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Old 01-29-2013, 11:58 AM   #201
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Montgomery would have to swallow a stick of dynamite the day of the draft for him to fall to our selection. New idea please.
Bennie Logan, DT from LSU sounds like a perfect DE in our scheme.

Quick off the snap and capable of handling double-teams due to his strength and use of leverage, Logan is a load in the middle and a big reason as to why LSU ranked fifth in the country last year in run defense.

Those close to LSU are excited about Logan's potential not only due to his natural skill-set but because of his commitment to improving.
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Old 01-29-2013, 12:07 PM   #202
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The Ravens ran out of the Nickel with a 4-man line, and roughed up Manning. The Broncos can't do that. They can only get pressure if they rush Von Miller on a 5 man line...which exposes them deep with a single Safety, and exposes them in the run game at times also.


Since when did 6'5" 260 lbs. become undersized for a 4-3 DE? Paul Kruger is that exact size.
It's not what the Ravens ran now it's what the Ravens ran when JDR was there. Also Paul Kruger is a damn LB in the Ravens scheme.
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Old 01-29-2013, 12:23 PM   #203
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In defense of Rahim, I suppose you could always bring up that it was a safety named Troy Polamalu who played up for the run and let DT get behind him in a playoff, OT situation.
Nope, that one falls at the scheme of one Infallible Dick LeBeau
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Old 01-29-2013, 12:25 PM   #204
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Bennie Logan, DT from LSU sounds like a perfect DE in our scheme.

Quick off the snap and capable of handling double-teams due to his strength and use of leverage, Logan is a load in the middle and a big reason as to why LSU ranked fifth in the country last year in run defense.

Those close to LSU are excited about Logan's potential not only due to his natural skill-set but because of his commitment to improving.
You have to wonder if the Broncos are going to leave Wolfe at DE in base formations and move him inside on passing downs like they do now, or just move him inside next season full time. In JDR's scheme, he'll need to bulk up some to do it, but it would make sense, depending on what happens with big Vick. I'd like to see the Broncos get the big pocket collapsing NT in the draft. A Jesse Williams, John Jenkins, Brandon Williams type of prospect.

You're right though. Logan would be a DE in this scheme as long as JDR is here.
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Old 01-29-2013, 12:55 PM   #205
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It is posts like this why people don't like you. You come off as a condenscending a-hole, and nobody likes that.

If you have an opinion of a player fine, back it up and present your opinion. Just because somebody disagrees with you is asinine to talk like that. Everybody as an a-hole, some are just bigger. And apparently yours is bigger. Bigger is not better.
It's to the same poster. One who doesn't watch any actual games/tape of college prospects, just reads stats and has an opinion. And we have already been down this road on Moore with this particular poster, it's wasted effort to do it again.

He thinks Wolfe is not good as a DE in our scheme and his replacement is a light weight weak side rusher, essentially negating the use of Von Miller. Now when someone has such crazy ideas, why would I or someone else want to keep explaining how hes not correct?
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Old 01-29-2013, 01:00 PM   #206
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Bennie Logan, DT from LSU sounds like a perfect DE in our scheme.

Quick off the snap and capable of handling double-teams due to his strength and use of leverage, Logan is a load in the middle and a big reason as to why LSU ranked fifth in the country last year in run defense.

Those close to LSU are excited about Logan's potential not only due to his natural skill-set but because of his commitment to improving.
Take the hose out of your mouth and step away from the huka bar...

Logan sounds like a backup NFL UT to me, who could (maybe) develop into a starter. Nothing to get overly excited about. I would rather get a starting DB in round 2...not a marginal DT.

When JDR was with the Ravens, he was the LB coach...not the DC. They had Tony Siragusa and Sam Adams (two 340-350 pound behemoths) at DT, and Micheal McCrary and some dude named Rob Burnett at DE (both weighed 260 lbs.). I have no idea where you keep getting this idea that the Broncos need a 300 lb. DE...we don't have a 3 man line (where you would typically need a bigger DE)...we have a 5 or 4 man line.

If you want a huge mofro to replace Bannan or Vickerson, then great...you will get your chance, this draft has a few (John Jenkins, Brandon Williams). For some reason, you keep trying to fit a square peg into a round hole, it's almost McDaniels-esque. Also, the Broncos Defense did fine stopping the rush up the middle in 2012, so drafting a 2 down NT isn't really a need. Put Wolfe in at UT and call it. Problem solved.

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Old 01-29-2013, 01:02 PM   #207
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Nope, that one falls at the scheme of one Infallible Dick LeBeau
And I've wondered if Milus didn't place Moore where he was on that play?
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Old 01-29-2013, 01:05 PM   #208
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Take the hose out of your mouth and step away from the huka bar...

Logan sounds like a backup NFL UT to me, who could (maybe) develop into a starter. Nothing to get overly excited about. I would rather get a starting DB in round 2...not a marginal DT.

When JDR was with the Ravens, he was the LB coach...not the DC. They had Tony Siragusa and Sam Adams (two 340-350 pound behemoths) at DT, and Micheal McCrary and some dude named Rob Burnett at DE (both weighed 260 lbs.). I have no idea where you keep getting this idea that the Broncos need a 300 lb. DE...we don't have a 3 man line (where you would typically need a bigger DE)...we have a 5 or 4 man line.

If you want a huge mofro to replace Bannan or Vickerson, then great...you will get your chance, this draft has a few (John Jenkins, Brandon Williams). For some reason, you keep trying to fit a square peg into a round hole, it's almost McDaniels-esque. Also, the Broncos Defense did fine stopping the rush up the middle in 2012, so drafting a 2 down NT isn't really a need. Put Wolfe in at UT and call it. Problem solved.
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Old 01-29-2013, 01:06 PM   #209
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IHe thinks Wolfe is not good as a DE in our scheme and his replacement is a light weight weak side rusher, essentially negating the use of Von Miller. Now when someone has such crazy ideas, why would I or someone else want to keep explaining how hes not correct?
Kinda like how JDR was going to use Jason Hunter? Utterly insane I tell ya!

Negate the use of Von Miller by moving Wolfe to UT and adding a faster pass-rushing DE? What on god's green earth are you talking about?
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Old 01-29-2013, 01:10 PM   #210
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And I've wondered if Milus didn't place Moore where he was on that play?
Nope. The play was Cover Two with Tampa drop in the deep middle basically making it a cover three with both safeties in the deep third and five at the marker. Why, OH freaking WHY, we were in that Coverage instead of Quarters and four underneath at the markers I'll never know Worst freaking playcall of the season and totally not situationally appropriate.

Moore Blew the coverage by even considering coming up on the TE at the marker. Deep third is deep third. Boy blew it hard. Period.
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Old 01-29-2013, 01:14 PM   #211
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Star Loutlelierilerli is a 9th round pick`!!!
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Old 01-29-2013, 01:31 PM   #212
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MUG says Wolfe will ALWAYS play DE, so it's gospel

Baltimore circa 2000 used Peter Boulware, like we use Von Miller...they had humongous DT's and average size DE's. JDR said in training camp he wanted Wolfe to increase the size of his base to play inside. That tells me all I need to know.


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Star Loutlelierilerli is a 9th round pick`!!!
You're still mad that I initially gave a mid 1st round grade on Lotulelei two months ago? Tough crowd.

Jerel Worthy is the greatest EVAR!!1!!!!!1

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Old 01-29-2013, 01:34 PM   #213
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Jerel Worthy is the greatest!!1!!!!!1
Not anymore. He has one leg now.

And no, you didn't give him a mid-first grade off the rip. That was after admitting you never watched him play and based it off his production and measurables and were able to watch a few games. . .

Originally: You said he was only a first rounder because of how weak this class, depsite the fact that he is going to go in the Top 5 of this draft. Everyone laughed at you and queefed on your face!

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Old 01-29-2013, 01:48 PM   #214
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You have to wonder if the Broncos are going to leave Wolfe at DE in base formations and move him inside on passing downs like they do now, or just move him inside next season full time. In JDR's scheme, he'll need to bulk up some to do it, but it would make sense, depending on what happens with big Vick. I'd like to see the Broncos get the big pocket collapsing NT in the draft. A Jesse Williams, John Jenkins, Brandon Williams type of prospect.

You're right though. Logan would be a DE in this scheme as long as JDR is here.
Wolfe will probably be staying at DE, though he plays and his position in this scheme is that of a DT..he is so very important to Von's success. And the more Wolfe and Von develop, the better and more dynamic they will be. As long as Von is playing OLB, we will need Wolfe, or similar player at DE.
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Old 01-29-2013, 02:11 PM   #215
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Nope. The play was Cover Two with Tampa drop in the deep middle basically making it a cover three with both safeties in the deep third and five at the marker. Why, OH freaking WHY, we were in that Coverage instead of Quarters and four underneath at the markers I'll never know Worst freaking playcall of the season and totally not situationally appropriate.

Moore Blew the coverage by even considering coming up on the TE at the marker. Deep third is deep third. Boy blew it hard. Period.
Which I guess is why Milus is no longer with us.
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Old 01-29-2013, 02:19 PM   #216
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Which I guess is why Milus is no longer with us.
You were being sarcastic about Troy and Moore.. Right..?
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Old 01-29-2013, 02:27 PM   #217
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Wolfe will probably be staying at DE, though he plays and his position in this scheme is that of a DT..he is so very important to Von's success. And the more Wolfe and Von develop, the better and more dynamic they will be. As long as Von is playing OLB, we will need Wolfe, or similar player at DE.

I agree with Wolfe being used as a Justin Smith type player, I said the samething about Hunt. That is why I was high on him. For us to move him full time inside we would be looking at a replacement DE around 290, that is if we run the same scheme. I see zero reason to replace the scheme after one year of running it with the success we had. I think we luck out this year with the FA's available and the deep draft at DT.
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Old 01-29-2013, 04:03 PM   #218
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I agree with Wolfe being used as a Justin Smith type player, I said the samething about Hunt. That is why I was high on him. For us to move him full time inside we would be looking at a replacement DE around 290, that is if we run the same scheme. I see zero reason to replace the scheme after one year of running it with the success we had. I think we luck out this year with the FA's available and the deep draft at DT.
I hope we get one in the draft (Williams) and one in free agency (Knighton/Sims).. I think we can let Bannan go now.. lol..

I'm telling you bro, 49ers will take him in the first if he makes it there.
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Old 01-29-2013, 04:21 PM   #219
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Which I guess is why Milus is no longer with us.
Hold on, Milus screwed up because one of his players made the same mental and technical error he made 3 weeks before the playoff game at the worst strategically placed time. That he did not correct and get Moore to execute that coverage correctly would be grounds for dismissal.

The playcall, well that comes from the DC. Yes, Del Rio gets to have the same shame Lebeau had in DEN the previous year with the game on the line. He made a terrible playcall at the worst possible time. I am glad they did not go full on prevent defense, but rush 3 and have your deep safety bite on an underneath route and allow the WR to get behind him and then still play the ball technically wrong to confound the mental errors

Del Rio simply made a tremendous playcalling error. The shame is, they played so well in the fourth Quarter and finished so many games this year. Best fourth Quarter defense in the league by many measures during the regular season. Why play like its a first grade developmental league and work on playing the marker? Just play four deep and keep the damn ball in front and in bounds!
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Old 01-29-2013, 04:51 PM   #220
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I hope we get one in the draft (Williams) and one in free agency (Knighton/Sims).. I think we can let Bannan go now.. lol..

I'm telling you bro, 49ers will take him in the first if he makes it there.
I think we go RB/CB in the first round. DE/DT in the second then RB/CB in the third. Just a feeling, just like I think Denver uses the same formula as we did last year with the DL. Cheap rotation guys.


Maybe it will just be those three positions in the first three rounds

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Old 01-29-2013, 08:01 PM   #221
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I think we go RB/CB in the first round. DE/DT in the second then RB/CB in the third. Just a feeling, just like I think Denver uses the same formula as we did last year with the DL. Cheap rotation guys.


Maybe it will just be those three positions in the first three rounds
Putting personal interests aside, do you really think we draft a DE that early..? It would have to be Hunt or maybe Jones. But I really don't think we are taking a DE, at least not an early one. But I would be open for either especially Hunt.

I really think we target a safety early, maybe two.
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Old 01-29-2013, 08:15 PM   #222
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Putting personal interests aside, do you really think we draft a DE that early..? It would have to be Hunt or maybe Jones. But I really don't think we are taking a DE, at least not an early one. But I would be open for either especially Hunt.

I really think we target a safety early, maybe two.
I'm saying DT/DE because the player we draft will have size like Wolfe. We rotate too much not to keep depth on the front four. Also I think the front four will be better with a bigger DE with more speed then Wolfe.
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Old 01-30-2013, 08:53 AM   #223
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It's to the same poster. One who doesn't watch any actual games/tape of college prospects, just reads stats and has an opinion. And we have already been down this road on Moore with this particular poster, it's wasted effort to do it again.
Though Rahim Moore misjudged the ball (and barely missed it), Tony Carter didn't do anything on the play. Carter was supposed to jam Jacoby Jones and cover him all the way up the sideline. He did neither.

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Also I think the front four will be better with a bigger DE with more speed then Wolfe.
Impossible, unless you plan to draft J.J. Watt, who is the same size as Wolfe, but much faster and quicker. J.J. Watt has a rare combination of size, speed, and strength that has probably never been seen in the NFL, and probably won't be seen again for several more years.


It's preferable for a strongside 4-3 DE to have 4.60-4.80 speed (with great size , and moves) in order to get around the opposing Right Tackle by any means necessary, while also being able to stop the run. In the Broncos Base Defense there is virtually no chance for a QB sack the way the Defensive Line is currently constructed. Wolfe is too far away from the QB at DE and too slow, and Dumervil can be double-teamed. Vickerson and Bannan have no pass-rush ability.

Sam Montgomery brings that burst that is necessary to close the distance to the QB quickly from the end position. He is a better prospect than Chandler Jones was in 2011 (same size, but much faster). Montgomery has the height to bulk up to 280 lbs. easily if that's what you want (DB4L), while remaining relatively fast. If Montgomery really does fall to the mid-20's the Broncos should do whatever it takes to get him. Other than him, I would possibly consider some of the other higher rated DE's but still need to study them a bit more...at initial glance, Montgomery looks like a better fit than some of the other prospects.


I spent some time last night looking at John Hankins and John Jenkins for the NT position. John Hankins may be a good impact NT, but won't be available when the Broncos pick. John Jenkins is a weird prospect to me. He has extremely quick feet, but he's slow as molasses in the open field, and has trouble switching directions. His functional strength (both upper and lower body) is highly questionable. I would like to see how many bench reps he puts up at the combine. It's too early for me to tell if he can become an impact player in the NFL or not, so I'm reserving judgement for now.

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Old 01-30-2013, 08:58 AM   #224
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Though Rahim Moore misjudged the ball (and barely missed it), Tony Carter didn't do anything on the play. Carter was supposed to jam Jacoby Jones and cover him all the way up the sideline. He did neither.



Impossible, unless you plan to draft J.J. Watt, who is the same size as Wolfe, but much faster and quicker. J.J. Watt has a rare combination of size, speed, and strength that has probably never been seen in the NFL, and probably won't be seen again for several more years.


It's preferable for a strongside 4-3 DE to have 4.60-4.80 speed (with great size , and moves) in order to get around the opposing Right Tackle by any means necessary, while also being able to stop the run. In the Broncos Base Defense there is virtually no chance for a QB sack the way the Defensive Line is currently constructed. Wolfe is too far away from the QB at DE and too slow, and Dumervil can be double-teamed. Vickerson and Bannan have no pass-rush ability.

Sam Montgomery brings that burst that is necessary to close the distance to the QB quickly from the end position. He is a better prospect than Chandler Jones was in 2011 (same size, but much faster). Montgomery has the height to bulk up to 280 lbs. easily if that's what you want (DB4L), while remaining relatively fast. If Montgomery really does fall to the mid-20's the Broncos should do whatever it takes to get him. Other than him, I would possibly consider some of the other higher rated DE's but still need to study them a bit more...at initial glance, Montgomery looks like a better fit than some of the other prospects.


I spent some time last night looking at John Hankins and John Jenkins for the NT position. John Hankins is a good impact NT, but won't be available when the Broncos pick. John Jenkins is a weird prospect to me. He has extremely quick feet, but he's slow as molasses in the open field, and has trouble switching directions. His functional strength (both upper and lower body) is highly questionable. I would like to see how many bench reps he puts up at the combine. It's too early for me to tell if he can become an impact player in the NFL or not, so I'm reserving judgement for now. I can tell you, I don't like his lack of production.
Hankins will actually more than likely be there. Theres a real good chance.
And i am not advocating taking him, but sometimes you guys act like there's 180 picks before DEN makes a pick.
Theres only 27 slots in front of us, emkay guys.
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Old 01-30-2013, 09:06 AM   #225
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I'm saying DT/DE because the player we draft will have size like Wolfe. We rotate too much not to keep depth on the front four. Also I think the front four will be better with a bigger DE with more speed then Wolfe.
Yeah, good luck with that.

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