my parents were the first generation of anyone in my lineage to not be on a farm), but it isn't completely off.

In the scenarios you outlined, if things didn't produce and the crops didn't grow -- they would get compensated for that if they have insurance. That is why there is the FCIA and RMA. It is accessible to almost everyone at no cost as long as they are growing an insurable crop or have the qualifying livestock, it's part of the USDA.

The numbers Meck gave are just a hairline of the actual costs of subsidization that goes towards the farming community. I deal with this sort of thing every day and there is debate about it weekly in the Department of Agriculture and within its associated programs and services.
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Old 02-07-2013, 02:23 PM   #102
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RaiderH8R does have some valid points, but his stereotype isn't justified.

My Uncle is a farmer in eastern Colorado. Very hard worker. Loves to farm. But, he never produces! His crops die every single year, and he alone makes four times what my family makes in subsidy checks alone. He's not a bad guy, and he's still a hard worker, but in reality farming is a no-risk business nowadays that pays WAY more than 95% of the jobs out there.
But does he have a Dodge or Ford truck?
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Old 02-08-2013, 06:32 AM   #103
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in reality farming is a no-risk business nowadays that pays WAY more than 95% of the jobs out there.
If that were true, everyone would do it.
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Old 02-08-2013, 09:02 AM   #104
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His assessment might be a little harsh (and could be offensive, but I wasn't offended and my ancestors have been farmers since Christ had a crew-cut, my parents were the first generation of anyone in my lineage to not be on a farm), but it isn't completely off.

In the scenarios you outlined, if things didn't produce and the crops didn't grow -- they would get compensated for that if they have insurance. That is why there is the FCIA and RMA. It is accessible to almost everyone at no cost as long as they are growing an insurable crop or have the qualifying livestock, it's part of the USDA.

The numbers Meck gave are just a hairline of the actual costs of subsidization that goes towards the farming community. I deal with this sort of thing every day and there is debate about it weekly in the Department of Agriculture and within its associated programs and services.
Ok Req if you have the numbers then let's see them. Everything I'm seeing shows that most farms are not subsidized so this idea that farming is without risk is complete HORSE SHIAT!

Another link with the facts. This time it's a visual. H8r?

http://www.economist.com/node/21563323
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Old 02-08-2013, 09:17 AM   #105
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Well, depending on how the Supreme Court shakes out on this one, things could either get significantly better or marginally worse for farmers.

http://rt.com/usa/news/monsanto-supr...rt-bowman-775/

By the way, Mosanto is the devil.
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Old 02-08-2013, 09:30 AM   #106
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Has anyone mentioned the Samsung commercial with Paul Rudd, Seth Rogen, and Lebron James? I thought that was a pretty funny one too.
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Old 02-08-2013, 10:11 AM   #107
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Ok Req if you have the numbers then let's see them. Everything I'm seeing shows that most farms are not subsidized so this idea that farming is without risk is complete HORSE SHIAT!

Another link with the facts. This time it's a visual. H8r?

http://www.economist.com/node/21563323
A lot of the numbers I personally see deal with compliance and they are not for me to be sharing with John Q. Public because they involve legal matters and battles which I cannot discuss on this open forum. Your links to EWG are an absolutely great resource for what goes on with commodities, crop insurance, disaster relief and conservation subsidies. These are only a portion of payments with an associate cost that is calculated. There is behind the scenes action with everything, which is partly what I'm getting at.

Whoever said there isn't a risk is FOS. There is ALWAYS a risk and due to that risk because of a lengthy amount of variables. That is why there are programs and such set up in case that happens, whether it is disaster relief or insuring a bottom line dollar for crops in a year where production might be down due to ecological factors.

~ 40% (as you said, not a majority) of American farmers receive federal subsidies -- 60% do not. The ones that don't aren't producing crops or dealing with livestock that fall under those parameters, or are likely on extraordinarily small farmsteads that do not put out much of a product. They aren't producing for the masses. Small farmsteads (~ 600,000 ) make up ~ 30% of operations in America.

Commercial farming receives most of the kickbacks, but that is also because they are producing way more than the average, regular Joe farmer and are likely dealing with crops that have a savvy bottom dollar attached to them. A majority of them are Upper Great Plains because they are the soybean, corn, wheat, etc. producers that receive a lot of government funds. Corn subsidies are through the roof after our love for ethanol came to fruition (absolutely losing battle and not even close to cost effective) and absolutely need to be expired. (I think some things did at the tail of 2011, but I wasn't here when that was going on.) SD, ND, IA, NE -- etc. -- ~70% + of them are getting some sort of subsidy and the premier reason why is the sort of business they deal in.

Agriculture has changed a lot. The Secretary of Agriculture has even agreed to the point where some of these subsidies are getting out of hand, but maintains that we have a "value system" to re-inforce, so for the time being it's quite OK. These people don't have it easy and they work their asses off. Most I come into contact with actually feel bad when they can't produce and get a relief check because they take damn good pride in their work and know that when they hurt -- the rest of us hurt too because they are producers.

I think a lot of people like H8R and a few others are jaded because of personal experiences and what they have seen. Everyone basis decisions of personal experience. If a guy like H8R goes out and spends $30,000 of his hard earned money on a new vehicle, I'm sure he'd get pretty pissed when he sees someone spending that much on a truck for a farm -- and subsequently getting it free of charge after it is written off as an itemized expenditure related to business operations when tax season rolls around when he isn't afforded that same benefit.

I will shoot you off some more stuff in private when I can. I have to go out and get some field stuff done in a different county before the blizzard hits. Adios.
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Old 02-08-2013, 09:40 PM   #108
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