The oakland raiders suck!

[Crushaholic]

Tamba Hali is the best player on the Chiefs. I know some Chiefs fans who were panicking about the Hali re-signing delay...

[KCStud]

Originally Posted by Drek

Only because Doom missed 2010 as well as two games in 2011. If you add Doom's '09 and '11 seasons he has as many sacks as Hali, but with two fewer games played.


And Hali still isn't nearly as good in coverage or overall run defense as Miller was as a rookie. So if all that matters from a LB is pass rush then Hali has the edge or the time being. But if a LB is expected to be a versatile player then Miller is already a better player.

Hali and Doom are comparable players who just play in different fronts. Miller is an all around more disruptive player than Doom on the same squad.

Tamba doesn't play in coverage in our scheme. That's his biggest flaw and the coaches hide it well by playing in the nickel.

I think Miller is a better all around player right now, but last year he struggled against the run while Tamba was solid. I think Tamba was the better pass rusher and run stopper at the end of last year.

But then again Miller didn't have an offseason, so I fully expect him to be a better all around player right now. I don't know if he's a better pass rusher though. That's pretty close.

[cutthemdown]

I don't have a problem with Miller not being ranked number 1. He missed games, he was great behind the LOS which got him noticed. All his big plays were sacks, or slicing in and making a nice run stop behind the LOS.

He still has to get better at his angles in the run game when he can't just blow the play up. Sometimes you have to pursue through traffic and make a play, or guard a TE or RB, those things he still can improve on. Then if he does, and still gets sacks, we can say he is one of the best in the NFL.

The good news is pressure on the QB is the most important thing. So if you are going to be a one trick pony, that is a good pony to ride.

[KCStud]

Hell Justin Houston could be #1 on this list in the future. He was an absolute steal last year.

[ZachKC]

Originally Posted by Shananahan

Nobody needs to play devil's advocate. There's nothing too ridiculous about Hali being #1, and most of the people here would be shocked and outraged if he were on our team and ranked lower.

I'm not sure he's really a 'true' linebacker like Miller can probably be, but that's where he plays.

Yea. Hali is a total beast but he does play a strange hybrid style and calling him a true LB isn't wrong but he is unique.

He is really really strong against the run as well. All over the field.

[cutthemdown]

Skipping to dbacks I think Broncos secondary coupled with Doom and Miller is all we need to make big plays of defense. Tracy Porter has way more speed at his age 25, then Goodman had last 3 yrs. He can play zone and man to man and is a good solid tackler. Bailey is still one of the best in the NFL. Harris looks like he can play some and Florence decent for depth. Adams at safety is a good move. Steady player that won't make mistakes. If Moore or Carter can improve the Broncos would have a really solid secondary. Good coverage, good pass rush, can maybe make up for avg dt rotation IMO.

[Bronco Rob]

Originally Posted by cutthemdown

Skipping to dbacks I think Broncos secondary coupled with Doom and Miller is all we need to make big plays of defense. Tracy Porter has way more speed at his age 25, then Goodman had last 3 yrs. He can play zone and man to man and is a good solid tackler. Bailey is still one of the best in the NFL. Harris looks like he can play some and Florence decent for depth. Adams at safety is a good move. Steady player that won't make mistakes. If Moore or Carter can improve the Broncos would have a really solid secondary. Good coverage, good pass rush, can maybe make up for avg dt rotation IMO.

Not to mention the addition of Jack Del Rio and playing with an acutal lead.

[Doggcow]

I'd argue Miller is the best OLB in the league, this list is crap.

[JJG]

Originally Posted by Doggcow

I'd argue Miller is the best OLB in the league, this list is crap.

maybe we should wait more than one year before crowning him. He's on the way, but not there yet

[cutthemdown]

I feel good about agreeing Miller goes on to be mentioned with the very best linebackers. The other players seem to gush about his ability to get to the quarterback. He's a special player I think. Hali a fine player but I think Miller soars above him eventually.

[KCStud]

Originally Posted by Doggcow

I'd argue Miller is the best OLB in the league, this list is crap.

It can be argued that Von Miller isn't even the best OLB in his own draft class.

[Kaylore]

Originally Posted by KCStud

It can be argued that Von Miller isn't even the best OLB in his own draft class.

lemme guess! The real one is on the Chiefs!

[KCStud]

Originally Posted by Kaylore

lemme guess! The real one is on the Chiefs!

Justin Houston, Aldon Smith, Ryan Kerrigan.

[DENVERDUI55]

Originally Posted by KCStud

Justin Houston, Aldon Smith, Ryan Kerrigan.

Now that is comical. Kerrigan and Houston really? You could make an argument right now for Smith but the other two? I wouldn't expect anything else from you though.

[KCStud]

Originally Posted by DENVERDUI55

Now that is comical. Kerrigan and Houston really? You could make an argument right now for Smith but the other two? I wouldn't expect anything else from you though.

Houston started in the 2nd half of the season and tore it up. Let's see how he compared to Von's 2nd half.

Miller: 38 tackles, 5.5 sacks, 5.5 stuffs
Houston: 35 tackles, 5.5 sacks, 3 stuffs

Looks pretty similar to me, except Houston is a better run defender. Von had 41 run stops last year starting 15 games. Houston had 32 run stops starting 10.

Houston was also 4th in the NFL drawing 6 holding penalties.

But you guys are right. Houston couldn't hold Von's jock.

[Hercules Rockefeller]

Von missed a game and played with a club on his right hand because of injury and still out performed Houston during that stretch. Try again troll.

[R-Mac]

Originally Posted by KCStud

Justin Houston, Aldon Smith, Ryan Kerrigan.

Von Miller: 64 tackles, 50 solo, 21 TFL, 11.5 sacks, 4 PDef, 2 FF

Justin Houston: 56 tackles, 46 solo, 10 TFL, 5.5 sacks, 4 PDef, 1 FF

Aldon Smith: 37 tackles, 31 solo, 15 TFL, 14 sacks, 4 PDef, 2 FF

Ryan Kerrigan: 63 tackles, 41 solo, 9 TFL, 7.5 sacks, 4 PDef, 1 Int, 4 FF

The only player here that can challenge Miller as a complete OLB is Kerrigan, and he is 4 sacks behind Miller.

Miller is 6 sacks ahead of Houston, and has 2x more tackles for loss.

Smith was a pass rusher, 2.5 sacks ahead of Miller, but with 27 less tackles and 19 less solo tackles.

Miller made an impact against the run and the pass, with different responsibilities on 1st, 2nd and 3rd down. Smith was more productive as a pass rusher, but he started zero games and was not a complete OLB like Von Miller.

I don't know why Von Miller would not be the best OLB in his draft class so far.

Link to TFL:

http://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/play...ckles-for-loss

[KCStud]

Some of you need to realize that Von needs work on his run defending. There's more to being an OLB then racking up sacks.

[R-Mac]

Originally Posted by KCStud

Some of you need to realize that Von needs work on his run defending. There's more to being an OLB then racking up sacks.

Besides racking up sacks, Miller led all rookies in tackles for loss.

Actually, he was 3rd in the NFL in TFL with 21, behind JPP and Ware (both with 26).

[Bronco Rob]

Originally Posted by KCStud

Some of you need to realize that Von needs work on his run defending. There's more to being an OLB then racking up sacks.

Just ask DT (Doesn't Tackle) derrick thomas about that....

[KCStud]

Originally Posted by Bronco Rob

Just ask DT (Doesn't Tackle) derrick thomas about that....

Von will never be able to hold DT's jock, so don't even start with that baloney.

[JJG]

Originally Posted by KCStud

Von will never be able to hold DT's jock, so don't even start with that baloney.

in what way?
rushing the passer?
coverage?
stopping the run?

[KCStud]

Originally Posted by JJG

in what way?
rushing the passer?
coverage?
stopping the run?

This

[Bronco Rob]

Originally Posted by KCStud

Von will never be able to hold DT's jock, so don't even start with that baloney.

dt had 601 career tackles and one interception.

No worries..


Derrick Thomas didn't play the run or the pass.

He was surrounded by talented players and focal point of the defenses in Kansas City.

He has 601 career tackles.

He has 1 I repeat 1 career interception.

He only led the NFL in sacks once. (1990)

In the biggest game of his career (a drubbing by the Bills) he was on the bench.

He never took his team to the next level. (3 career playoff victories)

[DENVERDUI55]

Originally Posted by KCStud

Houston started in the 2nd half of the season and tore it up. Let's see how he compared to Von's 2nd half.

Miller: 38 tackles, 5.5 sacks, 5.5 stuffs
Houston: 35 tackles, 5.5 sacks, 3 stuffs

Looks pretty similar to me, except Houston is a better run defender. Von had 41 run stops last year starting 15 games. Houston had 32 run stops starting 10.

Houston was also 4th in the NFL drawing 6 holding penalties.

But you guys are right. Houston couldn't hold Von's jock.

So you cherry pick stats where Miller was injured? Typical chiefs fan using stats to argue. Houston was getting zero double teams where Miller faced double teams and was on one hand and still effective. Yeah Dumervil had strong finish of the year when Miller was getting double teamed. How much was Houston getting mentioned in DROTY?