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-   -   Immigration reform (http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=110023)

cutthemdown 01-29-2013 05:59 PM

Immigration reform
 
I think this has more legs then gun control and a bigger issue. What do you all think of the plans being thrown around? Do you think securing the the border will be part of the deal?

Lastly how many of the illegals do you think want to be Americans out of the 11 million? I wonder how many really would want to pay back tax, learn english, take the citzenship oath. Many just plan to go back to mexico at some point.

That One Guy 01-30-2013 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cutthemdown (Post 3790381)
I think this has more legs then gun control and a bigger issue. What do you all think of the plans being thrown around? Do you think securing the the border will be part of the deal?

Lastly how many of the illegals do you think want to be Americans out of the 11 million? I wonder how many really would want to pay back tax, learn english, take the citzenship oath. Many just plan to go back to mexico at some point.

What we think doesn't really matter - there's too many Hispanic votes to ignore. It'll come soon.

01-31-2013 10:15 AM

Amnesty by another name. Somehow they think putting a fancy wrapper on a can of **** and calling it "roses" makes it not ****.

01-31-2013 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by That One Guy (Post 3790654)
What we think doesn't really matter - there's too many Hispanic votes to ignore. It'll come soon.

How's that? Democrats know granting amnesty doesn't translate into votes for a party; if that were the case, the GOP would have seen a spike in the 1986 amnesty debacle. Democrats offer free stuff to these people as well as catering to their national and ethnic hostilities which is what is translating to anticipated votes for them. The idea that the GOP has to go along or risk being left behind at the ballot box is one of many DNC lies being heavily pimped by the media.

We're being drowned in yet another propaganda campaign.

Anyone who thinks they'll "crack down" and "enforce the law this time" after this amnesty either wasn't alive during the 1986 amnesty when we were all fed the same ****, or they're stupid as a box of rocks.

If they aren't enforcing the law now, they never will. That is a scandal beyond all scandals and yet the government and media make-believe it's not there because they're promoting a pro-amnesty agenda.

peacepipe 01-31-2013 11:10 AM

I'm all for conservatives/Republicans killing this bill,they'll make permanent their status as a minority party.

Requiem 01-31-2013 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peacepipe (Post 3791051)
I'm all for conservatives/Republicans killing this bill,they'll make permanent their status as a minority party.

Take a wild guess as to why they have Mark Rubio front and center on this issue. Hilarious!

01-31-2013 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Requiem (Post 3791055)
Take a wild guess as to why they have Mark Rubio front and center on this issue. Hilarious!

Because elements in the party are corrupt and pandering.

BroncsRule 01-31-2013 12:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nyuk nyuk (Post 3791028)
..That is a scandal beyond all scandals and yet the government and media make-believe it's not there because they're promoting a pro-amnesty agenda.

No, the scandal beyond all scandals was when we all stood by and watched a small number of banksters raid the public till to the tune of one and one half trillion dollars, and we all just let 'em walk..

cutthemdown 01-31-2013 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peacepipe (Post 3791051)
I'm all for conservatives/Republicans killing this bill,they'll make permanent their status as a minority party.

They won't kill it. Obama laid out things like paying back taxes, learning English, etc. I bet about half at least won't even want to do that. Swear allegience to the USA? no way they love being mexicans. Most want to return and are just here for the work.

Peace if an illegal refuses to become a citizen what would you do with them? slap on the wrist or aggressive deportation?

Also I think its funny you said what you did because you always claim its whats best for the country not what your party should want. So what is it political or do you think amnesty for them makes us a stronger country?

peacepipe 02-01-2013 12:29 PM

It's a political reality,demographics have shifted & as a whole the country has shifted left,center-left,but left nonetheless.
Obama has deported almost,if not more,immigrants in his 1st term than gwb did his entire 8 yrs in office.
Immigration reform is what is best for the country,call it amnesty,call it what you want,but it is unrealistic to think that you'll deport 11+million people.
If they don't want to be a citizen,then obviously they get deported.

Play2win 02-01-2013 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peacepipe (Post 3791591)
It's a political reality,demographics have shifted & as a whole the country has shifted left,center-left,but left nonetheless.
Obama has deported almost,if not more,immigrants in his 1st term than gwb did his entire 8 yrs in office.
Immigration reform is what is best for the country,call it amnesty,call it what you want,but it is unrealistic to think that you'll deport 11+million people.
If they don't want to be a citizen,then obviously they get deported.

Exactly. Make it a hard road for them to obtain citizenship. They must really want it to get it. Also, make the employers live up to their responsibilities.

Then you have something enforceable.

peacepipe 02-01-2013 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drunk idiot kicker (Post 3791611)
Exactly. Make it a hard road for them to obtain citizenship. They must really want it to get it. Also, make the employers live up to their responsibilities.

Then you have something enforceable.

Doesn't need to be a major obstacle,pay a fine,pay any unpaid taxes, & get in line. It doesn't need to be a pathway that takes decades to go through.

Play2win 02-01-2013 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peacepipe (Post 3791621)
Doesn't need to be a major obstacle,pay a fine,pay any unpaid taxes, & get in line. It doesn't need to be a pathway that takes decades to go through.

I differ in opinion. I think I needs to be hard, so that they become American— they believe in America, they will fight for America, and they will spend in America. Not still send the money back to Mexico.

It does have to take "decades", but a few years, learn the way our government works, our history, and speak English. And get tested on it. You must pass the evaluation to become a citizen.

They either do that, or they go back home.

If you are not doing one of these things (work permits/visa exceptions of course), then you are breaking the law, and that is enforceable, and will be enforced.

bronco militia 02-01-2013 03:30 PM

imagration reform: more imagration laws to ignore

ZZZ...

That One Guy 02-01-2013 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bronco militia (Post 3791654)
imagration reform: more imagration laws to ignore

ZZZ...

Exactly. Some will qualify to become citizens and some will still be illegal. Nothing really changes.

cutthemdown 02-01-2013 04:46 PM

We have to deport ones who refuse to become citizens. And we have to deny services to all illegals once we do this. Also obviously securing the border is a no brainer. We have to make it damn near impossible to sneak in. Once in we need to make it tough for illegals to get services.

Then we roll out the red carpet for the honest hard working ones who really want to become Americans, learn English, and join the best counrty on Earth. We have to remember that is what makes us special and really stronger then other countries. Its not politically correct but lets face it some things races do better then other races. By having all religions, all races, all types we are actually better served then places like China who are stuck never being good at track and field. :)

peacepipe 02-01-2013 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drunk idiot kicker (Post 3791651)
I differ in opinion. I think I needs to be hard, so that they become American— they believe in America, they will fight for America, and they will spend in America. Not still send the money back to Mexico.

It does have to take "decades", but a few years, learn the way our government works, our history, and speak English. And get tested on it. You must pass the evaluation to become a citizen.

They either do that, or they go back home.

If you are not doing one of these things (work permits/visa exceptions of course), then you are breaking the law, and that is enforceable, and will be enforced.

You're wrong,but you are entitled to believe whatever it is you believe. Like I have stated I'm all for rethugs taking the unrealistic approach you're advocating.

cutthemdown 02-01-2013 05:37 PM

Peace he is only saying it should take a few years to go through the procedure. I think Obama saying they go to the end of line is saying that. Why do you see that as an unreasonable republican approach. Seems to me repubs ready to cave on this you should be happy. Your winning.

Rohirrim 02-01-2013 05:46 PM

They're talking about all the same stuff they talked about when they passed the Simpson/Mazzoli bill in the 80s. It won't be any different now. They'll pass something. Everybody will get a photo op. We'll discover it's all meaningless bull****, and the meaningful parts there are in it won't be implemented. Our government is dysfunctional.

peacepipe 02-01-2013 05:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cutthemdown (Post 3791699)
Peace he is only saying it should take a few years to go through the procedure. I think Obama saying they go to the end of line is saying that. Why do you see that as an unreasonable republican approach. Seems to me repubs ready to cave on this you should be happy. Your winning.

I'm not saying it should take a week or two weeks,but to make it so difficult that someone has to wait 15 yrs is another. Like with the dream act,go to college,join the army & serve our country to prove you will contribute to our country. Let's say someone comes forward wants to be citizen,join the army serve 4 yrs get your green card serve 8 yrs and get your citizenship.

cutthemdown 02-01-2013 08:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peacepipe (Post 3791706)
I'm not saying it should take a week or two weeks,but to make it so difficult that someone has to wait 15 yrs is another. Like with the dream act,go to college,join the army & serve our country to prove you will contribute to our country. Let's say someone comes forward wants to be citizen,join the army serve 4 yrs get your green card serve 8 yrs and get your citizenship.

15 yrs would be ridiculous. I know we already take non citizens in the military don't we? i have no problem with military service = citzenship. That is very Starship Troopers.

My question is what % of illegals really want to be Americans enough to jump through the hoops.

Play2win 02-01-2013 09:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cutthemdown (Post 3791783)
15 yrs would be ridiculous. I know we already take non citizens in the military don't we? i have no problem with military service = citzenship. That is very Starship Troopers.

My question is what % of illegals really want to be Americans enough to jump through the hoops.

Bingo.

At least make them earn it, and in some shape, form or fashion be some sort of asset to America.

If they work here, spend their money here.

Play2win 02-01-2013 09:56 PM

My hope is if this does go through, once the slate is clean, they start enforcing the law– and imposing penalty and sentence– to both the illegals and the company owners who knowingly break the law.

peacepipe 02-01-2013 10:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drunk idiot kicker (Post 3791791)
Bingo.

At least make them earn it, and in some shape, form or fashion be some sort of asset to America.

If they work here, spend their money here.

What do you think serving our military is? It's called earning it.
btw,they do spend there money here.

Play2win 02-02-2013 01:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peacepipe (Post 3791796)
What do you think serving our military is? It's called earning it.
btw,they do spend there money here.

Nice blanket statement.

(Scurries off to wikipedia right away...)


As far as the Military, I wasn't talking about that at all. Of course there is a vested interest there. I would also add, that I would want most of the US Military to be made up of actual Americans.


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