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Old 01-14-2013, 08:51 PM   #201
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It's always the same rant. It must be difficult to live with such perfection.
Struck a nerve with a local! My point is the game sucked whether you were there or not. All this talk about how much pain people are in. Please. At least one could claim they felt some pain after 4 hours of zero degrees. That isn't even real pain. That's just called really damn cold.

I've watched plenty of losses on TV last year including the playoff game. It's just much easier at home. CLICK! And it's over.

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Old 01-14-2013, 09:04 PM   #202
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It's so funny that every brokeback on this board says that the Chiefs season's of the 90's meant nothing, but this season was a great accomplishment for Brokeback Nation!!!

You accomplished more with Tebow last year than you did with Manning this year! Talk about wasting 18 million dollars!

You can make fun of Matt Cassel all you want but at the end of the day, you wasted money on Manning this year for the same result that Cassel yielded: one-and-done playoff loss!
This makes no sense? Are you saying that because Manning lost a DIVISIONAL PLAYOFF Game that he was a bust and equal to Cassell/Quinn/or blind monkey kFc started at QB this year?

You realize teams are built over time right? You understand that you can't just cherry pick a QB and suddenly go to the SB right? I mean kFc is so great at finding QB talent and getting to the playoffs and the SB every 50 years or so.

I bet you are mouth breathing at the other end of the InteRNetS thinking that if your team drafts a QB you will win the SB next year right?

Manning was an investment, we are more competitive and closer to winning a SB now than if we had Tebow or Orton or even Cutler.

Your logic is so weak I bet you have trouble winning tic-tac toe games vs children.

Here is a hint STUD, your team is on the clock and when the draft rolls around everyone is going to relive how epicly bad kFc was to earn the 1st overall pick. Meanwhile we will be picking in the late 20's just needing a couple depth pieces to help maintain the Playoff team Elway has built and make it better.

We will go into the season favored to win the Division, pundits will be talking about the uphill battle Reid faces turning kFc around.

Which end of the stick do you really want to be on? The promising end or the suck end?
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Old 01-15-2013, 07:36 AM   #203
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Fortes Fortuna Adjuvat-Fortune Favors the Brave! The Army Rangers Motto

I get playing the percentages, I get the poor performance because of the soft mentality of the head coach, but do not Offer up we were Shocked as an Excuse for that travesty on SAT. I just talked to several NFL coaches I know and they are all at Fox and Elway for trying to sell that BS to the media. Every NFL team preaches "Sudden Change" on Defense and Offense situationally. That means being mentally tough when a TO or sudden Score from DEF or ST's occurs. If DEN was shellshocked, it was because of poor mental preparation from the coaching staff before and during the game. Situational awareness and initiative were mismanaged all day long.

First, that loss was a failure of leadership and coaching. The lack of coaching for Moore was atrocious. JDR, Ron Milus, and Sam Garnes are not sleeping well at all right now for botching that rush three, five under, 3 deep play where the DAMN safety never flipped his hips to keep depth and tried to backpedal to a deep ball. WTF does he care if they complete the ball in front of HIM?!? Why was he reading the underneath routes at all in that situation? Poor coaching, and even worse situational awareness by a kid who is over his head covering deep still. Why not invite the short throw and rush 4? It is not like they were getting any pressure all game anyway and could even think they could with just 3! Then, play quarters coverage all day with umbrella principles to funnel all catches in bounds? WTF are you playing that crap coverage in the first place?

Second, after that, why take a knee? Why? It is philosophical. However, it also surrenders the initiative. It says, hey BAL if you want this game its there for you to take it, we just want you to give it to us. A team like BAL will take that Initiative when offered it. I do NOT think BAL played that well at all, they just simply said thank you and took advantage of DEN's own terrible mistakes. 4 of their 5 TD's were our mistakes and the other was a lucky as hell non PI call return TD. We gave them all kinds of chances to stay alive and let them stick around. Never once did they risk putting them away. That is not being Brave or taking the initiative IMHO.

Third, DEN deserved to lose that game, because that was the ONLY way BAL had a chance to win. Do not show up on Defense, commit horrible mistakes that lead directly to TD's, and make assinine decisions with the game on the line. Even as poorly as they played, they should have been able to withstand it if Moore simply does his job. That was a desperation throw by Flacco, and as badly as he was postioned when it was thrown, if he used proper technique he had the ability to break it up, commit PI, or even Intercept that ball and end the game!

I was sure that would not happen this week. Boy was I wrong. Mentally, this team has a LOOONG way to go if they ever want to be more than regular season world beaters. Way too many poor leadership decisions in that game and way too many mistakes.
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Old 01-15-2013, 08:20 AM   #204
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^ Agree with everything you said, Med. But still think running the ball on that late 4th quarter 3rd down was the right call. It's the kneeling on the final regulation possession that I have a problem with.

And a question: if the leadership/decision making is that bad, how did they go 13-3 and win 11 straight? And barely be challenged in those 11? I tend to look at it more as a team that did not react well to, and handle, adversity.
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Old 01-15-2013, 08:33 AM   #205
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Like Dreesen said in the locker room, the team reverted to the team it was at the beginning of the season. He couldn't explain why. For some reason, under pressure, they suddenly believed that they were the stumbling team of the first quarter of the season more than they believed they were the team that won eleven straight. Why?

Maybe they should all read some Malcolm Gladwell to deal with that issue?
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Old 01-15-2013, 08:35 AM   #206
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^ Agree with everything you said, Med. But still think running the ball on that late 4th quarter 3rd down was the right call. It's the kneeling on the final regulation possession that I have a problem with.

And a question: if the leadership/decision making is that bad, how did they go 13-3 and win 11 straight? And barely be challenged in those 11? I tend to look at it more as a team that did not react well to, and handle, adversity.
I disagree with the 3rd down call completely and here is why.

I think you roll out sprint right option, which BAL will not be ready to defend, and hit a wide open TE in the Flat for the First down. If its not there, Peyton does not throw the ball away he simply slides feet first and eats the play and RUNS THE CLOCK. You lose 5-7 yards at worst and win the game if you get the easy completion. If you get the worst case scenario, you simply punt and DO NOT take the time out and keep the clock running even more. BAL still has to have Moore implode to Win the game, but you send the message we are here to play 60 Minutes, instead of here you take the ball and good luck!
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Old 01-15-2013, 08:46 AM   #207
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I think you roll out sprint right option, which BAL will not be ready to defend, and hit a wide open TE in the Flat for the First down. If its not there, Peyton does not throw the ball away he simply slides feet first and eats the play and RUNS THE CLOCK.
Well, Manning rolling right didn't work out to well in OT, you may recall.

And again, it wasn't the 3rd down run (the right call IMO) that lost us the game. It was that Jacoby Jones/Raheem Moore debacle that did us in.
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Old 01-15-2013, 08:49 AM   #208
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Only Sheepstud would come here after a 2 win season with Quinn and Cassel at QB and start QB smack.

Can we perma-ban this troll?
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Old 01-15-2013, 08:57 AM   #209
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I know it doesn't count for much but, the Ravens are going to have to pay out the ass now for Flacco.
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Old 01-15-2013, 08:58 AM   #210
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I know it doesn't count for much but, the Ravens are going to have to pay out the ass now for Flacco.
That and they're going to get rolled by the Pats on Sunday.
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Old 01-15-2013, 09:11 AM   #211
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I disagree with the 3rd down call completely and here is why.

I think you roll out sprint right option, which BAL will not be ready to defend, and hit a wide open TE in the Flat for the First down. If its not there, Peyton does not throw the ball away he simply slides feet first and eats the play and RUNS THE CLOCK. You lose 5-7 yards at worst and win the game if you get the easy completion. If you get the worst case scenario, you simply punt and DO NOT take the time out and keep the clock running even more. BAL still has to have Moore implode to Win the game, but you send the message we are here to play 60 Minutes, instead of here you take the ball and good luck!
I think that would have been a sweet call. A really sweet call. Though i still can't hate on the run. The chances that Baltimore would have come back were epically low. It happened, and that sucks, but epically low.

But can we retire the "team X doesnt deserve to win" cliche, like there's some moralistic value to sports outcomes?
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Old 01-15-2013, 09:44 AM   #212
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Correct me if I'm wrong (I'm not going back and watching the game) but the Broncos kneeled down 2 different times with the exact same conditions, that is, they kneeled down at the end of the first half with 30 seconds and 2 TOs and they kneeled down at the end of the second half with 30 seconds and 2 TOs. Or was it just one time (not twice) the Broncos did this?

Am I remembering this correctly?
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Old 01-15-2013, 10:03 AM   #213
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Correct me if I'm wrong (I'm not going back and watching the game) but the Broncos kneeled down 2 different times with the exact same conditions, that is, they kneeled down at the end of the first half with 30 seconds and 2 TOs and they kneeled down at the end of the second half with 30 seconds and 2 TOs. Or was it just one time (not twice) the Broncos did this?

Am I remembering this correctly?
Broncos ran at the end of the first half, knelt at the end of regulation.
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Old 01-15-2013, 10:04 AM   #214
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Well, Manning rolling right didn't work out to well in OT, you may recall.

And again, it wasn't the 3rd down run (the right call IMO) that lost us the game. It was that Jacoby Jones/Raheem Moore debacle that did us in.
That was not a designed playcall, the protection broke down immediately and Manning panicked. It was 2cd and 6 for goodness sake as well, he should have thrown that ball away. He knows better.

However, if they ran that play (Sprint right option) on that third down its a low risk high reward way to play it with aggression versus passivity. There could also have been an incomplete there, but if the TE is open that's a real good risk I would take all day, every day.

Plus, that is not a standard DEN play and BAL would not have reacted well to that playcall. I gaurantee they would have had a shot at making the first down and maybe more.
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Old 01-15-2013, 10:05 AM   #215
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Broncos ran at the end of the first half, knelt at the end of regulation.
Ok, thanks.
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Old 01-15-2013, 10:05 AM   #216
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Hula, I agree that overall the coaching staff was too conservative in this game. Most notable to me was that decision to run on third down with Hester, but I think it's possible Manning audibled into that play. I also think they should have taken a shot with the ball and two time outs at the end of regulation rather than kneeling. But I don't think the situation you're talking about called for anything but conservative. I don't think giving the ball back with ~75 seconds, ~80 yards, and no time outs is much of a gamble whereas passing the ball on third down is. The fact that they played the odds and lost is unfortunate, but that happened only because of a massive, lucky, highly unlikely failure. If we won like we should have nobody would be talking about this. Since the Ravens won on a miracle play it's being overblown.

Alas Tony, the bottom line is that this was an equal opportunity FUBAR screw up!! It took both incredible mistakes to lose this game.. even after all the other mistakes, bad luck and terrible calls that went against us, we still showed the resilence and will to win and we were going to win that game and very much should have!

It required both Fox and Moore to have to pull back to back MIND FARTS out of their arses in the last three minutes in order to snatch defeat from the hands of victory with this gift horse to the Ravens!
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Old 01-15-2013, 10:09 AM   #217
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That was not a designed playcall, the protection broke down immediately and Manning panicked. It was 2cd and 6 for goodness sake as well, he should have thrown that ball away. He knows better.

However, if they ran that play (Sprint right option) on that third down its a low risk high reward way to play it with aggression versus passivity. There could also have been an incomplete there, but if the TE is open that's a real good risk I would take all day, every day.

Plus, that is not a standard DEN play and BAL would not have reacted well to that playcall. I gaurantee they would have had a shot at making the first down and maybe more.
I agree but hindsight is 20/20. Also, a bootleg play takes Manning out of his confort zone just a little bit. That being said, I agee with the play in principle.
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Old 01-15-2013, 10:13 AM   #218
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That was not a designed playcall, the protection broke down immediately and Manning panicked. It was 2cd and 6 for goodness sake as well, he should have thrown that ball away. He knows better.

However, if they ran that play (Sprint right option) on that third down its a low risk high reward way to play it with aggression versus passivity. There could also have been an incomplete there, but if the TE is open that's a real good risk I would take all day, every day.

Plus, that is not a standard DEN play and BAL would not have reacted well to that playcall. I gaurantee they would have had a shot at making the first down and maybe more.
Good point Med12,

And everyone is focusing on the relative odds of completeing a 3rd and 7 pass in that situation. But had the plan been to get that first down no matter what, after we had just gotten the last first down with three conservative plays in a row that would have had a high odds of success! The Ravens saw we were trying to run out the clock and were loaded for bear for stopping the Dive run between guard and center.

After the run plays to get that first first down, on first, second or third down, Manning could have done his very best tuck fake hand off for yet another fake dive run over Haloti and dropped back for a quick 10 yard pass to Tamme, Decker or Stokely for the first down right then and there.. and possibly more.

Do that while taking an extra 45 seconds off the clock and then we could have taken three knees to end the thing! The Ravens know Foxy's tendencies in such situations which we had just reinforced on the previous series for a first down .. they would not have been expecting a first or second down pass in that situation if we set it up like another Dive run all along.

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Old 01-15-2013, 10:25 AM   #219
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If a teams success is measured on how far they go, how exactly did they go farther last year? Lost divisional round last year too.
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Old 01-15-2013, 11:02 AM   #220
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That was not a designed playcall, the protection broke down immediately and Manning panicked. It was 2cd and 6 for goodness sake as well, he should have thrown that ball away. He knows better.

However, if they ran that play (Sprint right option) on that third down its a low risk high reward way to play it with aggression versus passivity. There could also have been an incomplete there, but if the TE is open that's a real good risk I would take all day, every day.

Plus, that is not a standard DEN play and BAL would not have reacted well to that playcall. I gaurantee they would have had a shot at making the first down and maybe more.

I think that would have been a very good idea at the time. I agree the last play for us, wasn't a designed roll out. For whatever reason PM seemed to drift in the direction of the oncoming pass rusher this game. I think when he threw this terrible pick, he felt like he had to make something happen, which he did. I would have liked to have seen that ambition to win on the 3rd and 7by the play caller, so we wouldnt have to talk about Moore screwing the pooch.
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Old 01-16-2013, 01:41 PM   #221
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I 100% agree with Med's last few posts. And local folks are overwhelmingly agreeing what Med was posting. Even with the natural respect for Fox, Manning and Elway, there's a attitude saying stop trying to make excuses, you blew it.
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Old 01-17-2013, 10:53 AM   #222
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Only Sheepstud would come here after a 2 win season with Quinn and Cassel at QB and start QB smack.

Can we perma-ban this troll?
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Old 01-17-2013, 12:20 PM   #223
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^ Agree with everything you said, Med. But still think running the ball on that late 4th quarter 3rd down was the right call. It's the kneeling on the final regulation possession that I have a problem with.

And a question: if the leadership/decision making is that bad, how did they go 13-3 and win 11 straight? And barely be challenged in those 11? I tend to look at it more as a team that did not react well to, and handle, adversity.
I do too. Single stupidest play, or non play, I have seen in all my years of watching football.
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Old 01-17-2013, 12:51 PM   #224
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I know it's sad, but you guys need to realize that the rest of the division isn't going to be able to beat out the Broncos for the next couple of years.

You guys will be a top 4 seed again and will have another chance to make a run in '13 and '14 at the least.
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Old 01-17-2013, 10:02 PM   #225
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This makes no sense? Are you saying that because Manning lost a DIVISIONAL PLAYOFF Game that he was a bust and equal to Cassell/Quinn/or blind monkey kFc started at QB this year?

You realize teams are built over time right? You understand that you can't just cherry pick a QB and suddenly go to the SB right? I mean kFc is so great at finding QB talent and getting to the playoffs and the SB every 50 years or so.

I bet you are mouth breathing at the other end of the InteRNetS thinking that if your team drafts a QB you will win the SB next year right?

Manning was an investment, we are more competitive and closer to winning a SB now than if we had Tebow or Orton or even Cutler.

Your logic is so weak I bet you have trouble winning tic-tac toe games vs children.

Here is a hint STUD, your team is on the clock and when the draft rolls around everyone is going to relive how epicly bad kFc was to earn the 1st overall pick. Meanwhile we will be picking in the late 20's just needing a couple depth pieces to help maintain the Playoff team Elway has built and make it better.

We will go into the season favored to win the Division, pundits will be talking about the uphill battle Reid faces turning kFc around.

Which end of the stick do you really want to be on? The promising end or the suck end?
The promising end with a very good coaching staff/front office in place.

John Elway didn't build this roster. He's drafted 2 good players. Von Miller, who was a layup draft pick, and the DT.

Most of the roster was well set up before he got there and the playoff team last year was driven mostly by Shannahan/McDaniels draft picks.

This year a lot of other players like Stokely and Tamme were recruited by Manning.

Elway's 2nd round draft pick was the one who is now Denver's most hated player. We'll see what he does when Manning leaves. That will be when we find out what Elway is truly made of.
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