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-   -   Kizla: John Elway is a draft nerd, should take a DB (http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=110769)

Kaylore 04-23-2013 08:21 AM

Kizla: John Elway is a draft nerd, should take a DB
 
Quote:

John Elway is a draft nerd. At age 52, he could have any job. Car mogul. The governor of Colorado. But believe it or not: Elway has a thing for mock drafts.

"I like doing them," Elway said Monday.


Quote:

Here is my guess: The defensive secondary will present the largest number of good choices when the Broncos pick 28th overall, from cornerbacks D.J. Hayden of Houston and Jamar Taylor of Boise State to safeties Jonathan Cyprien of Florida International and Matt Elam of Florida.

Read more: Kiszla: Elway's best Broncos option in NFL draft is a defensive back - The Denver Post http://www.denverpost.com/kiszla/ci_...#ixzz2RIfulpis
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Will Kizla get punched in the throat for slamming Elway like this?

Likely not, but a DB or trading back looks like the most likely option at this point, in reverse order.

Tombstone RJ 04-23-2013 08:25 AM

Elway said that he and the staff will be doing several mock drafts these next few days before the draft because it's a lot like practice before a big game, which makes a lot of sense. He said they are 4 players deep at each pick but of course, this could all change with trades. Elway's favorite word for the draft is "fluid".

SouthStndJunkie 04-23-2013 08:25 AM

Nothing wrong with being a draft geek.

04-23-2013 08:30 AM

I like that they are 4 deep at 28. I don't want them trading up or down from that spot. This draft talent is a bit different this year. Not much of a drop off in impact players after 10th pick like years past.

Tombstone RJ 04-23-2013 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drunken.Broncoholic (Post 3833077)
I like that they are 4 deep at 28. I don't want them trading up or down from that spot. This draft talent is a bit different this year. Not much of a drop off in impact players after 10th pick like years past.

But here's the deal with the first round. Elway also said that they more or less only have about 20 to 23 players rated as a first round pick. From my understanding, Elway will give a player a first round grade if the player can come in and start immediately and be starting for the Broncos for the next 10 years.

Requiem 04-23-2013 08:41 AM

It isn't that they are "four deep" at #28. They do mocks and project four possible players they would be willing to pick at that position. If Denver is OTC and believes they have 4-5 players they like with grades not too far apart, why wouldn't they try and trade down and get another pick?

04-23-2013 08:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tombstone RJ (Post 3833081)
But here's the deal with the first round. Elway also said that they more or less only have about 20 to 23 players rated as a first round pick. From my understanding, Elway will give a player a first round grade if the player can come in and start immediately and be starting for the Broncos for the next 10 years.

I'm no draft mogul but I see more than 20-23 players that can come in and start immediately. Especially on the defensive side of the ball.

bronco militia 04-23-2013 09:02 AM

http://mcwaffles.com/Images/Nerds.gif

http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view2/207...ng-nerds-o.gif

Kaylore 04-23-2013 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Requiem (Post 3833082)
It isn't that they are "four deep" at #28. They do mocks and project four possible players they would be willing to pick at that position. If Denver is OTC and believes they have 4-5 players they like with grades not too far apart, why wouldn't they try and trade down and get another pick?

Exactly. And someone they really like could fall. Or someone could see someone they really love and make a favorable offer to trade up where the value would exceed the value of the player that is there. I'm hoping some team is stupidly in love with Geno Smith and we're the benefactor.

Rabb 04-23-2013 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tombstone RJ (Post 3833075)
Elway said that he and the staff will be doing several mock drafts these next few days before the draft because it's a lot like practice before a big game, which makes a lot of sense. He said they are 4 players deep at each pick but of course, this could all change with trades. Elway's favorite word for the draft is "fluid".

That and obviously...he can't say anything without using it.

Lestat 04-23-2013 09:25 AM

i love it, being a draft nerd has served us well so far.
i just don't buy us drafting a CB in the first with DRC just signed to a potential 2 year deal and Champ still here. we already have Harris at Nickel and they expect Bolden to make a move this year.

a RB or S makes the most sense at 28 unless a DE falls.
if we land Cyprien or Elam @ #28 it's a clear win and addresses who will start next to The Dream.

Ziggy 04-23-2013 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lestat (Post 3833099)
i love it, being a draft nerd has served us well so far.
i just don't buy us drafting a CB in the first with DRC just signed to a potential 2 year deal and Champ still here. we already have Harris at Nickel and they expect Bolden to make a move this year.

a RB or S makes the most sense at 28 unless a DE falls.
if we land Cyprien or Elam @ #28 it's a clear win and addresses who will start next to The Dream.

DRC isn't on an 2 year deal from what I understand.

Quote:

According to Aaron Wilson, DRC's deal is worth $10M over two seasons, with a $4.2M signing bonus, $800K salary in 2013, and voidable $5M salary for 2014. Jason La Canfora reports that the second year voids as long as Rodgers-Cromartie is on Denver's roster five days after the next Super Bowl.

Adding a voidable year, which is essentially a phantom extension of a one-year contract, is done solely for the purposes of spreading a cap hit.
http://www.itsalloverfatman.com/bron...-with-drc-deal

Unless something was reported incorrectly.

Requiem 04-23-2013 09:54 AM

Harris, Carter and DRC (if voided) are all in their "contract years."

Bailey has what, one more year on his contract after this and is old?

Bolden has this year, plus two more.

Um. . . yeah. I bet we go for a corner. Why wouldn't the Broncos want to get as many players to learn under Champ as possible?

We don't have any #1 guys in the wings to replace him. We better try and get one, unfortunately, there are maybe 4-5 of those tops in this draft. A lot of #2 and #3 guys though.

04-23-2013 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Requiem (Post 3833082)
It isn't that they are "four deep" at #28. They do mocks and project four possible players they would be willing to pick at that position. If Denver is OTC and believes they have 4-5 players they like with grades not too far apart, why wouldn't they try and trade down and get another pick?

I don't know, they did that last year and not much came out of it so far. I would've rather they stayed put and drafted Martin.

Lestat 04-23-2013 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziggy (Post 3833114)
DRC isn't on an 2 year deal from what I understand.


http://www.itsalloverfatman.com/bron...-with-drc-deal

Unless something was reported incorrectly.

i said potential because even though it voids out it's entirely possible they'll reach another 1 year deal with him depending on his play. or they could re-sign him to a multi year deal. just depends on his play and potential market price.

Cito Pelon 04-23-2013 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tombstone RJ (Post 3833075)
Elway said that he and the staff will be doing several mock drafts these next few days before the draft because it's a lot like practice before a big game, which makes a lot of sense. He said they are 4 players deep at each pick but of course, this could all change with trades. Elway's favorite word for the draft is "fluid".

Actually, doing multiple mocks with different scenarios introduced is probably a blast for these guys to do as the final prep. They've done all the grunt work, gathering the info, interviewing, comparing players. Now they get to have a little fun, everybody gets to play GM.

Requiem 04-23-2013 10:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drunken.Broncoholic (Post 3833124)
I don't know, they did that last year and not much came out of it so far. I would've rather they stayed put and drafted Martin.

The guy they traded down and got did awesome for us.

Drafting Osweiler when you just signed Manning in the second, using one of the fourths you got to trade up for Ronnie Hillman and using the other fourth you got in a trade to take a CB who blew out his ACL were all pretty questionable moves.

This draft is much deeper in rounds 2-4 than it was last year. I feel very confident (based on our needs) that Denver can move from 28 down to the 30s and get guys at positions we can use help at (LB, DL, S, RB, etc.) and have a variety of starters. They were able to do make out well in 2011. We just need to get players who can contribute right away.

I'd like to see us move down from #28 (unless one of their first round graded prospects is available) and pick up an additional pick or two. There is great value at the positions listed above in those areas. I'd like to see us be able to address all of them and get a shot at other prospects who can contribute. I think we need to trade down unless someone who is awesome is there. I really doubt there is going to be a significant value between guys at #28 and say #35. If you can move back to there with a team interested in Nassib, Manuel, Barkley, etc. and end up getting another early to mid-round pick, why not?

We will have to wait and see how the board falls. If they stand pat at #28, it tells me they are getting a guy with a first round grade.

spdirty 04-23-2013 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Requiem (Post 3833146)
The guy they traded down and got did awesome for us.

Drafting Osweiler when you just signed Manning in the second, using one of the fourths you got to trade up for Ronnie Hillman and using the other fourth you got in a trade to take a CB who blew out his ACL were all pretty questionable moves.

This draft is much deeper in rounds 2-4 than it was last year. I feel very confident (based on our needs) that Denver can move from 28 down to the 30s and get guys at positions we can use help at (LB, DL, S, RB, etc.) and have a variety of starters. They were able to do make out well in 2011. We just need to get players who can contribute right away.

I'd like to see us move down from #28 (unless one of their first round graded prospects is available) and pick up an additional pick or two. There is great value at the positions listed above in those areas. I'd like to see us be able to address all of them and get a shot at other prospects who can contribute. I think we need to trade down unless someone who is awesome is there. I really doubt there is going to be a significant value between guys at #28 and say #35. If you can move back to there with a team interested in Nassib, Manuel, Barkley, etc. and end up getting another early to mid-round pick, why not?

We will have to wait and see how the board falls. If they stand pat at #28, it tells me they are getting a guy with a first round grade.

Yeah, this is the dream scenario. But a lot depends on who is there and what the offer is. I think everyone would love to trade down this year and pick up an extra 3rd. Just hope like hell that J'Ville, the Jets, and Buffalo pass on the quarterbacks with their first round picks and freak out when we're at 28. Geno, Nassib, and Barkley falling to us would be a freaking dream.

Lestat 04-23-2013 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drunken.Broncoholic (Post 3833124)
I don't know, they did that last year and not much came out of it so far. I would've rather they stayed put and drafted Martin.

we got a starting flex DL who can play DE and DT, it allowed us to grab Osweiler and Hillman by making the initial move and then moving down again.
Martin is nice but i'd rather have the haul we landed(especially if Oz turns into a franchise QB) than just Martin.

04-23-2013 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lestat (Post 3833166)
we got a starting flex DL who can play DE and DT, it allowed us to grab Osweiler and Hillman by making the initial move and then moving down again.
Martin is nice but i'd rather have the haul we landed(especially if Oz turns into a franchise QB) than just Martin.

I didnt agree with taking a QB. Thought we needed another player on the field having an impact. In the long run he could pan out, but I would've done that a bit different. Wolfe is making strides though. Not sure if we could've got Martin and Wolfe but if that was possible it would've been better IMO

04-23-2013 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Requiem (Post 3833146)

We will have to wait and see how the board falls. If they stand pat at #28, it tells me they are getting a guy with a first round grade.


This is what I'm hoping for. But if they do trade down, your making a valid point that's making me more at ease about it.

Requiem 04-23-2013 11:38 AM

The Osweiler thing was just too predictable. It's sad to know that Brian Xanders was advocating for Lavonte David. Woodyard definitely stepped his game up, but it would have been nice to have used a second rounder on a guy who is actually going to do something for the team. If the Broncos really thought that Osweiler was the BPA with that pick, I am calling BS.

I can understand the insurance because of the uncertain nature of Manning's recovery, but good lord. I have high hopes for Hillman, but mortgaging what you got in a trade down was really piss poor value management of resources in the draft. When you have that many picks, you need to get more than ONE GUY (Wolfe) who starts a game as a rookie. That is SIMPLY unacceptable.

Lestat 04-23-2013 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Requiem (Post 3833188)
The Osweiler thing was just too predictable. It's sad to know that Brian Xanders was advocating for Lavonte David. Woodyard definitely stepped his game up, but it would have been nice to have used a second rounder on a guy who is actually going to do something for the team. If the Broncos really thought that Osweiler was the BPA with that pick, I am calling BS.

I can understand the insurance because of the uncertain nature of Manning's recovery, but good lord. I have high hopes for Hillman, but mortgaging what you got in a trade down was really piss poor value management of resources in the draft. When you have that many picks, you need to get more than ONE GUY (Wolfe) who starts a game as a rookie. That is SIMPLY unacceptable.

we had OLB's last season. David wasn't a need, Von plays SAM, DJ played WILL. Woodyard obviously was well liked by the staff and we drafted Trevathan.

not every draft this team does will produce immediate starters. some will take 2-3 years to crack the line up. that's the nature of the draft and of football.
i would for every draft to produce 3-4 instant starters and the rest are depth players but that's not going to happen.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drunken.Broncoholic (Post 3833173)
I didnt agree with taking a QB. Thought we needed another player on the field having an impact. In the long run he could pan out, but I would've done that a bit different. Wolfe is making strides though. Not sure if we could've got Martin and Wolfe but if that was possible it would've been better IMO

we had the opportunity to draft a QB in the 2nd round with franchise QB potential. that doesn't happen very often. we have a QB who can learn under Manning and be groomed for the starting role.
it's not an immediate impact rookie but if the player pans out then it's the future of the franchise for 10-15 years.
i would rather gamble on that and have him take over after Manning so that we can partially sustain the success than to go all in for 2-3 years and have to get another QB to take over after he's gone from the team and not able to groom the understudy.

broncosteven 04-23-2013 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tombstone RJ (Post 3833075)
Elway said that he and the staff will be doing several mock drafts these next few days before the draft because it's a lot like practice before a big game, which makes a lot of sense. He said they are 4 players deep at each pick but of course, this could all change with trades. Elway's favorite word for the draft is "fluid".

mCd spent the days prior to the draft pissing people off and getting them fired.

Big difference in how they approached the draft.

Lestat 04-23-2013 11:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by broncosteven (Post 3833194)
mCd spent the days prior to the draft pissing people off and getting them fired.

Big difference in how they approached the draft.

Elway also doesn't have just 80-100 players as draftable :yayaya:


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