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-   -   Todd Mcshay Mock 5.0 (http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=110666)

ludo21 04-11-2013 09:48 AM

Todd Mcshay Mock 5.0
 
I dont have ESPN insider, can anyone post this please?

or just pm me if need be?

I am curious to see his mock. Thanks in advance! :thumbs:

http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/draft...raft-scenarios

Cool Breeze 04-11-2013 01:51 PM

1 Chiefs = Joeckel
2 Jaguars = Jordan
3 Raiders = Ansah
4 EAGLES = Lotulelei
5 Lions = Fisher
6 Browns = Geno Smith
7 Cardinals = Lane Johnson
8 Bills = Warmack
9 Jets = Milliner
10 Titans = Floyd
11 Chargers = Cooper
12 Dolphins = Rhodes
13 Buccaneers = Austin
14 Panthers = Richardson
15 Saints = Mingo
16 Rams = Patterson
17 Steelers = Jarvis Jones
18 Cowboys = Vaccaro
19 Giants = Fluker
20 Bears = Eifert
21 Bengals = Trufant
22 Rams (from WSH) = Lacy
23 Vikings = Ogletree
24 Colts = Hayden
25 Vikings (from SEA) = Sylvester Williams
26 Packers = Pugh
27 Texans = Watson
28 Broncos = Werner
29 Patriots = Datone Jones
30 Falcons = Jamar Taylor
31 49ers = Cyprien
32 Ravens = Te'o

Tombstone RJ 04-11-2013 02:01 PM

If the Browns draft Geno Smith I will be laughing hysterically. It's much worse than trading up for Trent Richardson. I'm not so sure Geno is the first QB drafted, let alone he's taken in the top 10.

You have to wonder where Geno would be drafted if he was in last year's draft. Or, in a total hypothetical situation where all of last year's QBs are drafted this year, where would Geno be taken?

ludo21 04-11-2013 02:13 PM

not sure Geno at 6 is laughable to a team that NEEDS a QB terribly.

???

srphoenix 04-11-2013 02:16 PM

I'd be happy with Werner, seems like he has a higher ceiling than his counterpart carradine that a lot of people have us taking.

Tombstone RJ 04-11-2013 02:18 PM

I'd take Weeden over Geno. Geno has one thing on Weeden, he's younger. But other than that, is there really any chance Geno beats out Weeden for the starting spot? The Browns have a lot of issues but is Geno going to fix their offense?

SouthStndJunkie 04-11-2013 02:37 PM

I'd cream my boxer briefs and wear them on my head for a day if Björn Werner fell to the 28th pick and Denver drafted him.

I don't see Björn Werner falling anywhere near Denver's pick.

Apparently, he isn't viewed as a Top 10 pick any longer though....but I think he'll be a stud in the NFL.

gyldenlove 04-11-2013 02:53 PM

I like Werner best as a base-end but he definitely has some pass rush ability and would be a very solid pick. He could rotate with Ayers on the weak side and could play in nickel situations.

Requiem 04-11-2013 03:05 PM

Werner is a Kevin Vandenbosh clone. His pass rushing skills are overrated. Half of them came from two games this year. Actually more than half.

04-11-2013 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Requiem (Post 3827833)
Werner is a Kevin Vandenbosh clone. His pass rushing skills are overrated. Half of them came from two games this year. Actually more than half.

This! And I am not a huge fan of Tank either.. Brandon Jenkins was the talent in that program.. It was him being double teamed that opened things up for Werner and Tank.

SouthStndJunkie 04-11-2013 04:30 PM

You guys mean Kyle Vanden Bosch?

There could be worse players to compare him to, Kyle Vanden Bosch has had a couple of 12+ sack seasons and has played in the league 12 years.

Requiem 04-11-2013 04:39 PM

Yes, Kyle -- sorry.

And it wasn't a slamming comparison. It was pretty high praise, but yeah. Except he had 3 seasons with over 8 sacks, one for 6.5 and the rest were under 5. I expect 7-8 to be what Werner would get consistently. JMHO.

DBroncos4life 04-11-2013 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Requiem (Post 3827870)
Yes, Kyle -- sorry.

And it wasn't a slamming comparison. It was pretty high praise, but yeah. Except he had 3 seasons with over 8 sacks, one for 6.5 and the rest were under 5. I expect 7-8 to be what Werner would get consistently. JMHO.

Kyle had a couple knee injuries during his career (first three seasons) so that is why his sack numbers are so up and down. Maybe if Werner can avoid those he will be more consistent player for us.

04-11-2013 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ludo21 (Post 3827791)
not sure Geno at 6 is laughable to a team that NEEDS a QB terribly.

???

I don't think he's a top-6 prospect

04-11-2013 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BroncosfanGuy (Post 3827905)
I don't think he's a top-6 prospect

And who is in this draft? Ansah? Floyd? Milliner?

04-11-2013 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by R-Mac (Post 3827946)
And who is in this draft? Ansah? Floyd? Milliner?

I'd rate all those guys over Smith, sure.

I took Smith in the OM mock draft so I'm not really that down on him. I just don't think he's a top 6 prospect. I don't think any QB is this year.

04-11-2013 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BroncosfanGuy (Post 3827950)
I'd rate all those guys over Smith, sure.

I took Smith in the OM mock draft so I'm not really that down on him. I just don't think he's a top 6 prospect. I don't think any QB is this year.

I think this draft has become a bizarre process where the QBs are being dragged through the mud, and at the same time the players at the top are escaping with extreme flaws. Every detail for the QBs is an issue, they are all inconsistent, but what about the other players?

Ansah is the DE version of Dontari Poe. All the athletic ability, but very raw and with low production in college. Charles Davis said some interesting things about Ansah, calling him overhyped. Body of work: 9 games as a starter. Was a backup last season until other players got hurt. Football was his last resort after he was cut from the basketball team twice. The guy came from Ghana; who knows how old he really is.

Ansah was a monster in the Senior Bowl game (hint: like Robert Ayers...) where there are no adjustments and there are a lot of breakdowns on assignments. During the week of practice, Ansah was nothing special, just average 1-on-1. And now he is a top 5 pick? Because of potential? Well, the QBs also have potential, especially the ones with strong arm and superior mobility.

Floyd has short arms for a DT, did not produce as a pass rusher. He is good, can create some pressure, but did not finish plays as a pass rusher. I did not see him dominate the line of scrimmage, he is not strong against double teams. Looks like a 4-3, 1-gap DT so he might not be that versatile. He played DE in 2011 but what did he accomplish there? 4.5 career sacks, 31 3/4" arms. Is this a top 5 pick? How?

Milliner is another questionable player being pushed to the top. He was not a starter in 2011, playing behind De'Quan Menzie. Became a starter in 2012 and deflected a lot of passes, but he lacks ball skills to create turnovers. In the top 5, teams should look for CBs that are playmakers with great coverage and also ball skills. He tries to make plays against the run but is inconsistent with his tackling. A good CB with size and speed, but he did not do enough to be a top 5 pick. Maybe the Alabama logo on his helmet is helping his stock.

These other players also have a lot of holes but the QBs - probably because of their importance combined with overreaction after the previous class - are the ones dealing with heavy, detailed criticism.

04-12-2013 04:00 AM

Werner would be awesome, I don't think I have seen any mocks where he fell to Denver.

pricejj 04-12-2013 08:06 AM

Carradine > Werner

04-12-2013 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pricejj (Post 3828068)
Carradine > Werner

Jenkins>The rest

Mediator12 04-12-2013 09:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by R-Mac (Post 3827967)
I think this draft has become a bizarre process where the QBs are being dragged through the mud, and at the same time the players at the top are escaping with extreme flaws. Every detail for the QBs is an issue, they are all inconsistent, but what about the other players?

Ansah is the DE version of Dontari Poe. All the athletic ability, but very raw and with low production in college. Charles Davis said some interesting things about Ansah, calling him overhyped. Body of work: 9 games as a starter. Was a backup last season until other players got hurt. Football was his last resort after he was cut from the basketball team twice. The guy came from Ghana; who knows how old he really is.

Ansah was a monster in the Senior Bowl game (hint: like Robert Ayers...) where there are no adjustments and there are a lot of breakdowns on assignments. During the week of practice, Ansah was nothing special, just average 1-on-1. And now he is a top 5 pick? Because of potential? Well, the QBs also have potential, especially the ones with strong arm and superior mobility.

Floyd has short arms for a DT, did not produce as a pass rusher. He is good, can create some pressure, but did not finish plays as a pass rusher. I did not see him dominate the line of scrimmage, he is not strong against double teams. Looks like a 4-3, 1-gap DT so he might not be that versatile. He played DE in 2011 but what did he accomplish there? 4.5 career sacks, 31 3/4" arms. Is this a top 5 pick? How?

Milliner is another questionable player being pushed to the top. He was not a starter in 2011, playing behind De'Quan Menzie. Became a starter in 2012 and deflected a lot of passes, but he lacks ball skills to create turnovers. In the top 5, teams should look for CBs that are playmakers with great coverage and also ball skills. He tries to make plays against the run but is inconsistent with his tackling. A good CB with size and speed, but he did not do enough to be a top 5 pick. Maybe the Alabama logo on his helmet is helping his stock.

These other players also have a lot of holes but the QBs - probably because of their importance combined with overreaction after the previous class - are the ones dealing with heavy, detailed criticism.

QB's have a lot more criticism on them now because very few of them play in anything resembling a prostyle offense. Way too many, including Geno Smith, have played predominantly in the shotgun in college in a spread only Offense. It makes a very difficult evaluation to a pro style offense for many reasons. The hardest part is the damn snap and turning their backs to the Pre-snap cues. The second is reading a defense without the help of spreading them out. The third is calling plays at the LOS once the COACHES not the QB sees the presnap read. Mental experience for QB's coming out of college has decreased significantly due to all these factors.

QB, more than any other position, relies on making quick, ACCURATE reads both presnap to get into a favorable play, and post snap in a passing coverage and route recognition need. Physically, these QB's have a lot skills coming out, but the NFL is a MENTAL league. It is extremely detailed and precise compared to college. So, these QB's have to have experience in a pro style offense (Andrew Luck with Harbaugh and being able to audible) or superior skills sets (RGIII or Russell Wilson to run an option offense) to impact right away at the next level and deserve a First round pick.

That is WHY they get so much scrutiny on skill sets, but its also a must have position to succeed Consistently in today's NFL. Way too many physically skilled QB's with Low mental capabilities have busted in the first round over the years. And they used to weigh you down in the Salary cap if you whiffed too.

ludo21 04-12-2013 10:25 AM

Geno will go top 10.. to many crappy teams need a QB that wont be able to wait

DBroncos4life 04-12-2013 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bmore Manning (Post 3828082)
Jenkins>The rest

McShay>price
Price is only pimping Tank and Moore because his LSU fling flamed out.

04-12-2013 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DBroncos4life (Post 3828166)
McShay>price
Price is only pimping Tank and Moore because his LSU fling flamed out.

LOL!

Better trade up for Moore!

DBroncos4life 04-12-2013 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bmore Manning (Post 3828175)
LOL!

Better trade up for Moore!

Well he is the only player in the draft capable of sacking a NFL QB. :rofl:

Seriously I like Moore as well prospect. Miller would be thrilled to have him in Denver too. Still I wouldn't trade up to get him! Also I can't help but get this Everette Brown vib about him. Maybe it's because he just doesn't seem like a guy that is going to put in the work to be great.


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