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Old 05-21-2012, 09:49 AM   #126
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Goodman just visited the Titans. I wouldn't imagine there's much of a market for a #2/Nickel CB who will be 34 when the season starts. He's at the end of his career.

The Broncos definitely needed a younger player, but I think Goodman played pretty well for being opposite of Champ. The Safety pass coverage was pathetic.
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Old 05-21-2012, 09:59 AM   #127
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Goodman just visited the Titans. I wouldn't imagine there's much of a market for a #2/Nickel CB who will be 34 when the season starts. He's at the end of his career.

The Broncos definitely needed a younger player, but I think Goodman played pretty well for being opposite of Champ. The Safety pass coverage was pathetic.
Is it possible both the safety play and Goodman's play was pathetic? I don't seem to recall his being very good at any time during his career. He averages about 2 interceptions a year. I'm not under any delusion that Porter will be much upgrade from him if at all, but Goodman's not that great to begin with.
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Old 05-21-2012, 10:35 AM   #128
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Is it possible both the safety play and Goodman's play was pathetic? I don't seem to recall his being very good at any time during his career. He averages about 2 interceptions a year. I'm not under any delusion that Porter will be much upgrade from him if at all, but Goodman's not that great to begin with.
I completely agree with you. The point I am trying to make is that there are only 4 new starters on the Defense, to go from 25th in points, to top 10 (this year) is going to be tough. But who knows?

1. Goodman -> Porter (minor upgrade)
2. Dawkins -> Adams (minor upgrade pass defense, minor downgrade in run defense)
3. Bunkley -> Bannan (major downgrade in run defense)
4. Thomas/McBean -> Wolfe (upgrade in both pass and run defense)

To me, it looks like the Defense has potentially upgraded at pass defense and potentially downgraded in run defense. Hopefully, with the offseason additions, we can crack the top 5 in sacks, and significantly improve on INT's from 31st.

Is this a top 10 Defense? That would be a stretch. Middle of the pack would be a major improvement from last year, and with the addition of Peyton Manning, could put us in a position to compete for a Superbowl.

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Old 05-21-2012, 10:43 AM   #129
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The point I am trying to make is that there are only 4 new starters on the Defense
Only?

4 new players = 36%. That's pretty significant IMO. And there's certainly the possibility that there's at least one more starter-level move between now and week one.
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Old 05-21-2012, 10:44 AM   #130
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The point I am trying to make is that there are only 4 new starters on the Defense
Only?

4 new players = 36%. That's pretty significant IMO. And there's certainly the possibility that there's at least one more starter-level move between now and week one.
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Old 05-21-2012, 10:49 AM   #131
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to go from 25th in points, to top 10 (this year) is going to be tough.

.....

Is this a top 10 Defense? That would be a stretch. Middle of the pack would be a major improvement from last year
I think Denver's defense is already middle-of-the-pack. Their PPG allowed was inflated due to a few ridiculous blowouts (NE, GB, DET, BUF).

'Average' is the worst-case-scenario, in my opinion.
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Old 05-21-2012, 10:50 AM   #132
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I completely agree with you. The point I am trying to make is that there are only 4 new starters on the Defense, to go from 25th in points, to top 10 (this year) is going to be tough. But who knows?

1. Goodman -> Porter (minor upgrade)
2. Dawkins -> Adams (minor upgrade pass defense, minor downgrade in run defense)
3. Bunkley -> Bannan (major downgrade in run defense)
4. Thomas/McBean -> Wolfe (upgrade in both pass and run defense)

To me, it looks like the Defense has potentially upgraded at pass defense and potentially downgraded in run defense. Hopefully, with the offseason additions, we can crack the top 5 in sacks, and significantly improve on INT's from 31st.

Is this a top 10 Defense? That would be a stretch. Middle of the pack would be a major improvement from last year, and with the addition of Peyton Manning, could put us in a position to compete for a Superbowl.
I'm in agreement with you on that. I see this defense as improving slightly overall, but seriously lacking in the run game. I'd wager we're at 20 or so overall next year, 25 or worse in run defense, and about the middle of the pack in pass defense. I don't think our offense is going to keep offenses off the field as much as people think, and I have a feeling it is going to be us playing from behind, not the other teams.
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Old 05-21-2012, 10:54 AM   #133
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Only?

4 new players = 36%. That's pretty significant IMO. And there's certainly the possibility that there's at least one more starter-level move between now and week one.
How many did they add before last year? Three new starters and several new backups or so.

Change happens. Four new guys isn't that big of a deal, as the foundation remains intact and almost all will potentially upgrade the position.
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Old 05-21-2012, 10:55 AM   #134
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I have a feeling it is going to be us playing from behind, not the other teams.
Just a feeling, huh?
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Old 05-21-2012, 11:02 AM   #135
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The offense isn't going to sputter along as it did all last season. PM at 80% is better than about 90% of the QBs out there.
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Old 05-21-2012, 11:06 AM   #136
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How many did they add before last year? Three new starters and several new backups or so.

Change happens. Four new guys isn't that big of a deal, as the foundation remains intact and almost all will potentially upgrade the position.
Same scheme? Yes
4 new Starters? Yes
Major upgrades? No (with the possible exception of Wolfe at UT)

Almost ALL the improvements will be predicated on Manning's success in moving the football.
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Old 05-21-2012, 11:16 AM   #137
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Same scheme? Yes
4 new Starters? Yes
Major upgrades? No (with the possible exception of Wolfe at UT)

Almost ALL the improvements will be predicated on Manning's success in moving the football.
There's not a single move that this team has made, outside of Manning, where you can say "this guy is a major upgrade from what we had before."

To me that won't translate to much.
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Old 05-21-2012, 11:28 AM   #138
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Maybe it's time for you to stop posting, houghtam.
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Old 05-21-2012, 11:31 AM   #139
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Maybe it's time for you to stop posting, houghtam.
You're such a good Broncos fan.
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Old 05-21-2012, 11:37 AM   #140
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Sorry dude. If you can't get optimistic about adding one of the very best QBs to ever play the game to a (somewhat) young and improving team with potential then I don't really know what else to say.

I love Tebow as much as anybody and was frustrated with the way everything played out, tired of the constant turnover at the position and looking forward to building on last season. That didn't happen, and they replaced him with a top-five player. I just can't find a way to complain about it.

By all means, though, continue to cry about it nonstop with every post you make.
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Old 05-21-2012, 11:53 AM   #141
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Same scheme? Yes
4 new Starters? Yes
Major upgrades? No (with the possible exception of Wolfe at UT)

Almost ALL the improvements will be predicated on Manning's success in moving the football.
Del Rio is running a similar scheme as Benedict Allen, doesn't mean its the same. Del Rio's track record is a whole lot stronger and more consistent than Allen, who was very hit and miss last year.

He's as big an addition as you could ask for on defense.

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There's not a single move that this team has made, outside of Manning, where you can say "this guy is a major upgrade from what we had before."

To me that won't translate to much.
I'd argue that Adams could be a significant addition. Dawkins was a great in the box weapon but he wasn't consistently healthy and was a liability in coverage. Carter was solid all around but obviously felt more comfortable playing the SS role instead of the FS role. When Dawkins was out we relied on Rahim Moore, David Bruton, and worse to fill in.

Adams now lets Carter lock into SS where he's most comfortable. Carter isn't the play maker of Dawkins but he's more capable in coverage and is a solid run defender in his own right.

Adams is a better FS than we had on the entire team last year. Moore might have the light come on and take the job, but if does it's because he took a huge step up.

So we've effectively improve both safety spots over the course of 16 games by signing one guy.

We've also made a noteworthy improvement at #2, #3, and #4 CB. All of which are valuable contributor roles. Florence is better than Goodman. Porter is better than Goodman. Harris is still here and can provide depth across the secondary. Some nice pick ups to shore up the DBs.

At LB we're going to see what Nate Irving has. If the FO was right to draft him in the 3rd and everything comes together for him this year we might be talking about a long term starter upgrade at MLB pulled from effectively out of nowhere.
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Old 05-21-2012, 12:01 PM   #142
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Sorry dude. If you can't get optimistic about adding one of the very best QBs to ever play the game to a (somewhat) young and improving team with potential then I don't really know what else to say.

I love Tebow as much as anybody and was frustrated with the way everything played out, tired of the constant turnover at the position and looking forward to building on last season. That didn't happen, and they replaced him with a top-five player. I just can't find a way to complain about it.

By all means, though, continue to cry about it nonstop with every post you make.
The uninformed posters think manning is just one of 53
They don't understand how much better practices will be
Accountabilty and confidence that Denver will step onto the field every game with arguably the best player at the most important position
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Old 05-21-2012, 12:05 PM   #143
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Sorry dude. If you can't get optimistic about adding one of the very best QBs to ever play the game to a (somewhat) young and improving team with potential then I don't really know what else to say.

I love Tebow as much as anybody and was frustrated with the way everything played out, tired of the constant turnover at the position and looking forward to building on last season. That didn't happen, and they replaced him with a top-five player. I just can't find a way to complain about it.

By all means, though, continue to cry about it nonstop with every post you make.
And the bolded part is why I'm fed up. I've already made my point known, and I stick by it. If you don't get fed up over repeatedly replacing the position that was not the weakest link on the team in hopes for someone else to step in and turn things around, then I don't really know what else to say.

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showpos...&postcount=687

From me, all Bowlen gets is this year to improve upon last year. I don't have another "just another couple years" in me after the last decade and a half.

If you really want to see me stop posting, just root for the Broncos to not win a playoff game this year. That's all it will take.

Last edited by houghtam; 05-21-2012 at 12:08 PM..
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Old 05-21-2012, 12:21 PM   #144
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Jesus, that's pathetic.
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Old 05-21-2012, 12:21 PM   #145
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Del Rio is running a similar scheme as Benedict Allen, doesn't mean its the same. Del Rio's track record is a whole lot stronger and more consistent than Allen, who was very hit and miss last year.

He's as big an addition as you could ask for on defense.


I'd argue that Adams could be a significant addition. Dawkins was a great in the box weapon but he wasn't consistently healthy and was a liability in coverage. Carter was solid all around but obviously felt more comfortable playing the SS role instead of the FS role. When Dawkins was out we relied on Rahim Moore, David Bruton, and worse to fill in.

Adams now lets Carter lock into SS where he's most comfortable. Carter isn't the play maker of Dawkins but he's more capable in coverage and is a solid run defender in his own right.

Adams is a better FS than we had on the entire team last year. Moore might have the light come on and take the job, but if does it's because he took a huge step up.

So we've effectively improve both safety spots over the course of 16 games by signing one guy.

We've also made a noteworthy improvement at #2, #3, and #4 CB. All of which are valuable contributor roles. Florence is better than Goodman. Porter is better than Goodman. Harris is still here and can provide depth across the secondary. Some nice pick ups to shore up the DBs.

At LB we're going to see what Nate Irving has. If the FO was right to draft him in the 3rd and everything comes together for him this year we might be talking about a long term starter upgrade at MLB pulled from effectively out of nowhere.
Well said!
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Old 05-21-2012, 12:23 PM   #146
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The uninformed posters think manning is just one of 53
They don't understand how much better practices will be
Accountabilty and confidence that Denver will step onto the field every game with arguably the best player at the most important position
Please stop making soooo much sense!
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Old 05-21-2012, 12:24 PM   #147
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And the bolded part is why I'm fed up. I've already made my point known, and I stick by it. If you don't get fed up over repeatedly replacing the position that was not the weakest link on the team in hopes for someone else to step in and turn things around, then I don't really know what else to say.

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showpos...&postcount=687

From me, all Bowlen gets is this year to improve upon last year. I don't have another "just another couple years" in me after the last decade and a half.

If you really want to see me stop posting, just root for the Broncos to not win a playoff game this year. That's all it will take.
Wow.
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Old 05-21-2012, 12:25 PM   #148
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Del Rio is running a similar scheme as Benedict Allen, doesn't mean its the same. Del Rio's track record is a whole lot stronger and more consistent than Allen, who was very hit and miss last year.

He's as big an addition as you could ask for on defense.


I'd argue that Adams could be a significant addition. Dawkins was a great in the box weapon but he wasn't consistently healthy and was a liability in coverage. Carter was solid all around but obviously felt more comfortable playing the SS role instead of the FS role. When Dawkins was out we relied on Rahim Moore, David Bruton, and worse to fill in.

Adams now lets Carter lock into SS where he's most comfortable. Carter isn't the play maker of Dawkins but he's more capable in coverage and is a solid run defender in his own right.

Adams is a better FS than we had on the entire team last year. Moore might have the light come on and take the job, but if does it's because he took a huge step up.

So we've effectively improve both safety spots over the course of 16 games by signing one guy.

We've also made a noteworthy improvement at #2, #3, and #4 CB. All of which are valuable contributor roles. Florence is better than Goodman. Porter is better than Goodman. Harris is still here and can provide depth across the secondary. Some nice pick ups to shore up the DBs.

At LB we're going to see what Nate Irving has. If the FO was right to draft him in the 3rd and everything comes together for him this year we might be talking about a long term starter upgrade at MLB pulled from effectively out of nowhere.
I tried telling Pricey this 20 posts ago!
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Old 05-21-2012, 12:25 PM   #149
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Wow.
What, is this a surprise to you? I've been saying it for months.
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Old 05-21-2012, 12:27 PM   #150
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What, is this a surprise to you? I've been saying it for months.
Sorry I didn't know you was that big of a troll.
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