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Old 05-21-2012, 12:45 PM   #151
houghtam
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Originally Posted by DBroncos4life View Post
Sorry I didn't know you was that big of a troll.
Imagine you buy a cellphone from a certain company. This company is well-known for having good cell phones, maybe not the greatest, but it's won its fair share of awards. Let's say after being a loyal customer for years, they install a new operating system, find out it sucks, but stick with it a really long time. They finally replace it for one that doesn't have all the bells and whistles, but does what you need it to do. Meanwhile, the case falls apart, the screen cracks, but it never drops calls and does what it needs to. What does the cellphone company do? They replace the OS. Well the new OS isn't compatible with a lot of stuff on the market and has a lot of bugs, a lot of which the tekkies think can be improved. But instead, a new CEO comes in and gets rid of that OS. The new one is just awful, but there's another one waiting in the wings that, although it's rough around the edges, still manages to get the job done. New CEO comes in, meanwhile, the case is still falling apart, the screen still cracks, and the phone is just a total POS. What does the new CEO do? Scrap the OS again and add a different OS that some consider the best of all time. Phone still sucks, but man it looks cool.

How long would you stick with that company? I'm a consumer of the Denver Broncos. I'm a fan, but I'm also a consumer. If I don't agree with the way a company is being run, I have every right to spend my money elsewhere, or not at all.

You also have every right to criticize me, but it won't change anything, and only makes you look like someone trying to be a superfan.
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Old 05-21-2012, 12:51 PM   #152
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Originally Posted by houghtam View Post
Imagine you buy a cellphone from a certain company. This company is well-known for having good cell phones, maybe not the greatest, but it's won its fair share of awards. Let's say after being a loyal customer for years, they install a new operating system, find out it sucks, but stick with it a really long time. They finally replace it for one that doesn't have all the bells and whistles, but does what you need it to do. Meanwhile, the case falls apart, the screen cracks, but it never drops calls and does what it needs to. What does the cellphone company do? They replace the OS. Well the new OS isn't compatible with a lot of stuff on the market and has a lot of bugs, a lot of which the tekkies think can be improved. But instead, a new CEO comes in and gets rid of that OS. The new one is just awful, but there's another one waiting in the wings that, although it's rough around the edges, still manages to get the job done. New CEO comes in, meanwhile, the case is still falling apart, the screen still cracks, and the phone is just a total POS. What does the new CEO do? Scrap the OS again and add a different OS that some consider the best of all time. Phone still sucks, but man it looks cool.

How long would you stick with that company? I'm a consumer of the Denver Broncos. I'm a fan, but I'm also a consumer. If I don't agree with the way a company is being run, I have every right to spend my money elsewhere, or not at all.

You also have every right to criticize me, but it won't change anything, and only makes you look like someone trying to be a superfan.
Me calling you a troll for not want the team to be successful doesn't make me a super fan.
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Old 05-21-2012, 12:51 PM   #153
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Imagine you buy a cellphone from a certain company.......
How long would you stick with that company? I'm a consumer of the Denver Broncos. I'm a fan, but I'm also a consumer. If I don't agree with the way a company is being run, I have every right to spend my money elsewhere, or not at all.

You also have every right to criticize me, but it won't change anything, and only makes you look like someone trying to be a superfan.
Bad analogy IMO. Boycotting a company that wrongs you is one thing. Boycotting the Mane, which has zero relation to said company that you believe is wronging you, are two completely different things.
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Old 05-21-2012, 12:53 PM   #154
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Bad analogy IMO. Boycotting a company that wrongs you is one thing. Boycotting the Mane, which has zero relation to said company that you believe is wronging you, are two completely different things.
Plus he didn't have to sign a long term contract to be a fan!
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Old 05-21-2012, 12:54 PM   #155
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Imagine you buy a cellphone from a certain company. This company is well-known for having good cell phones, maybe not the greatest, but it's won its fair share of awards. Let's say after being a loyal customer for years, they install a new operating system, find out it sucks, but stick with it a really long time. They finally replace it for one that doesn't have all the bells and whistles, but does what you need it to do. Meanwhile, the case falls apart, the screen cracks, but it never drops calls and does what it needs to. What does the cellphone company do? They replace the OS. Well the new OS isn't compatible with a lot of stuff on the market and has a lot of bugs, a lot of which the tekkies think can be improved. But instead, a new CEO comes in and gets rid of that OS. The new one is just awful, but there's another one waiting in the wings that, although it's rough around the edges, still manages to get the job done. New CEO comes in, meanwhile, the case is still falling apart, the screen still cracks, and the phone is just a total POS. What does the new CEO do? Scrap the OS again and add a different OS that some consider the best of all time. Phone still sucks, but man it looks cool.

How long would you stick with that company? I'm a consumer of the Denver Broncos. I'm a fan, but I'm also a consumer. If I don't agree with the way a company is being run, I have every right to spend my money elsewhere, or not at all.

You also have every right to criticize me, but it won't change anything, and only makes you look like someone trying to be a superfan.
That's such an exaggeration and horrible comparison. There's turnover everywhere in life guy. The Colts just dumped the GOAT for a bells and whistles type fresh model. Guess who happens to be the beneficiary? The Denver Broncos! You need to look at it like they just got an older muscle car, with a brand new engine. If your not a Tebow fan, you should be ecstatic Denver has Peyton. The SBs are coming!
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Old 05-21-2012, 12:56 PM   #156
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Me calling you a troll for not want the team to be successful doesn't make me a super fan.
How have I demonstrated that I don't want the team to be successful?

The bolded part of my post that you quoted was a response to Shanahanahanan...he said I should stop posting, and I told him that if he wants me to stop, he should root for the Broncos not to win a playoff game, not me.

I will be rooting for the Broncos just like anyone else this year. I just have an ultimatum that the team will have to live up to this year in order for them to continue to receive my money. I've got another kid on the way now and only one income coming in anyway...I'm sure I can find better things to spend my money on, if need be. If that makes me a troll, then so be it.
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Old 05-21-2012, 12:59 PM   #157
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Bad analogy IMO. Boycotting a company that wrongs you is one thing. Boycotting the Mane, which has zero relation to said company that you believe is wronging you, are two completely different things.
Really? Two completely different things? Would the Mane exist without the Broncos? Would you be here if it weren't a Broncos message board? I'll stop posting because I won't be following or supporting the Broncos anymore. I'm not just going to quit posting here and continue supporting the Broncos in private.

Edit: And come on, Beantown. You and several others on this board have known me since long before I joined the Mane. You can even use ten year old posts from the old board if you need to, but am I someone you would describe as "reactionary?" No. I defended Shanahan for years until I finally got fed up. I own a freaking Cutler jersey. I was for giving McDaniels a shot until, well, we know how that ended.

It's finally come to a head. I'm fed up. It really couldn't get any simpler.

Last edited by houghtam; 05-21-2012 at 01:04 PM..
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Old 05-21-2012, 01:03 PM   #158
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Really? Two completely different things? Would the Mane exist without the Broncos? Would you be here if it weren't a Broncos message board? I'll stop posting because I won't be following or supporting the Broncos anymore. I'm not just going to quit posting here and continue supporting the Broncos in private.
I'm talking financially....like you supposedly are above.

I haven't supported the NFL financially since the lockout began. Not one penny. Before that, I was spending between $1,000 and $3,000 per year on Sunday ticket, merchandise and game tix depending on if it was a "Denver road trip" year and if they were playing here in NE.

I don't spend a penny. But I still post here.
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Old 05-21-2012, 01:06 PM   #159
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I'm talking financially....like you supposedly are above.

I haven't supported the NFL financially since the lockout began. Not one penny. Before that, I was spending between $1,000 and $3,000 per year on Sunday ticket, merchandise and game tix depending on if it was a "Denver road trip" year and if they were playing here in NE.

I don't spend a penny. But I still post here.
If you watch Broncos games, you're still supporting the NFL and the team.
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Old 05-21-2012, 01:07 PM   #160
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Del Rio is running a similar scheme as Benedict Allen, doesn't mean its the same. Del Rio's track record is a whole lot stronger and more consistent than Allen, who was very hit and miss last year.

He's as big an addition as you could ask for on defense.
I agree. The FO has pretty much upgraded as much as they possibly could in the offseason (with the exception of NT). Hopefully the Defense can be special.



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At LB we're going to see what Nate Irving has. If the FO was right to draft him in the 3rd and everything comes together for him this year we might be talking about a long term starter upgrade at MLB pulled from effectively out of nowhere.
Mays is the starter.

1. You don't pay a guy $4M per year to sit the bench.
2. And you definitely don't pay a Mays $4M per year (for 3 years) if Irving had shown any indication that he could start at MLB in the NFL.
3. You also don't sign 2 UDFA's who can play MLB, if you thought Irving was starting MLB material.
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Old 05-21-2012, 01:10 PM   #161
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If you watch Broncos games, you're still supporting the NFL and the team.
That's not true. Not financially, at least.....unless you are in a Nielsen home. I am not.
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Old 05-21-2012, 01:10 PM   #162
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Imagine you buy a cellphone from a certain company. This company is well-known for having good cell phones, maybe not the greatest, but it's won its fair share of awards. Let's say after being a loyal customer for years, they install a new operating system, find out it sucks, but stick with it a really long time. They finally replace it for one that doesn't have all the bells and whistles, but does what you need it to do. Meanwhile, the case falls apart, the screen cracks, but it never drops calls and does what it needs to. What does the cellphone company do? They replace the OS. Well the new OS isn't compatible with a lot of stuff on the market and has a lot of bugs, a lot of which the tekkies think can be improved. But instead, a new CEO comes in and gets rid of that OS. The new one is just awful, but there's another one waiting in the wings that, although it's rough around the edges, still manages to get the job done. New CEO comes in, meanwhile, the case is still falling apart, the screen still cracks, and the phone is just a total POS. What does the new CEO do? Scrap the OS again and add a different OS that some consider the best of all time. Phone still sucks, but man it looks cool.

How long would you stick with that company? I'm a consumer of the Denver Broncos. I'm a fan, but I'm also a consumer. If I don't agree with the way a company is being run, I have every right to spend my money elsewhere, or not at all.

You also have every right to criticize me, but it won't change anything, and only makes you look like someone trying to be a superfan.
Imagine growing up a Bronco fan.
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Old 05-21-2012, 01:12 PM   #163
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I agree. The FO has pretty much upgraded as much as they possibly could in the offseason (with the exception of NT). Hopefully the Defense can be special.





Mays is the starter.

1. You don't pay a guy $4M per year to sit the bench.
2. And you definitely don't pay a Mays $4M per year (for 3 years) if Irving had shown any indication that he could start at MLB in the NFL.
3. You also don't sign 2 UDFA's who can play MLB, if you thought Irving was starting MLB material.
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Old 05-21-2012, 01:12 PM   #164
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Imagine growing up a Bronco fan.
I don't have to imagine it. I did.
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Old 05-21-2012, 01:14 PM   #165
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I don't have to imagine it. I did.
Then what the hell are you talking about?
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Old 05-21-2012, 01:14 PM   #166
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That's not true. Not financially, at least.....unless you are in a Nielsen home. I am not.
Then you are underestimating the affect commercials have on you. If you didn't spend money because of advertising that you see, there would be no reason to advertise during Broncos games, or anywhere else for that matter.

Unless, let me guess, you're one of those people that "commercials don't affect me?"
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Old 05-21-2012, 01:15 PM   #167
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Then what the hell are you talking about?
So if you grew up a fan, you can't get fed up with your team? Got it. Thanks for clearing that up, superfan.
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Old 05-21-2012, 01:17 PM   #168
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If Dumervil and Miller can both stay healthy this season, that will be another huge upgrade over last season.
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Old 05-21-2012, 01:21 PM   #169
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Then you are underestimating the affect commercials have on you. If you didn't spend money because of advertising that you see, there would be no reason to advertise during Broncos games, or anywhere else for that matter.

Unless, let me guess, you're one of those people that "commercials don't affect me?"
They don't. I don't watch the games live for the most part. I record and tivo through the commercials. But let's pretend I don't. The goal of their commercials is to get you to buy their products. To do that, they must be memorable.

Of those that I've actually watched, the only sponsors I can even remember are:

beer companies like Bud light, miller lite, coors light and dos equis. I don't buy any of these beers, with the exception of dos equis for my annual cinco de mayo party. NFL has zero role in this purchase.

Car companies. Same here. My current cars have never been advertised during an NFL game.

Coke, pepsi and specific snacks like doritos, fritos and chips? I honestly don't buy these items at all, and I'm the primary grocery shopper in my house.

I could go on.

[Edit: I just checked a few websites for "top nfl sponsors" and the following, in addition to what I mentioned above, seem to round out the top __ lists:

Hotel (Marriott) - never stayed in one that I know of
Wireless service provider (Verizon) - never had them. I've had AT&T pre-merger and now Virgin Mobile
Credit card (Visa) - I actually dumped my "official Broncos Visa" last year
Pizza (Papa John's) - don't have one anywhere near me
Shipping services (FedEx) - our firm requires this when overnight shipping is required, not because of nfl sponsorship
Automotive (General Motors) - never owned one
Sports/energy drink (Gatorade) - don't drink this...burns a hole in my stomach

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Old 05-21-2012, 01:25 PM   #170
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They don't. I don't watch the games live for the most part. I record and tivo through the commercials. But let's pretend I don't. The goal of their commercials is to get you to buy their products. To do that, they must be memorable.

Of those that I've actually watched, the only sponsors I can even remember are:

beer companies like Bud light, miller lite, coors light and dos equis. I don't buy any of these beers, with the exception of dos equis for my annual cinco de mayo party. NFL has zero role in this purchase.

Car companies. Same here. My current cars have never been advertised during an NFL game.

Coke, pepsi and specific snacks like doritos, fritos and chips? I honestly don't buy these items at all, and I'm the primary grocery shopper in my house.

I could go on.
Gotcha.

That puts you in with the other 75% of people who think advertising doesn't affect them. Yet those marketing budgets keep getting higher and higher. That other 25% must do a lot of spending.
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Old 05-21-2012, 01:30 PM   #171
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Just to be clear, houghtam, your opinion is that Denver is a worse team right now than they were last year, yes?
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Old 05-21-2012, 01:34 PM   #172
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Gotcha.

That puts you in with the other 75% of people who think advertising doesn't affect them. Yet those marketing budgets keep getting higher and higher. That other 25% must do a lot of spending.
Look. It's a chicken or the egg argument. There's no doubt people do a lot of spending on those items. They're popular. Why? Is it because they advertise during the nfl? Or is it because they advertise during everything? Or is it because they buy up prime real estate in the stores that carry them? Or is it because they circulate coupons? Is it because people's parents bought them growing up, so it's all they know?

There's no way to prove that if a company spends xx dollars on ads during the NFL, they will get xx dollars back in revenue.

For me, it comes down to this: if Bud Light DIDN'T spend the usual $50 mil or whatever it is they spend on each SB, their revenue wouldn't go down by a penny IMO.
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Old 05-21-2012, 01:38 PM   #173
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Just to be clear, houghtam, your opinion is that Denver is a worse team right now than they were last year, yes?
I can't say that, which is why I'm giving them this year to show what they can do. What I can say, as I and many others on this board have, is that I don't agree that we were a QB away from a SB, and that the money spent on Manning would have been better spent somewhere else. I also am not of the opinion that a QB like Tebow or an offensive scheme like we ran last year can't be successful in the NFL if surrounded by the right talent.

Why not give them a few years to get the system in place, you ask? Because I've done that. I did with Griese. I did with Plummer. I did with Cutler. I did with Orton. I was going to with Tebow.

Not anymore.
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Old 05-21-2012, 01:41 PM   #174
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So you waited until they acquired a HOF quarterback to lose your patience.

Gotcha.
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Old 05-21-2012, 01:44 PM   #175
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So you waited until they acquired a HOF quarterback to lose your patience.

Gotcha.
yep. That's exactly what happened. When Cutler was creating turnovers in the red zone, the whole time I was thinking "Gee, I can't wait until the Broncos sign a HOF quarterback. Then I'll really be mad!"
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