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Mecklomaniac 10-19-2012 07:02 PM

QB Mount Rushmore
 
Ok, bye week boredom. After Monday nights comeback ESPN talked about if you had a Mount Rushmore for QBs who would it be. They had Peyton, Elway, Marino and Favre.

Radio station up here in Seattle picked it up and had a good discussion. They discussed a lot of different criteria (changed the game, championships, leadership, yards, etc..)

Sammy Baugh---- changed the way the game is played.
Otto Graham --- 10 consecutive championship games winning 7.
Warren Moon-- CFL and NFL hall of fame, lead the way for black QBs
Passing Yards--- Brett Favre
Leadership --- Elway taking teams with limited talent to the Superbowl
Comebacks --- Peyton Manning
Career pass completion % --- Chad Pennington :)


If you could only pick four who would you go with and why?

10-19-2012 07:15 PM

Johnny Unitas?

TheChamp24 10-19-2012 07:16 PM

Unitas changed the game a lot.

Unitas, Montana, Elway and Manning I think

10-19-2012 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheChamp24 (Post 3702706)
Manning

I would not want to be the dude in charge of chiseling out the forehead.

SouthStndJunkie 10-19-2012 07:35 PM

Yep....Johnny Unitas should have been on that list for sure and Joe Namath shouldn't be on the list.

Carmelo15 10-19-2012 07:35 PM

1. Joe Montana
2. John Elway
3. Peyton Manning
4. Dan Marino

errand 10-19-2012 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SouthStndJunkie (Post 3702718)
Yep....Johnny Unitas should have been on that list for sure and Joe Namath shouldn't be on the list.

Namath changed the game of how much money players earned.......and gave the AFL credibility winning SB III over heavily favored Colts....

He doesn't make my list of Baugh, Graham, Unitas, and Elway....but he was instrumental in changing the game some way.

SouthStndJunkie 10-19-2012 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by errand (Post 3702732)
Namath changed the game of how much money players earned.......and gave the AFL credibility winning SB III over heavily favored Colts....

He doesn't make my list of Baugh, Graham, Unitas, and Elway....but he was instrumental in changing the game some way.

It's just my opinion, but anyone with a career 50.1% completion percentage and a 173 TD to 220 INT ratio shouldn't be in this list.

Namath's all time won/loss record is also under .500 at 62-63-4.

Maybe I would feel different had a I seen him play growing up and saw his impact in the game in that era.

You can't tell the history of the AFL/NFL without talking about him, but I don't think he should be in consideration for the Mount Rushmore of QBs.

maher_tyler 10-19-2012 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by menonite (Post 3702705)
Johnny Unitas?

I knew that list didn't look right.

I voted Elway, Montana, Manning and Namath but would switch to Unitas.

errand 10-19-2012 08:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SouthStndJunkie (Post 3702734)
It's just my opinion, but anyone with a career 50.1% completion percentage and a 173 TD to 220 INT ratio shouldn't be in this list.

Namath's all time won/loss record is also under .500 at 62-63-4.

Maybe I would feel different had a I seen him play growing up and saw his impact in the game in that era.

You can't tell the history of the AFL/NFL without talking about him, but I don't think he should be in consideration for the Mount Rushmore of QBs.


again, depends on the criteria.....he gave the AFL credibility which led to the merger with NFL which created the new national past time and helped usher in higher salaries for the players.....

Sure his numbers weren't that great compared to the ones being put up by every QB today...but the leagues were alot different then than they are now....

to hit on half your passes was actually pretty good back in the day as DB's and LB's were allowed to knock your WR's down throughout the whole route practically, and linemen protecting you weren't allowed to use their hands when pass blocking, etc.....

Just one man's opinion...

BowlenBall 10-19-2012 08:10 PM

Elway and Montana, no question.

Manning (but would like him to win one more super bowl to make it a slam dunk)

Very close for the last slot, but I suppose I'd give it to Unitas (Marion has no rings, therefore is not eligible)

cutthemdown 10-19-2012 08:21 PM

Elway- I am a Bronco fan
Unitas- first to really make the forward pass deadly
Marino- did anyone every throw the ball around better
Montana-ushered in the west coast high% passing game we still see today.

ScottXray 10-19-2012 08:51 PM

If only 4 I would have to go with
Elway ( carried three teams to bowls and then won 2 with complete teams)

Montana ( multiple championships, first to run the WCO)

Graham ( 10 consecutive championship games!)

Bradshaw ( eww... that almost made me throw up) ( 4 SB wins)
Brady might edge him out here. Basically a toss up. Someone Morph Brady and Bradshaws faces.

If Manning gets another 2 SB win then he probably replaces the last, because of his play elevating his teams.



Criteria...Multiple championships and appearances due to QB play!

On that basis Marino, Favre, Moon, Unitas et al don't make the mount. Currently also Peyton Manning.

extralife 10-20-2012 01:16 AM

Unitas, Montana, Brady, Manning.

I wanted to drop Manning for Graham so you could have four QBs for four different generations, but right now I can't see this without both Manning and Brady. Elway and Graham would be five and six in some order.

cutthemdown 10-20-2012 01:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by extralife (Post 3702874)
Unitas, Montana, Brady, Manning.

I wanted to drop Manning for Graham so you could have four QBs for four different generations, but right now I can't see this without both Manning and Brady. Elway and Graham would be five and six in some order.

I disagree. Brady would never have survived the game back in Elways day. Back then dbacks could grab, they got 1 full step after you threw the ball to drive you into the dirt. You could hit defensless players and take them out of the game, which happened a lot. Broncos learned from the Raiders that whoozy players cant play football. Dennis Smith and Atwater took that out on WR for a decade. Meanwhile the Raiders would pummel Elway left and right, out of bounds, after the whistle, after he threw the ball, everytime he ran, and there was no sliding.

Manning and Brady are the best of the new era, but hard to compare or say they are better then Marino, Elway, Fouts, Kelly, those guys took a beating and kept on ticking.

The tackle that jim burt put on Montana to screw his back up would also be illegal now. Now pile driving the QB with your whole body weight.

Lycan 10-20-2012 03:28 AM

For me it's: Elway, Montana, Marino, Manning.

The four best QB's of all time IMO.

extralife 10-20-2012 04:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cutthemdown (Post 3702875)
I disagree. Brady would never have survived the game back in Elways day.

Brady is tough as ****. Maybe he misses a few more games, maybe he doesn't, you can't really say. The rules protect QBs much better these days, but don't forget that said protection was enacted and necessitated by the sheer athletic ability of defenders in today's game.

If you want to argue that Manning and Brady wouldn't have the same stats they do now if they had played in a different era, you won't find me disagreeing. But given that Manning is going to retire as number one or number two all time in every significant passing category and Brady won't be that far behind despite playing in a conservative offense for the first half of his career, well, a little statistical deflation wouldn't kill them. And winning is winning regardless of the era--in that department, Brady's five super bowl appearances are tied with you-know-who for the most all time. Brady has also succeeded in two entire different offensive systems, playing entirely different games. His winning percentage is the best in NFL history for a QB with anything near his games played (granted, Otto Graham has better numbers in this department, his just didn't come entirely in the NFL).

And if today's QBs would find it harder to play in a league that didn't protect them as much, yesterday's QBs would find it difficult to operate with the precision, responsibility, knowledge, and accuracy of Peyton Manning and his acolytes. Manning's command of the game is simply on a different level, he's the most distinctive QB to ever play the game. Watching Manning play the game is simply different from watching anyone else play the game. If I trust what I've read, the analog here is basically Unitas and no one else.

HorseHead 10-20-2012 05:31 AM

By the end of his career, Brady will be right next to our boy on Rushmore..

Granted, a couple of those rings came courtesy of a clutch kicker, before the Moss air show, he didn't exactly have a stellar wr corps either...

10-20-2012 06:17 AM

I went with Marino, Elway, Brady, Manning.

I feel like the each occupy a particular archetype, and were the best of that archetype. So, for example Montana -- he's slightly under Brady, similar mold.

Or the drop back and find something, gunslinger -- that's Marino. Favre was a poor man's Marino.

Elway is the athletic, mobile, will his team to victory type (big arm).

I think Manning is on it -- the ultimate cerebral, read the defense before snap, change the play, etc. There has never been anyone better at that aspect.

rmsanger 10-20-2012 06:52 AM

Bros I love Elway and all but by the end of this next decade he'll be a tier 2 QB in the public's perception.

Most people today regard Montana & Marino higher than Elway with Favre being on the same level. When it's all said and done likely the current crazy stats will drive the #'s for Brady, Manning, Brees, and Rodgers above what is currently HOF material.

Just sayin!

10-20-2012 08:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lycan (Post 3702887)
For me it's: Elway, Montana, Marino, Manning.

The four best QB's of all time IMO.

This is what I think too. Helps that is my era of players too.

HorseHead 10-20-2012 09:07 AM

I disagree with the above that Elway will be "tier 2 qb" when all is said and done. After this next wave..

Actually, I think Elway's stock has risen, and has been cemented irregardless of stats.

In many ways, the QB's you see today have Elway's style DNA written all over their play..(RG 3 , Cam etc.)

In many ways he was the prototype...

Hamrob 10-20-2012 10:33 AM

For me, it's:

Baugh...the very best of the old days
Unitas...the first true gun slinger
Montana...Joe cool
Elway...Better than Marino
Manning...Better than Brady

That's my top-5

Honorable Mentions

Staubach
Marino
Favre
Brady

Hamrob 10-20-2012 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rmsanger (Post 3702909)
Bros I love Elway and all but by the end of this next decade he'll be a tier 2 QB in the public's perception.

Most people today regard Montana & Marino higher than Elway with Favre being on the same level. When it's all said and done likely the current crazy stats will drive the #'s for Brady, Manning, Brees, and Rodgers above what is currently HOF material.

Just sayin!

Who regards Marino greater than Elway???

I don't see that, I don't hear that....that's just not the facts.

Elway...5 AFC Championships, 2 Rings..........and stats right there with Marino...playing with lesser talent around him for most of his career.

I think....there's a pitty party going on out there for Marino...But, I don't think people feel he was a beter all around QB than Elway!

gunns 10-20-2012 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HorseHead (Post 3702948)
I disagree with the above that Elway will be "tier 2 qb" when all is said and done. After this next wave..

Actually, I think Elway's stock has risen, and has been cemented irregardless of stats.

In many ways, the QB's you see today have Elway's style DNA written all over their play..(RG 3 , Cam etc.)

In many ways he was the prototype...

I agree. Montana had a team to work with and make him look very good. Not saying he wasn't but one does have to wonder if there would have been that much success without it. Marino had the quick release plus accuracy BUT he also had some great WR tandems. Elway was one of the great athletes at the position and one of the few players I've ever seen carrying teams on his back.

Unitas definitely should be up there. Namath not so much as far as QB play, Bradshaw either, he didn't win 4 SB's, his defenses did.


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