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-   -   Article on Denver Drafts in SD newpaper (http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=108747)

prunch 11-15-2012 02:55 PM

Article on Denver Drafts in SD newpaper
 
http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2012/...feeling-draft/

The comments show them as a bit annoyed at this article being in a Charger newspaper. Hah!

gyldenlove 11-15-2012 03:14 PM

The 2010 and 2011 drafts may the most important aspects of this football team. We netted both our starting WRs, C, LG, RT, presumably both safeties, top pass rusher and starting LB, plus undrafted free agent starting CB.

8 or 9 starters from 2 drafts. That is frankly outstanding, you should on average land 2.5 starters per draft to be successful and we are just about doubling that rate with those 2 drafts.

11-15-2012 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gyldenlove (Post 3727178)
The 2010 and 2011 drafts may the most important aspects of this football team. We netted both our starting WRs, C, LG, RT, presumably both safeties, top pass rusher and starting LB, plus undrafted free agent starting CB.

8 or 9 starters from 2 drafts. That is frankly outstanding, you should on average land 2.5 starters per draft to be successful and we are just about doubling that rate with those 2 drafts.

Considering how depleted the roster was when Elway took over, getting players better than what we had wasn't all that difficult. That said, Im thrilled with where we are compared to where we were when Elway took over. The turnaround top to bottom has beem amazing.

11-15-2012 03:27 PM

Quote:

Chad W. Boyer Top Commenter
AJ Smith:
2003 1st Round: Sammy Davis; out of football.
2004 1st Round: Philip Rivers; currently 31st in Total QBR in NFL; just a guy.
2005 1st Round: Shawn Merriman; out of football.
2005 1st Round: Luis Castillo; out of football.
2006 1st Round: Antonio Cromartie; NY Jets; just a guy.
2007 1st Round: Buster Davis: out of football.
2008 1st Round: Antoine Cason; just a guy.
2009 1st Round: Larry English; utterly useless.
2010 1st Round: Ryan Matthews; jury still out.
2011 1st Round: Cory Luiget; jury still out.
2012 1st Round: Melvin Ingram; jury still out.

How many hundreds of millions did AJ waste on those picks? Probably north of a 1/4 billion (250 million+) dollars.
Reply Like Fo
lollll

11-15-2012 04:24 PM

To be fair we took Kno-Show, Ayers, and The "Ultimate(ly useless) Teammate" with three of our four 1st round picks*.



*under coach McDouchebag

fdf 11-15-2012 04:32 PM

I know this is not a popular opinion. But we had one great draft under he who must not be named in 2010. Decker, Thomas, Beadles and Walton.

KipCorrington25 11-15-2012 04:33 PM

McDaniels was to talent evaluation what Stephen Hawking is to figure skating.

Atwater His Ass 11-15-2012 04:39 PM

Ayers may still work out. He's at least showing it on the field now. Doesn't justify his draft position to be sure, but at this point I'd take a solid contributer than can make the occasional play.

ColoradoDarin 11-15-2012 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atwater His Ass (Post 3727248)
Ayers may still work out. He's at least showing it on the field now. Doesn't justify his draft position to be sure, but at this point I'd take a solid contributer than can make the occasional play.

Ayers was supposed to need 3 years as a project, and his progress was obviously slowed by McDaniels. So I'd say McD gets half credit there (good drafting, piss poor coaching).

SonOfLe-loLang 11-15-2012 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ColoradoDarin (Post 3727251)
Ayers was supposed to need 3 years as a project, and his progress was obviously slowed by McDaniels. So I'd say McD gets half credit there (good drafting, piss poor coaching).

Im not defending mcdaniels, but i dont think the blame for Robert Ayers slow development falls at his feet.

ZONA 11-15-2012 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ColoradoDarin (Post 3727251)
Ayers was supposed to need 3 years as a project, and his progress was obviously slowed by McDaniels. So I'd say McD gets half credit there (good drafting, piss poor coaching).

Yeah, I think Mayock said he thought he would need a few years also. He basically played 1 year of college football and that scared alot of people, that he was going to be a 1 year wonder in college football. Mayock said he had loads of ability but was very raw and could take some time but he thought in the end, he could be the best defensive player taken in that draft.

Ayers is emerging. It's up to him to keep improving. His first year here I thought he was trying to get by on purely physical ability (sounds like most rookies huh) but he's slowly started to mold into a really nice threat. I think I heard during last game that also in previous year they were not sure about his optimum playing weight but now they think they finally have that figured out. He does look a little more lean this year. Also, and this is a big one. He frankly wasn't surrounded with the best coaching and players the 1st year or 2. At the end of this year, I think he'll be pushing Doom as the starter. I think he plays the run much better then Doom and now he's finally showing the ability to get to the QB, with some sacks and really a good amount of pressures.

ColoradoDarin 11-15-2012 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SonOfLe-loLang (Post 3727267)
Im not defending mcdaniels, but i dont think the blame for Robert Ayers slow development falls at his feet.

Obviously I'm not in Dove Valley, so I couldn't tell you one way or the other, and it's not a point I think that matters all that much (I don't care if people loved or hated McDaniels, so I'm not emotionally invested either way on the point). My guess is because McD drafted him for OLB in a 3-4, where he should have been playing DE in a 4-3 like he is now - but the current D coaching probably has a lot to do with his development. Ayers showed flashes last year and he's come on well in rotation this year. Maybe not a "starter", but solid play with plenty of snaps. Once drafted, I throw that part out as sunk cost and hope whomever is on the team becomes what we need.

ColoradoDarin 11-15-2012 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZONA (Post 3727268)
Yeah, I think Mayock said he thought he would need a few years also. He basically played 1 year of college football and that scared alot of people, that he was going to be a 1 year wonder in college football. Mayock said he had loads of ability but was very raw and could take some time but he thought in the end, he could be the best defensive player taken in that draft.

Ayers is emerging. It's up to him to keep improving. His first year here I thought he was trying to get by on purely physical ability (sounds like most rookies huh) but he's slowly started to mold into a really nice threat. I think I heard during last game that also in previous year they were not sure about his optimum playing weight but now they think they finally have that figured out. He does look a little more lean this year. Also, and this is a big one. He frankly wasn't surrounded with the best coaching and players the 1st year or 2. At the end of this year, I think he'll be pushing Doom as the starter. I think he plays the run much better then Doom and now he's finally showing the ability to get to the QB, with some sacks and really a good amount of pressures.

Yes!

lonestar 11-15-2012 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Powderaddict (Post 3727186)
Considering how depleted the roster was when Elway took over, getting players better than what we had wasn't all that difficult. That said, Im thrilled with where we are compared to where we were when Elway took over. The turnaround top to bottom has beem amazing.

Considering how piss poor the talent was when Josh got here, not to say that he killed it year one, the upgrades made in that second draft and SINCE in Johns next two are outstanding..
Code:

2012 - Denver Broncos
RD        SEL #        PLAYER        POSITION        SCHOOL
2        36        Derek Wolfe        DT        Cincinnati
2        57        Brock Osweiler        QB        Arizona State
3        67        Ronnie Hillman        RB        San Diego State
4        101        Omar Bolden        CB        Arizona State
4        108        Philip Blake        C        Baylor
5        137        Malik Jackson        DE        Tennessee
6        188        Danny Trevathan        LB        Kentucky

2011 - Denver Broncos
RD        SEL #        PLAYER        POSITION        SCHOOL
1        2        Von Miller        LB        Texas A&M
2        45        Rahim Moore        DB        UCLA
2        46        Orlando Franklin        T        Miami (Fla.)

3        67        Nate Irving        LB        North Carolina State
4        108        Quinton Carter        DB        Oklahoma
4        129        Julius Thomas        TE        Portland State
6        189        Mike Mohamed        LB        California
7        204        Virgil Green        TE        Nevada-Reno

7        247        Jeremy Beal        DE        Oklahoma
2010 - Denver Broncos
RD        SEL #        PLAYER        POSITION        SCHOOL
1        22        Demaryius Thomas        WR        Georgia Tech
1        25        Tim Tebow        QB        Florida
2        45        Zane Beadles        G        Utah
3        80        J.D. Walton        C        Baylor
3        87        Eric Decker        WR        Minnesota

5        137        Perrish Cox        CB        Oklahoma State
6        183        Eric Olsen        G        Notre Dame
7        225        Syd'Quan Thompson        DB        California
7        232        Jammie Kirlew        DE        Indiana
2009 - Denver Broncos
RD        SEL #        PLAYER        POSITION        SCHOOL
1        12        Knowshon Moreno        RB        Georgia
1        18        Robert Ayers        LB        Tennessee


Please remember that the entire 08 D except for 3 Champ, DJ and one other were crap canned and NONE of those cut started again in the NFL with most of them out of the NFL the next year..

add to that the almost entire cast of RB, TE and at least one of the starting OL were not starter by EOS..

Now after cutting/trading cutlet, BM and TS before the season or after it. there was not much left of mikeys personnel by the time that John came to town..

Some whine and complain today about some of those losses while others celebrate them depending on how emotionally attached they were..

since IIRC 2000 only one of mikeys rounds one through three daftees have been resigned and that was DJ, who some love and many just want to move on from..

there was not much in the cupboard long term talent wise at the end of 2008..

Picking up
Code:

1        22        Demaryius Thomas        WR        Georgia Tech
2        45        Zane Beadles        G        Utah
3        80        J.D. Walton        C        Baylor
3        87        Eric Decker        WR        Minnesota

in Joshes last draft, all of which are solid starters helped get us back on track.. and Ayers seems to be lighting it up also the jury is still out on KM but looking like a Broncos exile or Death sentence to me..

John coming in and hitting it strong in his two years with only one real miss has restored faith to many..

lonestar 11-15-2012 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZONA (Post 3727268)
Yeah, I think Mayock said he thought he would need a few years also. He basically played 1 year of college football and that scared alot of people, that he was going to be a 1 year wonder in college football. Mayock said he had loads of ability but was very raw and could take some time but he thought in the end, he could be the best defensive player taken in that draft.

Ayers is emerging. It's up to him to keep improving. His first year here I thought he was trying to get by on purely physical ability (sounds like most rookies huh) but he's slowly started to mold into a really nice threat. I think I heard during last game that also in previous year they were not sure about his optimum playing weight but now they think they finally have that figured out. He does look a little more lean this year. Also, and this is a big one. He frankly wasn't surrounded with the best coaching and players the 1st year or 2. At the end of this year, I think he'll be pushing Doom as the starter. I think he plays the run much better then Doom and now he's finally showing the ability to get to the QB, with some sacks and really a good amount of pressures.

heresy I say burn him and the stake..

watch out stating that will get you lots of neg reps..

I have always said Doom is a one trick pony, a very good one at that, but his inability to play the run solidly placed him at tied for 41st in tackles last year.. with Ayers only slightly behind him at 50 (or 3 tackles) with very limited playing time..

Lets hope that Doom will up his game, but I think the size he plays at will always limit his OTHER THAN pass rushing ability..

gyldenlove 11-15-2012 06:55 PM

That 2009 draft, even if Ayers becomes a pro-bowler was still a giant heap of dung, here is what we got with 2 1st round picks, 3 2nd round picks, 2 4th round picks, 1 5th, 6th and 7th round picks:

1 defensive end.

We also picked up at least half a dozen players who washed out of the league before their rookie contracts expired.

Archer81 11-15-2012 07:49 PM

5 year plan became a 2 year plan the second Manning signed. A rare QB who improves the entire team and makes players better then they are.

It is odd thinking that Denver could have meaningless games in December for a good reason, and not because we are outside looking in.

:Broncos:

theAPAOps5 11-15-2012 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by g6matty (Post 3727189)
lollll

what is funny is he lists Shawn Merriman as out of football. He is actually making some plays in Buffalo!

extralife 11-15-2012 07:58 PM

lets not go hog wild with Ayers here. he would have been cut in camp if Hunter didn't go down, if you recall.

rugbythug 11-15-2012 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by extralife (Post 3727370)
lets not go hog wild with Ayers here. he would have been cut in camp if Hunter didn't go down, if you recall.

Doubt that.

Mogulseeker 11-15-2012 08:57 PM

Ayers is solid.

McDman 11-15-2012 09:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lonestar (Post 3727304)
heresy I say burn him and the stake..

watch out stating that will get you lots of neg reps..

I have always said Doom is a one trick pony, a very good one at that, but his inability to play the run solidly placed him at tied for 41st in tackles last year.. with Ayers only slightly behind him at 50 (or 3 tackles) with very limited playing time..

Lets hope that Doom will up his game, but I think the size he plays at will always limit his OTHER THAN pass rushing ability..

To be fair to Doom he hasn't exactly had stellar DTs playing next to him to help in the run game.

McDman 11-15-2012 09:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by extralife (Post 3727370)
lets not go hog wild with Ayers here. he would have been cut in camp if Hunter didn't go down, if you recall.

No chance.

lonestar 11-15-2012 10:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gyldenlove (Post 3727337)
That 2009 draft, even if Ayers becomes a pro-bowler was still a giant heap of dung, here is what we got with 2 1st round picks, 3 2nd round picks, 2 4th round picks, 1 5th, 6th and 7th round picks:

1 defensive end.

We also picked up at least half a dozen players who washed out of the league before their rookie contracts expired.

Did anyone stay anything to the contrary?

Considering the scouts were unable to give him (or he did not want their reports) info that he needed to get better results, well perhaps that also falls back on mikey and his crap employees.

They scouted for Mikey's kind of guys and frankly one decent (depends on how much you liked cutlet, BM and TS) daft certainly did nothing to calm my fears of another DAFT.

Mikey wanted X kind of guys, Josh wanted something else and if all you were looking for all year was X how do you modify that In a few weeks.

They fired the staff when they were unable to produce the info that Josh wanted. That much was clear.

So who was wrong Josh or Bates.

Seemed to everyone here that the second draft resulted in some damned fine starters still starting today.

Tends to make me think the scouts fubared a lot of that data Josh had to go on.

I guess if you hate him that much, logic will not prevail.
.

lonestar 11-15-2012 11:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by McDman (Post 3727435)
To be fair to Doom he hasn't exactly had stellar DTs playing next to him to help in the run game.

I agree but then who was to blame for that..

Personally I was asking for Buckley in the draft and many other DTs, while mikey continued DAFTING lousy player..

I have always believed that you win and lose games on the LOS..

if you have control of the LOS then everyone behind them are just that much better.

tell me the last time the Broncos controlled the LOS on either side consistently.. and lets not talk about the ZBS after the real OL guys retired we could not do squat inside the red zone and inside the five it was a joke except for one year when Anderson was our RB.. and maybe when Bell had damned near as many TDs as he did yards..

TWO BIG backs that could power their way in.. what did mikey do traded them so his tater could be a hero..

we had a great Offense between the 20's inside the ed zone zip.. whoops I forgot automatic Elam.. every year the EOY presser was the same we are one or two players away and we have to improve inside the Red Zone..

Now we actually have some horsepower on the LOS especially on the DL, OL may take another year or two to build them up physically and coach techniques.. They are pretty good now, but the kiddies are here to stay and getting better by the game.. We should see another jump in output with another real off season..


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