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Old 02-26-2012, 04:45 PM   #1
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Robert Turbin, RB Utah State

He's got tremendous size and runs well downhill. Good character but has durability and ball protection issues. He clocked 4.44 today (they bumped the official to 4.5) and at 225 that's a lot of man to bring down. His knock is that there is uncertainty that he can be an every down back which is good, we don't need an every down back. We need a worker with size to wear down Ds and spell McG. Turbin can break off the 80 harder as well,something we have lacked in our game. I am a buyer in round 4.
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Old 02-26-2012, 04:55 PM   #2
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Tremendous size?

225 is about 2% above average...
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Old 02-26-2012, 05:53 PM   #3
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Tremendous size?

225 is about 2% above average...


That's blatantly wrong, and you're going to trick maners into thinking it's true when it's just not.

The average weight of 28 backs who weighed in at the 2012 combine was 206 lbs.... 2% of 225 is 220 1/2...

You're only off by 15.5 pounds!

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Old 02-26-2012, 05:56 PM   #4
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Well, that's just flatout wrong, and you're going to trick maners into thinking it's true when it's just not.

The average of the 28 backs who went to the combine was 206.... 2% of 225 is 220 1/2... You're only off by 15 pounds!
The average size for an NFL running back is 219.6 lbs.

225 is 2.4% larger.

Wow...

Kids a good player but his size is far from "tremendous".
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Old 02-26-2012, 06:07 PM   #5
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The average size for an NFL running back is 219.6 lbs.

225 is 2.4% larger.

Wow...

Kids a good player but his size is far from "tremendous".


Average of the top 25 backs in 2012 was 218.9, essentially what you said. Those numbers are obviously inflated in both height and weight.

Also, we're clearly talking about the averages of prospects, not rookies. NPretty much every running back puts on 5 pounds of muscle in their first NFL offseason, there's a reason why the NFL average is so much bigger...

So... Robert Turbin is 2.4% bigger than the average back despite never having been on an NFL weight lifting regiment/diet/never had an offseason to put on weight...

But if you don't want to take into account the fact that the average back puts on 10 pounds (your numbers, not mine) from combine to the NFL, that's fine...

wow...?

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Old 02-26-2012, 06:08 PM   #6
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Avearage of the top 25 backs in 2012 was 218.96, and those numbers are obviously inflated in both height and weight. Most guys tack on an inch and 5 pounds to their actual measurements.
lol... once again, reference my original post on the subject that you called "blatantly wrong":

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Originally Posted by TheReverend View Post
Tremendous size?

225 is about 2% above average...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jameson View Post
Also, we're clearly talking about the averages of prospects, not rookies. NPretty much every running back puts on 5 pounds of muscle in their first NFL offseason, there's a reason why the NFL average is so much bigger...

But if you don't want to take into account the fact that the average back puts on 10 pounds (your numbers, not mine) from combine to the NFL, that's fine...
I'll take "Made up stats" for $1,000, Alex.
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Old 02-26-2012, 04:58 PM   #7
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Dude looked like a beast to today!!! I have never seen him play (don't fallow College football much). What was his competition like? Did he go against good defenses?

If we could get him in the 3rd-4th I am all for it!!! His fanaticism for the Hulk sure explains how he looked today at the combine.
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Old 02-26-2012, 04:59 PM   #8
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he destroyed my Cowboys. I have been wishing he was a Bronco since then. Still he does have injury issues I don't think he gets taken before late 3rd.
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Old 02-26-2012, 05:03 PM   #9
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he destroyed my Cowboys. I have been wishing he was a Bronco since then. Still he does have injury issues I don't think he gets taken before late 3rd.
That's what I am talking about. 4th or later and he starts presenting real value. And with the short shelf life of the position in the nfl I would like to see us grab a guy or two through the draft. One is likely all we'll grab, if any.
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Old 02-26-2012, 05:18 PM   #10
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Watching him today he seemed kind of top heavy. Looked like it limited his flexibility a bit when they had him running routes.

Just what I saw, anyway.

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Old 02-26-2012, 05:18 PM   #11
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Durability and ball control issues? Sounds like a winner!
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Old 02-26-2012, 05:21 PM   #12
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Durability and ball control issues? Sounds like a winner!
He's not a fumbling menagerie but an extra drop or two in a season makes a world of difference. And if he didn't have issues we wouldn't get a whiff at the guy. After today we may not anyway.
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Old 02-26-2012, 05:48 PM   #13
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I ****ing love this man. That is all. No other player I'd rather see in orange and blue. Same durability issues that McGahee had coming out of college. You do NOT get a better blend of power and speed in this draft with anyone else but TR.
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Old 02-26-2012, 05:49 PM   #14
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I am a buyer in round 4.
We won't make it past the 2nd, mark my words.
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Old 02-26-2012, 06:28 PM   #15
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We won't make it past the 2nd, mark my words.
Yeah, he probably beasted his way out of our reach.
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Old 02-26-2012, 05:57 PM   #16
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I don't want 4.5 ish power back with durability concerns. We have a decent power back to split carries with in McGahee. What I want is a sub 4.5 40 speed back with vision that's able to cut and go and catch an edge and get those 10, 15, 20 yard runs on 3rd and 3. I basically want prime Clinton Portis without the flavor.
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Old 02-26-2012, 06:29 PM   #17
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I don't want 4.5 ish power back with durability concerns. We have a decent power back to split carries with in McGahee. What I want is a sub 4.5 40 speed back with vision that's able to cut and go and catch an edge and get those 10, 15, 20 yard runs on 3rd and 3. I basically want prime Clinton Portis without the flavor.
He's sub 4.5. He ran 4.44 and 4.47.
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Old 02-26-2012, 10:49 PM   #18
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I don't want 4.5 ish power back with durability concerns. We have a decent power back to split carries with in McGahee. What I want is a sub 4.5 40 speed back with vision that's able to cut and go and catch an edge and get those 10, 15, 20 yard runs on 3rd and 3. I basically want prime Clinton Portis without the flavor.
that would be nice. but the power back we have currently probably doesn't have much left in the tank, and if you think about our HC preference in RBs it is highly unlikely this team drafts a LaMichael James type of back. look at Fox's track record, most of his backs have been big strong runners, usually in the 6ft and 220lbs+ range. Fox seemingly prefers power and ball control backs who break yardage at a consistent 4-5 yards an attempt, as opposed to smaller backs who rely on speed and get dropped for loss more often than they break the long run.
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Old 02-26-2012, 06:15 PM   #19
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Clearly it's impossible that larger backs tend to have more success in the league, while smaller backs fail or are not drafted.
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Old 02-26-2012, 06:44 PM   #20
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Well I deleted that post to edit it and then you quoted me.

And weight is possible to put on, yes. That doesn't help the fallacy in your thinking that just because NFL RBs are heavier on average they must have gained that weight after being drafted. Had you even considered that perhaps the ones who had success were the ones who were above the combine average, and then stuck around in the league thereby raising the average NFL RB weight?

It's silly logic, dude.
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Old 02-26-2012, 06:50 PM   #21
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Well I deleted that post to edit it and then you quoted me.

And weight is possible to put on, yes. That doesn't help the fallacy in your thinking that just because NFL RBs are heavier on average they must have gained that weight after being drafted. Had you even considered that perhaps the ones who had success were the ones who were above the combine average, and then stuck around in the league thereby raising the average NFL RB weight?

It's silly logic, dude.
I can still quote you to show how ironic it is that you question my logic and call it silly...

I have and I'm going to go back to that espn inside website, and do the same excel average, this time using only the top 15 prospects (instead of the 50 i did before)

If I'm wrong, I will own up. If this number is 210-214 lbs like i think it will be, these guys clearly put on at least 5 pounds
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Old 02-26-2012, 06:57 PM   #22
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I have and I'm going to go back to that espn inside website, and do the same excel average, this time using only the top 15 prospects (instead of the 50 i did before)

If I'm wrong, I will own up. If this number is 210-214 lbs like i think it will be, these guys clearly put on at least 5 pounds
You're probably not far off when it comes to the typical weight gain, I could easily see 5+ pounds being normal. I was just pointing out that coming to that conclusion on the basis of combine average versus NFL average is illogical. It's also silly to judge a guy by comparing him to the combine average, for similar reasons.
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Old 02-26-2012, 07:40 PM   #23
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That doesn't help the fallacy in your thinking that just because NFL RBs are heavier on average they must have gained that weight after being drafted. Had you even considered that perhaps the ones who had success were the ones who were above the combine average, and then stuck around in the league thereby raising the average NFL RB weight?

It's silly logic, dude.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jameson View Post
I have and I'm going to go back to that espn inside website, and do the same excel average, this time using only the top 15 prospects (instead of the 50 i did before)

If I'm wrong, I will own up. If this number is 210-214 lbs like i think it will be, these guys clearly put on at least 5 pounds
Average weights of top 10 drafted nfl rb prospects from 2006-2011


2012 Top-10 prospects have not been determined, and cannot be used.
*all RB's drafted and played at FB were ommited, as all FB prospects were listed under "RB" on this site (Greg Jones, Madison Hedgecock, etc.)

2011- 214 lbs

2010- 210 lbs

2009- 213 lbs

2008- 211 lbs

2007- 214 lbs

2006-212 lbs
In conclusion, the average of these top RB picks over the last 6 years is 212 lbs. Essentially, each top drafted running back puts on close to 8 pounds of the course of their career.

So Shanahan, you were "right" in that better players weigh more, which I wouldn't have disagreed with... ever.

But you did say this:

Quote:
That doesn't help the fallacy in your thinking that just because NFL RBs are heavier on average they must have gained that weight after being drafted.
and then one page later you completely contradicted yourself:

Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shananahan View Post
You're probably not far off when it comes to the typical weight gain, I could easily see 5+ pounds being normal.
my "fallacy" was a fact. The fact is players did put on 7+ pounds on average after being drafted. I don't mean to rub it in, or be a pompous a-hole, but.. case dismissed. lastly:

Quote:
Had you even considered that perhaps the ones who had success were the ones who were above the combine average, and then stuck around in the league thereby raising the average NFL RB weight?[
I had thought about that, but I knew that it wouldn't account for all of the weight differential.

Also, Reverend, I totally pulled that statistic that rookie running backs put on 5 pounds out of my ass, huh? I can't even refute claims you made, because you never made any claims. You just said I was backpedaling and utilized your (in my opinion) horrible jokes and entertaining but still annoying gifs.
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Old 02-26-2012, 07:45 PM   #24
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Also, Reverend, I totally pulled that statistic that rookie running backs put on 5 pounds out of my ass, huh? I can't even refute claims you made, because you never made any claims. You just said I was backpedaling and utilized your (in my opinion) horrible jokes and entertaining but still annoying gifs.
...yes, yes I did make a claim.

I claimed he didn't have tremendous size because he's 2% bigger than the average NFL RB.

You called that blatantly wrong... but its an actual fact that you even ended up admitting.
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Old 02-26-2012, 07:49 PM   #25
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...yes, yes I did make a claim.

I claimed he didn't have tremendous size because he's 2% bigger than the average NFL RB.

You called that blatantly wrong... but its an actual fact that you even ended up admitting.
I can admit that those numbers are correct, but I refuted the importance of those numbers since the combine numbers are what matter.

Since, like I just proved, each player, including Turbin, will hypothetically put on an average of 8 pounds, putting at Turbin at a massive 228-235. Not so "above average" anymore, huh? That's a full 8-15 pounds bigger than the average back, 4-6% more than the average back. At the very minimum, that's 2-3 times bigger than your estimate.

Case closed.
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