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Old 01-24-2013, 07:16 PM   #376
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Way to take a stand... as usual.... never commit to anything controversial but mock anyone who does... this is what is wrong with our society now.
You are, by definition...an idiot.
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Old 01-24-2013, 07:17 PM   #377
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Tim Tebow will never...ever be an effective QB in the NFL.

Why?

Because he can't throw the football.
It's basically that simple. Comparing him to QBs like young Wilson Kaep etc etc is ridiculous. Those QBs can THROW.
 
Old 01-24-2013, 07:34 PM   #378
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You still haven't answered the question. What was Elway's motivation for sabotaging Tebow? Saying he doesn't know what he's doing isn't the same is saying he was sabotaging him. Sabotage suggests he was actively trying to ruin Tebow. Explain specifically how Elway sabotaged Tebow and explain why he chose to.

Saying "because Dirk Nowitzki = Tebow" doesn't work for me.

Are you, by chance, Angryllama's friend?
Elway's motivation was the fact he didn't know how to build around Tebow. John Gruden has been studying spread offenses constantly to try to understand them fully and implement them.. he has gone to college teams to do this. Belichick has done the same. This is why McD drafted Tebow because he fit in Belichick's offense.

Do you think Elway has this knowledge? Does he even know how to get it? Do you think he would risk his future on tying himself to Tebow when he has no idea how to build around him?

Elway was afraid if he tied himself to Tebow the way McDaniels did he would risk going down too.. even though it really wasn't anything to do with Tebow but that was the perception.

So... to sabotage Tebow the first thing he did was get a coach he knew Tebow would look terrible with and would have no idea how to use Tebow.

He also gave Tebow ZERO help preparing for the first season to potential be the starter WHILE claiming Tebow was going to get the starting job. He also let Gaffney go who was Tebow's biggest supporter in the locker room - ex-Florida guy. Probably because Gaffney was a anti Orton guy as well.

Then training camp starts and because Fox's system is designed for Orton who they always wanted to start Tebow looks terrible in practice.. meanwhile they are flooidng the media with anti Tebow press and fueling the anti Tebow sentiment in the Bronco lockerroom. Making an environment ideal for the people who didn't want to see Tebow start.. such as the receivers who are more concerned with their bank account than winning - like Lloyd.

Then Orton tanks and they move Lloyd... so Tebow has no veteran receivers, no training camp and Decker is limited raw and Demaryius Thomas is coming back from injury.

They moved the veteran receivers to ensure Tebow would have little chance of success... so he would tank that season and then they could use the resources they cleared to help them build around a QB they wanted in a system they understood the next season. It worked kinda.. only they picked a guy who isn't physically capable of surviving NFL playoff games anymore...

But Elway's goal is just to create the illusion of success anyway.... just to protect his job.. I don't think he really cares about winning.. it's not his priority. Winning to him is protecting his own future.. even if it's at the expense of the fans present.

Last edited by MacGruder; 01-24-2013 at 07:42 PM..
 
Old 01-24-2013, 07:35 PM   #379
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Illusion of success........

Kinda like what you've been pedaling here about tebow.
 
Old 01-24-2013, 07:37 PM   #380
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It's basically that simple. Comparing him to QBs like young Wilson Kaep etc etc is ridiculous. Those QBs can THROW.
Tebow could throw before NFL coaches changed his motion... they changed his motion because that's their job.

That's the problem with NFL people.. they are paid so much money they feel they have to do **** like that to earn their pay check.. when what they should be doing is simply letting him play and not messing with him. People in the NFL completely over think things.. paralysis by over analysis...
 
Old 01-24-2013, 07:38 PM   #381
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Originally Posted by MacGruder View Post
Elway's motivation was the fact he didn't know how to build around Tebow. John Gruden has been studying spread offenses constantly to try to understand them fully and implement them.. he has gone to college teams to do this. Belichick has done the same. This is why McD drafted Tebow because he fit in Belichick's offense.

Do you think Elway has this knowledge? Does he even know how to get it? Do you think he would risk his future on tying himself to Tebow when he has no idea how to build around him?

Elway was afraid if he tied himself to Tebow the way McDaniels did he would risk going down too.. even though it really wasn't anything to do with Tebow but that was the perception.

So... to sabotage Tebow the first thing he did was get a coach he knew Tebow would look terrible with and would have no idea how to use Tebow.

He also gave Tebow ZERO help preparing for the first season to potential be the starter WHILE claiming Tebow was going to get the starting job. He also let Gaffney go who was Tebow's biggest supporter in the locker room - ex-Florida guy. Probably because Gaffney was a anti Orton guy as well.

Then training camp starts and because Fox's system is designed for Orton who they always wanted to start Tebow looks terrible in practice.. meanwhile they are flooidng the media with anti Tebow press and fueling the anti Tebow sentiment in the Bronco lockerroom. Making a environment ideal for the people who wanted to see Tebow start.. such as the receivers who are more concerned with their bank account than winning - like Lloyd.

Then Orton tanks and they move Lloyd... so Tebow has no veteran receivers, no training camp and Decker is limited raw and Demaryius Thomas is coming back from injury.

They moved the veteran receivers to ensure Tebow would have little chance of success... so he would tank that season and then they could use the resources they cleared to help them build around a QB they wanted in a system they understood the next season. It worked kinda.. only they picked a guy who isn't physically capable of surviving NFL playoff games anymore...

But Elway's goal is just to create the illusion of success anyway.... just to protect his job.. I don't think he really cares about winning.. it's not his priority. Winning to him is protecting his own future.. even if it's at the expense of the fans present.
No.

You have been refuted.
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Old 01-24-2013, 07:39 PM   #382
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Illusion of success........

Kinda like what you've been pedaling here about tebow.
No.. that's what you all have been peddling with Peyton... his pretty numbers in the regular season are the illusion of success.. reality hit in the post season.
 
Old 01-24-2013, 07:39 PM   #383
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Tebow could throw before NFL coaches changed his motion... they changed his motion because that's their job.

That's the problem with NFL people.. they are paid so much money they feel they have to do **** like that to earn their pay check.. when what they should be doing is simply letting him play and not messing with him. People in the NFL completely over think things.. paralysis by over analysis...
Every time you make up something or say something that is not true, you will get this response: No.
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Old 01-24-2013, 07:40 PM   #384
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Tebow could throw before NFL coaches changed his motion... they changed his motion because that's their job.

That's the problem with NFL people.. they are paid so much money they feel they have to do **** like that to earn their pay check.. when what they should be doing is simply letting him play and not messing with him. People in the NFL completely over think things.. paralysis by over analysis...
Eric crouch could throw before NFL people too. Same with Gino Torretta. As Ryan Leaf. Jamarcus. Vince young. Face it, you're argument looks like a big bag of mashed up azzholes. Keep clinging to college success hoping it translates to the NFL

Last edited by Drunken.Broncoholic; 01-24-2013 at 07:44 PM..
 
Old 01-24-2013, 07:49 PM   #385
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Eric crouch could throw before NFL people too. Same with Gino Torretta. As Ryan Leaf. Jamarcus. Vince young. Face it, you're argument looks like a big bag of mashed up azzholes. Keep clinging to college success hoping it translates to the NFL
What do you expect to happen when you take a player and change everything about the way they play and put them in a system that they have never played in on a TERRIBLE team with terrible coaches and weak players?



Look at guys like Cam and RGIII etc... they these guys had excellent offensive coaches around them.. cam had tons of experience weapons around him on offense and a line that was dominant. Tebow outplayed Cam on just as bad a team with coaches doing next to nothing to adapt to him.

You can ignore that but it's the reality..

And those players you mention were not Tebow.. they didn't dominate the toughest defenses in college for years. They played in an era without parity....

You can lump them all together because it looks similar but it isn't. Tebow has upside these guys don't... he was dominating off of raw ability.. also this is a different era.. those guys could have succeeded in this era too for that reason.. but not if they were screwed over and not given a real chance like Tebow has been...
 
Old 01-24-2013, 08:01 PM   #386
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What do you expect to happen when you take a player and change everything about the way they play and put them in a system that they have never played in on a TERRIBLE team with terrible coaches and weak players?



Look at guys like Cam and RGIII etc... they these guys had excellent offensive coaches around them.. cam had tons of experience weapons around him on offense and a line that was dominant. Tebow outplayed Cam on just as bad a team with coaches doing next to nothing to adapt to him.

You can ignore that but it's the reality..

And those players you mention were not Tebow.. they didn't dominate the toughest defenses in college for years. They played in an era without parity....

You can lump them all together because it looks similar but it isn't. Tebow has upside these guys don't... he was dominating off of raw ability.. also this is a different era.. those guys could have succeeded in this era too for that reason.. but not if they were screwed over and not given a real chance like Tebow has been...
Which guy out played the other guy again

Career 35 16 8-6-0 173 361 47.9 2422 17 4.7 9 2.5 56 6.7 6.5 14.0 69.2 75.3 41 258 5.38 5.22 10.2 6 7 12


Career 32 32 13-19-0 590 1002 58.9 7920 40 4.0 29 2.9 91 7.9 7.4 13.4 247.5 85.3 71 504 6.91 6.44 6.6 2 2 34
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Old 01-24-2013, 08:05 PM   #387
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Which guy out played the other guy again

Career 35 16 8-6-0 173 361 47.9 2422 17 4.7 9 2.5 56 6.7 6.5 14.0 69.2 75.3 41 258 5.38 5.22 10.2 6 7 12


Career 32 32 13-19-0 590 1002 58.9 7920 40 4.0 29 2.9 91 7.9 7.4 13.4 247.5 85.3 71 504 6.91 6.44 6.6 2 2 34
You're doing it again.. meaningless numbers in losses.

I said why Cam looked better.. he had a better offense around him and Tebow had a better D. Both were terrible teams.. Tebow led his to success cam didn't...

They tried to use Cam like Tebow this season and he played WORSE not better. They thought for sure if they followed the Tebow formula that Cam would do even better and he was worse.

Just like everyone assumed Peyton would be better than Tebow..
 
Old 01-24-2013, 08:10 PM   #388
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Which guy out played the other guy again

Career 35 16 8-6-0 173 361 47.9 2422 17 4.7 9 2.5 56 6.7 6.5 14.0 69.2 75.3 41 258 5.38 5.22 10.2 6 7 12


Career 32 32 13-19-0 590 1002 58.9 7920 40 4.0 29 2.9 91 7.9 7.4 13.4 247.5 85.3 71 504 6.91 6.44 6.6 2 2 34
I'm going to go with the guy that isn't going to be out of the NFL because he sucks.
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Old 01-24-2013, 08:11 PM   #389
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You're doing it again.. meaningless numbers in losses.

I said why Cam looked better.. he had a better offense around him and Tebow had a better D. Both were terrible teams.. Tebow led his to success cam didn't...

They tried to use Cam like Tebow this season and he played WORSE not better. They thought for sure if they followed the Tebow formula that Cam would do even better and he was worse.

Just like everyone assumed Peyton would be better than Tebow..
Why are you here?


Tebow is gone.


Are you mad about the fact…yes…fact that Tebow will never be a starting QB in the league ever again?
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Old 01-24-2013, 08:14 PM   #390
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Why are you here?


Tebow is gone.


Are you mad about the fact…yes…fact that Tebow will never be a starting QB in the league ever again?
The same people saying Tebow's career is over are the same people saying he could never do what he did last season...

I'm really not worried.. Tebow proved himself already.. if people aren't smart enough to see that there's not much you can do.

Last edited by MacGruder; 01-24-2013 at 08:17 PM..
 
Old 01-24-2013, 08:25 PM   #391
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The same people saying Tebow's career is over are the same people saying he could never do what he did last season...

I'm really not worried.. Tebow proved himself already.. if people aren't smart enough to see that there's not much you can do.
The same Tebow that couldn't beat out Mark friggin Sanchez?
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Old 01-24-2013, 08:26 PM   #392
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The same Tebow that couldn't beat out Mark friggin Sanchez?
Another example of people just not understanding reality.. the Jets had already invested too much money in Sanchez... NFL people will never admit they are wrong about something...
 
Old 01-24-2013, 08:27 PM   #393
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The same Tebow that couldn't beat out Mark friggin Sanchez?
Or that 3rd stringer who's name I don't even know.
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Old 01-24-2013, 08:30 PM   #394
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Sure...what's the difference between the two?

MacGruber isn't the one who claimed Tebow would revolutionize the QB position......

Now that was stupid.....
How far do you think your boy Kyle under his shiny new 3 year deal would have gotten us this year?
 
Old 01-24-2013, 08:32 PM   #395
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Or that 3rd stringer who's name I don't even know.
Remember... NFL people will never admit they are wrong... Tebow was never supposed to be a QB for the Jets... just a wildcat QB.

The Jets were incredibly desperate for any kind of offensive weapons... he was used more as a diversion than anything.

If Tebow comes in and lights it up then they look bad for not playing him over Sanchez and their Sanchez investment is wrecked even more.

It's the same reason the Broncos made Tebow look back to protect Orton early on. They wouldn't even use him as a wildcat with Orton.
 
Old 01-24-2013, 08:33 PM   #396
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You're doing it again.. meaningless numbers in losses.

I said why Cam looked better.. he had a better offense around him and Tebow had a better D. Both were terrible teams.. Tebow led his to success cam didn't...

They tried to use Cam like Tebow this season and he played WORSE not better. They thought for sure if they followed the Tebow formula that Cam would do even better and he was worse.

Just like everyone assumed Peyton would be better than Tebow..
Your the one who conviently forget that Tebow got blown out by the Pats last year (I am talking about the Divisional Blowout not the 1st regular humiliation) and keep talking up the Steeler game.

Newton and Kapernick are better at being Tebow than Tebow is, he is going to find himself up playing for the Argonauts or Alloutes(sp?). Not because he is being run out of the NFL but because he sucks and no one wants to waste their time trying to figure out an offense simple enough for him to run.

When a 2 win team who cannot sell out their stadium isn't desperate enough to bring him in for pennies to fill the stands you know your guy is a bust.
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Old 01-24-2013, 08:35 PM   #397
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I haven't read but this page of the thread. However, I am willing to bet that I can sum it all up in one sentence.

Macgruber is right and everyone else on the planet is wrong.

Does that pretty much cover it.
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Old 01-24-2013, 08:37 PM   #398
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Remember... NFL people will never admit they are wrong... Tebow was never supposed to be a QB for the Jets... just a wildcat QB.

The Jets were incredibly desperate for any kind of offensive weapons... he was used more as a diversion than anything.

If Tebow comes in and lights it up then they look bad for not playing him over Sanchez and their Sanchez investment is wrecked even more.

It's the same reason the Broncos made Tebow look back to protect Orton early on. They wouldn't even use him as a wildcat with Orton.
Don't they look bad enough for starting a 3rd stringer over both guys?

What is the difference? They knew what they had in Tebow and they wanted to see what they had out of what'shisname3rdstringer. Either way they are losing.

Can NFL teams make a trade to a CFL team? That is the only way they unload their bust.

Elway trading Tebow for a 4th is almost as big a trade as Portis for Bailey and and 2nd! We are lucky we got anything back for a Punt Protector/gadget player.
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Old 01-24-2013, 08:47 PM   #399
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Your the one who conviently forget that Tebow got blown out by the Pats last year (I am talking about the Divisional Blowout not the 1st regular humiliation) and keep talking up the Steeler game.

Newton and Kapernick are better at being Tebow than Tebow is, he is going to find himself up playing for the Argonauts or Alloutes(sp?). Not because he is being run out of the NFL but because he sucks and no one wants to waste their time trying to figure out an offense simple enough for him to run.

When a 2 win team who cannot sell out their stadium isn't desperate enough to bring him in for pennies to fill the stands you know your guy is a bust.
So you trust the opinion of a 2 win team?
 
Old 01-24-2013, 08:52 PM   #400
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Another example of people just not understanding reality.. the Jets had already invested too much money in Sanchez... I will never admit I am wrong about something...

Fixed it for you.
 
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