VP Debate

[barryr]

Originally Posted by Dexter

Oh, I'm not afraid to admit I'll be voting for Obama. Not that I'm really excited about it, but really when the GOP goes the way it has been going for the last decade, what other choice do I have?

Until you guys are more willing to nominate someone more moderate like John Huntsman, I will not be voting for the republican ticket. I've explained this in my past posts. Not that I expect you to believe that I'd ever vote for a republican. Because if I'm voting for Obama, I'm just some dirty liberal right? Its like the far right and far left can't fathom that there are actual moderates that vote in this country.

You stated in previous threads you are "generally liberal" but now you are a "moderate?" Ok. Hunstman is great since he had no shot and no way would have had a chance to defeat Obama, a guy Obama appointed to an ambassador spot. That is why Obama supporters pretend they would have actually considered him, but when November came around, Hunstman who?

[ghwk]

Originally Posted by lonestar

Hey I have. A few minutes from time time while taking a dump. Which in hind site was more important your posts.
Pardon the pun.

How about "master of the forum" you not worry about if I add my thoughts.

If it is an issue put me on IGGY. Ah but then you don't get those snappy remarks in your whippy posts.

Taking dumps. At your age it's all you have left to contribute.

[Requiem]

Originally Posted by ghwk

Taking dumps. At your age it's all you have left to contribute.

He has already admitted that his purpose in WRP is to troll. Couple that in with how he posts (usually hating on the Broncos, besides McDaniels) in the main forum, and clearly you know what he is up to.

[TonyR]

The biggest moment of this debate from my pov was when Ryan was asked for specifics on how they were going to pay for their proposed tax cuts. He couldn't do it, of course. He dodged the question and the follow up attempts. The math doesn't add up and they know it, but brazenly keep putting it out there because the average voter isn't smart enough to figure this out.

So, all in all, a fairly even debate. But Ryan being exposed on the tax cut fairy tale, and Biden's superior grasp of foreign policy, gives Biden the win.

[barryr]

Originally Posted by TonyR

The biggest moment of this debate from my pov was when Ryan was asked for specifics on how they were going to pay for their proposed tax cuts. He couldn't do it, of course. He dodged the question and the follow up attempts. The math doesn't add up and they know it, but brazenly keep putting it out there because the average voter isn't smart enough to figure this out.

So, all in all, a fairly even debate. But Ryan being exposed on the tax cut fairy tale, and Biden's superior grasp of foreign policy, gives Biden the win.

Oh, so when Biden stated that intelligence will let them know when Iran is close to a nuke? The same intelligence the Obama admin. stated told them about what happened in Libya? Yeah, real comforting.

[Requiem]

Originally Posted by TonyR

The biggest moment of this debate from my pov was when Ryan was asked for specifics on how they were going to pay for their proposed tax cuts. He couldn't do it, of course. He dodged the question and the follow up attempts. The math doesn't add up and they know it, but brazenly keep putting it out there because the average voter isn't smart enough to figure this out.

So, all in all, a fairly even debate. But Ryan being exposed on the tax cut fairy tale, and Biden's superior grasp of foreign policy, gives Biden the win.

Bingo. Even the moderator was like, "WTF!?" -- Asking for specifics, yet he didn't. IIRC, he basically said they would have to work with Democrats on the matter before they could give exact #'s or something. I mean. . . come on.

[TonyR]

Originally Posted by Requiem

Bingo. Even the moderator was like, "WTF!?" -- Asking for specifics, yet he didn't. IIRC, he basically said they would have to work with Democrats on the matter before they could give exact #'s or something. I mean. . . come on.

And I have to credit Ryan for how he handled it. Deflected it pretty well, played the whole "we have a framework and we'll work to get bipartisan consensus" nonsense. But to anyone remotely tuned into the realities at play here he got crushed. Unfortunately for the country 90+% of people aren't remotely tuned in to the aforementioned realities.

[Bronco Yoda]

Biden took Ryan to the woodshed. A complete trouncing. It wasn't even close.

[Traveler]

Originally Posted by BroncoInferno

Well, you can clearly see one of the key differences between the right and left in this country. When our guy lost, we didn't pretend otherwise. Pretty boy got his lying butt handed to him last night, and you've got dopes like nyuk nyuk pretending that he did a good job. And the so-called liberal media is so afraid of being accused of bias that they pretend it was a wash. I had to laugh at one of the CNN headlines this morning: "Ryan holds own with Biden." Give me a break. Biden broke his loafer off in Ryan's rear.

Nice take!

As was stated by Chuck Todd, if you're arguing about mannerisms after a debate, it's abundantly clear you've lost.

Last nights debate reminded me of the line by Samuel L. Jackson in the Avengers movie:

"Ant (Ryan) meet Boot (Biden)."

[Smiling Assassin27]

Originally Posted by barryr

Oh, so when Biden stated that intelligence will let them know when Iran is close to a nuke? The same intelligence the Obama admin. stated told them about what happened in Libya? Yeah, real comforting.

Except Biden claimed the adminstration never knew more security was requested in Benghazi in direct opposition to every administration official who testified at the hearing early in the week and emails of those specific requests. Lying or just incompetent?

Second big lie was that Biden voted against both wars. He voted for unilateral action in Iraq but was probably hoping nobody remembers what he did in 2001 and 2003. Lying or dementia?

[Kaylore]

Originally Posted by Bronco Yoda

Biden took Ryan to the woodshed. A complete trouncing. It wasn't even close.

I don't agree and America doesn't. In fact Polling data is coming out and Biden's performance was not popular with undecideds and moderates. I would give a slight win to Biden, but I think in talking everyone down he may have "won the debate" but may have lost the audience in doing it ala Gore Vs Bush. Most of the online polls called it a draw, and early returns polled viewers are not showing they saw a clear-cut winner. What is intersting is now it looks like Biden's favorability may have gone down after the debate.

This is the mistake I cautioned against in the other thread. Democrats have such disdain for Republicans they just want to see them trash the opposition. Biden came after hime pretty hard. To the hard core Dems, that's what they "wanted to see" and after Obama getting nailed to the wall, maybe it will be, if nothing else, good for the base to feel they had a comeback after such a crappy performance by Obama.

However what really was accomplished? VP candidates don't usually sway the populace too much. I think Biden did a good job nailing Ryan down on the tax cut issue, but he got backed in on the Benghazi situation, sometimes directly contradicting what the intelligence community said.

Like I said, if the goal was to fire up the base, then Biden did his job. I think Ryan's job was to hold serve against a more experienced statesmen and not do any damage to a recently surging Romney - and I think he did that. Both fell into the pitfalls I warned against: Biden to flippant and arrogant at the wrong times, and Ryan to profesorial.

As a Republican, I'll let the Dems have this one and take the trouncing of the "real" candidates. Polling shows this didn't move voters and most are calling it a tie with Biden's favorability taking a hit. The Dems believing they're winning the battle but losing the war is ok by me.

[Requiem]

We can't have a member of a cult become POTUS. No way, no how!

NOT IN MY COUNTRY.

[pricejj]

Originally Posted by Kaylore

However what really was accomplished?

The voters saw Paul Ryan on a national stage for the first time. He was prepared, and straightforward. He gave the American people what they deserve, direction, with a true plan that will begin to dig us out of this mess.

[Requiem]

Originally Posted by pricejj

The voters saw Paul Ryan on a national stage for the first time. He was prepared, and straightforward. He gave the American people what they deserve, direction, with a true plan that will begin to dig us out of this mess.

[BroncoInferno]

Originally Posted by Kaylore

I don't agree and America doesn't. In fact Polling data is coming out and Biden's performance was not popular with undecideds and moderates. I would give a slight win to Biden, but I think in talking everyone down he may have "won the debate" but may have lost the audience in doing it ala Gore Vs Bush. Most of the online polls called it a draw, and early returns polled viewers are not showing they saw a clear-cut winner. What is intersting is now it looks like Biden's favorability may have gone down after the debate.

This is the mistake I cautioned against in the other thread. Democrats have such disdain for Republicans they just want to see them trash the opposition. Biden came after hime pretty hard. To the hard core Dems, that's what they "wanted to see" and after Obama getting nailed to the wall, maybe it will be, if nothing else, good for the base to feel they had a comeback after such a crappy performance by Obama.

However what really was accomplished? VP candidates don't usually sway the populace too much. I think Biden did a good job nailing Ryan down on the tax cut issue, but he got backed in on the Benghazi situation, sometimes directly contradicting what the intelligence community said.

Like I said, if the goal was to fire up the base, then Biden did his job. I think Ryan's job was to hold serve against a more experienced statesmen and not do any damage to a recently surging Romney - and I think he did that. Both fell into the pitfalls I warned against: Biden to flippant and arrogant at the wrong times, and Ryan to profesorial.

As a Republican, I'll let the Dems have this one and take the trouncing of the "real" candidates. Polling shows this didn't move voters and most are calling it a tie with Biden's favorability taking a hit. The Dems believing they're winning the battle but losing the war is ok by me.

VP debates never make much of difference. There's rarely any significant movement in the polls after one these things. Targeting Indy's in a VP debate is a fruitless pursuit because they're going to ultimately vote for the top of the ticket, not the VP, so Biden theoretically losing favorability isn't really relevant. Energizing the base and calling Ryan out on his BS was the goal, and Biden accomplished that in emphatic fashion.

[Marshall Dumervil]

Originally Posted by pricejj

The voters saw Paul Ryan on a national stage for the first time. He was prepared, and straightforward. He gave the American people what they deserve, direction, with a true plan that will begin to dig us out of this mess.

What was that plan again? The one he couldn't tell us about?

[BroncoInferno]

Originally Posted by pricejj

The voters saw Paul Ryan on a national stage for the first time. He was prepared, and straightforward. He gave the American people what they deserve, direction, with a true plan that will begin to dig us out of this mess.

What a dope.

[maher_tyler]

I thought it was close. I thought Biden pointing out that Romney/Ryan don't have much of a plan if at all. They call out Obama but don't have a way for paying for the tax cuts themselves. I'm glad Biden called out Ryan for the obvious BS. I think that is why Biden gets the slight nod. He could have kept the laughing and condescending down a little bit. Overall i thought it was a good debate.

[pricejj]

Originally Posted by Marshall Dumervil

What was that plan again? The one he couldn't tell us about?

Did you watch the debate?

Romney/Ryan's 5 point plan to invigorate the economy:
1. Energy independence
2. Improving the education system for our children and our workers
3. Taking advantage of trade globally to open new markets and export our goods, while stopping China’s cheating
4. Cutting and capping federal spending, and getting on track to have a balanced budget
5. Being the champion for small business to grow and create jobs

[TonyR]

Originally Posted by Marshall Dumervil

What was that plan again? The one he couldn't tell us about?

Right?!? It's funny how people like pricejj (among several others) think they have it all figured out and yet they are either too dishonest or too stupid to not see this. Ryan was asked for specifics, more than once, and floundered. He says the math works but can't explain how or why. A massive deception and people blindly fall for it. But hey, he looks and sounds convincing, right?

[Bronco Yoda]

Originally Posted by Kaylore

I don't agree and America doesn't. In fact Polling data is coming out and Biden's performance was not popular with undecideds and moderates. I would give a slight win to Biden, but I think in talking everyone down he may have "won the debate" but may have lost the audience in doing it ala Gore Vs Bush. Most of the online polls called it a draw, and early returns polled viewers are not showing they saw a clear-cut winner. What is intersting is now it looks like Biden's favorability may have gone down after the debate.

This is the mistake I cautioned against in the other thread. Democrats have such disdain for Republicans they just want to see them trash the opposition. Biden came after hime pretty hard. To the hard core Dems, that's what they "wanted to see" and after Obama getting nailed to the wall, maybe it will be, if nothing else, good for the base to feel they had a comeback after such a crappy performance by Obama.

However what really was accomplished? VP candidates don't usually sway the populace too much. I think Biden did a good job nailing Ryan down on the tax cut issue, but he got backed in on the Benghazi situation, sometimes directly contradicting what the intelligence community said.

Like I said, if the goal was to fire up the base, then Biden did his job. I think Ryan's job was to hold serve against a more experienced statesmen and not do any damage to a recently surging Romney - and I think he did that. Both fell into the pitfalls I warned against: Biden to flippant and arrogant at the wrong times, and Ryan to profesorial.

As a Republican, I'll let the Dems have this one and take the trouncing of the "real" candidates. Polling shows this didn't move voters and most are calling it a tie with Biden's favorability taking a hit. The Dems believing they're winning the battle but losing the war is ok by me.

You are clearly blinded by your faith and strong allegiance to a particular party. Ryan didn't win one single section of entire debate. Name one single section he won. I have it on DVR and will watch it again.


Biden is spitting out facts and positions left and right and all Ryan has to counter with is short stories about Romneys generosity towards a fellow church member or his neighbor in the military or meaningless catch phrases of lost credibility.

And what's with the sad puppy dog eye's Ryan? This may work for a dog at the shelter getting adopted... but a VP? One position from the big chair. Has American become this ****ing gullible?

Ryan was and is clearly out of his depths here. Perhaps not nearly on the scale of Sarah. But still not ready for VP.

Can anyone here really honestly say they'd be comfortable with Ryan as our President if something were to happen to Romney?

[BroncoInferno]

Originally Posted by pricejj

Did you watch the debate?

Romney/Ryan's 5 point plan to invigorate the economy:
1. Energy independence
2. Improving the education system for our children and our workers
3. Taking advantage of trade globally to open new markets and export our goods, while stopping China’s cheating
4. Cutting and capping federal spending, and getting on track to have a balanced budget
5. Being the champion for small business to grow and create jobs

And not one specific on the list. Saying you're in favor of energy independence, improving education etc. is meaningless if you don't specify how you plan to accomplish it.

[TonyR]

Originally Posted by pricejj

Did you watch the debate?

Romney/Ryan's 5 point plan to invigorate the economy:
1. Energy independence
2. Improving the education system for our children and our workers
3. Taking advantage of trade globally to open new markets and export our goods, while stopping China’s cheating
4. Cutting and capping federal spending, and getting on track to have a balanced budget
5. Being the champion for small business to grow and create jobs

Platitudes are platitudinous.

Here's mine:
1. World peace
2. Cures for the common cold and all cancers
3. Good food for everyone
4. Cheap gas
5. Seven hot virgins for every man

Vote for me!

[BroncoInferno]

Originally Posted by TonyR

Platitudes are platitudinous.

Here's mine:
1. World peace
2. Cures for the common cold and all cancers
3. Good food for everyone
4. Cheap gas
5. Seven hot virgins for every man

Vote for me!

Exactly. Romney/Ryan are in favor of energy independence! Just don't expect them to explain how they plan to accomplish that. They're running their campaign like a middle school election. "Longer recesses and no more homework. Vote for me!"

[TonyR]

Originally Posted by BroncoInferno

Exactly. Romney/Ryan are in favor of energy independence! Just don't expect them to explain how they plan to accomplish that. They're running their campaign like a middle school election. "Longer recesses and no more homework. Vote for me!"

It just bewilders me that reasonably intelligent people fall for this nonsense. Further proof that "common sense" is uncommon.