The Orange Mane -  a Denver Broncos Fan Community  

Go Back   The Orange Mane - a Denver Broncos Fan Community > Orange Mane Discussion > Orange Mane Central Discussion
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Chat Room Mark Forums Read



Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-16-2013, 03:55 PM   #101
gyldenlove
Ring of Famer
 
gyldenlove's Avatar
 

Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Nζstved, DK
Posts: 10,918

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Spencer Larsen
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by socalorado View Post
CIN either takes Minter or Reid or Elam.
The fan base is screaming to take a FS, and they have not been really keen on how Rey Rey panned out so far, so Minter is a big upgrade there too.
Your thinking of Burfict. CIN has 5! LBs that are FA's!!!
Vincent Rey – CIN – (RFA)
Thomas Howard – CIN
Manny Lawson – CIN
Rey Maualuga – CIN
Dan Skuta – CIN

And i am not sure what their salary cap is, but they have not been real happy with Rey Maualuga at MLB.
Maualuga is a pretty big failure in that defence, he has no instincts at all, he can't cover - he is basically Joe Mays.
gyldenlove is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2013, 03:56 PM   #102
BroncoMan4ever
Ring of Famer
 
BroncoMan4ever's Avatar
 
That's just like your opinion, man

Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Denver
Posts: 13,229

Adopt-a-Bronco:
VIRGIL GREEN!!!
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by broncosteven View Post
Well they did throw a ton of money at Manning last year, he wasn't on anyone's PS.

I could see them going after 1 big name if they feel the need to, doesn't seem to make a lot of sense to try to build a team for the future when PM's clock is ticking.

Melton would make the whole D better and a quality proven RB would make the O better. They are not building a team for Ossweiler.
Proven RB is just a way of saying a re-tread. RB is one of few positions a rookie can come in and be instantly successful. Why bring in an old guy when we can draft a good one
BroncoMan4ever is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2013, 04:10 PM   #103
DBroncos4life
Hey pic Mod!?!?! FU
 
DBroncos4life's Avatar
 
Bacon bits

Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: The wrong side of right.
Posts: 28,580

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Julius "Fluff"
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by socalorado View Post
CIN either takes Minter or Reid or Elam.
The fan base is screaming to take a FS, and they have not been really keen on how Rey Rey panned out so far, so Minter is a big upgrade there too.
Your thinking of Burfict. CIN has 5! LBs that are FA's!!!
Vincent Rey – CIN – (RFA)
Thomas Howard – CIN
Manny Lawson – CIN
Rey Maualuga – CIN
Dan Skuta – CIN

And i am not sure what their salary cap is, but they have not been real happy with Rey Maualuga at MLB.
Nate Clements, Adam Jones, and Terence Newman are FA's as well. That is a big chunk of their secondary.
DBroncos4life is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2013, 04:36 PM   #104
Mat'hir Uth Gan
Ring of Famer
 

Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 1,684
Default

Cincinnati probably resigns Howard to play WILL and moves Burfict to MIKE. Howard was pretty good for them up until his injury. Maualuga and Lawson won't be back. I think they'll draft Ogletree to play SAM. It's well-known they don't care about off the field drug issues. I don't really see a team before Cincinnati taking a chance on Ogletree.

I think we'll be able to nab Minter if we want him. Baltimore was really the only team I was concerned about. I do not expect Xavier Rhodes to fall to us.
Mat'hir Uth Gan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2013, 07:14 PM   #105
Bmore Manning
Guest
 

Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Requiem View Post
Pretty much ever "?" Smith had coming out of Utah is the same with Amerson at N.C. State, and they both excelled in reads off the zone. They are very similar.
Amerson would not excel in zone or at FS, he doesn't like to tackle. I cannot fathom where you and SoCal are coming up with this.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2013, 10:08 AM   #106
Old Dude
Super Moderator
 
Old Dude's Avatar
 
Consultant

Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: DIA Tunnels
Posts: 14,778
Default

I wouldn't be shocked to see Denver make a play for Richard Seymour.

The defensive line is still an issue. The Raiders are several million over the cap. With just a couple years remaining in his career, he'd be attracted to a contender (much like Neil Smith back in 97, so long as we're sticking to those analogies).

Sure, there are age and health issues, but there are always issues for UFAs.
Old Dude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2013, 03:51 AM   #107
fontaine
Ring of Famer
 
fontaine's Avatar
 
Go John Manning!

Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 13,044
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drek View Post

With that $9.75M to work with and our full allotment of draft picks this is the road map I'd outline for us:

1. Running Back.
I see a RB taylor made for this offense in the draft, his name is Stepfan Taylor from Stanford, currently projected as a late 2nd/early 3rd by most draft prognosticators. He's a well rounded three down back who can contribute in all phases of the Manning offense, much like Knowshon Moreno. He should offer a bit more explosiveness than Moreno and will be an ideal #2 behind him for a season or two before replacing him. Couple this with Hillman developing physically and we could have a good two back tandem of Taylor and Hillman for a long time going forward.

2. Offensive Line.
I'd love to draft one of the premier guards in this class, and Barrett Jones before his lisfranc was my top target with our first round pick. Unfortunately I just don't see the numbers adding up there, as the premier OGs likely go before our first round pick, Jones' health makes him a question mark we can't really afford to roll the dice on before round 3, and honestly, we need a guy we know can contribute right away. To me that means free agency. Obviously a late round OL should be included in the mix, but a quality 6th man needs to be acquired on the OL. To that end my personal preference would be signing Louis Vasquez away from the Chargers. He was a spread OL in college and is a better pass protector than run blocker, but has improved in that aspect of his game in the pros. Most importantly he's big and powerful. With the Chargers dropping both Smith and Turner there will likely be some front office transition and Vasquez isn't the kind of guy you put a tag on. For an AAV around $4-$5M we likely could lock up a 26 year old starting guard for a reasonable price. This would bump Beadles to the swing guard/tackle role, making him that 6th man I was talking about. If Vasquez can't be had then Donald Thomas from New England would be a solid alternative, competing with Beadles for the LG job while also providing another player with some experience at OC in a pinch.

3. Defensive Tackle.
We won't be in range to grab a standout DT in the draft and also will not have the money to go after a Henry Melton. That's ok because I see a perfect fit that will likely sign cheap on a "make good" deal. Terence Knighton of the Jacksonville Jaguars. Some off-field issues and freak injury problems have greatly depleted Knighton's value, including him losing his starting job in Jacksonville. They have a new GM and are likely once again changing coaches. This sounds like an excellent opportunity for Del Rio to recruit one of his former standouts, getting Knighton here on reasonable money to provide the 4-3 nose tackle this defense needs to take the next step. His salary would likely be quite reasonable since he needs to re-establish his value. If he does that and makes our roster he'd bump one of the other DTs off, making this more or less cap neutral as far as the final 53 man roster is concerned (what the cap number is based on).

4. Middle Linebacker.
To me this is where we go with our first round pick. Manti Te'o, Kevin Minter, and Alec Ogeltree are all first round worthy MLBs and one is almost definitely going to be available for us in the first. If Te'o's lackluster championship game makes him slide to us then great, we're sitting pretty, otherwise I'd be more than happy with Alec Ogeltree, the former safety with elite athleticism and NFL ready coverage skills. He'd instantly improve our ability to handle opposing TEs.

5. Safety.
This is a two part solution. Step one, move Champ to safety, taking his declining speed from only above average back to elite status, step two is sign another corner to battle Carter for the #2 job opposite Harris. This leaves a safety depth chart of Champ, Rahim Moore (he's a solid player, he's coming back, quit hating on him for one play), Q. Carter, and Bruton. I like the looks of that. So that leads straight to...

6. Corner.
Ideal world Del Rio can get us a sweet deal on Derek Cox from Jacksonville. While oft-injured he's a standout when on the field. I don't see that happening though, he's likely looking at >$7M AAV and we'd have a hard time fitting that on the books. The alternative also comes from Jacksonville though, in the form of Rashean Mathis. A former standout at corner he wasn't quite up to par this season after his ACL tear in 2011. He's healthy now though and got stronger as the year went on. He's an older experienced veteran who would provide us a very solid base to only work up from at #2 corner if Carter takes the next step forward. This way worst case scenario Mathis is #2, Carter is #3, and Omar Boldin is #4. Solid group. Add another mid to late round corner and we should be doing ok here.

So that's a road map I'd like to see the team shoot for. Use the available cash to splash the pot in stealing a division rival's best young OL, fixing one of our weaknesses while creating one for them, add even moderate draft luck and we can hit needs while still going BPA in rounds 1 and 2, then fill out the other immediate needs with low cost veteran signings that Del Rio should have some strong appeal to.
I completely agree with this except for the need at OL/S.

We already have a much improved interior with Walton/Beadles so I think they'll get better next year now that they'll be used to playing in this offense. Kuper will be at full strength next year along with Franklin continuing to improve. Koppen, Blake, and Ramirez will provide very good depth. So the question is: Any OL we bring in would have to be better than any of these guys to make the final roster.

The best chance for improvement in this team is going to come one of two ways:

1. Upgrading the biggest weakness in the roster at MLB, DT, RB (Moreno is good in this offense but we should expect a lot more from our run game it's up against 6 man fronts with safeties deep most of the time). Our run game is NOT a home run threat with any of our backs and there's huge room for improvement there. Our OL, passing game is good enough to create opportunities for the run game but ask yourself how many times the likes of Moreno/Hillman couldn't evade that final tackler that was the difference between a nice 12-15 yard gain and a home run?

2. BPA in the draft. We need another x-factor in this team. We have a number of them like Von with his pass rush, Trindon Holliday in Special Teams, Manning in the passing game but we still need a couple more difference makers against the run (either at DT or MLB) and a home run threat at RB or even TE.

I think the TE position is the dark horse in terms of need. Tamme isn't a difference maker, he's a decent compliment but not a guy who's going to dominate the opposition and our passing game is built to open up the crossing/shallow routes over the middle for a big time TE to exploit.
fontaine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2013, 04:54 AM   #108
TheReverend
www.PatrickTurley.org
 
TheReverend's Avatar
 
Not. Too. Shabby.

Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 36,608

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Mike Shanahan
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Dude View Post
I wouldn't be shocked to see Denver make a play for Richard Seymour.

The defensive line is still an issue. The Raiders are several million over the cap. With just a couple years remaining in his career, he'd be attracted to a contender (much like Neil Smith back in 97, so long as we're sticking to those analogies).

Sure, there are age and health issues, but there are always issues for UFAs.
Old Patriots 3-4 DEs have worked out extremely well for us.
TheReverend is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2013, 06:36 AM   #109
Rohirrim
Partisan
 
Rohirrim's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Twixt Hell & Highwater
Posts: 53,989

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Malik Jackson
Default

I think that having a guy like Sharrif Floyd at DT, who can create an interior pass rush out of the 4 man front, makes our secondary that much better. With Wolfe, Doom and Von rushing from the edges, that creates one on ones for Floyd. Since I've been saying the same thing for years (about various pass rushing DTs) and the Broncos obviously don't agree, I assume I'm wrong about that.
Rohirrim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2013, 08:15 AM   #110
eddie mac
Ireland's No1 Bronco
 
eddie mac's Avatar
 
Eddie Mac 87 gone but never forgott

Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: IRELAND
Posts: 16,621

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Rod Smith
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rohirrim View Post
I think that having a guy like Sharrif Floyd at DT, who can create an interior pass rush out of the 4 man front, makes our secondary that much better. With Wolfe, Doom and Von rushing from the edges, that creates one on ones for Floyd. Since I've been saying the same thing for years (about various pass rushing DTs) and the Broncos obviously don't agree, I assume I'm wrong about that.
Maybe only me but I always thought that the Broncos put guys up front to protect an often inadequate MLB (especially since Wilson retired) by keeping blockers away from the next level and playing decent run defense. If there's an interior rush to go along with that then it was always a bonus. Personally feel if you draft a guy like Floyd and start him you better have a guy beside him that can take on 2 and keep the OL off the LB'ers, cos we currently dont have anyone near a playmaker there in the middle and dont even start me on their coverage skills.
eddie mac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2013, 09:04 AM   #111
Requiem
~~~
 
Requiem's Avatar
 
~ ~ ~

Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Earth Division
Posts: 23,109

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Princes of Tara
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bmore Manning View Post
Amerson would not excel in zone or at FS, he doesn't like to tackle. I cannot fathom where you and SoCal are coming up with this.
I'm starting to think more and more you don't really see much of Amerson play or do a generally poor job overall in grading out cornerbacks on their respective styles of play. You've been arguing non-sense for quite some time and I've had a hard time biting my tongue on and not being condescending about it.

He is not fast (won't run better than a 4.45) and his best skills are reading the eyes of the QB and then making an attack on the ball. He isn't going to have the luxury of doing that in man coverage (especially press) and as mentioned earlier, operates under a heavy zone scheme in college. That is why they had him at field corner with the Pack.

I've talked to over a dozen NC State fans the past few days about Amerson, their scheme (to see if it lined up with what I had said) and they all have the same feelings as me about him. They think he is a good player, but needs to be in the right scheme to succeed. A lot of them said zone corner, or he will have to make a move like Malcolm Jenkins, Charles Godfrey or Tanard Jackson made in the NFL to make up for not being able to play man. I even had a few long-time faithful state that 85% + of the coverages they ran this year were strictly zone.

If you saw the Miami and Tennessee games this year, you can see where SoCal and I are coming from. He did all right against FSU.
Requiem is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2013, 09:20 AM   #112
NFLBRONCO
Ring of Famer
 
NFLBRONCO's Avatar
 
Go Nuggets Go Lakers

Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Lafayette Colorado
Posts: 8,013
Default

I think Denver needs to address DT DE MLB G at minimum and slot WR and RB 2nd tier needs
NFLBRONCO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2013, 02:35 PM   #113
ozomulsion
Ring of Famer
 

Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 3,546

Adopt-a-Bronco:
The ladies man.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BroncoMan4ever View Post
What about Chris Rainey? Speed in the offense immediately. Hit him in screens and dumpoffs and let him run.
For whatever reason, we don't do screens in this offense. Catching screen passes and gaining big yards after the catch is one of KM's best attributes.
ozomulsion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2013, 04:51 PM   #114
Bmore Manning
Guest
 

Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Requiem View Post
I'm starting to think more and more you don't really see much of Amerson play or do a generally poor job overall in grading out cornerbacks on their respective styles of play. You've been arguing non-sense for quite some time and I've had a hard time biting my tongue on and not being condescending about it.

He is not fast (won't run better than a 4.45) and his best skills are reading the eyes of the QB and then making an attack on the ball. He isn't going to have the luxury of doing that in man coverage (especially press) and as mentioned earlier, operates under a heavy zone scheme in college. That is why they had him at field corner with the Pack.

I've talked to over a dozen NC State fans the past few days about Amerson, their scheme (to see if it lined up with what I had said) and they all have the same feelings as me about him. They think he is a good player, but needs to be in the right scheme to succeed. A lot of them said zone corner, or he will have to make a move like Malcolm Jenkins, Charles Godfrey or Tanard Jackson made in the NFL to make up for not being able to play man. I even had a few long-time faithful state that 85% + of the coverages they ran this year were strictly zone.

If you saw the Miami and Tennessee games this year, you can see where SoCal and I are coming from. He did all right against FSU.
His problem is how overly aggressive he played in 2012. I'm sure he played with a cockiness, because of his Junior season. Again I said I think he could learn to play press man. What about his game would you say he could play safety other than his ball skills? He's no stud at tackling, and when I watched him he at times looked disinterested, unless the ball was in the air. Maybe the attributes I'm looking for I'm forcing on prospects to deem them draft worthy. It could be all me, maybe I'm not good at evaluating CBs. Or I could be right and time will tell..
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2013, 06:12 PM   #115
broncos-rock
Ring of Famer
 

Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 1,303
Default

Not the easiest task but we need to find mannings Terrell Davis! We need a stud RB that can grind out the 7 yards but can also take it to the house.
broncos-rock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-21-2013, 02:14 PM   #116
Tombstone RJ
Ring of Famer
 
Tombstone RJ's Avatar
 
Old School

Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: In the Tetons!
Posts: 21,946

Adopt-a-Bronco:
WorrellWilliams
Default

If Lacy has a great combine he'll go in the first round. I wonder if the Broncos might think about snagging Mendenhall in FA?
Tombstone RJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-21-2013, 03:44 PM   #117
Mountain Bronco
Ring of Famer
 

Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: The Mountains
Posts: 1,646
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 24champ View Post
For the nth time, Champ isn't moving to safety. He had one bad game, and so did many others on the team. Now he shut down Torrey smith in the regular season by allowing only 14 yards.

Compounding Champs bad play was the fact that this defense got zero pressure on Flacco. You are asking alot of your secondary to shut down recievers when Flacco isn't under pressure throughout the game. This defense had 52 sacks for the year with doom and Von managing to get half a sack apiece in a playoff game. Not only did the front seven fail to generate pressure, it also failed to stop the run. Front seven is equally as responsible for this cluster****.

Bottom line is, nobody really showed up for this game. I don't see Champ moving to Safety but possibly a scheme change where he isn't on an island anymore. You move Champ to safety and you have another hole to fill, plus you have the highest paid safety in the league. Not good asset management from a talent and financial standpoint.

This, you can't just leave Champ on an Island anymore, but how many teams actually have a corner that you can? Because of the necessity of having more deep help, I think a safety upgrade is a must. I actually think Moore will grow and get better, but we could upgrade either safety spots. MLB is a huge glaring hole that needs filled and has to be done as we have to be able to (1) stop the run with the front 7 and (2) improve coverage on TE in the base and nickle packages. After those two areas of need, beef up front.

On offense, I see Virgil Green making a big leap next year as a matchup nightmare. At RB we are actually fairly deep, but with little star power. Not sure what to do there, but Moreno, McGahee and Hilman are all good, but none are game breakers. Would like some more depth at WR as beyond Thomas and Decker there isn't much.
Mountain Bronco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-21-2013, 07:46 PM   #118
broncos-rock
Ring of Famer
 

Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 1,303
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tombstone RJ View Post
If Lacy has a great combine he'll go in the first round. I wonder if the Broncos might think about snagging Mendenhall in FA?
That's funny you bring Mendenhall up, I'm thinking he has something to prove and would come cheap.
broncos-rock is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes



Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 10:04 PM.


Denver Broncos