The Orange Mane -  a Denver Broncos Fan Community  

Go Back   The Orange Mane - a Denver Broncos Fan Community > Orange Mane Discussion > Orange Mane Central Discussion
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Chat Room Mark Forums Read



Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12-20-2012, 09:50 PM   #126
baja
Headmaster
 
baja's Avatar
 
The Fixer

Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: in the present moment
Posts: 61,396

Adopt-a-Bronco:
C J Anderson
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by enjolras View Post
If Tebow would be willing to play Tight-End I'd want him back in a heartbeat.
Gosh enjolras haven't you read this thread it has been determined by the experts on the OM that is an utterly ridiculous idea. It has been dismissed out of hand.
baja is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2012, 09:57 PM   #127
baja
Headmaster
 
baja's Avatar
 
The Fixer

Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: in the present moment
Posts: 61,396

Adopt-a-Bronco:
C J Anderson
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by enjolras View Post
If Tebow would be willing to play Tight-End I'd want him back in a heartbeat.
Gosh enjolras haven't you read this thread it has been determined by the experts on the OM that is an utterly ridiculous idea. It has been dismissed out of hand.
baja is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2012, 10:07 PM   #128
broncofever
Guest
 

Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by enjolras View Post
If Tebow would be willing to play Tight-End I'd want him back in a heartbeat.
The kid is a great football player, not so much a QB, but a great leader. HOWEVER, that said I don't want that circus back in town and it would be a circus again. We'd also be stuck with the nitwits like McGruper or whatever who would never shut up about him being the QB when Manning retires. I do not want him back, not because I don't like the kid. I genuinely appreciate what the man achieved while here, but both for him and us it is not an option.

And this thread was clearly intended to bait everyone in this forum into the same dramatic outbursts that colored our last 2 plus years with McJackhole, Tim, Orton, etc. I am weary of that personally. I love that this season there is no QB controversy, coaching cheating scandal, just a really good football team with a leader who has both the intangibles and the skills. I wish Tim all the best, but it will never be here as a Bronco again.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2012, 10:25 PM   #129
baja
Headmaster
 
baja's Avatar
 
The Fixer

Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: in the present moment
Posts: 61,396

Adopt-a-Bronco:
C J Anderson
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by broncofever View Post
The kid is a great football player, not so much a QB, but a great leader. HOWEVER, that said I don't want that circus back in town and it would be a circus again. We'd also be stuck with the nitwits like McGruper or whatever who would never shut up about him being the QB when Manning retires. I do not want him back, not because I don't like the kid. I genuinely appreciate what the man achieved while here, but both for him and us it is not an option.

And this thread was clearly intended to bait everyone in this forum into the same dramatic outbursts that colored our last 2 plus years with McJackhole, Tim, Orton, etc. I am weary of that personally. I love that this season there is no QB controversy, coaching cheating scandal, just a really good football team with a leader who has both the intangibles and the skills. I wish Tim all the best, but it will never be here as a Bronco again.
That is not true. You jump to the conclusion it was a contrived thread, as the creator of the thread I will tell you that you are mistaken. You also assume the circus would continue. You have not thought it through. If Tebow is a TE (for example) where is the controversy? Tebow is a great football player, his instincts are off the charts. His run at QB would be over. Your biggest concern is the return of a poster you do not like. What about what is good for the Broncos. I say Tebow playing a skill position that does not involve being under center MIGHT be a good thing. Everyone is ready to toss him in the can so he could be had for cheap. The Broncos have taken a flier on far longer odds, Maurice Claret for example.

I like football players on the Broncos and Tim Tebow is a football player. Hell 2/3 rd's of this board wanted to cut Moreno, now everyone is singing his praises.

I have been on this board since the beginning and I have never witnessed a more knee jerk reacting group as this current group. What was the name of that game? Jump to Conclusions.

Last edited by baja; 12-21-2012 at 12:09 AM..
baja is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2012, 01:51 AM   #130
broncofever
Guest
 

Posts: n/a
Default

Baja, my biggest concern is not Mcgruder. I only bring him up as a joke and a shining example of someone who is largely irrational when it comes to their idol, but he's hardly the only one.

As for bringing in someone who has never played TE, why would we do that? There are actual TEs available, what benefit is there in retraining a QB to play a position he didn't play before? Why not just bring someone who already is a TE? Has he shown he can play TE well? Is he worth paying him an NFL salary for a position he hasn't played?

And let me be clear, Tebow will bring a circus, no matter what position you bring him in at. It will bring the people who will want him as QB and the rabid nuthuggers (like McGruder as one example). There will be all the talk about bringing him back to a team that dumped him. That is drama by itself even if not brought back as a QB. And frankly as you pointed out as far a knee jerking, do you not get that such a move would be lead to lots more knee jerk reactions?

He's a very nice young man and entertaining, but for both him and the Broncos its better to let him go and us to move on.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2012, 01:58 AM   #131
Bacchus
Guest
 

Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by baja View Post
to play any position the Broncos asked of him?

Maybe MLB or TE?
Way to go Baja, a one day thread that is already 7 pages long. I just hope Tebow leaves the NFL and goes on the lecture circuit. He could make hundreds of millions of dollars preaching God.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2012, 02:36 AM   #132
Bacchus
Guest
 

Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DomCasual View Post


The funny thing is that I posted that with no intention of trolling anyone. I figured it would get a small laugh, and that was about it. Right after I posted it, I started working on a little project, and forgot about my post. I come back an hour later, and there are all the responses. Honestly, I feel kind of bad.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2012, 07:26 AM   #133
Drek
Ring of Famer
 
Drek's Avatar
 

Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 12,334
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by gunns View Post
I still don't see a reason in your post to have kept Tebow. Because we didn't make those hind sight picks still does not quantify keeping Tebow. Nothing does.
Keeping Tebow would have removed the need for Osweiler, kind of a 1:1 correlation there.

And the key point of this:
Is Tim Tebow a play maker with the ball in his hands? Definitely.

Is he a good character guy? Definitely.

Is he a strong leader on the football field? Definitely.

Was he the first truly dominant spread option QB in college football, an offensive format that is now storming the NFL? Definitely.

The only question here is if he can mature into a better passer. The league is moving to Tebow's style of offense as the norm. Russell Wilson, RGIII, Cam Newton, Colin Kaepernick, etc.. These guys are the future of the NFL and WRs/RBs who don't like QBs keeping the ball are going to have to deal with it.

Maybe Tebow doesn't live up to his potential, but he was already sunk cost for this team to keep and see how it went, while we let Manning win in the window we have now.

At the same time Tebow is just about the most dynamic ball carrier you can find within 10-20 yards, i.e. the red zone. He would have been an excellent weapon in a Manning led offense as a ball carrier. He's a more powerful runner than anyone on our team right now, having him would only improve red zone efficiency. Earlier in the season when Moreno was a weekly inactive and Hillman couldn't find his place in the offense we wouldn't have resorted to Lance Ball getting worthless touches.

Right now we're the 5th ranked offense by yardage, but the 11th ranked offense in red zone TD rate. 11th is nice but I'd prefer that gap to be as small as possible. Tebow as a ball carrier can do that. See the benefit?
Drek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2012, 07:33 AM   #134
TheElusiveKyleOrton
BOOM.
 
TheElusiveKyleOrton's Avatar
 
Touched By God

Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Denver
Posts: 10,991
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drek View Post
Russell Wilson, RGIII, Cam Newton, Colin Kaepernick, etc.. These guys are the future of the NFL and WRs/RBs who don't like QBs keeping the ball are going to have to deal with it.
Every single one of those guys is accurate with throwing the football. Making them quarterbacks.

Timmy isn't. Making him a fullback.
__________________
Nobody puts Jay-bee in the corner.
TheElusiveKyleOrton is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2012, 07:42 AM   #135
Rohirrim
Partisan
 
Rohirrim's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Twixt Hell & Highwater
Posts: 55,935

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Malik Jackson
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by baja View Post
That is not true. You jump to the conclusion it was a contrived thread, as the creator of the thread I will tell you that you are mistaken. You also assume the circus would continue. You have not thought it through. If Tebow is a TE (for example) where is the controversy? Tebow is a great football player, his instincts are off the charts. His run at QB would be over. Your biggest concern is the return of a poster you do not like. What about what is good for the Broncos. I say Tebow playing a skill position that does not involve being under center MIGHT be a good thing. Everyone is ready to toss him in the can so he could be had for cheap. The Broncos have taken a flier on far longer odds, Maurice Claret for example.

I like football players on the Broncos and Tim Tebow is a football player. Hell 2/3 rd's of this board wanted to cut Moreno, now everyone is singing his praises.

I have been on this board since the beginning and I have never witnessed a more knee jerk reacting group as this current group. What was the name of that game? Jump to Conclusions.
Just to play along, Tebow is an athlete. Could you get a better QB without the drama? We already have one. Two, actually. Could you get a better TE without the drama? Sure. We already have a couple. FB? Already have one. RB? Already have one. No need. No point. No relevance. Let some other team have the Tebow experience. We've already had ours. He wouldn't do anything to make this team better, and his presence might disrupt the locker room and make the team worse. Okay?
Rohirrim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2012, 08:14 AM   #136
ScottXray
Opinionated A******
 
ScottXray's Avatar
 
We will NOT lose!

Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: PDX (Portland OR)
Posts: 6,100

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Off. CENTER
Default

While I wish the best for Tebow and appreciate what he did for us last year, there is no way I would want him back on the Broncos, and especially at the cost of two picks. As a FA, a few years down the road...maybe, if he is willing to play fullback, TE, or can show progress in his passing.

I do think that he has not been developed or used properly by either of the teams he has been on, and that he is the prototype Spread QB that is now becoming the new trend in the NFL. But he needs better passing skills to play in the NFL at that position, and it is questionable that he would ever get there.

It is obvioous that he does not practice well, or the Jets would have replaced Sanchez ( who is completing no more passes than Tebow did last year) with him earlier this year.

The media circus that comes with him is a big negative, and considering that we already dealt him away, I don't think it would ever happen as long as Elway is the GM here. He definitely thought that Tebow was not a NFL QB.
so the point is moot. Tebow won't be coming back here.
ScottXray is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2012, 08:17 AM   #137
Kaylore
4 time AFCW Champs
 
Kaylore's Avatar
 
12 straight road division wins

Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ceti Alpha V
Posts: 47,269

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Pat Bowlen
Default

Even if he ends up being an all-world tight end, which like LeLoLang, I am unsure he can even play, I wouldn't want Tebow on the team again. Nothing is worth putting up with the idiotic Tebowners and their hysterical posts.
Kaylore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2012, 08:28 AM   #138
Drek
Ring of Famer
 
Drek's Avatar
 

Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 12,334
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaylore View Post
Even if he ends up being an all-world tight end, which like LeLoLang, I am unsure he can even play, I wouldn't want Tebow on the team again. Nothing is worth putting up with the idiotic Tebowners and their hysterical posts.
So you'd rather have an inferior Broncos team instead of using the "ignore" feature on here for a handful of bad posters?

If someone promised me a winning record for the Broncos period as long as I stayed away from the Mane I'd be gone tomorrow and never come back. Talking Broncos football on here is nice, watching the team win is WAY better.
Drek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2012, 08:35 AM   #139
Rohirrim
Partisan
 
Rohirrim's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Twixt Hell & Highwater
Posts: 55,935

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Malik Jackson
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drek View Post
So you'd rather have an inferior Broncos team instead of using the "ignore" feature on here for a handful of bad posters?

If someone promised me a winning record for the Broncos period as long as I stayed away from the Mane I'd be gone tomorrow and never come back. Talking Broncos football on here is nice, watching the team win is WAY better.
I don't get how anybody could think that Tebow would make this team better. Peyton has come in and slowly over a season built the kind of lockerroom chemistry that teams die for. Even the D is looking up to PM and following his lead and drawing inspiration. All squads are leaning on each other and winning together. Bringing Tebow back would be like setting off a bomb in the lockerroom and destroying everything that has been built. Who's to say Peyton wouldn't take it as an insult? I just don't get it. The whole idea is ludicrous, IMHO.

Fortunately, if you asked Elway about this, he'd just laugh. So I can relax.
Rohirrim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2012, 08:37 AM   #140
WolfpackGuy
Call me, "Maybe"
 
WolfpackGuy's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Delaware
Posts: 7,394
Default

Avoid him like the plague, and hopefully, he goes to someone in the division.
WolfpackGuy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2012, 09:05 AM   #141
baja
Headmaster
 
baja's Avatar
 
The Fixer

Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: in the present moment
Posts: 61,396

Adopt-a-Bronco:
C J Anderson
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by broncofever View Post
Baja, my biggest concern is not Mcgruder. I only bring him up as a joke and a shining example of someone who is largely irrational when it comes to their idol, but he's hardly the only one.

As for bringing in someone who has never played TE, why would we do that? There are actual TEs available, what benefit is there in retraining a QB to play a position he didn't play before? Why not just bring someone who already is a TE? Has he shown he can play TE well? Is he worth paying him an NFL salary for a position he hasn't played?

And let me be clear, Tebow will bring a circus, no matter what position you bring him in at. It will bring the people who will want him as QB and the rabid nuthuggers (like McGruder as one example). There will be all the talk about bringing him back to a team that dumped him. That is drama by itself even if not brought back as a QB. And frankly as you pointed out as far a knee jerking, do you not get that such a move would be lead to lots more knee jerk reactions?

He's a very nice young man and entertaining, but for both him and the Broncos its better to let him go and us to move on.
It's very simple really Tebow is a very unique individual. he is a
phenomenal athlete, he has an iron will, he is a proven winner, considered the best collage player ever and he has the all important IT. if you can get him for reasonable cost and he is WILLING to play another position I think it is a no brainer you give him a try. Could be full back, not that hard to learn. He's basically been playing fullback from the qb position all his football days.

What's interesting is if his name were not Tebow this thread would be full of "Ya, lets bring him for a look" "What can it hurt" "We can cut him if he doesn't work out"

Everyone is talking about the irrational Tebow supporters in this thread what I think is irrational is the great distain for Tebow shown in this thread. Curious really.

As for the fear of a circus act from his fans - it's Tim Tebow the fullback sit down and shut up. He's only an issue in NY because Sanchez sucks so bad. You really think anyone would want Tebow over Manning?

Anyway enough of this....
baja is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2012, 09:08 AM   #142
BroncoInferno
Ring of Famer
 

Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 13,430
Default

Tebow is a 4.7 guy. That's adequate for a TE, but he wouldn't be anything special (assuming he was even capable of picking up the nuiances of the position this late into his football life).
BroncoInferno is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2012, 09:12 AM   #143
BroncoInferno
Ring of Famer
 

Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 13,430
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drek View Post
Keeping Tebow would have removed the need for Osweiler, kind of a 1:1 correlation there.
The problem with this logic is the inherent assumption that Tebow, long-term, will be at least as good of a QB as Osweiler, if not better. Elway and the coaching staff clearly do not believe that. They believe Osweiler can develop into the long-term replacement for Manning, and that Tebow can't. Whether or not they are correct remains to be seen, but that isn't a "1:1 correlation," at least not as far as the front office is concerned.
BroncoInferno is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2012, 09:13 AM   #144
baja
Headmaster
 
baja's Avatar
 
The Fixer

Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: in the present moment
Posts: 61,396

Adopt-a-Bronco:
C J Anderson
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rohirrim View Post
Just to play along, Tebow is an athlete. Could you get a better QB without the drama? We already have one. Two, actually. Could you get a better TE without the drama? Sure. We already have a couple. FB? Already have one. RB? Already have one. No need. No point. No relevance. Let some other team have the Tebow experience. We've already had ours. He wouldn't do anything to make this team better, and his presence might disrupt the locker room and make the team worse. Okay?
You really think Manning wouldn't handle Tebow the full back? You must not really get what kind of leader Peyton Manning is.
baja is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2012, 09:17 AM   #145
Rohirrim
Partisan
 
Rohirrim's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Twixt Hell & Highwater
Posts: 55,935

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Malik Jackson
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by baja View Post
You really think Manning wouldn't handle Tebow the full back? You must not really get what kind of leader Peyton Manning is.
Or you don't. If you don't think that Tebow coming back to Denver wouldn't be disruptive, I don't know what to tell you. Plus, he's just not that good! He couldn't break into the lineup of the Jets. The ****ing Jets! What does it take?
Rohirrim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2012, 09:18 AM   #146
Br0nc0Buster
2013 AFC Champs
 
Br0nc0Buster's Avatar
 
Oh........yea

Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Kansas
Posts: 6,021
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BroncoInferno View Post
The problem with this logic is the inherent assumption that Tebow, long-term, will be at least as good of a QB as Osweiler, if not better. Elway and the coaching staff clearly do not believe that. They believe Osweiler can develop into the long-term replacement for Manning, and that Tebow can't. Whether or not they are correct remains to be seen, but that isn't a "1:1 correlation," at least not as far as the front office is concerned.
exactly
Elway saw what he had in Tebow as a qb and said "pass", along with EVERY OTHER GM in the league

Os was handpicked because he is what Elway wants in a qb

Elway didnt want Tebow, it was never a "1:1 ratio"
Br0nc0Buster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2012, 10:07 AM   #147
Drek
Ring of Famer
 
Drek's Avatar
 

Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 12,334
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rohirrim View Post
I don't get how anybody could think that Tebow would make this team better. Peyton has come in and slowly over a season built the kind of lockerroom chemistry that teams die for. Even the D is looking up to PM and following his lead and drawing inspiration. All squads are leaning on each other and winning together. Bringing Tebow back would be like setting off a bomb in the lockerroom and destroying everything that has been built. Who's to say Peyton wouldn't take it as an insult? I just don't get it. The whole idea is ludicrous, IMHO.

Fortunately, if you asked Elway about this, he'd just laugh. So I can relax.
1. Tim Tebow is the guy who laid the foundation for said locker room chemistry the year before when he rallied much of this same team behind him to come back from a 1-5 start, winning the division and a playoff game.

2. Peyton Manning said when he signed here that Tim Tebow being on the roster did nothing to his choice, and that keeping Tebow would not have mattered to him. I'm sure he'd be even less opposed if keeping Tebow and letting Manning hand off to a 250 pound bulldozer of a human being on 3rd and 1 was the path forward.

So your claim that it has all these layers of complexity is what's truly ludicrous here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BroncoInferno View Post
Tebow is a 4.7 guy. That's adequate for a TE, but he wouldn't be anything special (assuming he was even capable of picking up the nuiances of the position this late into his football life).
Seriously?

So I'm guessing you grade all baseball players by their batting average too huh?

Tim Tebow had a top tier 10 yard, 20 yard, short shuttle, long shuttle, broad jump, and vertical jump numbers at the combine. Other than running fast in a long straight line he's comparable to guys like CJ Spiller, Eric Berry, etc., only he weighs 30-40 pounds more.

He's clearly something special in terms of raw athleticism. We saw that last year when defenses stacked the box and brought everything they had to stop him from running the ball, only to watch Tebow shrug off grown ass men like children and pound his way forward for first downs.

Ignoring his passing there is literally zero rationality in saying Tebow isn't an elite athlete by anyone's standards, just like there is zero rationality in saying he's anything but a play maker when the football is in his hands. Not finding a way to use that talent is a failure by any FO/coaching staff that has him, even if that means playing TE, H-Back, FB, HB, or whatever. He's too athletically gifted to simply discard.
Drek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2012, 10:07 AM   #148
TheElusiveKyleOrton
BOOM.
 
TheElusiveKyleOrton's Avatar
 
Touched By God

Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Denver
Posts: 10,991
Default

A high-ranking NFL personnel evaluator, who spoke on condition of anonymity to share his scouting report, said: “(Tebow) attempts to play quarterback despite poor footwork, throwing platforms, release, timing, efficiency, progression, reads, anticipation, arm strength, accuracy and any other position-specific category you can think of.

“God bless him for trying,” the personnel man said, “but I wouldn’t touch him and would pass on the Jacksonville job if it forced me to take him.”

lol 1:1 ratio.
__________________
Nobody puts Jay-bee in the corner.
TheElusiveKyleOrton is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2012, 10:10 AM   #149
Drek
Ring of Famer
 
Drek's Avatar
 

Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 12,334
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Br0nc0Buster View Post
exactly
Elway saw what he had in Tebow as a qb and said "pass", along with EVERY OTHER GM in the league

Os was handpicked because he is what Elway wants in a qb

Elway didnt want Tebow, it was never a "1:1 ratio"
The entire league also passed on Doug Flutie, which is why he had to go to the CFL.

The entire league except Bill Walsh passed on Steve Young at one point, after far less success than Tebow had in his brief opportunity to start.

The entire league passed on Rich Gannon as a QB, with New England originally trying to make him a safety.

The entire league passed on Kurt Warner, hence why he played arena league ball for a while.

The entire league passes on elite players all the time, only to be proven wrong further down the road time and time again. It is in no way a valid measuring stick.
Drek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2012, 10:14 AM   #150
TheElusiveKyleOrton
BOOM.
 
TheElusiveKyleOrton's Avatar
 
Touched By God

Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Denver
Posts: 10,991
Default

I'm just curious what exactly it will take for guys like Drek to give up the ghost of Tebow as a QB. What, in your mind, is a "valid measuring stick" to actually look at Tim Tebow objectively, and how is it exactly that you know so much better than those who are paid to evaluate guys like him?
__________________
Nobody puts Jay-bee in the corner.
TheElusiveKyleOrton is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes



Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 06:37 AM.


Denver Broncos