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Old 10-08-2012, 12:45 PM   #101
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We are 2 NFL Caliber LB's away from being dominant again, we could use another DT also. This should be a Defensive draft this year.

Next year should be the 13-3 year with a deep playoff run.
I agree. But we could've (should've) taken at least one step in that direction this year.

http://www.tampabay.com/blogs/bucs/c...-losing-effort
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Old 10-08-2012, 12:47 PM   #102
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Way to early for the hotseat for Fox. I wasn't overly happy when he was hired; after all he is 1 game above .500 in his career I think (or very close to that), and the panthers were in a rapid state of decline. That said I think he's done a very good job thus far. Getting that team to the playoffs last year and winning a playoff game has to be one of the better coaching seasons I've seen in a while.
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Old 10-08-2012, 12:48 PM   #103
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It is hard to win games vs playoff teams on the road. Especially when you turn it over 3 times.

Fox is fine. If we execute we win.
Exactly.

We could be undefeated if we executed. But, we haven't been efficient enough. I look for that to change in the second half of the season.
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Old 10-08-2012, 01:08 PM   #104
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This is probably my biggest issue and concern with this FO. They should have upgraded the LB position this year, not next year. Re-signing Joe Mays has been a disaster.
only so much money in the budget dude.. spending 20 mil on a QB kind of dropped acquisitions for every spot we needed..

While I do not remember who was available at MLB in FA this year I suspect it was more than they wanted to play for them..

JDR is an EX LB IIRC an all pro he knows the position and how to coach it. I'm pretty sure that John did not give Mays the extension on a whim but after consulting with JDR and Fox.

I'm also guessing that if they did not want him he would not have been resigned..

the MLB did not lose that game last night nor the HOU or ATL game.. we simply got beat by a better team..and costly turn overs was probably the biggest cause..

we could not stop the off tackle runs some past miller, we could not stop Welker and that my friend is not Mays fault nor WWs.. That was lack of pressure from the front four which has been upgraded big time since last year as well as DB issues.. Anyone expecting a LB of any sort to stop Welker is smoking something..

Now I'm not sold on Mays myself but laying all the blame on him and WW for losing that game is silly..

Will there be an upgrade at LB in the off season absolutely because DJ will be gone (they may just coach up WW).. and maybe even a new MLB.. but for now we are what we are and I suspect that JDR will continue to work with Mays..
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Old 10-08-2012, 01:09 PM   #105
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I agree. But we could've (should've) taken at least one step in that direction this year.

http://www.tampabay.com/blogs/bucs/c...-losing-effort
who would you have cut to make this upgrade..
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Old 10-08-2012, 01:13 PM   #106
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Way to early for the hotseat for Fox. I wasn't overly happy when he was hired; after all he is 1 game above .500 in his career I think (or very close to that), and the panthers were in a rapid state of decline. That said I think he's done a very good job thus far. Getting that team to the playoffs last year and winning a playoff game has to be one of the better coaching seasons I've seen in a while.
IIRC they were in a state of decline more-so because they were starting a rebuild while cutting bigger salaries and older players.. a decision that was not his alone but the owner and GM..
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Old 10-08-2012, 01:22 PM   #107
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who would you have cut to make this upgrade..
No real cuts needed. We only needed to skip drafting a spread option 3rd-string backup for Peyton Manning.
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Old 10-08-2012, 01:28 PM   #108
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No real cuts needed. We only needed to skip drafting a spread option 3rd-string backup for Peyton Manning.
Do you work?

LOL
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Old 10-08-2012, 01:28 PM   #109
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Fox is not on the hot seat for 1 single reason more then most.

This team knows Manning only has 2, maybe 3 years. They're not going to fire Fox and bring in a new HC to start over when you have a HOF QB in his last few years. That's too much change. I high doubt McCoy is gone either. At this point people, it comes down to players. Against the best teams in the league this offense has pretty much, minus some turnovers which are not on the coaches, have played well enough to win every single game.


We don't have enough good defensive players and that IS the bottom line. I'm not even saying we need a few more elite defensive players, I'm saying all we need is a few more lagit NFL caliber starters on defense, particularly the LB's.
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Old 10-08-2012, 01:32 PM   #110
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Fox is not on the hot seat for 1 single reason more then most.

This team knows Manning only has 2, maybe 3 years. They're not going to fire Fox and bring in a new HC to start over when you have a HOF QB in his last few years. That's too much change. I high doubt McCoy is gone either. At this point people, it comes down to players. Against the best teams in the league this offense has pretty much, minus some turnovers which are not on the coaches, have played well enough to win every single game.


We don't have enough good defensive players and that IS the bottom line. I'm not even saying we need a few more elite defensive players, I'm saying all we need is a few more lagit NFL caliber starters on defense, particularly the LB's.
C'mon, bro. Why even respond so much. All this **** is obvious....
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Old 10-08-2012, 01:41 PM   #111
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No real cuts needed. We only needed to skip drafting a spread option 3rd-string backup for Peyton Manning.
first of all he must be the backup because the third string guy has been inactive for a few weeks..

PM is not going to be around forever.. unless your drafting in the top 3 your likely not to get a starting QB without some sideline time..

and frankly the likely hood of a third round LB from Nebraska of all places being a big hit, well I like Bo's chances better..

I realize that some would have been content to have quinn as our backup.. But I'm not..
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Old 10-08-2012, 01:41 PM   #112
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Originally Posted by ZONA View Post
Fox is not on the hot seat for 1 single reason more then most.

This team knows Manning only has 2, maybe 3 years. They're not going to fire Fox and bring in a new HC to start over when you have a HOF QB in his last few years. That's too much change. I high doubt McCoy is gone either. At this point people, it comes down to players. Against the best teams in the league this offense has pretty much, minus some turnovers which are not on the coaches, have played well enough to win every single game.


We don't have enough good defensive players and that IS the bottom line. I'm not even saying we need a few more elite defensive players, I'm saying all we need is a few more lagit NFL caliber starters on defense, particularly the LB's.
I agree a change is unlikely but I also think Elway will give Manning whatever he asks for.
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Old 10-08-2012, 01:50 PM   #113
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Fox is not on the hot seat for 1 single reason more then most.

This team knows Manning only has 2, maybe 3 years. They're not going to fire Fox and bring in a new HC to start over when you have a HOF QB in his last few years. That's too much change. I high doubt McCoy is gone either. At this point people, it comes down to players. Against the best teams in the league this offense has pretty much, minus some turnovers which are not on the coaches, have played well enough to win every single game.


We don't have enough good defensive players and that IS the bottom line. I'm not even saying we need a few more elite defensive players, I'm saying all we need is a few more legit NFL caliber starters on defense, particularly the LB's.
we have lacked on teh D side of the LOS for going ona decade..

Save Champ and Doom. when Josh came to town we had pretty much crap..

8 of the 08 starters for this team were gone in 09 none of them started on another NFL team and some were never heard from again..

all of the Defensive players said that they were tired of being treated like second class citizens .

it takes time to rebuild a team.. you need to get the skill position players first as for the most part they take the longest to get proficient.. rarely does a player other than perhaps a top ten guy come in and make an instant impact..

Most top five DL guys are players and maybe even starters as rookies and some become studs day one.. but most need a year or two to become the player they can be..

Why anyone is calling for a coaches head in year 1.25 of a 3-4 year rebuild is beyond me..
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Old 10-08-2012, 01:51 PM   #114
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I agree a change is unlikely but I also think Elway will give Manning whatever he asks for.
Remember– this is just the first year.

How's the new macbook working for you, anyway?
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Old 10-08-2012, 02:00 PM   #115
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first of all he must be the backup because the third string guy has been inactive for a few weeks..

PM is not going to be around forever.. unless your drafting in the top 3 your likely not to get a starting QB without some sideline time..

and frankly the likely hood of a third round LB from Nebraska of all places being a big hit, well I like Bo's chances better..

I realize that some would have been content to have quinn as our backup.. But I'm not..
Lavonte went the pick after Broz in the 2nd round. And unlike Broz, he was projected by some to go as early as the 1st.

He fell to us and was an incredible value. But we took the early-round swing instead on a backup QB that wouldn't have been taken for another round at least.

Now no draft is a sure thing. But the Pats exposed our defense for what it was last year. It's no surprise that we've got holes that need filled. We didn't get it done. What we did get was a rook QB who might have a year or two left on his contract when the time comes for him to play. And you can't put a price on that, amirite?
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Old 10-08-2012, 02:06 PM   #116
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Lavonte went the pick after Broz in the 2nd round. And unlike Broz, he was projected by some to go as early as the 1st.

He fell to us and was an incredible value. But we took the early-round swing instead on a backup QB that wouldn't have been taken for another round at least.

Now no draft is a sure thing. But the Pats exposed our defense for what it was last year. It's no surprise that we've got holes that need filled. We didn't get it done. What we did get was a rook QB who might have a year or two left on his contract when the time comes for him to play. And you can't put a price on that, amirite?
last year they exposed everyone and so far this year also..

Getting beat by a better team is not worth pissing and moaning about..

I'd do the potential FQB in the third round any day over a maybe LB..

the draft is a crap shoot.. in any round..

I do not think had David been on the field he would have made any difference in stopping Welker do you?

Most of the bigger runs I remember were off tackle/TE not exactly MLB area..
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Old 10-08-2012, 02:12 PM   #117
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These first 4 games (OK, maybe not the Raiders game ) are making us battle-tested for the playoffs. We have the #2 strength of schedule, to this point. The Giants (SB winners) have the #1 strength of schedule...

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Old 10-08-2012, 03:38 PM   #118
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last year they exposed everyone and so far this year also..

Getting beat by a better team is not worth pissing and moaning about..

I'd do the potential FQB in the third round any day over a maybe LB..

the draft is a crap shoot.. in any round..

I do not think had David been on the field he would have made any difference in stopping Welker do you?

Most of the bigger runs I remember were off tackle/TE not exactly MLB area..
Pats lost 4 times last year. In 3 of those they were held to 20 or less points. You're not going to beat them conceding the field on defense.

And yes, the draft is a crap shoot. But if the goal is a Lombardi in 2013 or 2014, who do you want? A guy that may or may not contribute in 2013 or 2014. Or a guy that may or may not contribute in 2015 or 2016?

Oh, and Lavonte isn't playing MLB yet I don't think. But he's doing well enough, there's talk about it. Imagine that.

But nah.... we got Brock ridin' pine, so we're all good.
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Old 10-08-2012, 03:45 PM   #119
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Pats lost 4 times last year. In 3 of those they were held to 20 or less points. You're not going to beat them conceding the field on defense.

And yes, the draft is a crap shoot. But if the goal is a Lombardi in 2013 or 2014, who do you want? A guy that may or may not contribute in 2013 or 2014. Or a guy that may or may not contribute in 2015 or 2016?

Oh, and Lavonte isn't playing MLB yet I don't think. But he's doing well enough, there's talk about it. Imagine that.

But nah.... we got Brock ridin' pine, so we're all good.
wow did he **** over someone you know.. Lose money on a bet against his college team..

He was a good investment..

they thought they had the MLB spot addressed if they had not signed Mays already maybe thing would have been different..


"Do not worry about something you have no control over"..- Dale Carnegie How to Stop Worrying and Start Living 2004
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Old 10-08-2012, 04:31 PM   #120
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Wouldn't Brock have to be considered "Plan B" ?
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Old 10-08-2012, 04:59 PM   #121
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OP may have a point. If we miss the playoffs after signing Peyton Manning, Elway may start wondering if Fox is the answer. I suspect though that that doubt would probably take another season to fully ripen, but you never know.
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Old 10-08-2012, 05:00 PM   #122
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Fox was on the hotseat in Carolina for years before the let him go. What is it about NFL coaches where they can fail so miserably with a team for years then after they are fired they are the main focus of all the other teams looking for a coach. They seem to think there is only 50 or so people on the planet capable of being an NFL head coach.
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Old 10-08-2012, 06:27 PM   #123
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That's just what this team needs, another new coaching staff. The Knee Jerks around here are absolute ridiculous.
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Old 10-08-2012, 06:35 PM   #124
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wow did he **** over someone you know.. Lose money on a bet against his college team..

He was a good investment..

they thought they had the MLB spot addressed if they had not signed Mays already maybe thing would have been different..


"Do not worry about something you have no control over"..- Dale Carnegie How to Stop Worrying and Start Living 2004
Got nothing against Brock. We just drafted him way earlier than we needed and in the process skipped over safer prospects in immediate positions of need.

I hope he pans out. But that's no more likely than Lavonte becoming a quality NFL linebacker. Probably less.

And Lavonte could be playing right now. Not 3 years from now.
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Old 10-08-2012, 07:36 PM   #125
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Actually he didn't at all but I realize I will never convince you of that.
Those debates happened so long ago...that's why I asked. I know a lot of members were constantly b****ing about him and Kubiak...I defended them both...not sure who else did.
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