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-   -   Why GOP Scandal Mongers Can’t Have Nice Things (http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=111135)

frerottenextelway 06-04-2013 01:01 PM

Why GOP Scandal Mongers Can’t Have Nice Things
 
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/archive...things.php?m=1

(Snip)
"As Bill Clinton and John Edwards and Bill Jefferson and various others have made clear, Democrats do have scandals. Plenty of them actually. But here we have another good example of why Republicans so often have bad luck these days with bogus scandals they’re so hyped up about or ones that actually are legitimate scandals but which get overrun by so much hysterical nonsense that the actual scandal gets forgotten amidst a lava-like deluge of The Crazy. In a few words, most of the right-wing press is just astonishingly bad."

...

It must be so frustrating for the right-wing crazies, so desperate to find some kind of big conspiracy, only to have to continually fall flat on their faces with the most scandal free presidency of modern times.

06-04-2013 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by frerottenextelway (Post 3856735)
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/archive...things.php?m=1

(Snip)
"As Bill Clinton and John Edwards and Bill Jefferson and various others have made clear, Democrats do have scandals. Plenty of them actually. But here we have another good example of why Republicans so often have bad luck these days with bogus scandals they’re so hyped up about or ones that actually are legitimate scandals but which get overrun by so much hysterical nonsense that the actual scandal gets forgotten amidst a lava-like deluge of The Crazy. In a few words, most of the right-wing press is just astonishingly bad."

...

It must be so frustrating for the right-wing crazies, so desperate to find some kind of big conspiracy, only to have to continually fall flat on their faces with the most scandal free presidency of modern times.

Let's see.

Nobody knows who ordered the IRS targeting. Even the IG admitted nobody would answer that question. But you say case closed. Anyone wanting to know the answer to that simple question if "overreaching"

Nobody knows who ordered the Benghazi Stand Down, or the Youtube shell-game. Somewhere there's an answer, but nobody's willing to say it. But you say case closed. Anyone who wants to know is "overreaching"

Nobody knows who authorized the seizing of massive chunks of Associated Press phone records. The guy in charge says he recused himself from that decision, but can't point to any proof that he actually did. Meanwhile, 0 people have been disciplined, but you say case closed. Anyone wondering WTF is "overreaching"

Your team's cheerleading is setting a new bar for political cynicism. It's hard to believe that every complaint made just a few years ago was so nakedly political.

Your guys have done things Dick Cheney could've only dreamed of. And in the future, you're making it more likely that a guy like him might give it a try. Congrats.

frerottenextelway 06-04-2013 03:27 PM

This exemplifies what the blog said to a tee. Thanks!

Smiling Assassin27 06-04-2013 03:29 PM

I guess if it were only GOP that was whining, you'd have a point. They aren't, so you don't.

06-04-2013 03:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by frerottenextelway (Post 3856823)
This exemplifies what the blog said to a tee. Thanks!

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/i...ZA04p67UIyuAig

Rohirrim 06-04-2013 06:49 PM

I remember when Issa launched this investigation by claiming he wasn't interested in the politics. :rofl:

Rigs11 06-05-2013 09:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BroncoBeavis (Post 3856800)
Let's see.

Nobody knows who ordered the IRS targeting. Even the IG admitted nobody would answer that question. But you say case closed. Anyone wanting to know the answer to that simple question if "overreaching"

Nobody knows who ordered the Benghazi Stand Down, or the Youtube shell-game. Somewhere there's an answer, but nobody's willing to say it. But you say case closed. Anyone who wants to know is "overreaching"

Nobody knows who authorized the seizing of massive chunks of Associated Press phone records. The guy in charge says he recused himself from that decision, but can't point to any proof that he actually did. Meanwhile, 0 people have been disciplined, but you say case closed. Anyone wondering WTF is "overreaching"

Your team's cheerleading is setting a new bar for political cynicism. It's hard to believe that every complaint made just a few years ago was so nakedly political.

Your guys have done things Dick Cheney could've only dreamed of. And in the future, you're making it more likely that a guy like him might give it a try. Congrats.

exactly, nobody knows..yet. Everyone in the GOP is running around with their panties twisted in an uproar. bunch of whiners.

06-05-2013 10:00 AM

The Plame Nuts are gonna have a super fun time with this one:

http://www.politico.com/story/2013/0...eak-92263.html

Quote:

Former CIA Director Leon Panetta revealed the name of the Navy SEAL unit that carried out the Osama bin Laden raid and named the unit’s ground commander at a 2011 ceremony attended by “Zero Dark Thirty” filmmaker Mark Boal, according to a draft Pentagon inspector general’s report obtained by a watchdog group.

Panetta also disclosed classified information designated as “top secret” and “secret” during his presentation at the CIA awards ceremony, says the draft IG report published Wednesday by the Project on Government Oversight.
No word yet on if Holder tried to prosecute Leon or at least read all his emails and phone logs. LOL

It would be almost funny if it weren't for the fact that (unlike Plame) the Seal commander involved in the Bin Laden raid will be a walking target for the rest of his life. But Hey, when the Obama admin needs a neat pre-election propaganda flick, there's no such thing as 'classified'

06-05-2013 10:08 AM

Holy ****.

http://www.theatlanticwire.com/polit...-thirty/65924/

Quote:

According to the report, this event was one of two times that the filmmakers were given classified names; the other was during an interview with a staffer. It was not the only time the team interacted with government staffers, though. Beginning literally the day after the public announcement that bin Laden had been killed, Boal and Bigelow were in email contact with representatives of the Department of Defense, a chain extensively cataloged in the document. Panetta was excited about the idea of the movie; as the report notes (and as has been reported previously), he hoped he'd be played in the movie by Al Pacino. (He had to settle for James Galdofini.)

El Minion 06-05-2013 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smiling Assassin27 (Post 3856824)
I guess if it were only GOP that was whining, you'd have a point. They aren't, so you don't.

College Republican National Committee Report Has Grim Findings for GOP
by Jon Favreau Jun 5, 2013 4:45 AM EDT

Here’s what many millennials don’t like: the ‘closed-minded, racist, rigid, old-fashioned’ GOP. That’s the finding of a sober study by the College Republican National Committee. Jon Favreau says it’s a wake-up call.

If you were among the roughly 97 percent of Americans who didn’t tune into one of the Sunday shows this weekend, you might not realize that the only two issues currently worthy of sustained national debate are the stupidity of some IRS bureaucrats and the overzealousness of some certain federal prosecutors during an investigation of leaks that may have jeopardized U.S. assets within al Qaeda and North Korea.

Perhaps you are old-fashioned and have additional concerns that are a bit more naive, even trite. For example, what is the political system doing to help businesses create jobs or lift incomes? What are both parties proposing to help people afford a decent education, buy a home, or save for retirement? Who, if anyone, is offering a compelling agenda that speaks to the aspirations of younger generations?

How cute. And yet, while one Sunday show was asking panelists to analyze painfully awkward clips of IRS employees line dancing (please stop that), the College Republican National Committee was busy launching a sober, thoughtful, well-researched conversation about the future of a major political party that is now viewed favorably by only 33 percent of Americans under 30.

As a Democrat who turned 32 on Sunday, which just barely qualifies me as a millennial (1980–2000), I find this conversation hugely important. Young voters, long dismissed by pundits as too cynical and disengaged to vote, famously did so in record numbers in the 2008 election. In 2012, when we were supposed to stay home and sulk because President Obama didn’t take us from near depression to full employment in 45 months (Politico: “Young Voters Sitting Out This November?”), we surpassed our previous turnout, handing the president his larger-than-expected margin of victory over Mitt Romney.

With the help of the Republican Party’s leading millennial pollster, Kristen Soltis Anderson, the College Republicans set out to discover how to win back some of these Americans in future elections. And what they found is younger voters simply don’t want the current brand of crazy that so much of the national Republican Party has been selling with such fervor.

One of the headlines from the study were the words that up-for-grabs young voters used to describe today’s GOP: “closed-minded, racist, rigid, old-fashioned.” And the party clearly is out of step with millennials on many of the social issues that receive so much media attention. The College Republican survey found that only 30 percent of young voters believe marriage should be legally defined as only between a man and a woman. Even strongly anti-abortion-rights voters said they were disturbed when Republican candidates talked about defunding Planned Parenthood and “redefining rape.” Young people were more likely to value environmental protection than older voters and most frequently listed a path to citizenship as the best way to reform immigration.

But to me, the most significant finding in the survey was the wholesale rejection of the national Republican Party’s economic agenda. For four years, Republican candidates have been telling Americans that Obama’s policies are responsible for nearly all their financial ills. Yet a majority of young people believe Republican policies played either a major role or the biggest role in bringing about the Great Recession, giving Democrats a 16-point advantage over Republicans in handling jobs and the economy.

After decades of pushing bigger and bigger tax cuts skewed to the wealthiest individuals and largest corporations, Republicans must face the fact that only 3 percent of the next generation wants more tax cuts for the wealthy. Three percent. In a survey taken after the January budget deal that raised taxes on the richest Americans, a majority of young voters still believe those taxes should be even higher.

Despite a push for lower corporate tax rates that has come from both Republicans and Democrats in Washington, only about a third of young people think such a policy would help create jobs or improve their lives. Despite a sustained Republican jihad against even the most basic regulations on Wall Street banks or insurance companies or corporate polluters, only 40 percent of young people believe they’d be better off if business regulations were reduced.

And after the 37th failed vote by House Republicans to repeal Obamacare—a perverse obsession that seems to defy both substantive and political logic—only 37 percent of young Americans believe they’d be better off if the law no longer existed. Today Obamacare is favored by 9 points among young people, 44 percent of whom say “basic health insurance is a right for all people, and if someone has no means of paying for it, the government should provide.”

It’s clear that young Americans are concerned about unnecessary government spending and unsustainable debt. But unlike much of Washington, we have not been afflicted with Simpson-Bowles fetish syndrome. In the College Republican survey, young people want more spending on education, not the massive cuts proposed by nearly every Republican candidate and congressman. We worry about the rising cost of entitlements, but not nearly as much as we worry about the rising cost of college and student-loan debt. In the survey, young people clearly recognize that the president is working to address these challenges while Republicans have been indifferent at best.

Soltis Anderson ends the College Republican report with an admonition: “Economic growth and opportunity policies cannot just be about tax cuts and spending cuts.” Among the next generation of American voters, she has found ample evidence to support that claim. And yet, if a Republican candidate for president said such a thing, he or she would be driven from the race by a horde of torchbearing, pitchfork-waving Tea Partiers.

The truth is, the Republican Party today doesn’t have an economic agenda that goes beyond tax cuts and spending cuts. It can spend the next few years hiding behind investigative witch hunts and over-the-top rhetoric that most Americans don’t take seriously. It can hide behind another 37 failed repeal votes of a health-care program that’s already working as it’s supposed to in states like California. But the party cannot keep hiding from an entire generation of voters who expect both sides to address their aspirations with smart, sensible, mainstream solutions.

As millennials, we’re not stupid, cynical, or naive. We’re educated, we’re engaged, and we’re ready for a serious conversation about our future.

Pony Boy 06-05-2013 10:44 AM

Jay Carney Defines a Scandal

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http://www.c-spanvideo.org/clip/4452354

06-05-2013 10:47 AM

I don't want to discredit the findings because they do hold some merit with regards to the GOP, but College students are often pretty wet behind the ears, live in a fantasy world, and really have yet been asked to produce anything of actual substance.... many kids priorities change when they start earnign goood money, get married and have children... I know mine did.

also the survey states that these students are concerned with wasteful spending and debt.... but they also think taxes should be higher... what other way for historically wasteful spender like the govenment to spend more than higher taxes? Once they at 90% with the Rich, who do they come after next.... its only a matter of time.

Rohirrim 06-05-2013 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BroncoBeavis (Post 3857185)
The Plame Nuts are gonna have a super fun time with this one:

http://www.politico.com/story/2013/0...eak-92263.html



No word yet on if Holder tried to prosecute Leon or at least read all his emails and phone logs. LOL

It would be almost funny if it weren't for the fact that (unlike Plame) the Seal commander involved in the Bin Laden raid will be a walking target for the rest of his life. But Hey, when the Obama admin needs a neat pre-election propaganda flick, there's no such thing as 'classified'

Did Panetta do it in order to hide the fact that he was trying to lie the U.S. into an unnecessary war?

Requiem 06-05-2013 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by B-Large (Post 3857237)
I don't want to discredit the findings because they do hold some merit with regards to the GOP, but College students are often pretty wet behind the ears, live in a fantasy world, and really have yet been asked to produce anything of actual substance.... many kids priorities change when they start earnign goood money, get married and have children... I know mine did.

also the survey states that these students are concerned with wasteful spending and debt.... but they also think taxes should be higher... what other way for historically wasteful spender like the govenment to spend more than higher taxes? Once they at 90% with the Rich, who do they come after next.... its only a matter of time.

The social views of the millennials (which I am a part of) are likely not to change. Things will always keep progressing on that end. There is no turn around from that sort of thing. This generation is diverse and understands that the world is more global than ever. I think that we are eager to attempt to fix the problems that the current holders of the torch cannot.

Fiscal and economic policy might be a different story, but I think most realize that getting this nation out of debt will take more than just spending cuts. There has to be an increase in revenue somewhere and obviously that is taxes, but what we truly need is a reformed tax code. None of this flat/fair tax jargon, something actually legitimate. Something simplified. Something where the most wealthy cannot continue to abuse the system and get away with hiding millions or generating their worth by means subject to less tax than what their effective FIT rate should be. It really isn't hard for anyone with a lick of sense to look at the federal budget and our nations spending and realize where the waste is and how ______ up our priorities are.

I really hope my generation can change things for the better.

El Minion 06-05-2013 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by B-Large (Post 3857237)
I don't want to discredit the findings because they do hold some merit with regards to the GOP, but College students are often pretty wet behind the ears, live in a fantasy world, and really have yet been asked to produce anything of actual substance.... many kids priorities change when they start earnign goood money, get married and have children... I know mine did.

also the survey states that these students are concerned with wasteful spending and debt.... but they also think taxes should be higher... what other way for historically wasteful spender like the govenment to spend more than higher taxes? Once they at 90% with the Rich, who do they come after next.... its only a matter of time.

So they are naive when they hear this from conservatives:

At a Dallas event featuring Steve Munisteri, the Chairman of the Republican Party of Texas, Ken Emanuelson, a leader in the Tea Party, said: “I'm going to be real honest with you – the Republican Party doesn't want black people to vote...”

<iframe width="100%" height="166" scrolling="no" frameborder="no" src="https://w.soundcloud.com/player/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F94 483448"></iframe>

Rohirrim 06-05-2013 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Requiem (Post 3857254)
The social views of the millennials (which I am a part of) are likely not to change. Things will always keep progressing on that end. There is no turn around from that sort of thing. This generation is diverse and understands that the world is more global than ever. I think that we are eager to attempt to fix the problems that the current holders of the torch cannot.

Fiscal and economic policy might be a different story, but I think most realize that getting this nation out of debt will take more than just spending cuts. There has to be an increase in revenue somewhere and obviously that is taxes, but what we truly need is a reformed tax code. None of this flat/fair tax jargon, something actually legitimate. Something simplified. Something where the most wealthy cannot continue to abuse the system and get away with hiding millions or generating their worth by means subject to less tax than what their effective FIT rate should be. It really isn't hard for anyone with a lick of sense to look at the federal budget and our nations spending and realize where the waste is and how ______ up our priorities are.

I really hope my generation can change things for the better.

I hope they come to realize that taxing capital gains at 13% while taxing working people at 30% is basically a form of almost criminal insanity.

cutthemdown 06-05-2013 11:58 AM

No its not capital gains come from investments which don't always make money. They have to be a lower rate.

Requiem 06-05-2013 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cutthemdown (Post 3857290)
No its not capital gains come from investments which don't always make money. They have to be a lower rate.

You are missing the point. This is how a lot of CEOs and businessmen of large corporations make their money. They pay themselves a minute yearly salary, but make up for it with capital gains assets which are taxed at a much lower rate than what they would have been had those figures come from a wage subject to a higher federal income tax bracket. Enough is enough with that crap.

Requiem 06-05-2013 12:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rohirrim (Post 3857282)
I hope they come to realize that taxing capital gains at 13% while taxing working people at 30% is basically a form of almost criminal insanity.

Well, I figured that out a long time ago. While I have hope for us, I'd venture to say it would be 50/50 on the number of people who would know what capital gains are or what it relates to. :)

06-05-2013 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rohirrim (Post 3857238)
Did Panetta do it in order to hide the fact that he was trying to lie the U.S. into an unnecessary war?

Why lie when you can just go anyway without even asking Congress. :)

Anyway this whole "Bush knew everything, but Obama knows nothing" dichotomy is getting more incredible by the day. LOL

06-05-2013 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Requiem (Post 3857254)
The social views of the millennials (which I am a part of) are likely not to change. Things will always keep progressing on that end. There is no turn around from that sort of thing. This generation is diverse and understands that the world is more global than ever. I think that we are eager to attempt to fix the problems that the current holders of the torch cannot.

Fiscal and economic policy might be a different story, but I think most realize that getting this nation out of debt will take more than just spending cuts. There has to be an increase in revenue somewhere and obviously that is taxes, but what we truly need is a reformed tax code. None of this flat/fair tax jargon, something actually legitimate. Something simplified. Something where the most wealthy cannot continue to abuse the system and get away with hiding millions or generating their worth by means subject to less tax than what their effective FIT rate should be. It really isn't hard for anyone with a lick of sense to look at the federal budget and our nations spending and realize where the waste is and how ______ up our priorities are.

I really hope my generation can change things for the better.


I think that is kind of the point, conservatism simple cannot keep up with the changes we see in the world and US, there is a small piece of me that identifies with people who are trying to protect and perserve their values- right to life, the family unit, etc- many conservatives believe this is the foundation to a solid America and how we remain a strong people.... if you concede on your value, then what did you ever stand for in the first place? However, just like we don't burn witches at the stake or have inquisition, people evolve and begin to weigh whether some of our current beliefs hold that original merit.

As far as economically, I still believe that a flat tax is the way to go, in combination with scaling back the scope of the Federal Government- this is not a partisan issue, both political parties have been great at expanding the Federal Government over the last 30 years- the flat tax does not need to be one rate for every earner, you can level it, but this 70K page tax code is so convoluted it needs to be scrapped and made so easy it can be done on-line. Every dollars get taxed, no more BS games that people of influence can carve out juicy deduction for themselves because they have the clout. There is just no reason that the USG cannot run off 15% of GDP or less.

06-05-2013 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by El Minion (Post 3857257)
So they are naive when they hear this from conservatives:

At a Dallas event featuring Steve Munisteri, the Chairman of the Republican Party of Texas, Ken Emanuelson, a leader in the Tea Party, said: “I'm going to be real honest with you – the Republican Party doesn't want black people to vote...”

<iframe width="100%" height="166" scrolling="no" frameborder="no" src="https://w.soundcloud.com/player/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F94 483448"></iframe>

I didn't say their points were void of all merit.

houghtam 06-05-2013 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by El Minion (Post 3857257)
So they are naive when they hear this from conservatives:

At a Dallas event featuring Steve Munisteri, the Chairman of the Republican Party of Texas, Ken Emanuelson, a leader in the Tea Party, said: “I'm going to be real honest with you – the Republican Party doesn't want black people to vote...”

<iframe width="100%" height="166" scrolling="no" frameborder="no" src="https://w.soundcloud.com/player/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F94 483448"></iframe>

To be fair, the rest of the quote said something like "at least not if it's 9 to 1 Democrat."

Does it make it any better? Mmmmmnah...


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