The Orange Mane -  a Denver Broncos Fan Community  

Go Back   The Orange Mane - a Denver Broncos Fan Community > Orange Mane Discussion > Orange Mane Central Discussion
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Chat Room Mark Forums Read



Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 11-05-2012, 09:27 AM   #76
Mile High 81
Solid Starter
 

Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Bad Salzuflen, Germany
Posts: 175
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by FearLanier View Post
Chiefs need to go after Cowher, Gruden and Chip Kelly. Get one of them.
Neither of them will coach there.

I believe if Pioli is not fired we see Josh MCD in KC....
Mile High 81 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2012, 09:35 AM   #77
FearLanier
Guest
 

Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mile High 81 View Post
Neither of them will coach there.

I believe if Pioli is not fired we see Josh MCD in KC....
Pioli wanted Josh McD last spring and it was reported that Clark said no because nobody would buy into him.

What makes you think that would change now?
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2012, 09:43 AM   #78
Tombstone RJ
Ring of Famer
 
Tombstone RJ's Avatar
 
Old School

Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: In the Tetons!
Posts: 22,100

Adopt-a-Bronco:
WorrellWilliams
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by FearLanier View Post
Chiefs need to go after Cowher, Gruden and Chip Kelly. Get one of them.
Chip Kelly said no to the Bucs, why would he say yes to the chefs? Cowher wants full executive power with a coaching job. I have a feeling this is the exact reason why he's still sitting at home. Gruden ain't leaving a cushy job for kc. Sorry.

fail post is failing

Last edited by Tombstone RJ; 11-05-2012 at 09:45 AM..
Tombstone RJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2012, 09:45 AM   #79
FearLanier
Guest
 

Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tombstone RJ View Post
Chip Kelly said no to the Bucs, why would he say yes to the chefs? Cowher wants full exective power with a coaching job. I have a feeling this is the exact reason why he's still sitting at home. Gruden ain't leaving a cushy job for kc. Sorry.

fail post is failing
Tampa Bay blacks out every game. Nobody really cares about the NFL in Florida.
Cowher would get power assuming Pioli is fired. But he will probably want to stay close to his family in Carolina.
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2012, 09:52 AM   #80
Tombstone RJ
Ring of Famer
 
Tombstone RJ's Avatar
 
Old School

Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: In the Tetons!
Posts: 22,100

Adopt-a-Bronco:
WorrellWilliams
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by FearLanier View Post
Tampa Bay blacks out every game. Nobody really cares about the NFL in Florida.
Cowher would get power assuming Pioli is fired. But he will probably want to stay close to his family in Carolina.
TB has a good GM already in place and a young QB with some talent. They are much closer to winning than kc and their fans do show up when they are winning. If kc is stupid enough to make Cowher their GM/HC go right ahead and hire him. Fact is Cowher's teams were loaded with talent because of their front office and Cowher benefitted from Pittsburgh's stability and overall philosophy. Now, can Cowher be successful at being a defacto GM and the HC in kc? I seriously doubt it.

kc needs to hire a compitent GM and HC and draft or trade for a good young QB. Personally, I hope they continue to keep failing. I'd love for them to hire Cowher and give him the ability to oversee all the football operations. He'd fail miserably IMHO.
Tombstone RJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2012, 09:59 AM   #81
FearLanier
Guest
 

Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tombstone RJ View Post
TB has a good GM already in place and a young QB with some talent. They are much closer to winning than kc and their fans do show up when they are winning. If kc is stupid enough to make Cowher their GM/HC go right ahead and hire him. Fact is Cowher's teams were loaded with talent because of their front office and Cowher benefitted from Pittsburgh's stability and overall philosophy. Now, can Cowher be successful at being a defacto GM and the HC in kc? I seriously doubt it.

kc needs to hire a compitent GM and HC and draft or trade for a good young QB. Personally, I hope they continue to keep failing. I'd love for them to hire Cowher and give him the ability to oversee all the football operations. He'd fail miserably IMHO.
Oh boy. Josh Freeman is vastly overrated. Trust us. Freeman is from Kansas City. We've seen him for years. His best quality is arm strength. He simply can't read defenses as well as a 1st round pick should.

I agree with your 2nd point.
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2012, 10:40 AM   #82
BroncoMan4ever
Ring of Famer
 
BroncoMan4ever's Avatar
 
That's just like your opinion, man

Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Denver
Posts: 13,348

Adopt-a-Bronco:
VIRGIL GREEN!!!
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by FearLanier View Post
Chiefs need to go after Cowher, Gruden and Chip Kelly. Get one of them.
Cowher and Gruden both seem happy in their current gigs. Only Gruden who might be a HC next season is Jay
BroncoMan4ever is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2012, 11:03 AM   #83
fwf
Guest
 

Posts: n/a
Default

All I know is that there's probably going to be some attractive job openings next season (N.O, SD, Carolina), and the f'n chiefs ain't one of them.
About all the have going for them is a some what loyal fan base.

It's a **** city , **** stadium, **** gm, **** owner, **** qb, a bunch of **** contracts and they play in a non **** division against the goat.
If you ask me they would be doing well to sign McCoy and see if they can steal a division win or 2 based on his experience.

Last edited by fwf; 11-05-2012 at 11:21 AM..
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2012, 11:38 AM   #84
Garcia Bronco
Hokie since 1993
 

Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 46,902

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Tom Jackson
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob's your Information Minister View Post
What do you guys know of him?

Is he ready to be a head coach?

We're debating about him on Chefsplanet.

http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=266137
I don't think so. He's too young.
Garcia Bronco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-18-2012, 08:28 PM   #85
RedskinBronco
Ring of Famer
 

Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,978
Default

Article on KS. He is doing some great things and he deserves a lot of respect and head coaching attention. Kyle has really impressed

http://m.nfl.com/news/0ap10000001135...-malleability/

Quote:
» And much more, beginning with a look at why Kyle Shanahan is on the head-coaching fast track ...


Chris Cooley was cut by the Washington Redskins on Aug. 28. The veteran tight end then returned to the team on Oct. 22.

It's pretty tough for him to comprehend what transpired in the eight weeks in between.

"When I got back, it was a new offense," Cooley recounted recently. "The learning curve for me was drastic. I missed seven games. The last game I didn't play was against the Giants. I watch all the games and I'm in tune to what we're doing, [but] I couldn't have called a third of the plays in that game. I couldn't have told you what they were, what the responsibilities were. The way they'd grown from Week 1 to Week 7 was unreal."

So is the ascension of Redskins offensive coordinator Kyle Shanahan on lists of potential head-coaching candidates. And Cooley's explanation hints at the primary reason why.

After leading a middling offense his first two years in Washington (ranked 18th and 16th in the league) under his father, the younger Shanahan retrofitted the traditional scheme Mike Shanahan has run around the talents of Robert Griffin III, for whom the 'Skins yielded a ransom to draft. Kyle installed concepts that Griffin ran at Baylor, mixed them with the old stuff, and created a unique attack designed to put his rookie quarterback in the best spot to prosper quickly. It worked. To wit:

Exihibit A: Griffin's 104.2 rating, 66.4 completion percentage and 18-to-4 TD-INT ratio.
Exhibit B: Washington now ranks fourth in total offense.
Exhibit C: With Griffin out in Week 15, it was easily adjustable to fit Washington's other rookie quarterback, Kirk Cousins.

"He's definitely exaggerating a little bit, just talking like Cooley does," Kyle Shanahan said over the phone, when apprised of his tight end's comments. "The whole basics of the zone read, we'd worked on that, did it really hard, put time into it from a Football 101 standpoint starting in OTAs, going from normal formations, getting the O-line right, getting the quarterback and running backs on the same page with the ballhandling. What Cooley saw was the simple ways to do it. That was the first couple games."

From there, the Redskins have kept defenses on their toes not by changing the concepts, but expanding the looks.

It's working. Washington topped the league in rushing at the quarter pole, stood second both at the midway point and after Week 12, and has risen back up to first since. So at this point, the idea that other teams would simply "catch up" to the problems the Redskins have created with their unique attack looks shaky.

"We've added moving parts -- out of crazy formations, running guys across the formation, bringing receivers in the backfield," Kyle continued. "Each week, we add to it. We got most wild with it the first time we played the Giants. To me, a lot of it is illusion. And it all goes back to what we've already done. The teaching has never really changed. The window dressing has. We can make it look like a lot of different stuff."

Kyle Shanahan's motivation to innovate here, more so than within the actual schematics, helps explain why he will draw interest from other clubs in need of a head coach this offseason. The 33-year-old chose to base his offense around the talent on hand, rather than forcing the talent to adapt to his ways. Which is to say he's inventive enough to be adapatable, something that would help any coach get the most out of his players.

In Griffin's case, Kyle said, "When we studied him, we saw a lot of things he did well, but (the zone-read) is what he did best, and we weren't going to take that away from him." So the Redskins went about trying to take what Griffin did best and make it something the offense could do well.

The interesting thing is that as Kyle Shanahan compiled tape of Baylor -- as well as the Tim Tebow-quarterbacked Denver Broncos, the Cam Newton Carolina Panthers and the Vince Young Tennessee Titans, to see how NFL defenses were combatting the option -- neither he nor any other Redskins coach consulted with any outside coach or option guru.

"I'm kinda glad we didn't," Kyle said. "Because of that, we had to look at it hard, study more tape, and we wound learning it better and coming up with our own impressions."

As you might expect, he scoffs at the notion that it's any kind of gimmick.

Kyle explains that the offense forces defenses to account for 11 players rather than 10, since the quarterback is part of the play. This opens up things everywhere else on the field. Washington runs, by Kyle's count, about nine plays per game off the read-option and the threat it creates. And when the Redskins are running it -- not playing off it -- an extra gap is created. It plays the angles and is built to put defensive guys in bad spots, which, he reminds, is offensive football.

Kyle concedes it can't be all you do in the NFL. But it can be an important element, so long as you can keep your quarterback upright.

"We don't want Robert to get hit, but the thing I've noticed is that people notice when he gets hit running the ball," Kyle Shanahan said. "But they don't realize how violent it is in the pocket. ... He doesn't get hit like (Matt) Schaub did or Rex (Grossman) did. Robert will do that (dropback) stuff, but with the threat of the zone-read, and the fact that he's not sitting there, defensive linemen aren't teeing off on him. It's not the same."

Still, to make it work, the Redskins have built in rules for Griffin. In scramble situations, he's only to run when he's not accounted for by the defense. And in most of those spots, he's told to use the angles and run to the sideline. They're coaching him to slide some, and get out of bounds more -- on option plays, too.

Kyle Shanahan also mentions that Griffin's two injuries this year came on scrambles, not designed runs.

Mike Shanahan told me earlier in the season that he expects the offense to be in a state of evolution for the first three years of Griffin's career, something evident in the way Kyle's running things. And maybe the best thing? In part because both the option looks and the old offense are rooted in zone-blocking concepts, it's easy to go back and forth in scheme, which allowed the Redskins to smoothly transition to Kirk Cousins last week. But again, the idea remains the same.

"You can't just turn it on and become a pocket passer. Most guys who are have been since they were born," Kyle Shanahan said. "They've been throwing from the pocket and reading coverages since Day 1. Robert's such a good athlete that he hasn't had to do that. He understands football, and he can do it. He works at it, and the way he thinks and works, he's gonna be good at everything. This is just what he does best now."

It doesn't take Amos Alonzo Stagg to recognize that. But it did take skill, and guts, to build it like this.

So far, it's paid off for the Redskins. Soon enough, it should pay off for Kyle Shanahan too.
RedskinBronco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-18-2012, 08:42 PM   #86
extralife
Ring of Famer
 

Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 5,007
Default

one HC prospect that no one seems to be talking about is Mike Zimmer. he's done good work with the Bengals for a number of years, and everyone that plays for him seems to like him a lot. he should get a shot somewhere.
extralife is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-18-2012, 08:44 PM   #87
SoCalBronco
Nixonite
 
SoCalBronco's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Arcadia, CA
Posts: 35,931

Adopt-a-Bronco:
D.J. Williams
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tombstone RJ View Post
Chip Kelly said no to the Bucs, why would he say yes to the chefs? Cowher wants full executive power with a coaching job. I have a feeling this is the exact reason why he's still sitting at home. Gruden ain't leaving a cushy job for kc. Sorry.

fail post is failing
There is a decent chance Chip Kelly is going to bolt this year.....the NCAA noose is tightening around Oregon's neck and their NOA from the Willie Lyles scandal should be coming out sometime in the spring.
__________________


BRING BACK BUTCH
SoCalBronco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-18-2012, 08:52 PM   #88
Tombstone RJ
Ring of Famer
 
Tombstone RJ's Avatar
 
Old School

Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: In the Tetons!
Posts: 22,100

Adopt-a-Bronco:
WorrellWilliams
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCalBronco View Post
There is a decent chance Chip Kelly is going to bolt this year.....the NCAA noose is tightening around Oregon's neck and their NOA from the Willie Lyles scandal should be coming out sometime in the spring.
I don't for a second doubt Kelly will end up in the NFL, I just seriously doubt it will be kc, but who knows? Maybe Hunt makes Kelly an offer he can't refuse?
Tombstone RJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-19-2012, 05:42 AM   #89
dsmoot
Ring of Famer
 

Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 1,718
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by lonestar View Post
I'm forever grateful of the two rings.. but after John left he only drug this franchise down.. with his piss poor personnel moves.. HE was a genius initially when FA first started.. then he believed all ills of the Broncos could be fixed with it.. and it kept getting more expensive each year especially after everyone else saw what he had done to plug holes to get us those two rings..


IMO he was here 8 seasons to long.. even the play off run with Jake was fools gold, As much as I liked Jake he had very little/nothing to support him talent wise.. the OL was a joke even if they had good numbers on running the ball, when we had to have the yards inside the 20 we folded like a cheap tent, Elam was a leader in scoring in the NFL because we could not finish with TD's when we got close..

his Defenses sucked for most of his career here.. only a couple of time ranked in the top ten.. and then usually one side was strong while the other side of the D was near the bottom.. lets not even talk about ST's as we for the most part really sucked there..

sorry but I have zero love for mikey past those two rings.. Who knows with the talent we already had on the team another HC could have come in and done the same thing..
Mike Shanahan is a good head coach. He is especially good on game day and making adjustments.

The positives end when you consider his role as GM because he made high risk moves thinking he was only a couple players away from reproducing his excellent personnel moves he made in the first couple of years. As a GM, he continually backed himself into a corner against the salary cap with inferior talent and a ton of dead money. Denver was unable to really go after superior FA talent because they simply didn't have the cash. They were limited to going after guys that were either on the backside of their career or taking chances on guys that didn't really pan out with their previous team with Mike thinking he could "inspire" them to reach their potential (another fail).

Mike (the GM) was also a travesty in the draft. Took way too many chances drafting for need instead of best player available. Too much damaged goods.

Back to head coach. The Broncos were generally overachievers relative to the talent he had in the latter years. Denver's .500 record exceeded the talent. That lack of talent and character exposed itself during the repeated end of the year collapses. Even going into the AFC championship game in 2005, there was an obvious difference in talent between Denver and the elite teams in the league.

The only negative I give Mike (the coach) is his commitment to defense and the inability to select a keeper at DC that he wasn't ready to throw under the bus for the teams misfortunes. Additionally, Mike's ego became a big barrier at the end. I actually became enraged at times watching his press conferences with the attitude he projected. Agreed, his time in Denver had worn out a couple of years before his eventual departure.

I give kudos to Mike (the coach) in the way he has turned the Redskins season around this year. He is very good for RG3. Although, the Skins need to practice RG3 getting on his butt sooner.

Too many people have difficulty separating Mike the coach from Mike the GM in his Denver years. We can have the same discussion about Dan Reeves. Unfortunately, John Ralston was much better at talent evaluation than he was managing players and handling game decisions.

Last edited by dsmoot; 12-19-2012 at 05:51 AM..
dsmoot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-19-2012, 05:56 AM   #90
Punisher
®WOOOOOOOOOOOOO
 
Punisher's Avatar
 
Money to Burn WOOOO®

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Broncos Video Vault
Posts: 7,177

Adopt-a-Bronco:
i4jelway7
Default

**** that hire Kyle Orton as HC
Punisher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2012, 07:34 AM   #91
colonelbeef
Lets be friend
 
colonelbeef's Avatar
 
Elway is the new Jerry West

Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 3,883

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Derek Wolfe
Default

Not ready. He needs to be a part of a few deep playoff runs first imo
colonelbeef is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2012, 07:40 AM   #92
colonelbeef
Lets be friend
 
colonelbeef's Avatar
 
Elway is the new Jerry West

Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 3,883

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Derek Wolfe
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by lonestar View Post
wow another poster that has to go straight to attack mode because he has nothing civil to say..

what have I said about tanahan that was wrong?

he was an excellent OC, over his head as HC Twice now, maybe even three times the jury is out in WAS, he was beyond lousy as the GM, his talent evaluations sucked to high heaven, loved to spend someone else's money, never saw a Defense he liked.. hired more coaches than most people on here can count.. fingers and toes..

won us a couple of rings past that he should have left when he was ahead, oh the one that almost everyone likes he won a lot of games..

But he lost every Playoff game after John left excpet one and THEN the next week we got our asses kicked..

did I leave anything out?

lonestar, you are one dumb mother****er. Wow.

So Mike Shanahan, who is currently 12th all time on the HC wins list, and has back to back SB wins on his resume, and is CURRENTLY in the running for coach of the year, is a 'good OC who was in over his head as a head coach' according to you.

The word stupid does not begin to describe your lack of perception, let alone intellect. Yikes.
colonelbeef is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2012, 07:48 AM   #93
bronco militia
OMG...this is horrible!
 
bronco militia's Avatar
 
THE GREATEST

Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: colorado springs, co
Posts: 24,894
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by colonelbeef View Post
lonestar, you are one dumb mother****er. Wow.

So Mike Shanahan, who is currently 12th all time on the HC wins list, and has back to back SB wins on his resume, and is CURRENTLY in the running for coach of the year, is a 'good OC who was in over his head as a head coach' according to you.

The word stupid does not begin to describe your lack of perception, let alone intellect. Yikes.


fyi, we landed on the moon
bronco militia is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2012, 07:49 AM   #94
bronco militia
OMG...this is horrible!
 
bronco militia's Avatar
 
THE GREATEST

Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: colorado springs, co
Posts: 24,894
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RedskinBronco View Post
Article on KS. He is doing some great things and he deserves a lot of respect and head coaching attention. Kyle has really impressed

http://m.nfl.com/news/0ap10000001135...-malleability/
that was an excellent article
bronco militia is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2012, 09:41 AM   #95
Mediator12
OM analyst
 
Mediator12's Avatar
 
Roby AND Latimer?Who the Hell Knew?

Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: INDY
Posts: 10,091

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Malik Jackson
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RedskinBronco View Post
Article on KS. He is doing some great things and he deserves a lot of respect and head coaching attention. Kyle has really impressed

http://m.nfl.com/news/0ap10000001135...-malleability/
But But, McCoy sucks because he was able to do the same thing in DEN with NO OTA's and a midseason switch

All he did was hold Tebows development back by trying to make him effective as an NFL player! Kyle should get no credit because he is holding RGIII back
Mediator12 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes



Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 07:51 AM.


Denver Broncos