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View Poll Results: Is Shanahan going to make it through the season?
Yes 61 83.56%
No 8 10.96%
It's Griese's fault 12 16.44%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 73. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 11-06-2012, 08:44 AM   #101
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if your unable to read that, it is time to go back to school...
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Old 11-06-2012, 09:26 AM   #102
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Around the league, the biggest criticism of Shanahan is that he doesn't listen to his scouts. He has always insisted on personnel control but doesn't heed good advice on players. Several former coaches and executives who have worked with him say he scouts off highlight tape. He wants to see a player's 10 best plays. He says he will coach him to that.

Those former workers say Shanahan believes he has the magic answer for that player. A favorite line, they say is: "He hasn't been coached by me."
- The little man upstairs
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Old 11-06-2012, 12:39 PM   #103
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When Wade Phillips left Denver the talent level OVERALL on the team was not that good from the OL, WR, LB, RB, DL & special teams. I distinctly remember thinking that John Elway would never return to the SB, much less win it before he retired. Compare the quality of the roster/depth between 1994 and 1997. In my opinion, Shanahan performed somewhat of a miracle in a short time shoring up the roster.

I am not a supporter of what Shanahan did past the Superbowl years and he did leave too late. I think ego was his biggest enemy in the GM role, relating to the players and to the fans. I think he no longer motivates players.

I think too many people have a short memory of what the Broncos looked like at the end of 1994 and no longer give Shanahan the credit he REALLY deserved when he first took over. The last 10 years have diminished peoples opinion of Mike.
Actually, Shanny inherited OL - Zimmerman, Habib, Nalen all of whom started during the 95-98 years.

DB - inherited Ray Crockett and Atwater.

LB - inherited Allen Aldridge, who started at MLB 95-97.

DL- Harald Hasselbach, kept for depth 95-98.

ST - inherited Elam, Rouen, Glynn Milburn, Hebron, and Keith Burns also.

WR - inherited Anthony Miller and got a decent couple of yrs from him, but yeah WR was poor.

And of course Shanny inherited Shannon Sharpe and John Elway. Also Dwayne Carswell who contributed for many a year as blocking TE.

So yeah, Shanny made some nice additions of older players to make those SB runs, as well as some nice draftees like Mobley, Pryce, Rod Smith, T. Davis.

Yeah, there was some shaky units as you said - DL, RB, WR. Shanny made some nice additions there with FA's and draftees. But don't pretend like that 1994 roster was shaky. Had a few HOF'rs, and Shanny inherited about 9-10 players from the 1994 roster that started for the 1996-1998 kickass years, and key rotation guys like Carswell and Hasselbach.

Last edited by Cito Pelon; 11-06-2012 at 12:46 PM..
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Old 11-06-2012, 07:19 PM   #104
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Actually, Shanny inherited OL - Zimmerman, Habib, Nalen all of whom started during the 95-98 years.

DB - inherited Ray Crockett and Atwater.

LB - inherited Allen Aldridge, who started at MLB 95-97.

DL- Harald Hasselbach, kept for depth 95-98.

ST - inherited Elam, Rouen, Glynn Milburn, Hebron, and Keith Burns also.

WR - inherited Anthony Miller and got a decent couple of yrs from him, but yeah WR was poor.

And of course Shanny inherited Shannon Sharpe and John Elway. Also Dwayne Carswell who contributed for many a year as blocking TE.

So yeah, Shanny made some nice additions of older players to make those SB runs, as well as some nice draftees like Mobley, Pryce, Rod Smith, T. Davis.

Yeah, there was some shaky units as you said - DL, RB, WR. Shanny made some nice additions there with FA's and draftees. But don't pretend like that 1994 roster was shaky. Had a few HOF'rs, and Shanny inherited about 9-10 players from the 1994 roster that started for the 1996-1998 kickass years, and key rotation guys like Carswell and Hasselbach.
Before I posted, I specifically looked at the roster differences. Some of the players you mentioned were players on the edge that were not key players in the SB years. You neglected to bring up people like Romanowski, Neil, Tony Jones, Neil Smith, Alfred Williams, Darrien Gordon, Howard Griffith, Mark Schlereth, Keith Traylor, Ed McCaffrey ---- all significant starters - 10 starters you are giving no credit to Shanahan for bringing in. Your post has some good points but is it is significantly understated.

Additionally, look at the players that were starters on the 1994 team that were not around in 1997. There was an ejection of some real age in those 3 years. Compare the depth of talent that allowed the team get past injuries - another significant improvement.

I never inferred that the 1994 Broncos had the talent of the current Chiefs. They were an aging team in key areas that needed significant infusion. All the players I mentioned above added a great deal of talent over the equivalent 1994 starters at their position. I give Mike the credit for that.

Last edited by dsmoot; 11-06-2012 at 07:35 PM..
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Old 11-07-2012, 12:29 AM   #105
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- The little man upstairs
Do you have a link for that quote..


that describes him to a T..
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Old 11-07-2012, 12:35 AM   #106
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Actually, Shanny inherited OL - Zimmerman, Habib, Nalen all of whom started during the 95-98 years.

DB - inherited Ray Crockett and Atwater.

LB - inherited Allen Aldridge, who started at MLB 95-97.

DL- Harald Hasselbach, kept for depth 95-98.

ST - inherited Elam, Rouen, Glynn Milburn, Hebron, and Keith Burns also.

WR - inherited Anthony Miller and got a decent couple of yrs from him, but yeah WR was poor.

And of course Shanny inherited Shannon Sharpe and John Elway. Also Dwayne Carswell who contributed for many a year as blocking TE.

So yeah, Shanny made some nice additions of older players to make those SB runs, as well as some nice draftees like Mobley, Pryce, Rod Smith, T. Davis.

Yeah, there was some shaky units as you said - DL, RB, WR. Shanny made some nice additions there with FA's and draftees. But don't pretend like that 1994 roster was shaky. Had a few HOF'rs, and Shanny inherited about 9-10 players from the 1994 roster that started for the 1996-1998 kickass years, and key rotation guys like Carswell and Hasselbach.


I hi-lited the HOF player in red so those that think mikey did not have talent,

Most noticeably he added a few DL guys that had a couple of years left in them, but then when they retired he failed to address replacing them..

BTW You forgot about Rod Smith he was on the roster also..
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Old 11-07-2012, 12:42 AM   #107
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Before I posted, I specifically looked at the roster differences. Some of the players you mentioned were players on the edge that were not key players in the SB years. You neglected to bring up people like Romanowski, Neil, Tony Jones, Neil Smith, Alfred Williams, Darrien Gordon, Howard Griffith, Mark Schlereth, Keith Traylor, Ed McCaffrey ---- all significant starters - 10 starters you are giving no credit to Shanahan for bringing in. Your post has some good points but is it is significantly understated.

Additionally, look at the players that were starters on the 1994 team that were not around in 1997. There was an ejection of some real age in those 3 years. Compare the depth of talent that allowed the team get past injuries - another significant improvement.

I never inferred that the 1994 Broncos had the talent of the current Chiefs. They were an aging team in key areas that needed significant infusion. All the players I mentioned above added a great deal of talent over the equivalent 1994 starters at their position. I give Mike the credit for that.
Actually he did comment about additions to the team
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Shanny made some nice additions of older players to make those SB runs,
he just did not name them all.. and you forgot Rod Smith who BTW was already on the roster when mikey showed up..
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Old 11-08-2012, 10:23 AM   #108
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Originally Posted by dsmoot View Post
Before I posted, I specifically looked at the roster differences. Some of the players you mentioned were players on the edge that were not key players in the SB years. You neglected to bring up people like Romanowski, Neil, Tony Jones, Neil Smith, Alfred Williams, Darrien Gordon, Howard Griffith, Mark Schlereth, Keith Traylor, Ed McCaffrey ---- all significant starters - 10 starters you are giving no credit to Shanahan for bringing in. Your post has some good points but is it is significantly understated.

Additionally, look at the players that were starters on the 1994 team that were not around in 1997. There was an ejection of some real age in those 3 years. Compare the depth of talent that allowed the team get past injuries - another significant improvement.

I never inferred that the 1994 Broncos had the talent of the current Chiefs. They were an aging team in key areas that needed significant infusion. All the players I mentioned above added a great deal of talent over the equivalent 1994 starters at their position. I give Mike the credit for that.
Absolutely. Basically, what Shanny inherited was an 7-9, 8-8 team (which he got out of them in 1995). Then he started upgrading the roster as you said to go along with the 10 starters he inherited from 1994, and made great FA choices of older vets that he managed to get 2-3-4 more years of good production out of. At the time I was thinking, "These dudes are over the hill." But he made it work, that was a heck of a run 96-98.
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Old 11-08-2012, 10:31 AM   #109
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Its the 99 and later Shanny that was the issue. His ego and stubborn side got in his way. I think Shanny would have been considered one of the best coaches ever if he stuck to coaching and let personnel side to someone else.
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Old 11-08-2012, 10:52 AM   #110
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Its the 99 and later Shanny that was the issue. His ego and stubborn side got in his way. I think Shanny would have been considered one of the best coaches ever if he stuck to coaching and let personnel side to someone else.
I think his arrogance really grew with the SB wins. Easy to justify with what he accomplished but it was down hill from there.
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Old 11-09-2012, 12:53 AM   #111
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Its the 99 and later Shanny that was the issue. His ego and stubborn side got in his way. I think Shanny would have been considered one of the best coaches ever if he stuck to coaching and let personnel side to someone else.
5 of the SIX rounds One thru Three players he did resign while on their rookie contracts were all drafted during or prior to 1999, that was a total of 6 of 41 of those players. Or 13% of the total he was able to keep as broncos. The rest were busts (mostly), players that were head cases we could not afford or player he seemed not interested in keeping because they flat balled in their last year in the rookie contract Heyward is the prime example. Instead of locking him up before the season he chose to wait and see if he was going to be that star he looked to be. Afterwards we had no cap space to try for him.

You ask why no space because of his penchant for overpaying UFA bums who killed us with dead cap money.
He had to resort to that because he fubared each draft. 35 rounds 1-3 players that he did not resign.
Those are the guys every good to great team built the foundation of the team with.

You are correct after 99 he did not help us whatsoever with personnel moves. Players and coaches.
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Old 11-09-2012, 01:05 AM   #112
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I think his arrogance really grew with the SB wins. Easy to justify with what he accomplished but it was down hill from there.
Pats contract for life sent mikey ego into overdrive. That is a big reason he got reckless with Pats money. Never met a salary cap he did not hit. Wild spending on UFA 2-3 year rentals that were beat before they got here on the very backside of their careers. But got very fat guaranteed money up front mostly called at the time signing bonuses IIRC.
They were either worn out/down of to fat to care. Which then meant rinse and repeat.

How many EOY presses did he say we are one or two players away.
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Old 11-09-2012, 05:24 AM   #113
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In the years since the SB wins defense was Shanny's biggest failing. And I think the biggest issue there was that he wasn't prepared to get a top DC in, then step back and let them run it. He usually hired lesser guys who knew their stuff but did as they were told

Just look at Houston. Kubiak followed the shanny blueprint and built a team that looked a lot like the broncos 99-08 vintage: struggling to get past.500, losing games they ought to win etc etc. But then Kubiak brough in Phillips to run the defense and - hey presto, suddenly you have a a decent defense with kubiak happy to step back and let Phillips do his thing, and the team starts winning.

Look at McD and Nolan: stellar defense, then McD starts meddling, Nolan walks and defense falls apart. Too much control freakery.

Now we see the same problems on the Washington defense since shanny took over....

So overall I'm glad Shanny's gone, he was probably fired a year or two too late in fact. BUT despite that I will always remember him for those superbowl wins that I think he fully deserves the credit for, and always appreciate him for that.

Yes he had a HOF QB, but so did Dan Reeves! Are people forgetting about those horrible superbowl blowouts?? Shanny managed to do a better job of surrounding ELway with talent and got enough decisions right to land us 2 lombardis - not an easy task.

I'm inclined to believe those who suggest that he got more stuck in his ways after the SB wins. Certainly he seems stuck in a rut, and a year or two off watching the rest of the league doesn't seem to have shown him any new tricks, which is disappointing......
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Old 11-09-2012, 07:55 AM   #114
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He ABSOLUTELY makes it through the season. There isn't too many instances of a coach being fired mid-season. Romeo Crennel gave up DC duties, but he's still the head coach. A better question would have been if Shanahan gets ANOTHER season...
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Old 11-10-2012, 07:29 AM   #115
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In the years since the SB wins defense was Shanny's biggest failing. And I think the biggest issue there was that he wasn't prepared to get a top DC in, then step back and let them run it. He usually hired lesser guys who knew their stuff but did as they were told

Just look at Houston. Kubiak followed the shanny blueprint and built a team that looked a lot like the broncos 99-08 vintage: struggling to get past.500, losing games they ought to win etc etc. But then Kubiak brough in Phillips to run the defense and - hey presto, suddenly you have a a decent defense with kubiak happy to step back and let Phillips do his thing, and the team starts winning.

Look at McD and Nolan: stellar defense, then McD starts meddling, Nolan walks and defense falls apart. Too much control freakery.

Now we see the same problems on the Washington defense since shanny took over....

So overall I'm glad Shanny's gone, he was probably fired a year or two too late in fact. BUT despite that I will always remember him for those superbowl wins that I think he fully deserves the credit for, and always appreciate him for that.

Yes he had a HOF QB, but so did Dan Reeves! Are people forgetting about those horrible superbowl blowouts?? Shanny managed to do a better job of surrounding ELway with talent and got enough decisions right to land us 2 lombardis - not an easy task.

I'm inclined to believe those who suggest that he got more stuck in his ways after the SB wins. Certainly he seems stuck in a rut, and a year or two off watching the rest of the league doesn't seem to have shown him any new tricks, which is disappointing......
What was very frustrating during the time after the Super Bowl years was watching the emergence of the Patriots and how they handled their personnel. They never seemed to reach for certain individuals, never were willing to overpay, drafted best player available, let veterans walk when their contract demands exceeded their value to the team and seemed to always put a quality next player up on the field. Having a Tom Brady come along didn't hurt but they seemed to have quality position coaches and stressed to everyone to focus on the game and do your job. The Pats didnt put up with much nonsense from anyone.

Contrast that to Shanahan who was always trying to pull a rabbit out of his hat and recreate that early success. He took way too many chances, thinking he was the mastermind that could take bad actors and mold them into good guys and great football players. However a new generation of player came along that Mike still hasn't figured out.

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Old 11-25-2012, 10:57 AM   #116
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Shanahan is in DC for as long as he wants, he has given them the best player in the league and a chance at a playoff run every year RG3 is healthy.

The people who doubt Shanahan are hilarious. Dude gave the 'loser' Elway back to back championships, got a home AFCCG with Crap Plummer at QB, then had the best young offense in the league coming together when he was fired.

Elway, Young, Cutler, now RG3. Guy knows what he is doing. lots of coaches look good or bad based on how good their QB is. It's no accident that Belichick looked like a failure right up until he was handed a Parcells drafted team and a future HOF QB in Brady. Remember when Mike Holmgren was the best coach in the league?
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Old 11-25-2012, 11:04 AM   #117
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Colonelbeef rarely has a good take when he rolls in. I know you hated Shanny being fired but giving us the positives about Shanny from 7 years ago is like a running back's career. 7 years is a long time. He hasnt been much and there is no more excuses if he doesn't get the Redskins back to the playoffs.
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Old 11-25-2012, 01:06 PM   #118
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Another typical shanahan game on thanksgiving. Get up early and shell shock the other team and then lose all momentum and fail to adjust.

He is lucky he has RGIII. That boy is SCARY good.
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Old 11-25-2012, 01:08 PM   #119
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Another typical shanahan game on thanksgiving. Get up early and shell shock the other team and then lose all momentum and fail to adjust.

He is lucky he has RGIII. That boy is SCARY good.
Umm...actually you are lucky he made the big decision to go and get him. Shanny has won two in a row to get back in the division race and you are STILL sniveling?

Ungrateful as always I guess.
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Old 11-25-2012, 01:17 PM   #120
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Umm...actually you are lucky he made the big decision to go and get him. Shanny has won two in a row to get back in the division race and you are STILL sniveling?

Ungrateful as always I guess.
Like I said we can talk at the end of the year. I know you are a big shanny supporter, but many here agree with how I label shanny so again we can agree to disagree and just see what the results bring.

Injuries are just an excuse. HE is lucky that he went out and drafted RGIII because even he knew being stubborn and STAKING HIS REPUTATION, as he put it in his own words, on Rex Grossman and John Beck was turning him into a league joke.

Big time game next week against the Giants. Everyone is saying the Skins will be the new NFC east power soon enough, so let's see if Shanahan is able to lead that. Color me skeptical but i put my money on another coach winning with the stud QB back there.
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Old 11-25-2012, 01:26 PM   #121
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I think his arrogance really grew with the SB wins. Easy to justify with what he accomplished but it was down hill from there.

I am a big believer in this being a young coaches league. Just the sheer hours you have to put in for preparation is crazy. I know Shanahan is a manager now more than anything but it trickles down and players know what goes on. It's all about setting the precedent.

One of my friends went to redskins park to welcome back the team from Dallas late Thursday night. Guess who was the first car out of there: Shanahan
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Old 11-25-2012, 01:33 PM   #122
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Umm...actually you are lucky he made the big decision to go and get him. Shanny has won two in a row to get back in the division race and you are STILL sniveling?

Ungrateful as always I guess.
Skins beat the Giants next week and things will get very interesting in the NFC East.
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Old 11-25-2012, 02:03 PM   #123
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Umm...actually you are lucky he made the big decision to go and get him. Shanny has won two in a row to get back in the division race and you are STILL sniveling?

Ungrateful as always I guess.
Go get RG 3? Where else could he go to save his ass? RG3 is golden and when Luck is gonzo, it was the only play to go up and get him. RG3 pick saved Shanny's job for at least a year or two.

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Skins beat the Giants next week and things will get very interesting in the NFC East.
That division blows and yet Redskins are still struggling to get into the playoff race.
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Old 11-25-2012, 03:58 PM   #124
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They gave up the Lincoln Monument & sh_t to get RGIII, but that dude has HOF written all over him. As for Shanahan, they're in running to win arguably the toughest div in football with a rookie QB. Good for him. Hope we meet them in the Superbowl!
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Old 11-25-2012, 04:58 PM   #125
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Go get RG 3? Where else could he go to save his ass? RG3 is golden and when Luck is gonzo, it was the only play to go up and get him. RG3 pick saved Shanny's job for at least a year or two.



That division blows and yet Redskins are still struggling to get into the playoff race.
and your point is?
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