Line protecting Manning at league-leading pace

[TonyR]

Originally Posted by bfoflcommish

it amazing how good an o-line will look when the QB gets rid of the ball in a timely matter and isnt running around everywhere behind LOS when def has eyes on him but oline doesnt.

Not only that, but making reads and adjusting based on them.

[errand]

what's funny is many on here act surprised by all of this despite many of us stating these things would happen once Manning signed.

[Bronco Yoda]

I put this mostly on PM's quick release, timely audibles, smart movement in the pocket.

[lonestar]

Originally Posted by errand

what's funny is many on here act surprised by all of this despite many of us stating these things would happen once Manning signed.

I knew it would happen just not this fast. Getting 8 or 9 other players on the same page this fast is a real testament to how good magu, and Manning are.

[errand]

Originally Posted by lonestar

I knew it would happen just not this fast. Getting 8 or 9 other players on the same page this fast is a real testament to how good magu, and Manning are.

I'm not shocked at all by how fast he's accomplished this....he led a team that was 1-15 the season before he was drafted to 13-3 in his 2nd season....surely he could help lead an 8-8 team there in one.

[KipCorrington25]

The elephant in the room, Walton goes down performance goes up...

[ozomulsion]

Originally Posted by Drunken.Broncoholic

Ya that was great to hear. Hopefully they aren't pushing too fast. There's some bad luck with players trying to come back too early

I enjoy your posts, for the most part but when I read this, I asked myself a question. Why in gods name would he or the team let him rush back from injury when Ramirez is highly capable of filling in for how ever long is needed? 0% chance of that happening.

[lonestar]

Originally Posted by ozomulsion

I enjoy your posts, for the most part but when I read this, I asked myself a question. Why in gods name would he or the team let him rush back from injury when Ramirez is highly capable of filling in for how ever long is needed? 0% chance of that happening.

All of the sacks this year took place when Manny was on the field. Not saying they were his fault but something was not functioning a normal level when he is in..

Does tha mean that franklin, Koppen or Walton was helping out in protection and their guy got in?

Not sure but something happened. IMO the run game dropped off when Kupes went in. Again something I can not put a finger on but it still seems to have a correlation.

[broncosteven]

Originally Posted by lonestar

Cutlet saved his own bacon much of the time running for his life. It was not because those OL were stellar at all in pass protect. ESP jalopy when they changed briefly to pocket drop back in 06 after kubes left for HOU.

That was a real fubar at best. Think Mikey wanted Jake out so bad after he got his new toy that it was instituted but after seeing that the OL flat was not big enough to power pas block they moved to roll out more often.

Yes Cutlers mobility helped but the OL was very good that year.

Shanny had to stop calling boots in 2006 because teams learned that Plummer was better outside the pocket than inside it. Pitt kept Jake in the pocket during the AFC championship and other teams used that as a blue print and played boot 1st. Plummers play inside the pocket digressed to the point that he forced Shanny to replace him. His last game as a starter was pathetic on Thanksgiving vs kFc.

The reason Jake had his best years with us was because of Shanny's system.

[broncosteven]

Originally Posted by Bronco Yoda

I put this mostly on PM's quick release, timely audibles, smart movement in the pocket.

I think just getting out of bad plays has helped this year vs last year.

How many times did we see an all out blitz coming last year and Tebow either not allowed to adjust or adjust and end up getting creamed?

1st game this year PM sees Polamalu coming on a blitz and audibles out of it, he totally took Polamalu out of the game.

In order of importance I would go Audibles, moving in the pocket, and then quick release.

[Agamemnon]

Manning's ability to get rid of the ball is huge, but don't kid yourselves, this o-line is pass-blocking much, much better than last season. Tebow held on to the ball too long sometimes, but that didn't really have anything to do with Beadles, Walton, and Franklin getting beat like drums all the time.

[broncosteven]

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

Manning's ability to get rid of the ball is huge, but don't kid yourselves, this o-line is pass-blocking much, much better than last season. Tebow held on to the ball too long sometimes, but that didn't really have anything to do with Beadles, Walton, and Franklin getting beat like drums all the time.

Koppen has upgraded the interior and now Beadles has 2 all pros on both sides which is just making him better. Plus we don't miss Kuper as much in pass pro with Koppen.

Koppen and Holliday were 2 great post TC pickups by this staff, these are the moves SB teams make.

[lonestar]

Originally Posted by broncosteven

Yes Cutlers mobility helped but the OL was very good that year.

Shanny had to stop calling boots in 2006 because teams learned that Plummer was better outside the pocket than inside it. Pitt kept Jake in the pocket during the AFC championship and other teams used that as a blue print and played boot 1st. Plummers play inside the pocket digressed to the point that he forced Shanny to replace him. His last game as a starter was pathetic on Thanksgiving vs kFc.

The reason Jake had his best years with us was because of Shanny's system.

Actually when Kubes left mikey hired dinger to replace him and they moved to the pocket passing scheme.

Even though they KNEW the OL had not been built to pocket protect. It had been designed for ZBS and roll it passing off of great fakes to the RBs.

They did this knowing that Jake was ill equipped for running this and that Mikey's heart throb cutlet was ..

Mikey learned the hard way when he promoted Greise over locker room favorite Bubby. He knew he could not do the same thing as Jake was the undisputed leader on Offense. Jake and mikey never got along much the same as John and Dan had to have a buffer in mikey. Kubes filled that bill kept mikey up of Jakes back. When Kubes left and dinger mikey old time college bud came to town, they changed the scheme Jake knew his time in DEN was over. But also knew of Mikey's fubar with Griese.

So he simply sabotaged him by first drafting, then the change in scheme all the while pining for his boi.

A shame that mikey was such a back stabber. But in the end all involved in the scheme got their fate.

Btw I think Jake had his best years in Kubes scheme more so than mikey's.
Mikey was just the HC.

Since Kubes left the O was never as good.

[lonestar]

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

Manning's ability to get rid of the ball is huge, but don't kid yourselves, this o-line is pass-blocking much, much better than last season. Tebow held on to the ball too long sometimes, but that didn't really have anything to do with Beadles, Walton, and Franklin getting beat like drums all the time.

I tend to believe that those guys getting beat like a drum was more bad coaching zero OTA during a transition to a new scheme and no ability to use dove valley for conditioning.

Very few issues this year after a full year offseason workouts, and conditioning.

Not to mention Mazu as their coach. I fully expect Beadles, Walton and Franklin to be long term starters.

Now I do not think they will play Cladys asking price therefore tagging him while they get a rookie OLT up and running.

[kappys]

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

Manning's ability to get rid of the ball is huge, but don't kid yourselves, this o-line is pass-blocking much, much better than last season. Tebow held on to the ball too long sometimes, but that didn't really have anything to do with Beadles, Walton, and Franklin getting beat like drums all the time.

Exactly - its not just Manning, and its not just getting rid of Tebow Either

Ryan Clady looks like he is back to form - he looks like he did his rookie season before the injury. I honestly forgot just how dominant he was back then but he right back into it both pass and run blocking

Zane Beadles I felt was the weak link. He was getting ragdolled out there. I don't know what the strength coach has done but he has really turned it around. He still struggles to move DT's right in front of him but he is able to hold his ground and he can really pull quickly for running plays and traps

Walton - by the end of last year he was already pretty good as pass pro. He looked about the same until his injury - still struggles to get out in front to run block. Koppen is actually rather similar

Kuper - solid pass blocker his entire career. There is a big drop off when Ramirez comes in though

Orlando - Last year he struggled against speed rushers but basically handled everything else. This year he seems to be much quicker getting into his backpedals. Technique and understanding better how to drive you guy past the QB in the pocket rather than just trying to stonewall him has resulted in very solid play from Franklin.

The Peyton Manning tide raises all boats but a lot of improvement comes from Clady being healthy, Franklin utilizing techniques to neutralize speed rushers and the remarkable strength improvement from Zane Beadles.

[baja]

Originally Posted by kappys

Exactly - its not just Manning, and its not just getting rid of Tebow Either

Ryan Clady looks like he is back to form - he looks like he did his rookie season before the injury. I honestly forgot just how dominant he was back then but he right back into it both pass and run blocking

Zane Beadles I felt was the weak link. He was getting ragdolled out there. I don't know what the strength coach has done but he has really turned it around. He still struggles to move DT's right in front of him but he is able to hold his ground and he can really pull quickly for running plays and traps

Walton - by the end of last year he was already pretty good as pass pro. He looked about the same until his injury - still struggles to get out in front to run block. Koppen is actually rather similar

Kuper - solid pass blocker his entire career. There is a big drop off when Ramirez comes in though

Orlando - Last year he struggled against speed rushers but basically handled everything else. This year he seems to be much quicker getting into his backpedals. Technique and understanding better how to drive you guy past the QB in the pocket rather than just trying to stonewall him has resulted in very solid play from Franklin.

The Peyton Manning tide raises all boats but a lot of improvement comes from Clady being healthy, Franklin utilizing techniques to neutralize speed rushers and the remarkable strength improvement from Zane Beadles.

Excellent post - rep.

Kudos to the current coaching staff. Hopefully they will do for Walton next season what they have done for Franklin, Beadles, Clady and the rest of them.

[TonyR]

Originally Posted by kappys

...its not just Manning...

Agree, it's not just Manning. But it is Manning more than anything else. He's that good.

In 2010 with Indy he got sacked 16 times in 16 starts. In 2011, without Manning, Indy QBs got sacked 35 times. So from 16 sackes to 35. More than double. Think about that for a minute.

Now last season Broncos QBs got sacked 42 times. This season? On pace for less than 20. From 42 to 20. Less than half. Think about that for a minute.

Now tell me, who/what is most responsible for the decline in sacks this season? Note I didn't say "the only thing" responsible. I just said "most" responsible.

My job is done here.

[Dutch]

I think JD was already getting there this season Baja. We are starting to look much, much better from a depth perspective across the boards. Especially on the lines. Weird, actually. Nice work coaching up the players they have to work with, in conjunction with some timely FO moves (Koppen, seriously, could that have worked out any better?).

[baja]

Originally Posted by Dutch

I think JD was already getting there this season Baja. We are starting to look much, much better from a depth perspective across the boards. Especially on the lines. Weird, actually. Nice work coaching up the players they have to work with, in conjunction with some timely FO moves (Koppen, seriously, could that have worked out any better?).

The only thing better would been if Walton didn't get hurt but replaced by Koppen because he outplayed Walton in practice. Cat's have too many good back ups on the lines

[lonestar]

Originally Posted by Dutch

I think JD was already getting there this season Baja. We are starting to look much, much better from a depth perspective across the boards. Especially on the lines. Weird, actually. Nice work coaching up the players they have to work with, in conjunction with some timely FO moves (Koppen, seriously, could that have worked out any better?).

Great post and your right on teh mark..

Way to many folks are hung up that Josh drafted them.. opposed to seeing the progress made from thier rookie years..

Going form super poor OL coaching the first year, to the no off season with a brand new Offensive scheme killed these guys particular..

VERY few OL guys come in and kick ass in their first couple of years, except perhaps those taken in rounds one and most of those are top 15 picks..

The game speed and size of the DL across from them simply overwhelms them.. Add to it the veteran moves they have just causes real problems..

Add to that two rookies starting next to each other further compounds it..

then add in that Clady had been playing like crap.. you get a BIGGIE WHAMMY..

not like Pouncey coming in a few years ago in PIT and starting on very experienced OL.. he had vets on both side of him to help his transition..

[lonestar]

Originally Posted by baja

The only thing better would been if Walton didn't get hurt but replaced by Koppen because he outplayed Walton in practice. Cat's have too many good back ups on the lines

as much as you might have wanted that it would have never happened..

Mazu knows that one it would have hindered his development and tow it would have disrupted the continuity of the others around him..

He was not getting any reps in practice without that they would have never beat him out..

Now had he come in early in training camp maybe..

once TC is over and the season starts changes to the line up are few and far between except for injury.. or flat screw ups (mays)..

there is simply to little practice time to experiment..

[kappys]

Originally Posted by TonyR

Agree, it's not just Manning. But it is Manning more than anything else. He's that good.

In 2010 with Indy he got sacked 16 times in 16 starts. In 2011, without Manning, Indy QBs got sacked 35 times. So from 16 sackes to 35. More than double. Think about that for a minute.

Now last season Broncos QBs got sacked 42 times. This season? On pace for less than 20. From 42 to 20. Less than half. Think about that for a minute.

Now tell me, who/what is most responsible for the decline in sacks this season? Note I didn't say "the only thing" responsible. I just said "most" responsible.

My job is done here.

From a pure sack standpoint sure - Manning doesn't get sacked because when the defense blitzes he recognizes it pre snap and goes to his hot read. That hasn't changed.

However the Denver O-line has done much better than recent Indy lines at keeping a nice open and clean pocket(I didn't bother watching Indy without Manning). There is very little pressure up front and both tackles have done a great job at walling off their guys. Manning is reproducing the sort of completion percentages he had in the mid 2000's when the Indy line was at its best.

[Doggcow]

The line has played great, but the #1 guy that protects Manning, is Manning.