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Old 05-03-2014, 09:28 AM   #1
txtebow
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Default "White Privilege"--very well stated Young man!

https://shine.yahoo.com/healthy-livi...182554683.html

"I do condemn them for diminishing everything I have personally accomplished, all the hard work I have done in my life, and for ascribing all the fruit I reap not to the seeds I sow but to some invisible patron saint of white maleness who places it out for me before I even arrive."
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Old 05-03-2014, 10:26 AM   #2
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https://shine.yahoo.com/healthy-livi...182554683.html

"I do condemn them for diminishing everything I have personally accomplished, all the hard work I have done in my life, and for ascribing all the fruit I reap not to the seeds I sow but to some invisible patron saint of white maleness who places it out for me before I even arrive."
, read the article and then you see the liberal left's answer, it's literally this: Fortgang is uneducated.

That's it, that is all the critics are saying. Fortgang just doesn't understand.

See, I told everyone here that when someone disagrees with the left they will resort to saying you are uneducated. So predictable. So sad.
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Old 05-03-2014, 01:56 PM   #3
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See, I told everyone here that when someone disagrees with the left they will resort to saying you are uneducated. So predictable. So sad.
NOWHERE do any of the "liberal" responses state, or even imply, that Fortgang is "uneducated". NOWHERE. If they do, please quote where they do so. The truth is that the responses are very respectful For example:

“It’s the wrong thing to demonize this gentleman, though. [His essay] just reveals how much work there is to be done.”

So, the only thing predictable and sad here is you. You can't counter the arguments, so you make sh*t up. Predictable and sad.
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Old 05-03-2014, 04:30 PM   #4
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NOWHERE do any of the "liberal" responses state, or even imply, that Fortgang is "uneducated". NOWHERE. If they do, please quote where they do so. The truth is that the responses are very respectful For example:

“It’s the wrong thing to demonize this gentleman, though. [His essay] just reveals how much work there is to be done.”

So, the only thing predictable and sad here is you. You can't counter the arguments, so you make sh*t up. Predictable and sad.
No, what's sad (and pathetic) is how so many wet behind the ears WHITE PEOPLE so readily accept the notion of "WHITE PRIVILEGE" as being a legitimate MODERN factor for success in America TODAY. WEALTHY PRIVILEGE absolutely exists; but to those who are born poor or middle class, white and male, there is ZERO advantage and in fact, it can be argued that it's a disadvantage when competing with minorities for admission to colleges and within the workforce while trying to work one's way up from middle class to the top tax bracket in 'Merica today....
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Old 05-03-2014, 04:48 PM   #5
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No, what's sad (and pathetic) is how so many wet behind the ears WHITE PEOPLE so readily accept the notion of "WHITE PRIVILEGE" as being a legitimate MODERN factor for success in America TODAY. WEALTHY PRIVILEGE absolutely exists; but to those who are born poor or middle class, white and male, there is ZERO advantage and in fact, it can be argued that it's a disadvantage when competing with minorities for admission to colleges and within the workforce while trying to work one's way up from middle class to the top tax bracket in 'Merica today....
That's probably true and has been for a couple of generations now. Why do you keep posting about it?
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Old 05-03-2014, 05:48 PM   #6
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That's probably true and has been for a couple of generations now. Why do you keep posting about it?
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Old 05-03-2014, 07:41 PM   #7
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That's probably true and has been for a couple of generations now. Why do you keep posting about it?
Because that phrase is getting more and more main stream media coverage; it's a creation from the fringe of the left wing; it's divisive, demeaning and anyone who chooses to use that term should be regarded as racist.

The fact that the yahoo article linked in post 1 displayed a " counter point" to the gentleman who refuted the whole notion of " white privilege" shows where the MSM 's leanings truly are...

Last edited by txtebow; 05-03-2014 at 07:45 PM..
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Old 05-04-2014, 10:50 AM   #8
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WEALTHY PRIVILEGE absolutely exists; but to those who are born poor or middle class, white and male, there is ZERO advantage and in fact, it can be argued that it's a disadvantage when competing with minorities for admission to colleges and within the workforce while trying to work one's way up from middle class to the top tax bracket in 'Merica today....
To an extent I agree with this. But, who has most of the wealth that fuels this ongoing and growing "wealthy privilege"?
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Old 05-04-2014, 02:40 PM   #9
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To an extent I agree with this. But, who has most of the wealth that fuels this ongoing and growing "wealthy privilege"?
A tiny % of the general population who claim European ancestry in the United States.

And the remedy as currently proposed by leftists like you? Creating artificial OUTCOMES for non whites. Our culture has evolved from " equal opportunity" ( which I 110% support) to mandating artificial outcomes based upon race. ( NYC fire fighters are a great example-- can't pass a written exam to the same extent as white applicants?? NO PROBLEM! Here's a badge AND BACK PAY for " discrimination". )


Going forward, I am all for aid and opportunity in college placement and for business contracts and loans for those academically qualified applicants who come from families making $60,000 or less annually. That is a fair and equitable way to potentiate the rebirth of the American dream. Race absolutely should not be a factor for consideration.
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Old 05-04-2014, 12:01 PM   #10
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NOWHERE do any of the "liberal" responses state, or even imply, that Fortgang is "uneducated". NOWHERE. If they do, please quote where they do so. The truth is that the responses are very respectful For example:

“It’s the wrong thing to demonize this gentleman, though. [His essay] just reveals how much work there is to be done.”

So, the only thing predictable and sad here is you. You can't counter the arguments, so you make sh*t up. Predictable and sad.

Others, though, were not as impressed. Some tweets noted that the student did not seem to understand the concept of privilege. In an opinion piece published in the Columbia Spectator, of Columbia University, students Dunni Oduyemi and Parul Guliani wrote that Fortgang’s piece inspired a “collective Eye roll.” They continue, “We decided that we had to respond to this op-ed, which completely misses the point and grossly misinterprets the meaning of privilege and the way it functions.” In addition, they note, “Recognizing the fact that white men benefit from the kinds of racist and sexist structures on which American society is built isn’t meant to diminish his accomplishments. It’s meant to remind us that white men don’t have an inherent predilection for success — the odds have just been stacked in their favor.”

It's pretty simple, they are saying Fortgang simply doesn't know what they are talking about which means he is uneducated in his opinion. I disagree, I think Fortgang is smart enough, and educated enough to know exactly their point, Fortgang is simply calling it BS. So, Fortgang disagrees with them, nothing more.
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Old 05-04-2014, 02:42 PM   #11
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Others, though, were not as impressed. Some tweets noted that the student did not seem to understand the concept of privilege. In an opinion piece published in the Columbia Spectator, of Columbia University, students Dunni Oduyemi and Parul Guliani wrote that Fortgang’s piece inspired a “collective Eye roll.” They continue, “We decided that we had to respond to this op-ed, which completely misses the point and grossly misinterprets the meaning of privilege and the way it functions.” In addition, they note, “Recognizing the fact that white men benefit from the kinds of racist and sexist structures on which American society is built isn’t meant to diminish his accomplishments. It’s meant to remind us that white men don’t have an inherent predilection for success — the odds have just been stacked in their favor.”

It's pretty simple, they are saying Fortgang simply doesn't know what they are talking about which means he is uneducated in his opinion. I disagree, I think Fortgang is smart enough, and educated enough to know exactly their point, Fortgang is simply calling it BS. So, Fortgang disagrees with them, nothing more.

Exactly.
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Old 05-05-2014, 05:26 AM   #12
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txtebow's thin skin couldn't handle the world without white privilege. Let’s say that txtebow forgot to pack his shampoo for a business trip. When he gets to the hotel, he sees that the complimentary shampoo is not the standard Suave product to which he's accustomed but rather Pink Oil Lotion for African American hair. He would think to himself: "Those black folks...This is so unfair!", and then he would come to the Orange Mane and start a thread about it.
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Old 05-05-2014, 06:45 AM   #13
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txtebow's thin skin couldn't handle the world without white privilege. Let’s say that txtebow forgot to pack his shampoo for a business trip. When he gets to the hotel, he sees that the complimentary shampoo is not the standard Suave product to which he's accustomed but rather Pink Oil Lotion for African American hair. He would think to himself: "Those black folks...This is so unfair!", and then he would come to the Orange Mane and start a thread about it.
If I was traveling abroad in a country that was 60% plus Black, I'd fully expect the hotel to cater to the MAJORITY. What a pathetic attempt to add to this discussion. Continue on with your self flagellation sheep.
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Old 05-05-2014, 07:30 AM   #14
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White privilege is not racism. The unintended perks and advantages are reality.
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Old 05-05-2014, 10:15 AM   #15
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White privilege is not racism. The unintended perks and advantages are reality.
The belief in "white privilege" is the very essence of racism. You are a shameful human being.
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Old 05-05-2014, 10:57 AM   #16
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The belief in "white privilege" is the very essence of racism. You are a shameful human being.
You're not very bright. You said it yourself. Catering to the majority is a majority privilege.
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Old 05-05-2014, 12:36 PM   #17
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You're not very bright. You said it yourself. Catering to the majority is a majority privilege.
So your idea of "white privilege" consists of the choice of toiletries offered up by a hotel? What I call an inconvenience you and your ilk proclaim as the basis for a racist political movement...
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Old 05-05-2014, 12:25 PM   #18
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White privilege is not racism. The unintended perks and advantages are reality.
I'd love an example from your personal experience.
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Old 05-05-2014, 06:39 PM   #19
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I'd love an example from your personal experience.
50 examples of White Privilege

1. I can if I wish arrange to be in the company of people of my race most of the time.

2. I can avoid spending time with people whom I was trained to mistrust and who have learned to mistrust my kind or me.

3. If I should need to move, I can be pretty sure of renting or purchasing housing in an area which I can afford and in which I would want to live.

4. I can be pretty sure that my neighbors in such a location will be neutral or pleasant to me.

5. I can go shopping alone most of the time, pretty well assured that I will not be followed or harassed.

6. I can turn on the television or open to the front page of the paper and see people of my race widely represented.

7. When I am told about our national heritage or about "civilization," I am shown that people of my color made it what it is.

8. I can be sure that my children will be given curricular materials that testify to the existence of their race.

9. If I want to, I can be pretty sure of finding a publisher for this piece on white privilege.

10. I can be pretty sure of having my voice heard in a group in which I am the only member of my race.

11. I can be casual about whether or not to listen to another person's voice in a group in which s/he is the only member of his/her race.

12. I can go into a music shop and count on finding the music of my race represented, into a supermarket and find the staple foods which fit with my cultural traditions, into a hairdresser's shop and find someone who can cut my hair.

13. Whether I use checks, credit cards or cash, I can count on my skin color not to work against the appearance of financial reliability.

14. I can arrange to protect my children most of the time from people who might not like them.

15. I do not have to educate my children to be aware of systemic racism for their own daily physical protection.

16. I can be pretty sure that my children's teachers and employers will tolerate them if they fit school and workplace norms; my chief worries about them do not concern others' attitudes toward their race.

17. I can talk with my mouth full and not have people put this down to my color.

18. I can swear, or dress in second hand clothes, or not answer letters, without having people attribute these choices to the bad morals, the poverty or the illiteracy of my race.

19. I can speak in public to a powerful male group without putting my race on trial.

20. I can do well in a challenging situation without being called a credit to my race.

21. I am never asked to speak for all the people of my racial group.

22. I can remain oblivious of the language and customs of persons of color who constitute the world's majority without feeling in my culture any penalty for such oblivion.

23. I can criticize our government and talk about how much I fear its policies and behavior without being seen as a cultural outsider.

24. I can be pretty sure that if I ask to talk to the "person in charge", I will be facing a person of my race.

25. If a traffic cop pulls me over or if the IRS audits my tax return, I can be sure I haven't been singled out because of my race.

26. I can easily buy posters, post-cards, picture books, greeting cards, dolls, toys and children's magazines featuring people of my race.

27. I can go home from most meetings of organizations I belong to feeling somewhat tied in, rather than isolated, out-of-place, outnumbered, unheard, held at a distance or feared.

28. I can be pretty sure that an argument with a colleague of another race is more likely to jeopardize her/his chances for advancement than to jeopardize mine.

29. I can be pretty sure that if I argue for the promotion of a person of another race, or a program centering on race, this is not likely to cost me heavily within my present setting, even if my colleagues disagree with me.

30. If I declare there is a racial issue at hand, or there isn't a racial issue at hand, my race will lend me more credibility for either position than a person of color will have.

31. I can choose to ignore developments in minority writing and minority activist programs, or disparage them, or learn from them, but in any case, I can find ways to be more or less protected from negative consequences of any of these choices.

32. My culture gives me little fear about ignoring the perspectives and powers of people of other races.

33. I am not made acutely aware that my shape, bearing or body odor will be taken as a reflection on my race.

34. I can worry about racism without being seen as self-interested or self-seeking.

35. I can take a job with an affirmative action employer without having my co-workers on the job suspect that I got it because of my race.

36. If my day, week or year is going badly, I need not ask of each negative episode or situation whether it had racial overtones.

37. I can be pretty sure of finding people who would be willing to talk with me and advise me about my next steps, professionally.

38. I can think over many options, social, political, imaginative or professional, without asking whether a person of my race would be accepted or allowed to do what I want to do.

39. I can be late to a meeting without having the lateness reflect on my race.

40. I can choose public accommodation without fearing that people of my race cannot get in or will be mistreated in the places I have chosen.

41. I can be sure that if I need legal or medical help, my race will not work against me.

42. I can arrange my activities so that I will never have to experience feelings of rejection owing to my race.

43. If I have low credibility as a leader I can be sure that my race is not the problem.

44. I can easily find academic courses and institutions which give attention only to people of my race.

45. I can expect figurative language and imagery in all of the arts to testify to experiences of my race.

46. I can chose blemish cover or bandages in "flesh" color and have them more or less match my skin.

47. I can travel alone or with my spouse without expecting embarrassment or hostility in those who deal with us.

48. I have no difficulty finding neighborhoods where people approve of our household.

49. My children are given texts and classes which implicitly support our kind of family unit and do not turn them against my choice of domestic partnership.

50. I will feel welcomed and "normal" in the usual walks of public life, institutional and social.
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Old 05-05-2014, 09:27 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Arkie View Post
50 examples of White Privilege

1. I can if I wish arrange to be in the company of people of my race most of the time.

2. I can avoid spending time with people whom I was trained to mistrust and who have learned to mistrust my kind or me.

3. If I should need to move, I can be pretty sure of renting or purchasing housing in an area which I can afford and in which I would want to live.

4. I can be pretty sure that my neighbors in such a location will be neutral or pleasant to me.

5. I can go shopping alone most of the time, pretty well assured that I will not be followed or harassed.

6. I can turn on the television or open to the front page of the paper and see people of my race widely represented.

7. When I am told about our national heritage or about "civilization," I am shown that people of my color made it what it is.

8. I can be sure that my children will be given curricular materials that testify to the existence of their race.

9. If I want to, I can be pretty sure of finding a publisher for this piece on white privilege.

10. I can be pretty sure of having my voice heard in a group in which I am the only member of my race.

11. I can be casual about whether or not to listen to another person's voice in a group in which s/he is the only member of his/her race.

12. I can go into a music shop and count on finding the music of my race represented, into a supermarket and find the staple foods which fit with my cultural traditions, into a hairdresser's shop and find someone who can cut my hair.

13. Whether I use checks, credit cards or cash, I can count on my skin color not to work against the appearance of financial reliability.

14. I can arrange to protect my children most of the time from people who might not like them.

15. I do not have to educate my children to be aware of systemic racism for their own daily physical protection.

16. I can be pretty sure that my children's teachers and employers will tolerate them if they fit school and workplace norms; my chief worries about them do not concern others' attitudes toward their race.

17. I can talk with my mouth full and not have people put this down to my color.

18. I can swear, or dress in second hand clothes, or not answer letters, without having people attribute these choices to the bad morals, the poverty or the illiteracy of my race.

19. I can speak in public to a powerful male group without putting my race on trial.

20. I can do well in a challenging situation without being called a credit to my race.

21. I am never asked to speak for all the people of my racial group.

22. I can remain oblivious of the language and customs of persons of color who constitute the world's majority without feeling in my culture any penalty for such oblivion.

23. I can criticize our government and talk about how much I fear its policies and behavior without being seen as a cultural outsider.

24. I can be pretty sure that if I ask to talk to the "person in charge", I will be facing a person of my race.

25. If a traffic cop pulls me over or if the IRS audits my tax return, I can be sure I haven't been singled out because of my race.

26. I can easily buy posters, post-cards, picture books, greeting cards, dolls, toys and children's magazines featuring people of my race.

27. I can go home from most meetings of organizations I belong to feeling somewhat tied in, rather than isolated, out-of-place, outnumbered, unheard, held at a distance or feared.

28. I can be pretty sure that an argument with a colleague of another race is more likely to jeopardize her/his chances for advancement than to jeopardize mine.

29. I can be pretty sure that if I argue for the promotion of a person of another race, or a program centering on race, this is not likely to cost me heavily within my present setting, even if my colleagues disagree with me.

30. If I declare there is a racial issue at hand, or there isn't a racial issue at hand, my race will lend me more credibility for either position than a person of color will have.

31. I can choose to ignore developments in minority writing and minority activist programs, or disparage them, or learn from them, but in any case, I can find ways to be more or less protected from negative consequences of any of these choices.

32. My culture gives me little fear about ignoring the perspectives and powers of people of other races.

33. I am not made acutely aware that my shape, bearing or body odor will be taken as a reflection on my race.

34. I can worry about racism without being seen as self-interested or self-seeking.

35. I can take a job with an affirmative action employer without having my co-workers on the job suspect that I got it because of my race.

36. If my day, week or year is going badly, I need not ask of each negative episode or situation whether it had racial overtones.

37. I can be pretty sure of finding people who would be willing to talk with me and advise me about my next steps, professionally.

38. I can think over many options, social, political, imaginative or professional, without asking whether a person of my race would be accepted or allowed to do what I want to do.

39. I can be late to a meeting without having the lateness reflect on my race.

40. I can choose public accommodation without fearing that people of my race cannot get in or will be mistreated in the places I have chosen.

41. I can be sure that if I need legal or medical help, my race will not work against me.

42. I can arrange my activities so that I will never have to experience feelings of rejection owing to my race.

43. If I have low credibility as a leader I can be sure that my race is not the problem.

44. I can easily find academic courses and institutions which give attention only to people of my race.

45. I can expect figurative language and imagery in all of the arts to testify to experiences of my race.

46. I can chose blemish cover or bandages in "flesh" color and have them more or less match my skin.

47. I can travel alone or with my spouse without expecting embarrassment or hostility in those who deal with us.

48. I have no difficulty finding neighborhoods where people approve of our household.

49. My children are given texts and classes which implicitly support our kind of family unit and do not turn them against my choice of domestic partnership.

50. I will feel welcomed and "normal" in the usual walks of public life, institutional and social.
Absolutely pathetic and NONE of these rise to the level of becoming the basis for demeaning the accomplishments of the majority while creating artificial outcomes for the minority. You still fail to connect the dots of " white privilege" " disparate impact" etc....
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Old 05-06-2014, 02:34 AM   #21
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Absolutely pathetic and NONE of these rise to the level of becoming the basis for demeaning the accomplishments of the majority while creating artificial outcomes for the minority. You still fail to connect the dots of " white privilege" " disparate impact" etc....
I never said they were a basis for demeaning anyone or rewarding anyone anything. We're not even discussing disparate impact. That's definitely a form of racism when it exists. White privilege is just the reality of perks and advantages that comes from living in a white society.

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Old 06-08-2014, 09:20 AM   #22
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Absolutely pathetic and NONE of these rise to the level of becoming the basis for demeaning the accomplishments of the majority while creating artificial outcomes for the minority. You still fail to connect the dots of " white privilege" " disparate impact" etc....
Blacks and other groups self-segregate and not only aren't condemned for it, but aren't considered as practicing racism or racial privilege for it.

Latino and Asian immigrants to this country chose to mostly settle around those of their shared ethnic background. Nobody is pointing guns at their heads for doing this. African immigrants to this country are mostly settling around black Americans, and again, nobody is pointing guns to their heads.

These racial double-standards is why people say that "anti racism" is really racism, and they're right.
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Old 05-05-2014, 10:35 AM   #23
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The last two paragraphs of that article are some of the most enlightening. They go on to explain exactly how white privilege has its roots in our society. That prior to 1952, if you weren't white, you could not be a naturalized citizen of this country. Its also noted in there how terms like "check your privilege" and other pithy statements do not help to overcome this notion of privilege, but rather breed hostility.

Bottom line is that both Fortgang and Battalora are right. Currently in this country you do have an opportunity to rise up from whatever your station or pigmentation is. As long as we keep pushing for individual equal rights we can only hope that such issues as these can drop into the historical background.
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Old 05-05-2014, 11:01 AM   #24
txtebow
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The last two paragraphs of that article are some of the most enlightening. They go on to explain exactly how white privilege has its roots in our society. That prior to 1952, if you weren't white, you could not be a naturalized citizen of this country. Its also noted in there how terms like "check your privilege" and other pithy statements do not help to overcome this notion of privilege, but rather breed hostility.

Bottom line is that both Fortgang and Battalora are right. Currently in this country you do have an opportunity to rise up from whatever your station or pigmentation is. As long as we keep pushing for individual equal rights we can only hope that such issues as these can drop into the historical background.
I don't think that too great a percentage of our population has any issue with " equal rights" ( opportunity). The problem is that "white privilege" helps give credence to the current left wing movement to go from equality of opportunity to equality of outcome( disparate impact, white privilege, etc). Go look up the NYC firefighter case where blacks and Latinos didn't perform as well as white applicants on a written exam and were subsequently not offered jobs. They were given the same opportunity as white applicants but the results in NYC firefighter demographics were deemed disproportionate and those previous applicants were given badges and back pay for " discrimination"
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Old 05-05-2014, 06:48 PM   #25
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So your idea of "white privilege" consists of the choice of toiletries offered up by a hotel? What I call an inconvenience you and your ilk proclaim as the basis for a racist political movement...
Reading comprehension doesn't come easy to you. I already said it wasn't racist in post #23. It's an inconvenience to be in the minority. You acknowledge that this country caters to the majority, but you can't admit it's a privilege.
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