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Old 02-11-2013, 09:27 PM   #1
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Default The man who killed Osama Bin Laden...Is Screwed

A long read but a damn good read. It's pretty disgusting how bad we treat our heroes. They should never HAVE to work again once they're done being badass mother****ing heroes for all of us. I don't think this should be a partisan political issue where the red team and the blue team argue over whose fault it is...but rather the shame of a nation, and what should be done about this. Hopefully this story gets enough run so that a movement starts and the lawmakers in Washington might make things right with our greatest heroes.

http://www.esquire.com/features/man-...bin-laden-0313
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Old 02-11-2013, 10:40 PM   #2
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I don't get it. Did he do 20 years? If not, what did he expect? It's bad ass that he killed Osama but that's the military.
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Old 02-12-2013, 01:31 AM   #3
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I don't get it. Did he do 20 years? If not, what did he expect? It's bad ass that he killed Osama but that's the military.
He didn't and refused to do a stint in the reserves to make that up. He did it to himself.
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Old 02-12-2013, 05:56 AM   #4
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He didn't and refused to do a stint in the reserves to make that up. He did it to himself.
It may be time to have a conversation regarding these guys and retirement. These dudes volunteer yes, so they know what's up, but they burn out much faster than the guy that sings in the choir for 20 years. Maybe a 15 year retirement might be more appropriate, I don't know.
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Old 02-12-2013, 06:00 AM   #5
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It may be time to have a conversation regarding these guys and retirement. These dudes volunteer yes, so they know what's up, but they burn out much faster than the guy that sings in the choir for 20 years. Maybe a 15 year retirement might be more appropriate, I don't know.
Interesting thought. SF guys go through a hell of a lot more stress than your average soldier, sailor or Marine.
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Old 02-12-2013, 08:42 AM   #6
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I don't get it. Did he do 20 years? If not, what did he expect? It's bad ass that he killed Osama but that's the military.
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He didn't and refused to do a stint in the reserves to make that up. He did it to himself.
The guy was burnt out. What, would you prefer having a burnt out SEAL continue to go on the most dangerous missions so he could get his retirement benefits?

I don't know, I am so in awe of SF that when hearing about 1 or more of them getting screwed by the government it just makes my blood boil. And this travesty needs to be dealt with. And if the government won't do anything about it, a few private charities need to get going to help these heroes out.

Like me, I'm a vet, did 4 years and out, didn't see any combat, I'd have gone if sent but I'm glad I didn't see any. If someone were to ever come up to me and say I'm a hero, I'd tell em to **** off. Cuz I'm not anywhere close to this guy. I might make it 3 or 4 days of SF training before quitting or washing out. This guy and his team members are better people than me. And better people than 99% of the world. This guy and his team members have done more for this country than 99% of the rest of us combined. And to think that he got the same kind of benefits that I got when I got out? Its total bull****. What in the hell can he put on a resume?
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Old 02-12-2013, 09:02 AM   #7
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The guy was burnt out. What, would you prefer having a burnt out SEAL continue to go on the most dangerous missions so he could get his retirement benefits?

I don't know, I am so in awe of SF that when hearing about 1 or more of them getting screwed by the government it just makes my blood boil. And this travesty needs to be dealt with. And if the government won't do anything about it, a few private charities need to get going to help these heroes out.

Like me, I'm a vet, did 4 years and out, didn't see any combat, I'd have gone if sent but I'm glad I didn't see any. If someone were to ever come up to me and say I'm a hero, I'd tell em to **** off. Cuz I'm not anywhere close to this guy. I might make it 3 or 4 days of SF training before quitting or washing out. This guy and his team members are better people than me. And better people than 99% of the world. This guy and his team members have done more for this country than 99% of the rest of us combined. And to think that he got the same kind of benefits that I got when I got out? Its total bull****. What in the hell can he put on a resume?
How bout

KILLED OSAMA BIN LADEN
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Old 02-12-2013, 02:23 PM   #8
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The guy was burnt out. What, would you prefer having a burnt out SEAL continue to go on the most dangerous missions so he could get his retirement benefits?

I don't know, I am so in awe of SF that when hearing about 1 or more of them getting screwed by the government it just makes my blood boil. And this travesty needs to be dealt with. And if the government won't do anything about it, a few private charities need to get going to help these heroes out.

Like me, I'm a vet, did 4 years and out, didn't see any combat, I'd have gone if sent but I'm glad I didn't see any. If someone were to ever come up to me and say I'm a hero, I'd tell em to **** off. Cuz I'm not anywhere close to this guy. I might make it 3 or 4 days of SF training before quitting or washing out. This guy and his team members are better people than me. And better people than 99% of the world. This guy and his team members have done more for this country than 99% of the rest of us combined. And to think that he got the same kind of benefits that I got when I got out? Its total bull****. What in the hell can he put on a resume?
No one is question his honor or fact that he did his duty, but he made very bad decision. I am sure that everyone in his command from the CO on down told him what would happen and gave him options. If he was burned out but needed the years they could have gotten him something down in Little Creek or NB Norfolk that could done his time and been home by 1600 every day. Heck he could walk right into Veteran Civilian Intern Billet for the DoN and had a job in Civil Service if he wanted it.

BTW I think there is more to this story then what been reported.

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Old 02-12-2013, 12:03 AM   #9
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These guys are some of the most motivated and disciplined individuals in the world, to the point of being almost machine like. They are forced into leadership positions that give them more powerful experience than mid-level executives in the worlds biggest companies, with more on the line, in quite literally the most stressful environment that anyone could be placed in.

If they spent 15+ years in the SEALs and actually had a good enough performance record to be the one chosen to take out Osama, then they represent a fraction of a percent of the individuals in this world in terms of performance and aptitude under stress.

It really sucks they can't put that on a resume. There's plenty of stories involving SEALs and other special forces guys going to Harvard Business School and coming out as successful executives. Harvard would love to have them, but you have to first take the tests, the interviews, and arrange for the loans/money to pay for such education. And if you have a family, school may not be an option at all.

I read the whole article, its pretty gut wrenching, takes all the glory out of being a hero when you realize they get the short end of the stick.
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Old 02-12-2013, 06:08 AM   #10
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http://gawker.com/5983541/despite-es...to-health-care

In the wake of the Esquire article's publication, which prompted a wave of media coverage (including here on Gawker), Stars and Stripes reporter Megan McCloskey did some digging and discovered that one of the main cruxes of the piece—that the the SEAL shooter receives no health coverage from the government—is inaccurate. Like other Iraq and Afghanistan veterans, asserts McCloskey, the SEAL is eligible for five years of free medical care upon retirement, a fact Esquire writer Phil Bronstein left out of his piece.

The writer, Phil Bronstein, who heads up the Center for Investigative Reporting, stands by the story. He said the assertion that the government gave the SEAL "nothing" in terms of health care is both fair and accurate, because the SEAL didn't know the VA benefits existed.
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Old 02-12-2013, 08:41 AM   #11
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http://gawker.com/5983541/despite-es...to-health-care

In the wake of the Esquire article's publication, which prompted a wave of media coverage (including here on Gawker), Stars and Stripes reporter Megan McCloskey did some digging and discovered that one of the main cruxes of the piece—that the the SEAL shooter receives no health coverage from the government—is inaccurate. Like other Iraq and Afghanistan veterans, asserts McCloskey, the SEAL is eligible for five years of free medical care upon retirement, a fact Esquire writer Phil Bronstein left out of his piece.

The writer, Phil Bronstein, who heads up the Center for Investigative Reporting, stands by the story. He said the assertion that the government gave the SEAL "nothing" in terms of health care is both fair and accurate, because the SEAL didn't know the VA benefits existed.
How this article got written with such poor research is amazing. There's this thing called outprocessing where, if you pay attention, you learn about the benefits you can access. Either this guy missed it or he wasn't told. Either way, a far cry from the point the article/author was trying to make. Shoddy.
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Old 02-12-2013, 01:13 PM   #12
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http://gawker.com/5983541/despite-es...to-health-care

In the wake of the Esquire article's publication, which prompted a wave of media coverage (including here on Gawker), Stars and Stripes reporter Megan McCloskey did some digging and discovered that one of the main cruxes of the piece—that the the SEAL shooter receives no health coverage from the government—is inaccurate. Like other Iraq and Afghanistan veterans, asserts McCloskey, the SEAL is eligible for five years of free medical care upon retirement, a fact Esquire writer Phil Bronstein left out of his piece.

The writer, Phil Bronstein, who heads up the Center for Investigative Reporting, stands by the story. He said the assertion that the government gave the SEAL "nothing" in terms of health care is both fair and accurate, because the SEAL didn't know the VA benefits existed.
The guy didn't retire. I do recall them offering something like the 18 month healthcare when I transitioned out but I didn't need it so I'm not sure the exacts of it. The claim here just doesn't make any sense.
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Old 02-12-2013, 01:21 PM   #13
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The guy didn't retire. I do recall them offering something like the 18 month healthcare when I transitioned out but I didn't need it so I'm not sure the exacts of it. The claim here just doesn't make any sense.
Huh? From the article:

"By early September of last year, the Shooter was out, officially. Retired."

The editor who ran the story says the story is making a point about the difficult and byzantine nature of the VA system, and how it is broken, and how it has affected this particular guy.

The original piece makes no such argument. It could have made that argument, but it did not, because it was badly edited. Esquire chose to publish a sweeping, overwrought account of how this hapless SEAL was "screwed" by the system—utterly abandoned—rather than presenting the case that the current system is inadequate and frustrating and difficult to navigate. That would have been a good case to make, but the story did not make it, and now the editors are trying to backfill the work they didn't do in the first place.
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Old 02-12-2013, 01:24 PM   #14
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Huh? From the article:

"By early September of last year, the Shooter was out, officially. Retired."

The editor who ran the story says the story is making a point about the difficult and byzantine nature of the VA system, and how it is broken, and how it has affected this particular guy.

The original piece makes no such argument. It could have made that argument, but it did not, because it was badly edited. Esquire chose to publish a sweeping, overwrought account of how this hapless SEAL was "screwed" by the system—utterly abandoned—rather than presenting the case that the current system is inadequate and frustrating and difficult to navigate. That would have been a good case to make, but the story did not make it, and now the editors are trying to backfill the work they didn't do in the first place.
He didn't retire - that's where this mess came from. If he'd retired, he'd have healthcare. He got out at 16 so that's the same, in that regard, as getting out after 3.
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Old 02-12-2013, 02:34 PM   #15
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http://gawker.com/5983541/despite-es...to-health-care

In the wake of the Esquire article's publication, which prompted a wave of media coverage (including here on Gawker), Stars and Stripes reporter Megan McCloskey did some digging and discovered that one of the main cruxes of the piece—that the the SEAL shooter receives no health coverage from the government—is inaccurate. Like other Iraq and Afghanistan veterans, asserts McCloskey, the SEAL is eligible for five years of free medical care upon retirement, a fact Esquire writer Phil Bronstein left out of his piece.

The writer, Phil Bronstein, who heads up the Center for Investigative Reporting, stands by the story. He said the assertion that the government gave the SEAL "nothing" in terms of health care is both fair and accurate, because the SEAL didn't know the VA benefits existed.
My dad goes to the VA and gets free or very reduced treatment and he has been out of the service for 45 years. Did they change coverage for VA services down to 5 years? That would suck.

I am surprised they don't have a better outplacement support in place for these guys. What is the line about teaching a man to fish? In the end it is his life and he has to make the transition himself. Sure people are making money off the event but he needs to focus on his life and what he can control.

I am all for giving these hero's unlimited healthcare (through the VA) and the support (mental and outplacement) he needs to adapt to civilian life but I am not for giving them anything. They need to forge their own paths through the rest of their lives. If anything the armed forces should have these guys thinking about life after the service the whole time they are in it.

I have been through a sudden life change and it sucks but I got through it by having goals, plans and doing what I could to make my life better.
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Old 02-12-2013, 06:20 AM   #16
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Very one sided, I feel for the guy but you make choices in life. My brother works for a private security company and makes 4 times what I do as an engineer and he's doing the same thing he did as a scout sniper/force recon Marine. There is always an option.

And yes, I am a veteran myself.
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Old 02-12-2013, 08:36 AM   #17
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Very one sided, I feel for the guy but you make choices in life. My brother works for a private security company and makes 4 times what I do as an engineer and he's doing the same thing he did as a scout sniper/force recon Marine. There is always an option.

And yes, I am a veteran myself.
What kind of security do they do? Like Blackwater or guarding armoured trucks in the US?
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Old 02-12-2013, 08:37 AM   #18
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What kind of security do they do? Like Blackwater or guarding armoured trucks in the US?
Blackwater is actually the exact company, I forget what they are named now but they changed names. He is at an embassy in Iraq.
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Old 02-12-2013, 06:28 AM   #19
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Let's not forget the heroes that did the waterboarding to find out where Osama was hiding, like it or not that really works.
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Old 02-12-2013, 07:00 AM   #20
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Let's cut more money from defense. Shyt there's talk of going away from the pension and just doing a 401k for the military.
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Old 02-12-2013, 08:17 AM   #21
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America has been screwing over its vets since the Congress refused to pay off Revolutionary War veterans. It's why Washington, DC is a federal district, because Congress wasn't sure a state militia would protect them against protesting soldiers. Hell, read about the Bonus March of WW1 veterans in 1932. America has always **** on its vets while at the same time politicians give speeches about how wonderful the vets are and how it's all apple pie and flags flying. It's an American tradition; After the bullets are done flying, the vets get kicked to the curb. After the Vietnam War, you would have thought it was the vets who were responsible for it, instead of the lying politicians.
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Old 02-12-2013, 08:33 AM   #22
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Single payer healthcare system for all.
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Old 02-12-2013, 08:46 AM   #23
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Single payer healthcare system for all.
That would require that a whole bunch of people pull their heads out of their asses and start looking at reality. Ain't gonna happen. Not to mention, you have giant industries like insurance, Big Pharma and healthcare buying up enough politicians and media message to make sure it never happens.
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Old 02-12-2013, 06:43 PM   #24
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Single payer healthcare system for all.
Yep.

A HEALTHY nation is a productive nation.
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Old 02-12-2013, 11:36 AM   #25
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Let's cut more money from defense. Shyt there's talk of going away from the pension and just doing a 401k for the military.
It's too bad there isn't more of a graduated system of retirement benefits for our military. You should get more benefits sticking around for 19 years than someone who does 4. I'm no expert, so maybe you do, but my impression is that isn't the case.

Cutting military spending should be (and mostly is) about eliminating spending on unneeded weapons development and procurement, and reducing the active force to levels appropriate for our current commitments (which have been reduced as we extricate ourselves from our major wars). We should take some of the savings and drastically increase our funding for veteran's support, in particular health-care (especially mental health), and programs to transition to civilian life. These aren't regular jobs, and shouldn't be treated as such. It is our responsibility to allow our military personnel to re-enter civilian life with as little trauma as possible.
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