US embassy in Libya in flames, ambassador dead

[DAN_BRONCO_FAN]

umm did i just hijack this thread and not realize it ?
lil ol me hijacking a thread it isnt possible is it

[DenverBrit]

Originally Posted by DAN_BRONCO_FAN

omg i love monty python but if it was making fun of oh say islam they would be beheaded
and why cant south park make fun of Mohammad yet everyone else is fair game
in other words why is their fear of Islam IN THE 21ST CENTURY
again if you drew a pic of Jesus and went to the vatican would you be stoned to death?

All religion needs to keep up with the times.

Unfortunately, religious fundamentalism is determined to keep their followers in the dark ages.
I can't explain why some Muslims are bent on rabid violence; most Mullahs will tell you they are 'corrupting' the Koran.
I've never read the Koran, so I don't know....but it is an expansionist religion.

Why can't they all adopt the concept of 'magic underwear' and simmer down?

[DAN_BRONCO_FAN]

Originally Posted by DenverBrit

Apparently you did.

FETCH THE COMFY CHAIR !!!!!!!!!!!

[DAN_BRONCO_FAN]

Originally Posted by DenverBrit

All religion needs to keep up with the times.

Unfortunately, religious fundamentalism is determined to keep their followers in the dark ages.
I can't explain why some Muslims are bent on rabid violence; most Mullahs will tell you they are 'corrupting' the Koran.
I've never read the Koran, so I don't know....but it is an expansionist religion.

Why can't they all adopt the concept of 'magic underwear' and simmer down?

or smoke weed which btw should be legalized which if im not mistaken clinton hinted or let voters think that he would but im off topic here and looks like im semi hijacking this thread lol

[elsid13]

TRIPOLI (Reuters) - Libyan authorities have made four arrests in the investigation into the attack on the U.S. consulate in Benghazi in which the U.S. ambassador and three embassy staff were killed, the deputy interior minister said on Thursday.


"Four men are in custody and we are interrogating them because they are suspected of helping instigate the events at the U.S. consulate," Wanis Sharif told Reuters.
He gave no more details.


U.S. ambassador to Libya Christopher Stevens and three other Americans died after the gunmen attacked the U.S. consulate and a safe house refuge in the eastern city of Benghazi on Tuesday night. The attackers were part of a mob blaming America for a film they said insulted the Prophet Mohammad.


http://news.yahoo.com/libya-makes-ar...175308342.html

[TonyR]

Commenting on the ridiculous notion that this picking on poor Mitt Romney is a case of media bias:

The media focused on Mitt Romney yesterday because Mitt Romney asked them to. If he had merely issued a formal statement expressing outrage at the mobs in Cairo and Benghazi, the media would have focused on the aspects of this ongoing story that Erickson finds so interesting — effectively, as Daniel Larison observed via Twitter, it would have done Romney’s work for him.

http://www.theamericanconservative.c...unforced-error

[houghtam]

Originally Posted by DAN_BRONCO_FAN

did it happen would we Americans let it happen i think not

I'm not sure which trailer park you were home-schooled in, but they apparently didn't teach you even the very basics of American History, let alone grammar and punctuation.

Not sure if you heard about this little war we fought oh, about 150 years ago? There was a lot of religious justification for slavery. Read Noah’s Curse: The Biblical Justification of American Slavery, it's got footnotes and quotes and everything, just like your English teacher (or mom) would have liked.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Originally Posted by houghtam

I'm not sure which trailer park you were home-schooled in, but they apparently didn't teach you even the very basics of American History, let alone grammar and punctuation.

In other words, he's the poster boy for the GOP base.

[Blart]

[mhgaffney]

Originally Posted by DAN_BRONCO_FAN

again in short westbro disgusting pos but they dont act violent
islam the ones in Pakistan Afghanistan Egypt Syria all other Islamic dominated countries who aint under the control of a strong government go well ape shat you seen them do it right . or are you blind
i say lets take away their foreign aid to all of em

Why not just stop bombing and attacking them...?

[mhgaffney]

The hate film was produced by a US hard core Zionist -- for the purpose of insulting Muslims. If a person sets out to incite hatred -- he will very likely succeed in at least pissing off people on the other side who are very much like him.

Obviously that happened in this case.

Isn't incitement a hate crime? Don't we have laws against incitement? Evidently the producer of the film has gone into hiding. But is he hiding from US law enforcement- - or from angry Muslims? Not sure which.

MHG


Israeli Filmmaker in Hiding After Deadly Protests

By Associated Press

September 12, 2012 "AP" -- An Israeli filmmaker based in California went into hiding Tuesday after his movie attacking Islam's Prophet Muhammad sparked angry assaults by ultra-conservative Muslims on U.S. missions in Egypt and Libya, where a U.S. ambassador and three other Americans were killed.

Speaking by phone from an undisclosed location, writer and director Sam Bacile remained defiant, saying Islam is a cancer and that the 56-year-old intended his film to be a provocative political statement condemning the religion.

Protesters angered over Bacile's film opened fire on and burned down the U.S. Consulate in the eastern Libyan city of Benghazi, killing U.S. Ambassador Christopher Stevens and three others on Tuesday. In Egypt, protesters scaled the walls of the U.S. Embassy in Cairo and replaced an American flag with an Islamic banner.

"This is a political movie," said Bacile. "The U.S. lost a lot of money and a lot of people in wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, but we're fighting with ideas."

Bacile, a California real estate developer who identifies himself as an Israeli Jew, said he believes the movie will help his native land by exposing Islam's flaws to the world.

"Islam is a cancer, period," he said repeatedly, his solemn voice thickly accented.

The two-hour movie, "Innocence of Muslims," cost $5 million to make and was financed with the help of more than 100 Jewish donors, said Bacile, who wrote and directed it.

The film claims Muhammad was a fraud. An English-language 13-minute trailer on YouTube shows an amateur cast performing a wooden dialogue of insults disguised as revelations about Muhammad, whose obedient followers are presented as a cadre of goons.

It depicts Muhammad as a feckless philanderer who approved of child sexual abuse, among other overtly insulting claims that have caused outrage.

Muslims find it offensive to depict Muhammad in any manner, let alone insult the prophet. A Danish newspaper's 2005 publication of 12 caricatures of the prophet triggered riots in many Muslim countries.

Though Bacile was apologetic about Americans who were killed as a result of the outrage over his film, he blamed lax embassy security and the perpetrators of the violence.

"I feel the security system (at the embassies) is no good," said Bacile. "America should do something to change it."

A consultant on the film, Steve Klein, said the filmmaker is concerned for family members who live in Egypt. Bacile declined to confirm.

Klein said he vowed to help Bacile make the movie but warned him that "you're going to be the next Theo van Gogh." Van Gogh was a Dutch filmmaker killed by a Muslim extremist in 2004 after making a film that was perceived as insulting to Islam.

"We went into this knowing this was probably going to happen," Klein said.

Bacile's film was dubbed into Egyptian Arabic by someone he doesn't know, but he speaks enough Arabic to confirm that the translation is accurate. It was made in three months in the summer of 2011, with 59 actors and about 45 people behind the camera.

The full film has been shown once, to a mostly empty theater in Hollywood earlier this year, said Bacile.

[nyuk nyuk]

Good on those protesters, I hope they aren't persecuted for that. What sect are they from?

One thing about those pictures, though. Where are the men in Islamic dress? Imams? They always show up in hordes when it comes time to burn some flags.

[nyuk nyuk]

Originally Posted by L.A. BRONCOS FAN

In other words, he's the poster boy for the GOP base.

Check those IQ scores again, brother.

[nyuk nyuk]

Originally Posted by mhgaffney

The hate film was produced by a US hard core Zionist -- for the purpose of insulting Muslims. If a person sets out to incite hatred -- he will very likely succeed in at least pissing off people on the other side who are very much like him.

Obviously that happened in this case.

Isn't incitement a hate crime? Don't we have laws against incitement? Evidently the producer of the film has gone into hiding. But is he hiding from US law enforcement- - or from angry Muslims? Not sure which.

I don't think speaking the obvious about a religion is either incitement or a hate crime - but then again simply offending certain groups is considered both, as if they have a special right to not be offended which overrides the right of free expression.

There are countless vids on YouTube of people insulting Muslims in every way imaginable, just as there are countless vids there of Muslims insulting everyone else in every way imaginable.

We should not allow Muslim chimpouts to dictate our right to free speech. If we do so we cave in to fear of violence (from a self-declared peaceful religion, no less) and allow theocratic hoodlums dictate our basic rights.

If you wouldn't allow Christians to dictate your right to free speech, why would you let Muslims?

[ant1999e]

The only thing left to do is

[Rigs11]

[DenverBrit]

Originally Posted by DBruleU

Ally = Friend. You can look it up in the dictionary if you want to.

The blunder was unfortunately the Egyptians elected a group that does not view us favorably in the least. The Arab Spring hasn't ended the way Obama wanted it to.

It's about context. In political terms, a country who is an Ally, is not necessarily a friend....or vice versa. Soviet Union comes to mind. A friend, diplomatically, means we are not at war with them.

I'm sure Obama....and the West, would prefer a pro western democracy, without a Muslim Brotherhood history. But we have no control over their election, only how we respond to the outcome.

So what should Obama have said?? We are still allies of Egypt?? I'm not sure what it is you find wrong with his statement, it has been praised by both parties.

The same two parties that have condemned Romney's ignorance. So they must be right.

[houghtam]

Originally Posted by DenverBrit

It's about context. In political terms, a country who is an Ally, is not necessarily a friend....or vice versa. Soviet Union comes to mind. A friend, diplomatically, means we are not at war with them.

I'm sure Obama....and the West, would prefer a pro western democracy, without a Muslim Brotherhood history. But we have no control over their election, only how we respond to the outcome.

So what should Obama have said?? We are still allies of Egypt?? I'm not sure what it is you find wrong with his statement, it has been praised by both parties.

The same two parties that have condemned Romney's ignorance. So they must be right.

another dictionary scholar who doesn't know how to use a dictionary. If "ally = friend, you can even look it up in the dictionary", then the dictionary would read:

al·ly
   noun
1. A friend.

Instead, we open the dictionary, flip to the a's, aaaaaaaaaaaaand...

al·ly
   noun
1. a person, group, or nation that is associated with another or others for some common cause or purpose: Canada and the United States were allies in World War II.
2. Biology . a plant, animal, or other organism bearing an evolutionary relationship to another, often as a member of the same family: The squash is an ally of the watermelon.
3. a person who associates or cooperates with another; supporter.

#priceisrightfailuremusic

And yes, Brit, you're absolutely correct. USSR and the US were allies in WWII. They were not friends. Japan, Germany and Italy were allies in WWII. They were not friends.

Ally =/= friend.

[DenverBrit]

It's pretty basic English, so I didn't need to look up that big word, especially in a political context.

[nyuk nyuk]

Originally Posted by DenverBrit

All religion needs to keep up with the times.

Unfortunately, religious fundamentalism is determined to keep their followers in the dark ages.
I can't explain why some Muslims are bent on rabid violence; most Mullahs will tell you they are 'corrupting' the Koran.
I've never read the Koran, so I don't know....but it is an expansionist religion.

Why can't they all adopt the concept of 'magic underwear' and simmer down?

That would mean loosening values to accommodate lefty social movements. I don't think they should do that. Certainly the political left have never been asked to truncate their belief system to accommodate the religious.

If you can't explain why some Muslims are bent on violence... Perhaps you'd find that answer by reading some Quran? The expansionism and violence begin within it.

[houghtam]

Interesting.

I don't have the links quite yet, but several news sources are now reporting that there was a peaceful protest outside the gates to the embassy. Then a 4 car caravan pulling up with black Islamic flags and heavily armed occupants rolls down the street, busts through the gates, and goes through all four single-story buildings in the compound, shooting the place up.

NPR is reporting "A lot of the witnesses that we've spoken to — neighbors, the son of the landlord, a Libyan guard who was wounded during the first part of the attack on Tuesday night — all say there was no protest at all," Leila reports. "They say that it began as an organized attack on the consulate."

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/...nghazi-planned

More later.

[nyuk nyuk]

Originally Posted by Rigs11

Did the cartoonist run out of brown ink?

[nyuk nyuk]

Originally Posted by houghtam

Interesting.

I don't have the links quite yet, but several news sources are now reporting that there was a peaceful protest outside the gates to the embassy. Then a 4 car caravan pulling up with black Islamic flags and heavily armed occupants rolls down the street, busts through the gates, and goes through all four single-story buildings in the compound, shooting the place up.

NPR is reporting "A lot of the witnesses that we've spoken to — neighbors, the son of the landlord, a Libyan guard who was wounded during the first part of the attack on Tuesday night — all say there was no protest at all," Leila reports. "They say that it began as an organized attack on the consulate."

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/...nghazi-planned

More later.

This is not new, but unfortunately the media asses are choosing to hype the YouTube BS.

9-11 anniversary. It's not hard to piece together.

Further - it was reported that threats were known specifically to that area, and yet these men were left in a consulate with little security.

This is scandalous as all hell.

[DenverBrit]

Originally Posted by nyuk nyuk

That would mean loosening values to accommodate lefty social movements. I don't think they should do that. Certainly the political left have never been asked to truncate their belief system to accommodate the religious.

If you can't explain why some Muslims are bent on violence... Perhaps you'd find that answer by reading some Quran? The expansionism and violence begin within it.

Ok, I can't begin to respond to your first paragraph........because it makes no sense. Unless you think fundamentalism is some kind of far right wing movement.

As for your second, are you claiming that all Muslims are terrorists and favor violence?? I have already acknowledge that Islam is expansionist, however, only 'fundamentalists' follow those archaic extremes.
Much like Christian 'fundamentalist' who's beliefs are rooted in the literal adherence to the Old Testament.

Again, Fundamentalism keeps its adherents in the dark ages.........actually, long before.

[nyuk nyuk]

Originally Posted by DenverBrit

Ok, I can't begin to respond to your first paragraph........because it makes no sense. Unless you think fundamentalism is some kind of far right wing movement.

As for your second, are you claiming that all Muslims are terrorists and favor violence?? I have already acknowledge that Islam is expansionist, however, only 'fundamentalists' follow those archaic extremes.
Much like Christian 'fundamentalist' who's beliefs are rooted in the literal adherence to the Old Testament.

Again, Fundamentalism keeps its adherents in the dark ages.........actually, long before.

It makes perfect sense when you consider that "keeping up with the times" often involves internalizing secular liberal humanistic values and generally leading a lifestyle of hyperindividualist impulse-driven narcissism. I don't think religions should be caving in to garbage like this, yet at least to a degree that's exactly what some are doing, even if that means not being faithful to scriptures. There are plenty of ways in which religion (mainstream, at least) has a solid and appropriate foundation for societal stability, but unfortunately all too often narcissism is so strong in people that they react knee-jerk fashion to anything that asks for self-sacrifice, putting off gratification, or calls for traditional forms of civic duty.

Extremism can come from either direction, and they're both a danger. Though in the Western world, fundamentalist Christian views are obviously nowhere near as dangerous as Islamic ones, and in my opinion, are overall more healthy for society than secular humanism. I think the Islamic world could benefit greatly by being evangelized by Christians and it would help stem the problem of violent Jihad.

Clearly there are shades of violence within Islam, but I believe that Western apologists overstate the numbers of Muslims (especially in the Islamic world) who are more modernized and against terrorist activity. I'd also point out that there are more pacifistic Muslims who are persecuted to the point of violence by other Muslims for heresy - in part due to their unorthodox views on Jihad. The Ahmadiyya sect are among them.

Safe to say that if a religion allows "apostates" within it to be slaughtered, then reasonable expectations of behavior with outsiders are pretty much thrown out the window. On that account alone, to me the problem becomes Islam itself. Part of the problem is that the concept of modernization is tied to Westernization, and that's going to breed hostility.

In the Islamic world, obviously the atmosphere is very repressive. The question for us in modern times is that is the Islamic religion not this extremist, or is it merely that we're not seeing so many outbursts of this extremism due to Islam's weak military position in the world and thus the general unwillingness of the Muslims in more numbers of stick their necks out and participate? In times past, certainly, when Islam had the upper hand, they marched from West Africa to South Asia, and had volunteers all too willingly line up for loot and booty. Islamic terrorist activity and other forms of religious strife with other groups have gone on Asia for a very long time. Imagine what it would be like there if Muslims found themselves in political control there. I think we'd pretty much see a repeat of history."