View Single Post
Old 03-04-2013, 06:57 PM   #56
Ring of Famer

Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 6,384

Originally Posted by errand View Post
Chicago says hi!

Chicago pop. - 2.7 million
Houston pop. - 2.15 million

Chicago household median income -$38,600
Houston household median income-$37,000

% Black - Chicago 32.9% Houston 24%
% Hispanic - Chicago 28.9% Houston 44%
% Asian - Chicago - 5.5% Houston 6%
% White - Chicago 31.7% Houston 26%

both cities are pretty similar......until you see that,

Chicago has no carry and conceal law, where Houston does. Chicago has arguably the toughest gun laws in the nation....Houston? Guns are bought as fashion acessories

Chicago doesn't have any gun shops, gun shows, etc....where Houston has approximately 1500 places (pawn shops, gun shops, gun shows, walmart, etc.) where you could buy a gun (shotgun, rifle, pistol)

In 2012, Chicago had 506 homicides, Houston had 207 homicides

Total homicides per 100K in population Chicago has almost twice as many (18.4) as Houston (9.6)

How is that possible?
Hi Chicago, how are you? Did you know we were talking about whether having a gun in the home prevents burglaries?

The rest of the nation and the international community say hi!

Theoretically, knowledge that potential victims have access to firearms could increase the perceived cost of committing a crime to a potential perpetrator and thus prevent the crime from occurring. However, there does not seem to be credible evidence that higher levels of gun ownership and availability actually deter crime. A criminologist once claimed that publicized police programs to train citizens in gun use in Orlando (to prevent rape) and in Kansas City (to prevent robbery) led to reductions in crime.[80] However, a careful analysis of the data found no evidence that crime rates changed in either location after the training.[81] The deterrent effects of civilian gun ownership on burglary rates were supposedly shown by the experiences of Morton Grove, Illinois—after it banned handguns—and Kennesaw, Georgia (I saw you use it AGAIN as an example in that other's horse**** and I've already addressed this...I lived in Kennesaw for three years)— after it required that firearms be kept in all homes.[80] Again, a careful analysis of the data did not show that guns reduced crime.[82] Instead, in Morton Grove, the banning of handguns was actually followed by a large and statistically significant decrease in burglary reports.[81]

One study found an association between lower crime rates in states with higher levels of household gun ownership.[83] But the gun ownership data for the analysis were not valid. The source of the data (Voter News Service) stated that the data could not justifiably be used to determine state-level gun ownership levels or changes in gun ownership rates.

Some have argued that when gun prevalence is high, there are fewer burglaries[84] and fewer "hot" burglaries (when someone is at home) because burglars will seek out unoccupied dwellings to avoid being shot.[80,85] But the evidence does not show this. An international compilation of victimization surveys in 11 developed countries found that the United States (with the most guns) was average in terms of attempted and completed burglary rates,[86] and there was no relationship between gun prevalence and burglary rates.[12] Studies in the United States across states and counties found that in areas with higher levels of household gun ownership, there were actually more burglaries, and there were more burglaries when someone was at home, not less.[63,87] One reason may be that guns, like cash and jewelry, are attractive loot for burglars, and burglars may target houses with many guns.
I already posted this when Aurora happened, and no one had an answer for it then...I don't suppose you will now. There are 5 full pages for you to feast on, and just in case "Medscape" is too liberal of a site for you, here's a list of their sources. You can slog through them if you I've said, I've already done the research, and I already know the facts.


Lizotte AJ, Bordua DJ. Firearms ownership for sport and protection: two divergent models. Am Sociol Rev. 1980;45:229–244.

Glaeser EL, Glendon S. Who owns guns? Criminals, victims, and the culture of violence. Am Econ Rev. 1998;88:458–462.

Hemenway D, Barber C, Miller M. Unintentional firearm deaths: a comparison of other-inflicted and self-inflicted shootings. Accid Anal Prev. 2010;42:1184–1188.

Richardson EG, Hemenway D. Homicide, suicide, and unintentional firearm fatality: comparing the United States with other high-income countries, 2003 [published online ahead of print June 21, 2010]. J Trauma. doi: 10.1097/TA. 0b013e3181dbaddf

Centers for Disease Control. Rates of homicide, suicide and firearm-related death among children, 26 industrialized countries. MMWR Morb Mortal Wkly Rep. 1997;46:101–105. Accessed December 17, 2010.

Centers for Disease Control. WISQARS Injury Mortality Reports, 1999–2007. Accessed December 17, 2010.

Miller M, Azrael D, Hemenway D. Firearm availability and unintentional firearm deaths. Accid Anal Prev. 2001;33:477–484.

Price JH, Thompson AJ, Dake JA. Factors associated with state variations in homicide, suicide, and unintentional firearm deaths. J Community Health. 2004;29:271–283.

Miller M, Azrael D, Hemenway D, Vriniotis M. Firearm storage practices and rates of unintentional firearm deaths in the United States. Accid Anal Prev. 2005;37:661–667.

Vyrostek S, Annest J, Ryan G. Surveillance for fatal and nonfatal injuries-United States 2001. MMWR Surveill Summ. 2004;53(SS-7):1–57.

Sinauer N, Annest JL, Mercy JA. Unintentional, nonfatal firearm-related injuries: a preventable public health burden. JAMA. 1996;275:1740–1743.

Hemenway D. Private Guns Public Health. Ann Arbor, MI: University of Michigan Press; 2006.

Katcher ML, Meister AN, Sorkness CA, et al. Use of the modified Delphi technique to identify and rate home injury hazard risks and prevention methods for young children. Inj Prev. 2006;12:189–194.

Peterson LG, Peterson M, O'Shanick GJ, Swann A. Self-inflicted gunshot wounds: lethality of method versus intent. Am J Psychiatry. 1985;142:228–231.

Owens D, Horrocks J, House A. Fatal and non-fatal repetition of self-harm. Br J Psychiatry. 2002;181:193–199.

Gibb SJ, Beautrais AL, Fergusson DM. Mortality and further suicidal behaviour after an index suicide attempt: a 10-year study. Aust N Z J Psychiatry. 2005;39:95–100.

Jamison KR. Night Falls Fast: Understanding Suicide. New York, NY: Knopf; 1999.

Miller M, Hemenway D. The relationship between firearms and suicide: a review of the literature. Aggress Violent Behav. 1999;4:807–814.

Brent DA, Perper JA, Goldstein CE, et al. Risk factors for adolescent suicide: a comparison of adolescent suicide victims with suicidal inpatients. Arch Gen Psychiatry. 1988;45:581–588.

Brent DA, Perper JA, Allman CJ, Moritz GM, Wartella ME, Zelenak JP. The presence and accessibility of firearms in the homes of adolescent suicides: a case-control study. JAMA. 1991;266:2989–2995.

Brent DA, Perper J, Moritz G, Baugher M, Allman C. Suicide in adolescents with no apparent psychopathology. J Am Acad Child Adolesc Psychiatry. 1993;32:494–500.

Brent DA, Perper JA, Moritz G, Baugher M, Schweers J, Roth C. Firearms and adolescent suicide: a community casecontrol study. Am J Dis Child. 1993;147:1066–1071.

Brent DA, Perper JA, Moritz G, Baugher M, Schweers J, Roth C. Suicide in affectively ill adolescents: a case-control study. J Affect Disord. 1994;31:193–202.

Brent DA, Baugher M, Bridge J, Chen T, Chiappetta L. Age- and sex-related risk factors for adolescent suicide. J Am Acad Child Adolesc Psychiatry. 1999;38:1497–1505.

Conwell Y, Duberstein PR, Connor K, Eberly S, Cox C, Caine ED. Access to firearms and risk for suicide in middle-aged and older adults. Am J Geriatr Psychiatry. 2002;10:407–416.

Kellermann AL, Rivara FP, Somes G, et al. Suicide in the home in relation to gun ownership. N Engl J Med. 1992;327:467–472.

Cummings P, Koepsell TD, Grossman DC, Savarino J, Thompson RS. The association between the purchase of a handgun and homicide or suicide. Am J Public Health. 1997;87:974–978.

Kung HC, Pearson JL, Liu X. Risk factors for male and female suicide decedents ages 15–64 in the United States: results from the 1993 National Mortality Followback Survey. Soc Psychiatry Psychiatr Epidemiol. 2003;38:419–426.

Kung HC, Pearson JL, Wei R. Substance use, firearm availability, depressive symptoms, and mental health service utilization among white and African American suicide decedents aged 15 to 64 years. Ann Epidemiol. 2005;15:614–621.

Dahlberg LL, Ikeda RM, Kresnow MJ. Guns in the home and risk of a violent death in the home: findings from a national study. Am J Epidemiol. 2004;160:929–936.

Wiebe DJ. Homicide and suicide risks associated with firearms in the home: a national case-control study. Ann Emerg Med. 2003;41:771–782.

Shah S, Hoffman RE, Wake L, Marine WM. Adolescent suicide and household access to firearms in Colorado: results of a case-control study. J Adolesc Health. 2000;26:157–163.

Grassel KM, Wintemute GJ, Wright MA, Romero MP. Association between handgun purchase and mortality from firearm injury. Inj Prev. 2003;9:48–52.

Shenassa ED, Rogers ML, Spalding KL, Roberts MB. Safer storage of firearms at home and risk of suicide: a study of protective factors in a nationally representative sample. J Epidemiol Community Health. 2004;58:841–848.

Grossman DC, Mueller BA, Riedy C, et al. Gun storage practices and risk of youth suicide and unintentional firearm injuries. JAMA. 2005;293:707–714.

Wintemute GJ, Parham CA, Beaumont JJ, Wright M, Drake C. Mortality among recent purchasers of handguns. N Engl J Med. 1999;341:1583–1589.

Markush R, Bartolucci A. Firearms and suicide in the United States. Am J Public Health. 1984;64:123–127.

Lester D. Firearm availability and the incidence of suicide and homicide. Acta Psychiatr Belg. 1988;88:387–393.

Birkmayer J, Hemenway D. Suicide and gun prevalence: are youth disproportionately affected? Suicide Life Threat Behav. 2001;31:303–310.

Lester D. Availability of guns and the likelihood of suicide. Sociol Soc Res. 1987;71:287–288.

Lester D. Gun ownership and suicide in the United States. Psychol Med. 1989;19:519–521.

Hellsten JJ. Motivation and Opportunity: An Ecological Investigation of U.S. Urban Suicide, 1970–1990. Irvine, CA: University of California; 1995.

Miller M, Lippmann S, Azrael D, Hemenway D. Household firearm ownership and rates of suicide across the 50 U.S. states. J Trauma. 2007;62:1029–1035.

Miller M, Azrael D, Hemenawy D. Household firearm ownership levels and suicide across U.S. regions and states, 0 1988–1997. Epidemiology. 2002;13:517–524.

Kleck G, Patterson EB. The impact of gun control and gun ownership levels on violence rates. J Quant Criminol. 1993;9:249–287.

Miller M, Azrael D, Hepburn L, Hemenway D. The association between changes in household firearm ownership and rates of suicide in the United States, 1981–2002. Inj Prev. 2006;12:178–182.

Kessler R, Berglund P, Borges G, Nock M, Wang PS. Trends in suicide ideation, plans, gestures, and attempts in the United States, 1990–1992 to 2001–2003. JAMA. 2005;293:2487–2495.

Sorenson SB, Vittes KA. Mental health and firearms in community-based surveys: implications for suicide prevention. Eval Rev. 2008;32:239–256.

Oslin DW, Zubritsky C, Brown G, Mullahy M, Puliafico A, Ten Have T. Managing suicide risk in late life: Access to firearms as a public health risk. Am J Geriatr Psychiatry. 2004;12:30–36.

Miller M, Barber C, Azrael D, Hemenway D, Molnar BE. Recent psychopathology, suicidal thoughts and suicide attempts in households with and without firearms: findings from the National Comorbidity Study Replication. Inj Prev. 2009;15:183–187.

Ilgen M, Zivin K, McCammon R, Valenstein M. Mental illness, previous suicidality, and access to guns in the United States. Psychiatr Serv. 2008;59:198–200.

Berman A, Brown R, Diaz G, et al. Consensus statement on youth suicide by firearms. Arch Suicide Res. 1998;4:89–94.

Mann JJ, Apter A, Bertolote J, et al. Suicide prevention strategies: a systematic review. JAMA. 2005;294:2064–2074.

Miller M, Azrael D, Hemenway D. Rates of household firearm ownership and homicide across US regions and states, 1988–1997. Am J Public Health. 2002;92:1988–1993.

Miller M, Hemenway D, Azrael D. Statelevel homicide victimization rates in the US in relation to survey measures of household firearm ownership, 2001–2003. Soc Sci Med. 2007;64:656–664.

Zimring FE. The medium is the message: firearms caliber as a determinant of death from assault. J Legal Stud. 1972;1:97–123.

Hepburn L, Hemenawy D. Firearm availability and homicide: a review of the literature. Aggress Violent Behav. 2004;9:417–440.

Hemenway D, Miller M. Firearm availability and homicide rates across twentysix high-income countries. J Trauma. 2000;49:985–988.

Brearly HC. Homicide in the United States. Chapel Hill, NC: University of North Carolina Press; 2003.

Seitz ST. Firearms, homicide, and gun control effectiveness. Law Soc Rev. 1972;6:595–614.

Lester D. Relationship between firearm availability and primary and secondary murder. Psychol Rep. 1990;67:490.

Ruddell R, Mays G. State background checks and firearm homicides. J Crim Justice. 2005;33:127–136.

Duggan M. More guns more crime. J Polit Econ. 2001;109:1086–1114.

Cook P, Ludwig J. The social costs of gun ownership. J Public Econ. 2006;90:379–391.

Kellermann AL, Rivara FP, Rushforth NB, et al. Gun ownership as a risk factor for homicide in the home. N Engl J Med. 1993;329:1084–1091.

Rowland J, Holtzhauer F. Homicide involving firearms between family, relatives, and friends in Ohio: an offenderbased case-control study. Am J Epidemiol. 1989;130:825.

Kleck G, Hogan H. A national case control study of homicide offending and gun ownership. Soc Probl. 1999;46:175–193.

Hemenway D, Shinoda-Tagawa T, Miller M. Firearm availability and female homicide victimization rates among 25 populous high-income countries. J Am Med Womens Assoc. 2002;57:100–104.

Bailey JE, Kellermann AL, Somes GW, Banton JG, Rivara FP, Rushforth NP. Risk factors for violent death of women in the home. Arch Int Med. 1997;157:777–782.

Campbell JC, Webster D, Koziol-McLain J, et al. Risk factors for femicide in abusive relationships: results from a multi-site case control study. Am J Public Health. 2003;93:1089–1097.

Reiss AJ, Roth JA, eds. Understanding and Preventing Violence: Panel on the Understanding and Control of Violent Behavior. Washington, DC: National Academies Press; 1993.

Hastings JE, Hamberger LK. Personality characteristics of spouse abusers: a controlled comparison. Violence Vict. 1988;3:31–48.

Block C, Christakos A. Intimate partner homicide in Chicago over 29 years. Crime Delinq. 1995;41:496–526.

Hemenway D, Azrael D. Gun Use in the United States: Results of a National Survey. Washington, DC: National Institute of Justice; 1997.

Azrael D, Hemenway D. "In the safety of your own home": results from a national survey on gun use at home. Soc Sci Med. 2000;50:285–291.

Sorenson SB, Wiebe DJ. Weapons in the lives of battered women. Am J Public Health. 2004;94:1412–1417.

Rothman EF, Hemenway D, Miller M, Azrael D. Batterers' use of guns to threaten intimate partners. J Am Med Womens Assoc. 2005;60:62–68.

Catalano S. Victimization During Household Burglary. Washington, DC: US Department of Justice; 2010.

Bureau of Justice Statistics. Criminal Victimization in the United States 2007. Washington, DC: US Department of Justice; 2010.

Kleck G. Crime control through private use of armed forces. Soc Probl. 1988;35:1–21.

McDowall D, Lizotte AJ, Wiersema B. General deterrence through civilian gun ownership: an evaluation of the quasiexperimental evidence. Criminology. 1991;29:1085–1099.

McDowall D, Wiersema B, Loftin D. Did mandatory firearm ownership in Kennesaw really prevent burglary? Sociol Soc Res. 1989;74:48–51.

Lott JRJ. More Guns, Less Crime: Understanding Crime and Gun Control Laws. Chicago, IL: Univeristy of Chicago Press; 1998.

Kopel D. The Samurai, the Mountie, and the Cowboy: Should America Adopt the Gun Controls of Other Democracies. Buffalo, NY: Prometheus Books; 1992.

Kleck G. Targeting Guns: Firearms and Their Control. Hawthrone, NY: Aldine de Gruyter; 1997.

Mayhew P, van Dijk J. Criminal Victimization in Eleven Industrialized Countries: Key Findings From the International Crime Victimization Surveys. London, UK: Information and Publications Group; 1997.

Cook P, Ludwig J. Guns and burglary. In: Ludwig J, Cook P, eds. Evaluating Gun Policy. Washington, DC: Brookings Institute; 2003:74–107.

Wright JD, Rossi PH, Daly K. Under the Gun: Weapons, Crime, and Violence in America. Hawthorne, NY: Aldine Publishing; 1983.

National Research Council. Firearms and Violence: A Critical Review. Washington, DC: National Academy Press; 2005:89, 106.

Kellermann AL, Westphal L, Fischer L, Harvard B. Weapon involvement in home invasion crimes. JAMA. 1995;273:1759–1762.

Cook P, Ludwig J. Defensive gun uses: new evidence from a national survey. J Quant Criminol. 1998;14:111–131.

McDowall D, Loftin D, Presser S. Measuring civilian defensive firearm use: a methodological experiment. J Quant Criminol. 2000;16:1–19.

Cook P, Ludwig J. Guns in America: Results of a Comprehensive National Survey on Firearms Ownership and Use. Washington, DC: Police Foundation; 1996.

Hemenway D, Azrael D. The relative frequency of offensive and defensive gun use: results from a national survey. Violence Vict. 2000;15:257–272.

Hemenway D, Miller M, Azrael D. Gun use in the United States: results from two national surveys. Inj Prev. 2000;6:263–267.

Tark J, Kleck G. Resisting crime: the effects of victim action on the outcomes of crimes. Criminology. 2004;42:861–909.

Violence Policy Center. Unintended consequences: pro-handgun experts prove that handguns are a dangerous choice for selfdefense. Accessed December 17, 2010.

Kellermann AL, Reay DT. Protection or peril? An analysis of firearm related deaths in the home. N Engl J Med. 1986;314:1557–1560.

Kellermann AL, Somes G, Rivara FP, Lee RK, Banton JG. Injuries and deaths due to firearms in the home. J Trauma. 1998;42:263–267.

Lee RK, Waxweiler RJ, Dobbins JG, Paschetag T. Incidence rates of firearm injuries in Galveston, Texas, 1979–1981. Am J Epidemiol. 1991;134:511–521.

Firearm-related injuries affecting the pediatric population. Committee on Injury and Poison Prevention. American Academy of Pediatrics. Pediatrics. 2000;105(4, pt 1):888–895.
houghtam is offline   Reply With Quote