The official firearm owners thread

[Bronx33]

Originally Posted by Tombstone RJ

If you can't kill someone with a .38, you shouldn't be allowed to own a pistol of any kind, jmho.

It's all about basic knowledge and, seriously, being taught how to handle and shoot a gun.

Knowing how to handle and shoot a weapon in the dark under a stressful life or death situaition has nothing to do with not being allowed to own a pistol. All the rules change when it comes time to shoot a fellow human there isn't going to be time to post up against a wall and take your deep breaths thers time to aim for the mass and that's about it.

[Cito Pelon]

Originally Posted by Florida_Bronco

All true. The reason I picked the .357 Sig over the 40 or 45 is for increased penetration those vehicles. God forbid, should I ever be in that situation, I definetly want that extra penetration.

Do you have a link to the other thread? I don't remember seeing it.

I thought a .45 had more stopping power than a .357 I'm gonna sell my S&W .357 Model 19 and some other pistols and rifles and get a top-end .45 auto.

[Bronx33]

Originally Posted by Cito Pelon

I thought a .45 had more stopping power than a .357 I'm gonna sell my S&W .357 Model 19 and some other pistols and rifles and get a top-end .45 auto.

Just look at the ballistics between the two and it applies more for cops not all your shots are going to be 5 feet you need a weapon that covers a broader distance (and still have knock down power) the .45s drops drastically the longer the distance.

[Tombstone RJ]

Originally Posted by Bronx33

Knowing how to handle and shoot a weapon in the dark under a stressful life or death situaition has nothing to do with not being allowed to own a pistol. All the rules change when it comes time to shoot a fellow human there isn't going to be time to post up against a wall and take your deep breaths thers time to aim for the mass and that's about it.

However, if you have a gun in the house, and you don't teach the people you love HOW to shoot that weapon, then your asking for all kinds of trouble down the line.

I'm talking about basic home defense. An uninvited intruder comes into your home, your wife is all by herself, and there is a weapon next to her... it doesn't have to be a .44 Magnum Auto Mag. If she can't simply pull out a .38 revolver to defend herself and the house, then yes, I think there is a problem.

Teach her how to fire that weapon correctly, and a .38 can drop anyone. However, if you don't spend that time, it really doesn't matter what she has at her side, in fact, it can do MORE harm than good to have that Desert Eagle at the bedside... if you get my drift.

[Cito Pelon]

Originally Posted by Tombstone RJ

If you can't kill someone with a .38, you shouldn't be allowed to own a pistol of any kind, jmho.

It's all about basic knowledge and, seriously, being taught how to handle and shoot a gun.

Oh yeah, I think I'll keep my S&W .38 Chief's Special. That's a nice little pistol and accurate as all get out.

[GonzoLays]

Ahh, the yearly over-compensation thread.

By the way, Bronco Beerslug won.

[Bronx33]

Originally Posted by Tombstone RJ

However, if you have a gun in the house, and you don't teach the people you love HOW to shoot that weapon, then your asking for all kinds of trouble down the line.

I'm talking about basic home defense. An uninvited intruder comes into your home, your wife is all by herself, and there is a weapon next to her... it doesn't have to be a .44 Magnum Auto Mag. If she can't simply pull out a .38 revolver to defend herself and the house, then yes, I think there is a problem.

Teach her how to fire that weapon correctly, and a .38 can drop anyone. However, if you don't spend that time, it really doesn't matter what she has at her side, in fact, it can do MORE harm than good to have that Desert Eagle at the bedside... if you get my drift.

If you increase the caliber to take alot of pressure off the old lady to place a shot, all i know is i want that MF down and i don't want my old lady to empty a clip dropping the turd. I understand what your saying but i like to cut my work in half or whomever is behind the gun and eliminate a reloading situaition.

[Tombstone RJ]

Originally Posted by Bronx33

If you increase the caliber to take alot of pressure off the old lady to place a shot, all i know is i want that MF down and i don't want my old lady to empty a clip dropping the turd. I understand what your saying but i like to cut my work in half or whomever is behind the gun and eliminate a reloading situaition.

I see your point. However, if it's such a large caliber weapon that she can't control it when she shoots... well, then, what's the point?

Also, God forbid, that weapon is taken from her, then there's another can of worms.

Again, if you can't drop that intruder with a .38, somethings wrong.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Originally Posted by Cito Pelon

I thought a .45 had more stopping power than a .357 I'm gonna sell my S&W .357 Model 19 and some other pistols and rifles and get a top-end .45 auto.

I don't think that's always true. Check out the muzzle velocity of 45s and then other calibers.

Muzzle velocity 45s

* 14.7 g (230 gr) Full Metal Jacket: 260 m/s (860 ft/s)
* 11.9 g (185 gr) CCI/Speer Gold Dot JHP (from 5in (127 mm) barrel): 317 m/s (1041 ft/s)
* 14.7 g (230 gr) Federal Hi-Shok JHP (from 5 in (127 mm) barrel): 260 m/s (860 ft/s)

+ P loads

* 11.9 g (185 gr) JHP: 350 m/s (1150 ft/s)
* 14.7 g (230 gr) JHP: 290 m/s (950 ft/s)
----------------------------------------

38 Special +P loading fires a 125-grain bullet at 945 ft/s for a muzzle energy of 248 ft·lbf.

A standard-pressure .38 Special only makes 850 ft/s for 201 ft·lbf of muzzle energy.

A 9 mm Luger, by comparison, will fire a 124-grain bullet at 1140 ft/s for 358 ft·lbf of energy, and a .380 ACP will fire a 95-grain bullet at 955 ft/s for 192 ft·lbf of energy.

The .357 Magnum will fire a 125-grain bullet at 1,450 ft/s for a muzzle energy of 583 ft·lbf, or packing nearly three times as much energy as the same bullet in a .38 Special.

[Bronx33]

Originally Posted by Tombstone RJ

I see your point. However, if it's such a large caliber weapon that she can't control it when she shoots... well, then, what's the point?

Also, God forbid, that weapon is taken from her, then there's another can of worms.

Again, if you can't drop that intruder with a .38, somethings wrong.

I just like 100% effectiveness not 80% and .357 is not that big, small sizes are availiable, not all people are dead shots but like to defend themselves. (just sayin)

[Tombstone RJ]

Originally Posted by Bronx33

I just like 100% effectiveness not 80% and .357 is not that big, small sizes are availiable, not all people are dead shots but like to defend themselves. (just sayin)

Point taken.

[Bronx33]

Originally Posted by Bronco_Beerslug

I don't think that's always true. Check out the muzzle velocity of 45s and then other calibers.

Muzzle velocity 45s

* 14.7 g (230 gr) Full Metal Jacket: 260 m/s (860 ft/s)
* 11.9 g (185 gr) CCI/Speer Gold Dot JHP (from 5in (127 mm) barrel): 317 m/s (1041 ft/s)
* 14.7 g (230 gr) Federal Hi-Shok JHP (from 5 in (127 mm) barrel): 260 m/s (860 ft/s)

+ P loads

* 11.9 g (185 gr) JHP: 350 m/s (1150 ft/s)
* 14.7 g (230 gr) JHP: 290 m/s (950 ft/s)
----------------------------------------

38 Special +P loading fires a 125-grain bullet at 945 ft/s for a muzzle energy of 248 ft·lbf.

A standard-pressure .38 Special only makes 850 ft/s for 201 ft·lbf of muzzle energy.

A 9 mm Luger, by comparison, will fire a 124-grain bullet at 1140 ft/s for 358 ft·lbf of energy, and a .380 ACP will fire a 95-grain bullet at 955 ft/s for 192 ft·lbf of energy.

The .357 Magnum will fire a 125-grain bullet at 1,450 ft/s for a muzzle energy of 583 ft·lbf, or packing nearly three times as much energy as the same bullet in a .38 Special.

Huge difference when picking a caliber that best suites ones needs, i personally want something that knocks the piss out something at 15ft and 50 yards.

[Spider]

this is the bad boy I carry ...........
Light weight
Holds hundreds of rounds .............

[Cito Pelon]

Originally Posted by Bronx33

Just look at the ballistics between the two and it applies more for cops not all your shots are going to be 5 feet you need a weapon that covers a broader distance (and still have knock down power) the .45s drops drastically the longer the distance.

Well, wait a sec, I dragged out some ballistics info and from what I see the .45 ACP is comparable to the .357.

Give me some more info, pls. I'm not a gun geek by any means, so maybe you can help me out. I do want accuracy and torque at longer range than I have with my .357 S&W revolver and I don't mind having more than six shots. I was looking at the .45 as maybe a little better than the .357 in accuracy and torque at longer ranges, plus being an auto as opposed to a revolver. I see that Florida has a .357 auto in his post, I honestly did not know anybody made a .357 auto.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Originally Posted by Bronx33

Huge difference when picking a caliber that best suites ones needs, i personally want something that knocks the piss out something at 15ft and 50 yards.

I could actually watch the rounds coming out of my buddy's 45 when we were shooting awhile back.

[Bronx33]

Originally Posted by §Pide®

this is the bad boy I carry ...........
Light weight
Holds hundreds of rounds .............

And it has a compass in the stock!

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Originally Posted by Bronx33

And it has a compass in the stock!

And it's the the weapon that took down Black Bart!

[Florida_Bronco]

Originally Posted by Cito Pelon

I thought a .45 had more stopping power than a .357 I'm gonna sell my S&W .357 Model 19 and some other pistols and rifles and get a top-end .45 auto.

I'm not sure about the .357 magnum and .45, but the .357 Sig (which is much different than a .357 magnum) fires a much more powerful bullet.

[Spider]

Originally Posted by Bronx33

And it has a compass in the stock!

and it can break a headlight at close range ...................Powerfull weapon lillte miss Daisey is
Break the skin and can cause a nasty infection if the conditions are right , like riding in a car and getting second hand smoke

[Florida_Bronco]

Originally Posted by GonzoLays

Ahh, the yearly over-compensation thread.

By the way, Bronco Beerslug won.

What the **** are you talking about?

[Bronx33]

Originally Posted by Cito Pelon

Well, wait a sec, I dragged out some ballistics info and from what I see the .45 ACP is comparable to the .357.

Give me some more info, pls. I'm not a gun geek by any means, so maybe you can help me out. I do want accuracy and torque at longer range than I have with my .357 S&W revolver and I don't mind having more than six shots. I was looking at the .45 as maybe a little better than the .357 in accuracy and torque at longer ranges, plus being an auto as opposed to a revolver. I see that Florida has a .357 auto in his post, I honestly did not know anybody made a .357 auto.

Cool info huh! it's all personal preference i was looking at a weapon choice from a cops point of view and the .357 supports those needs. If one wants a bigger caliber then by all means get one i just tend to frown on the lower calibers as an effective turd dropper without using more shots.

[Bronx33]

Originally Posted by Florida_Bronco

What the **** are you talking about?

He don't know florida ignore the twit.

[cutthemdown]

I don't really see why Americans love guns so much. But having said that I do have a cheap 250 dollar pump shotgun by Mossberg and a .38 s&w my dad left me. You wonder though if we wouldn't have been better off only letting police have guns. I know way too late now it's a fundamental right and plus all the criminals have them now already. Still though we have so many guns in this country it's crazy.

[Meck77]

I have enough to hold back a small insurgent attack from the north, south, east, or west by myself. One of my neighbors is a retired marine. No idea what he has over his way but when that dude get's in a mood it is simply awesome.

[Cito Pelon]

Originally Posted by Bronx33

Cool info huh! it's all personal preference i was looking at a weapon choice from a cops point of view and the .357 supports those needs. If one wants a bigger caliber then by all means get one i just tend to frown on the lower calibers as an effective turd dropper without using more shots.

Yeah, I was thinking it's an either/or situation with the .357 and the .45. They both seem to fit the bill as bear-stoppers, which is all I'm interested in. There is the added worry of jamming with an auto, especially backpacking where dirt and water is always a problem.

This particular .357 I have is not real accurate also, at least not with me. I figure my effective range with it is about 10 yards. Well, I don't know. I've been talking about selling these pistols and rifles for about 2 years now, and still have not done it, haven't even taken them to the gunshop to see what I can get for them.