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Old 12-14-2006, 05:17 PM   #201
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I agree... to a point. Speaking in basketball terms only, you take the best deal.

But, professional sports is a business, and it's not always just about the play on the floor. Last night they mentioned on SportsCenter that yesterday's 76ers game only had 11,000 people show up to it.

Now, what happens if, theoretically, AI and Pierce go on a tear, make a deep run into the playoffs, etc? You're going to have a lot of pissed off, disillusioned 76ers fans. I'm not saying that AI makes Boston a title contender, but just think what would happen if Boston instantly got good, won games, etc. You have a fan base that is already shook at the fact that AI is leaving, meanwhile they see him helping a rival team win. Meanwhile, the 76ers still suck and are rebuilding. At least if you ship him to another conference altogether it doesn't hurt as much.

Again, I agree, from a purely Basketball standpoint, 76ers need the best players/expiring contracts/draft picks it can get. But people are already not showing up to games with AI. Him going to the Celtics probably won't help that.

Yea, you are right. I'm wrong.

I'm worn out.

We'll see if the Iverson +1 superstar thing will workout afterall. Most likely, he will be playing with Carmelo.

AAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHH!

Man, what a wasted week.
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Old 12-14-2006, 05:21 PM   #202
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http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthr...t=50555&page=5

Latest update from Marc Stein of ESPN. Says the Nuggest are the frontrunners right now.
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Old 12-14-2006, 05:59 PM   #203
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Damn...nuggpuppy booted me off. I'd registered awhile back but never posted and they must have scrubbed my log in and email. Now I can't access it...CO or Nuggs4, can you help me out?
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Old 12-14-2006, 06:14 PM   #204
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Here is the insider's post at the Sixer's board. He says Iverson to Denver.

&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&& &&&&&


There is light at the end of the tunnel...its almost over.

Miami's late interest is postering by Pat Riley to get someone to overpay for AI..or at least pay more than they are currently offering.

Minny has been the most active caller this morning..trying to get a three way together before its too late but its not working.....no one wants their bad contracts.

Chad Ford was dead on in his chat today when he said that Portland and Charlotte are the third teams in most scenarios that are concocted. Almost every scenario the Sixers are picking thru this morning has one or both of them involved.(Dallas the other team mentioned as third party) Sixers would be getting Magliore and/or Brevin Knight in most of these scenarios.

Denver even has floated some offers involved that include TWO first round picks.

The following teams are all out of the running for AI:
IND
BOS
GSW
LAC
SAC
MIA
CHA
MIN

Which leaves.....one team.....the soon to be winner of the AI race...the Denver Nuggets. The details are not finalized.....and may change in several variations that are being discussed......both 2 and multi team trades...but your winner is the DENVER NUGGETS, barring a last minute breakdown.

I was told a trade of AI to the Nuggets WILL happen by end of day tomorrow.

The variations.....could be a combination of the below..but this is what I was told is involved.(could be some or all...lots of variables right now)

1 to 2 first round picks.
Joe Smith and/or Eduardo Najera
Andre Miller or Brevin Knight
1 of Magliore,Croshere or some other expiring contract(still trying to find Nene 3-way opportunities)

Some, but not the front burner variations, include Samuel Dalembert.

None of the variations include Camby,JR Smith or Kenyon Martin.

I will take 5 minutes of questions...before I have to run for now.
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Old 12-14-2006, 06:22 PM   #205
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If this draft is as deep as people say it is, hope they can find a way to keep one of the 1sts.
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Old 12-14-2006, 06:54 PM   #206
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Damn...nuggpuppy booted me off. I'd registered awhile back but never posted and they must have scrubbed my log in and email. Now I can't access it...CO or Nuggs4, can you help me out?
What was your username? I'll get you back on. Because of Sandy Clough, they're cleaning out some of the lurkers. Drop me an email. james at massivemusicamerica dot com.
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Old 12-14-2006, 07:09 PM   #207
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What was your username? I'll get you back on. Because of Sandy Clough, they're cleaning out some of the lurkers. Drop me an email. james at massivemusicamerica dot com.
Same as here, just no under scores. Tell sherky that I posted in his "Are you a true Nuggets fan?" thread
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Old 12-14-2006, 07:10 PM   #208
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What was your username? I'll get you back on. Because of Sandy Clough, they're cleaning out some of the lurkers. Drop me an email. james at massivemusicamerica dot com.
Nuggs anything out there you hearing. That eric guy has been pretty quiet lately.
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Old 12-14-2006, 07:57 PM   #209
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Nuggs anything out there you hearing. That eric guy has been pretty quiet lately.
He's underground right now. Rumors around the boards are getting hot and heavy. At the risk of sounding like a complete tool, I'm starting to think this deal doesn't include Nene OR Dre. I think we might be making out like bandits here.
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Old 12-14-2006, 08:06 PM   #210
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He's underground right now. Rumors around the boards are getting hot and heavy. At the risk of sounding like a complete tool, I'm starting to think this deal doesn't include Nene OR Dre. I think we might be making out like bandits here.
How could they make the salaries match up without at least one of them being involved? I seriously doubt they're offering up Camby as it wouldn't make sense to lose him for the sake of keeping Miller.
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Old 12-14-2006, 08:17 PM   #211
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How could they make the salaries match up without at least one of them being involved? I seriously doubt they're offering up Camby as it wouldn't make sense to lose him for the sake of keeping Miller.
There is always K-Mart.
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Old 12-14-2006, 08:26 PM   #212
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King is not Isaih Thomas
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Old 12-14-2006, 08:29 PM   #213
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If we let go of Camby, that would show a huge faith in Nene to not only be healthy, but that he'll pan out.

Interesting times, that's for sure...

But here's a what-if for you:
Starting lineup, 2007:
AI
JR
Melo
K-Mart
Nene
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Old 12-14-2006, 08:37 PM   #214
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I was listening to fan 950 this morning and they speculated that Stan Kronke might just say F it and bust the cap and take a hit in luxury tax. He always says the Nuggets are his pride and joy and wants to win. With the merchandise and tickets that AI coming would bring on top of Melo that could diflect the hit. Maybe he is just saying I don't care if we keep Nene get this mofo here!
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Old 12-14-2006, 08:43 PM   #215
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I was listening to fan 950 this morning and they speculated that Stan Kronke might just say F it and bust the cap and take a hit in luxury tax. He always says the Nuggets are his pride and joy and wants to win. With the merchandise and tickets that AI coming would bring on top of Melo that could diflect the hit. Maybe he is just saying I don't care if we keep Nene get this mofo here!
It will be an interesting thing to follow, the business side of the NBA. There was an article in the Post last week about the Nuggets' attendance was low this year. The article speculated that it was because of the ticket increase (23%, if I remember correctly) but also mentioned the fact that no great teams have come to Denver yet. (The only team even remotely good at the time of the article was Minnesota, and even now the only other interesting team to come through is the Heat with DWade)

But as I stated earlier in this thread, the other night on SportsCenter they mentioned that the 76ers only drew 11K fans the other night, the lowest in a long time... So needless to say, AI puts asses in the seats... And if the Nuggs can go on a run, man Pepsi could potentially be rocking this year.

There will be a lot of revenue to be made off AI, especially if both him and Melo represent the Nuggets in Vegas this year.
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Old 12-14-2006, 08:46 PM   #216
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There is always K-Mart.
The Sixers aren't going to take on the remaining years of Kenyon's deal. They're currently counting down the days until they get out from under the contract of Chris Webber (another highly paid microfracture surgery patient), so there's no way they'd want him.
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Old 12-14-2006, 08:53 PM   #217
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How could they make the salaries match up without at least one of them being involved? I seriously doubt they're offering up Camby as it wouldn't make sense to lose him for the sake of keeping Miller.
Joe Smith, Najera, Boykins all, depending on how they work their contracts are expiring.

6.8+4.6+3.0 = 14.4 million

Which is 2.8 million short of AI, and works (easily actually) under the current CBA.

Don't know why they'd go for anything like that, but there is an answer.

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If we let go of Camby, that would show a huge faith in Nene to not only be healthy, but that he'll pan out.

Interesting times, that's for sure...

But here's a what-if for you:
Starting lineup, 2007:
AI
JR
Melo
K-Mart
Nene
That might be it later in the season, but I honestly don't see K-mart being anything more than MAYBE a figure head starter (perhaps technically starting, but not gettin the majority of the minutes) next year.

He'll be coming off one year of rehab on a second microfractured knee. It took a guy half a decade younger more than a year to get back into form from just one such surgery.

Perhaps by midseason he'll be ready to hang with West Power Forwards, but if the FO has learned anything from this debacle is to make sure your players are fit to play (Karl's personal idiosyncracies notwithstanding).

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Old 12-14-2006, 09:10 PM   #218
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Joe Smith, Najera, Boykins all, depending on how they work their contracts are expiring.

6.8+4.6+3.0 = 14.4 million

Which is 2.8 million short of AI, and works (easily actually) under the current CBA.

Don't know why they'd go for anything like that, but there is an answer.
Let's say that was the deal. Joe Smith, Najera, Boykins and two first round draft picks. Next season, the Nuggets would have 73 million dollars tied up between six players. That means Kroenke is going have a payroll hovering around 85 million dollars next season. An increase of around 22 million in salary from this season + 17 million in luxury tax expenses.

So in the end, if that is deal, Kroenke is going to hand over 40(!) million more dollars then he would normally had he not acquired Allen Iverson.

Is Allen Iverson worth 40 million dollars a year? That's a lot of pepsi and cotton candy if you ask me.
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Old 12-14-2006, 09:14 PM   #219
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And keep in mind that JR Smith is coming up for an extension after next season. If you acquire AI, you can say goodbye to JR. Unless Kroenke wants to jump out of character and roll like he is James Dolan or Mark Cuban.
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Old 12-14-2006, 09:16 PM   #220
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If you don't land AI, you can blame Nene's dumb ass.

That might the dumbest signing I have ever seen. 6 years, 60 million for a guy who was coming off knee surgery, has never averaged more than 11 pts or 6 rebounds in a season, and there was no market for him.
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Old 12-14-2006, 09:22 PM   #221
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Let's say that was the deal. Joe Smith, Najera, Boykins and two first round draft picks. Next season, the Nuggets would have 73 million dollars tied up between six players. That means Kroenke is going have a payroll hovering around 85 million dollars next season. An increase of around 22 million in salary from this season + 17 million in luxury tax expenses.

So in the end, if that is deal, Kroenke is going to hand over 40(!) million more dollars then he would normally had he not acquired Allen Iverson.

Is Allen Iverson worth 40 million dollars a year? That's a lot of pepsi and cotton candy if you ask me.

No doubt. That is a win now move. It doesn't exactly hamstring us, though I don't necessarily like giving up BOTH picks (smacks too much of the bad Kiki, good Kiki GOT us picks)

I mean we'll have 6 big contracts, but Camby's will be winding down, and we know Melo will be worth it. We have to HOPE K-mart can come back to at least be serviceable and that Nene will develop into a (by the West's standards) good F/C. I see AI being great to tailing off to merely good during the life of his contract.

The only thing weird is that Andre is the odd man out. I mean AI will want the ball, though Andre is good in getting our front court easy baskets. But what do you do with him? Dre isn't a spark off the bench and he can't play with AI.

And JR is just going to get more and more minutes (assuming his minutes are the ones that AI takes). He'll take some back over the years and Dre will become even more marginalized.

Oh well...maybe in 2 years we trade Dre's expiring contract along with K-mart (who will bounce back hopefully) for another disgruntled superstar...right around when AI will have lost a step.
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Old 12-14-2006, 09:25 PM   #222
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If you don't land AI, you can blame Nene's dumb ass.

That might the dumbest signing I have ever seen. 6 years, 60 million for a guy who was coming off knee surgery, has never averaged more than 11 pts or 6 rebounds in a season, and there was no market for him.
I have to agree. At the time, they justified it by saying they wanted it done quickly before the market moved and they might have to pay even MORE.

I guess they saw what Curry and Chandler got.

Say hello to Gooden and Wilcox...

An 27+ million dollar contract over 3 years would be infinitely more moveable for a 24 year old big, even with the knee surgery. Not easy, but moveable.

I think they listened to the wrong "insiders" or had people knew they were bugged and were feeding us crap.
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Old 12-14-2006, 09:28 PM   #223
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Nene contract was Dah UMB. Another billiant move by wonder boy Kiki. Same guy who was rumored to want Darko OVER Melo and James.
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Old 12-14-2006, 09:32 PM   #224
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No doubt. That is a win now move. It doesn't exactly hamstring us, though I don't necessarily like giving up BOTH picks (smacks too much of the bad Kiki, good Kiki GOT us picks)
That's the thing, Kroenke has been trading away draft picks to avoid paying the luxury tax forever. Have no doubt of this.

But with Iverson, Kroenke has to say hello to the luxury tax for the next three years AT LEAST. Thats a HUGE move for him. Huge.

He goes from making money, to losing money. The Nuggs might be the object of his affection, but everybody has a breaking point. I seriously doubt he wants to take money out of his own pocket to watch the Nuggs for the next three years.
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Old 12-14-2006, 09:49 PM   #225
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Nene contract was Dah UMB. Another billiant move by wonder boy Kiki. Same guy who was rumored to want Darko OVER Melo and James.
That wasn't Kiki. That was the current FO...or at least an interim team.

We know Kiki's weaknesses, but let's not forget how utterly crappy the Nuggs were before he started the moves.

Half of it is an owner willing to spend, but he made good moves to help the Nuggets get relevant again.

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That's the thing, Kroenke has been trading away draft picks to avoid paying the luxury tax forever. Have no doubt of this.

But with Iverson, Kroenke has to say hello to the luxury tax for the next three years AT LEAST. Thats a HUGE move for him. Huge.

He goes from making money, to losing money. The Nuggs might be the object of his affection, but everybody has a breaking point. I seriously doubt he wants to take money out of his own pocket to watch the Nuggs for the next three years.

He goes to PAYING more money. We don't know Nuggets finances, so we can't tell if he'd be in the red. But having possibly 2 near locks for the All-star game for the next 2-3 years can't hurt the bottom line.

Or what a championship might do.

It's out of character, but we'll see.

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