OT: Game of Thrones Major Spoiler Thread

[Fedaykin]

Originally Posted by broncosteven

You need to read on the toilet, before my car accident that was the only time I had to myself and it is amazing how quick you can get through a book.

If you get serious reading time on the throne -- you'd probably be better served by eating the book for its fiber content rather than reading it.

Just sayin'

[Fedaykin]

I greatly enjoyed this first episode. It was very true to the source material with only understandable editing to accommodate the requisite runtime and the worst of the taboo sexual content. This is good -- I'm very glad the writers have chosen not to pervert the source material by making unnecessary changes which happens all to often with adaptions. I'm glad this is showing on HBO -- that'll go a long way toward giving the writers/producers the freedom needed to be true to the source -- especially the dark and adult tone of the series (and I don't mean the sexual content). This ain't "The Hobbit".

The casting was pretty good -- with some outstanding early performances (Tyrion and Danerys especially). With the exception of poor characterization of Robb, Theon and Jon (those three are nearly indistinguishable in this episode -- easy enough to understand with their limited screen time) and Cersei to a degree, all the characters were brought to life very well, especially for a first episode.

[lostknight]

Originally Posted by Fedaykin

I greatly enjoyed this first episode. It was very true to the source material with only understandable editing to accommodate the requisite runtime and the worst of the taboo sexual content. This is good -- I'm very glad the writers have chosen not to pervert the source material by making unnecessary changes which happens all to often with adaptions. I'm glad this is showing on HBO -- that'll go a long way toward giving the writers/producers the freedom needed to be true to the source -- especially the dark and adult tone of the series (and I don't mean the sexual content). This ain't "The Hobbit".

Outside of Vicerys nipple-twisting his sister (which was only slightly toned down), I'm not sure we have seen any cuts so far in that area. They haven't mentioned the whole Targaryens marry their sister thing yet.

The casting was pretty good -- with some outstanding early performances (Tyrion and Danerys especially). With the exception of poor characterization of Robb, Theon and Jon (those three are nearly indistinguishable in this episode -- easy enough to understand with their limited screen time) and Cersei to a degree, all the characters were brought to life very well, especially for a first episode.

Actually Cate is the one character that doesn't fit well to me. In the books she was one who was pushing Ned to take the job. In the series so far, she seems much more reserved.

[Fedaykin]

Originally Posted by lostknight

Outside of Vicerys nipple-twisting his sister (which was only slightly toned down), I'm not sure we have seen any cuts so far in that area. They haven't mentioned the whole Targaryens marry their sister thing yet.

I'm speaking mostly of the fact that they they've changed (and avoided discussion of) the ages of the young characters involved in the most adult themes.

It'd be a hard thing to change the Jaime/Cersei incest as it plays such an important role in the plot.

Actually Cate is the one character that doesn't fit well to me. In the books she was one who was pushing Ned to take the job. In the series so far, she seems much more reserved.

Ahh, you're right. It's been about a decade since I read the first book. Though IIRC she was outwardly supporting it but inwardly against it?

[lostknight]

Originally Posted by Fedaykin

I'm speaking mostly of the fact that they they've changed (and avoided discussion of) the ages of the young characters involved in the most adult themes.

True enough. The Sansa stuff that happens later is going to be squicky enough without it. In general I think it makes sense to leave them a couple of years older, if nothing else because younger actors would be very problematic at delivering certain scenes.

It'd be a hard thing to change the Jaime/Cersei incest as it plays such an important role in the plot.

True.

Ahh, you're right. It's been about a decade since I read the first book. Though IIRC she was outwardly supporting it but inwardly against it?

I re-read it last night, and while I would say that in what she says she's a bit conflicted, she flat out tells Ned that he has to take the job. She gets a bit more wonked about it once Ned decides that she has to stay.

I agree with the Theon stuff. They seem to have shifted some of the antagonism between him and Jon to Rob, which I think is a mistake. Especially if Jon is who we think he is.

[Fedaykin]

Originally Posted by lostknight

True enough. The Sansa stuff that happens later is going to be squicky enough without it. In general I think it makes sense to leave them a couple of years older, if nothing else because younger actors would be very problematic at delivering certain scenes.

Yeah, based on my estimation of the ages of the actors playing Joffrey and Sansa, there will be considerable changes to their relationship.

I re-read it last night, and while I would say that in what she says she's a bit conflicted, she flat out tells Ned that he has to take the job. She gets a bit more wonked about it once Ned decides that she has to stay.

Ahh, I'm remembering now. Now I'm contemplating reading GoT again even more.

I agree with the Theon stuff. They seem to have shifted some of the antagonism between him and Jon to Rob, which I think is a mistake. Especially if Jon is who we think he is.

Honestly I was having trouble telling the actors playing the three boys apart. Does Theon even get addressed by name?

[Old Dude]

Originally Posted by Fedaykin

...
Honestly I was having trouble telling the actors playing the three boys apart. Does Theon even get addressed by name?

If he was, I didn't catch it. And some viewers may incorrectly assume, at least at this point, that he's the fifth child of the Starks, whereas I'm not sure we ever saw Rickon (the three-year old).

I'll bet a lot of this gets clarified in the next couple of episodes, though. They already had a lot of characters to introduce and a lot of ground to cover in the opener.

[Fedaykin]

Originally Posted by Old Dude

If he was, I didn't catch it. And some viewers may incorrectly assume, at least at this point, that he's the fifth child of the Starks, whereas I'm not sure we ever saw Rickon (the three-year old).

Rickon was in the archery scene for all of 2 seconds, heh.

I'll bet a lot of this gets clarified in the next couple of episodes, though. They already had a lot of characters to introduce and a lot of ground to cover in the opener.

No doubt -- there is no lack of characters to introduce and familiarize the audience with! I imagine for someone who hasn't read the books it'll take some time.

[spdirty]

Watched the first episode. Gonna have to watch about 3 more times before I start figuring out wtf is going on.

[spdirty]

So is HBO gonna go all in with this **** or are they gonna half ass and quit after 2 or 3 seasons like they did Deadwood and Rome?

[jutang]

I was lost watching the first episode and fell asleep for the last 10 minutes. Not a great start to the series with way too many character introductions.

[extralife]

read real books

[That One Guy]

Originally Posted by extralife

read real books

I mostly read just non-fiction. Not wanting to study is the only reason I just read through this thread. Lord of the Rings looked stupid so I never read nor watched any of them. Is this in that realm?

[That One Guy]

Originally Posted by Boobs McGee

Crazier idea: Libraries are free

If you have an e-reader, Piratebay it now and check it out from the library some other time to clear the guilt.

[RhymesayersDU]

I enjoyed the first episode.

I'm reading through this thread, and trying to piece things together. I mean, I was paying attention but there's a lot going on. Just to clarify, that was the Queen getting nailed by her brother at the end? And they have another sibling, the dwarf?

[myMind]

Originally Posted by RhymesayersDU

Just to clarify, that was the Queen getting nailed by her brother at the end? And they have another sibling, the dwarf?

Yes

[Old Dude]

Originally Posted by RhymesayersDU

I enjoyed the first episode.

I'm reading through this thread, and trying to piece things together. I mean, I was paying attention but there's a lot going on. Just to clarify, that was the Queen getting nailed by her brother at the end? And they have another sibling, the dwarf?

Yup. Maybe this will help as a guide to who is related to who.

For about 300 years, Westeros (the England-like land where most of the action takes place) was ruled by the Targaryen dynasty - the so-called dragon kings. These folks were a little like the Egyptian Pharaohs and engaged in a lot of interbreeding. Marriages between brothers and sisters were common. (This practice did NOT extend to anyone else in the country.)

About 15 years before the story starts, the Targaryens were overthrown by a group of nobles. The leader of te rebellion was Robert Baratheon, who is now (the very fat and out of shape) King. (Baratheon also has a couple of brothers who haven't been introduced yet.)

The only surviving Targaryens were a brother and sister - and who were little more than infants at the time of the "usurpation." They've been bouncing around between various patrons on the continent ever since then. Theoretically, they have the primary claim on the throne and those who don't accept Baratheon's rule would like to see them returned. Obviously, their benefactors are hoping for various rewards and influence if this comes about. The sister, Daenerys, has just been married off to the continental equivalent of Ghengis Khan - with the hope that they'll eventually restore the Targaryens to the throne.

Among the noble families who assisted Baratheon in gaining the throne were the Lannisters, the Starks, the Tullys and the Arryns.

After the rebellion, there was a lot of intermarriage between these families to strengthen their alliances.

The head of the House of Lannister, Tywin, arranged a marriage between his daughter, Cersei, and King Robert. They have three kids, the oldest of whom is Joffrey. Cersei, as you know from episode 1, is having an incestuous affair with her twin brother Jaimie. Tyrion, the dwarf, is their younger brother.

The Tullys married off one of their daughters to Ned Stark. (Catelyn). The Starks have five kids. The other Tully daughter (Lysa) was married off to Jon Arryn. (They have one child - a boy). As the series begins, Jon Arryn (who was working as the Kings Right Hand Man) has died under suspicious circumstances. Lysa has fled the King's main castle/city where her husband died, back to a fortress held by the Arryn family, and has written to her sister that she thinks Jon was murdered by the Lannister family.

Jon Snow is not a Stark. He is the bastard son of Ed Stark, who Ed allows to hang around.

The Theon kid we've been taking about is also temporarily residing with the Starks, but he's not directly related to them. He's from yet another noble family.

Anyway, that's for starters.

[Edited to correct the info regarding Lysa's whereabouts.]

[meangene]

Originally Posted by Old Dude

Yup. Maybe this will help as a guide to who is related to who.

For about 300 years, Westeros (the England-like land where most of the action takes place) was ruled by the Targaryen dynasty - the so-called dragon kings. These folks were a little like the Egyptian Pharaohs and engaged in a lot of interbreeding. Marriages between brothers and sisters were common. (This practice did NOT extend to anyone else in the country.)

About 15 years before the story starts, the Targaryens were overthrown by a group of nobles. The leader of te rebellion was Robert Baratheon, who is now (the very fat and out of shape) King. (Baratheon also has a couple of brothers who haven't been introduced yet.)

The only surviving Targaryens were a brother and sister - and who were little more than infants at the time of the "usurpation." They've been bouncing around between various patrons on the continent ever since then. Theoretically, they have the primary claim on the throne and those who don't accept Baratheon's rule would like to see them returned. Obviously, their benefactors are hoping for various rewards and influence if this comes about. The sister, Daenerys, has just been married off to the continental equivalent of Ghengis Khan - with the hope that they'll eventually restore the Targaryens to the throne.

Among the noble families who assisted Baratheon in gaining the throne were the Lannisters, the Starks, the Tullys and the Arryns.

After the rebellion, there was a lot of intermarriage between these families to strengthen their alliances.

The head of the House of Lannister, Tywin, arranged a marriage between his daughter, Cersei, and King Robert. They have three kids, the oldest of whom is Joffrey. Cersei, as you know from episode 1, is having an incestuous affair with her twin brother Jaimie. Tyrion, the dwarf, is their younger brother.

The Tullys married off one of their daughters to Ned Stark. (Catelyn). The Starks have five kids. The other Tully daughter (Lysa) was married off to Jon Arryn. (They have one child - a boy). As the series begins, Jon Arryn (who was working as the Kings Right Hand Man) has died under suspicious circumstances. Lysa has fled back to the Tully castle and has written to her sister that she thinks Jon was murdered by the Lannister family.

Jon Snow is not a Stark. He is the bastard son of Ed Stark, who Ed allows to hang around.

The Theon kid we've been taking about is also temporarily residing with the Starks, but he's not directly related to them. He's from yet another noble family.

Anyway, that's for starters.

Thanks! That really helps! There were an awful lot of characters introduced very quickly.

[RhymesayersDU]

Question: in this story, do the gals only get banged doggy style?

But seriously, thanks for the backstory.

[Old Dude]

By the time this story reaches Book 4, almost everyone gets banged doggy-style.

[Kaylore]

Originally Posted by Old Dude

By the time this story reaches Book 4, almost everyone gets banged doggy-style.

I haven't read the books, but the author is apparently a scholar on royal lineages and such things were pretty consistent (and still are) with royal/elite behavior, including incest.

[Old Dude]

You'll also notice a few parallels with the War of the Roses - The House of Stark = House of York. House of Lannister = House of Lancaster, etc. Richard III (one of the Bard's best villains) was a dwarf. etc., etc.

But this only goes so far. Martin mixes all kinds of plots and issues into his story.

The other theme it might help to know is the role of magic. In this world, there was a time when magic really worked and magical creatures did their thing - more than just legends.

Eventually, it all faded away, and at the time the story begins, it's a very "low-magic" environment. A dire beast here and there. Some petrified dragon eggs. An occasional dream or prophesy.

Slowly but surely, that's gonna change.

[spdirty]

Thank you very much old dude. Now I'll watch it again this week knowing a little more.

Can you please give us cliff notes after every episode?

[scorpio]

Originally Posted by Old Dude

Lysa has fled back to the Tully castle and has written to her sister that she thinks Jon was murdered by the Lannister family.
.

Minor point, Lysa actually flees back the Eyrie, which is the Arryn family stronghold.

[jutang]

Sums up of the first episode. Too bad I already deleted it from my DVR. I think I would have enjoyed it more watching it a second time.

http://tvrecaps.ew.com/?post_type=tv...4&preview=true