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-   -   What the team should do to move forward (http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=114433)

SVine 02-02-2014 10:49 PM

What the team should do to move forward
 
Lots of knee jerk reactions, myself included, with strong opinions on how the Broncos should move forward. It seems that the majority of Mane posters don't want Fox to be fired, and probably even a bigger majority want Peyton to come back.

But going forward, what should this team do? Keep most the roster intact and hope you don't have so many injuries? Purge players, and if so, which ones? Purge any of the coaches? Hope you have a good draft? (although having the 2nd worst draft position makes it extremely unlikely that the draft helps the Broncos moreso than it helps other teams)

Tombstone RJ 02-02-2014 10:52 PM

this team needs to get more physical and that starts with the defense. On offense, they have to run the ball effectively. I'd have no problem firing the special teams coach as well because the special teams sucked too so make that coach the sacrificial "your outta here" firing.

R8R H8R 02-02-2014 10:52 PM

Obviously, not physical enough. Improve that and let's see.

Popps 02-02-2014 10:54 PM

Size and speed at LB, S and in the secondary. Draft a young pass-rusher, and figure out a way to enable our O-line to be able to punch teams in the mouth when we need to.

SEA got pressure up front with 3-4 guys all night, too. That's devastating for an offense.
There's our lesson for next season right there...

Agamemnon 02-02-2014 10:58 PM

Yes drafting physical defensive players will totally fix our turnover issues and the fact that we have a regular season QB trying to carry a team in the playoffs.

::)

Action 02-02-2014 11:00 PM

Seattle's gameplan was pretty much what Giants did the Patriots in 07-08, in regards to rushing the QB.

We need to be more physical on defense. Running the ball, we can improve but I don't think we need to emphasize taking the ball out of Peyton's hands. Anytime you get down like we did, you're going to pass. We never really got into situations to get the run game truly going. Peyton said they wanted to get Moreno involved heavy too, so I'm sure that was part of the plan.

On top of all that, Seahawks weren't able to run the ball very well and still win and play well on offense.

Get some bigger and better LBs... specifically MLB. Get some bigger physical guys up front.

What's funny is, the most physical guy on our dline is probably Vickerson/Knighton...and Vickerson was drafted by the Seahawks. I'd say Vickerson is a more physical player though...nastier.

They obviously have a formula over there for physicality.

Agamemnon 02-02-2014 11:04 PM

God you people are killing me. It took the Seahawks three or four years to build that roster of physical defenders. We have a year or two with Manning and we are going to be drafting late every year. The reality is that we are what we are unless a rebuild starts. The only way this team wins a Super Bowl is if they stop turning the ball over. I have little faith in that department.

Tombstone RJ 02-02-2014 11:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Agamemnon (Post 4051519)
God you people are killing me. It took the Seahawks three or four years to build that roster of physical defenders. We have a year or two with Manning and we are going to be drafting late every year. The reality is that we are what we are unless a rebuild starts. The only way this team wins a Super Bowl is if they stop turning the ball over. I have little faith in that department.

wrong, it took Seattle getting lucky finding Russell Wilson--a QB--to get them to the SB. As good as that defense is, without Wilson making those key third down conversions, the team is not the same.

sure, the Broncos helped Seattle by crapping their pants. But the Broncos can absolutely fix that by having a more effective running game (Manning made some very bad throws due to pressure) and having a defense that can get pressure with 4 guys up front.

BigPlayShay 02-02-2014 11:10 PM

Run the ball more, and effectively. Stay healthy.

Pick Six 02-02-2014 11:14 PM

We need to get our depth back, on the offensive line. It was embarrassing to see the push Seattle got, on our line...

Action 02-02-2014 11:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crushaholic (Post 4051527)
We need to get our depth back, on the offensive line. It was embarrassing to see the push Seattle got, on our line...

This. I think we need a big physical guard, Iupati type.

Agamemnon 02-02-2014 11:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tombstone RJ (Post 4051521)
wrong, it took Seattle getting lucky finding Russell Wilson--a QB--to get them to the SB. As good as that defense is, without Wilson making those key third down conversions, the team is not the same.

sure, the Broncos helped Seattle by crapping their pants. But the Broncos can absolutely fix that by having a more effective running game (Manning made some very bad throws due to pressure) and having a defense that can get pressure with 4 guys up front.

I really think you are delusional if you think our offense is ever going to be balanced with Peyton Manning at QB. Also do you really see rookies fixing this defense overnight?

Oh and turnovers. Let's get down to what cost us this game. Seattle had a +29 turnover differential going into this game as I recall and Denver was +0 or some such. That played out tonight right before our eyes. That's hard to fix unless you change the culture of a team, and I just don't see that happening in the year or two Manning has left.

Tombstone RJ 02-02-2014 11:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Agamemnon (Post 4051529)
I really think you are delusional if you think our offense is ever going to be balanced with Peyton Manning at QB. Also do you really see rookies fixing this defense overnight?

Oh and turnovers. Let's get down to what cost us this game. Seattle had a +29 turnover differential going into this game as I recall and Denver was +0 or some such. That played out tonight right before our eyes. That's hard to fix unless you change the culture of a team, and I just don't see that happening in the year or two Manning has left.

You can always improve the defense, what does that have to do with Manning? Nada. Not a friggen thing. Yes, the Broncos can make the defense better, more physical and do it in a short amount of time. This has nothing to do with Manning.

As for the Broncos offense, they have to run the ball better too, and that means being more physical up front. Sure, Manning is gonna be Manning but even when Manning retires, having an effective running game will help the next QB.

Agamemnon 02-02-2014 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tombstone RJ (Post 4051533)
You can always improve the defense, what does that have to do with Manning? Nada. Not a friggen thing. Yes, the Broncos can make the defense better, more physical and do it in a short amount of time. This has nothing to do with Manning.

As for the Broncos offense, they have to run the ball better too, and that means being more physical up front. Sure, Manning is gonna be Manning but even when Manning retires, having an effective running game will help the next QB.

I'm 100% with you on the improved running game idea. But hell, we don't even use a fullback. That's the issue with Manning right now. He dictates what offense we are going to run and it's not an offense geared towards a balanced attack with a great running game.

Also the defense will get better simply due to getting healthy, and yes we might hit some home runs with immediate impact defensive rookes, but in the end if we don't stop turning the ball over it won't matter.

sgbfan 02-02-2014 11:26 PM

Maybe we should trade our second round pick for a first rounder next year that gets us an all-pro safety, and draft an all pro CB in the fifth round. While we're at it, why don't we pick up 3-4 starters as UDFA and an awesome QB in the third round. That would be a good start...

broncosteven 02-02-2014 11:27 PM

Resign DRC - Rework CHamp

Resign Big Deck, I would float Welker as trade bait for either D player of need or a draft pick, what ever the market would bear, then trade up for a BPA type of player until the 3rd round. If there is no market for Wes and still some cap space to move around then keep Wes. Keep Caldwell, try out Robinson in TC. I would also trade/cut Dreesen(sp?) then bring in a blocking FB to run some I formation plays with the FB cleaning the holes inside rather than stacking the OL from LT to RT and pulling a guard all the time. Plus with a blocking FB he could catch some balls out in the flat and help in pass pro.
Let KM Leave, Ball is the same player if not better, he always gets hurt in big games and cannot play a full season anymore.
Lure Bobby Turner to the Broncos and hire him as a RB coach, let him draft an RB where ever he wants to or if he finds one in FA let him make a move.

Get Harris and Von and Big Vick back 100%, paying Big Vick as much as we can.

Give Beadles a low ball offer (only if Kuper cannot play as a backup) move Clark inside to LG, Draft a Tackle/Guard/or maybe even C.

Draft A pure rushing DE, MIKE, SAFETY, CB, land another safety and CB that are solid Vets in FA, maybe even a MIKE vet too. Would rather see them get a MIKE via draft but we will see.

Getting Bobby Turner would be key, our run game is setup with the pass and we could do nothing last night. Get Turner even as a talent evaluator and find a tweener even if they have to add in some zone for him (hence the I formation FB).

An old Manning or Young QBOTF would need a stout D and great run game, 2 things we do not have. Get that great D and great run game and we are popping corks this time next year and not reading goofy butt hurt posts about blowing everything up and starting over like the Raiders after they lost their SB!

Agamemnon 02-02-2014 11:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by broncosteven (Post 4051539)
Resign DRC - Rework CHamp

Resign Big Deck, I would float Welker as trade bait for either D player of need or a draft pick, what ever the market would bear, then trade up for a BPA type of player until the 3rd round. If there is no market for Wes and still some cap space to move around then keep Wes. Keep Caldwell, try out Robinson in TC. I would also trade/cut Dreesen(sp?) then bring in a blocking FB to run some I formation plays with the FB cleaning the holes inside rather than stacking the OL from LT to RT and pulling a guard all the time. Plus with a blocking FB he could catch some balls out in the flat and help in pass pro.
Let KM Leave, Ball is the same player if not better, he always gets hurt in big games and cannot play a full season anymore.
Lure Bobby Turner to the Broncos and hire him as a RB coach, let him draft an RB where ever he wants to or if he finds one in FA let him make a move.

Get Harris and Von and Big Vick back 100%, paying Big Vick as much as we can.

Give Beadles a low ball offer (only if Kuper cannot play as a backup) move Clark inside to LG, Draft a Tackle/Guard/or maybe even C.

Draft A pure rushing DE, MIKE, SAFETY, CB, land another safety and CB that are solid Vets in FA, maybe even a MIKE vet too. Would rather see them get a MIKE via draft but we will see.

Getting Bobby Turner would be key, our run game is setup with the pass and we could do nothing last night. Get Turner even as a talent evaluator and find a tweener even if they have to add in some zone for him (hence the I formation FB).

An old Manning or Young QBOTF would need a stout D and great run game, 2 things we do not have. Get that great D and great run game and we are popping corks this time next year and not reading goofy butt hurt posts about blowing everything up and starting over like the Raiders after they lost their SB!

Get a great D and a great run game in a year or two and hope age doesn't start catching up with Manning? Great plan. ::)

bronc_fan23 02-02-2014 11:39 PM

We need two of the best players in the NFL back off of the injury list, along with our up and coming star CB.

bigbucks24 02-03-2014 01:01 AM

Free Agents
Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie
Knowshon Moreno
Robert Ayers
Wesley Woodyard
Mike Adams
Stewart Bradley
Quentin Jammer
Zane Beadles
Shaun Phillips
Paris Lenon
Dan Koppen
Andre Caldwell
Winston Justice
Michael Huff
Eric Decker
Steve Vallos

Restricted Free Agents
Mitch Unrein
Chris Harris
Trindon Holliday

Exclusive Rights Free Agents
Tony Carter
Duke Ihenacho
Brandon Marshall

And nearly no cap space currently. What do you do?

rolandftw 02-03-2014 01:09 AM

Rework Champ's contract and move him over to Safety. He says he wants to come back and will consider that. If not, you have to cut him as he's not worth $10 million a year, anymore. More offensive line depth.

Let Decker go to the highest bidder. Need a less finesse WR, one that isn't whining about pass interference calls all game long. Re-Sign DRC. Need defensive ends, especially if Wolfe isn't the same. Definitely need to draft/sign a MLB as well.

Not going to happen, but fire John Fox and the rest of the coaching staff.

Agamemnon 02-03-2014 01:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rolandftw (Post 4051608)
Rework Champ's contract and move him over to Safety. He says he wants to come back and will consider that. If not, you have to cut him as he's not worth $10 million a year, anymore. More offensive line depth.

Let Decker go to the highest bidder. Need a less finesse WR, one that isn't whining about pass interference calls all game long. Re-Sign DRC. Need defensive ends, especially if Wolfe isn't the same. Definitely need to draft/sign a MLB as well.

Not going to happen, but fire John Fox and the rest of the coaching staff.

I just realized we don't have to fire Fox. We can simply not renew his contract. Suddenly I think it might actually happen. Elway isn't going to fire the guy outright, but after this game he has to see Dan Reeves in John Fox doesn't he? I mean it's so ****ing obvious. Seriously, how do you extend him after this?

rolandftw 02-03-2014 01:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Agamemnon (Post 4051622)
I just realized we don't have to fire Fox. We can simply not renew his contract. Suddenly I think it might actually happen. Elway isn't going to fire the guy outright, but after this game he has to see Dan Reeves in John Fox doesn't he? I mean it's so ****ing obvious. Seriously, how do you extend him after this?

I think he has one year left. Was a four year deal at the time. But that doesn't change my view, he and his staff should be gone.

Armchair Bronco 02-03-2014 01:31 AM

No way Elway fires Fox. He'll demand a new DC but will let Fox command the ship for one more year.

dsmoot 02-03-2014 01:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Agamemnon (Post 4051529)
I really think you are delusional if you think our offense is ever going to be balanced with Peyton Manning at QB. Also do you really see rookies fixing this defense overnight?

Oh and turnovers. Let's get down to what cost us this game. Seattle had a +29 turnover differential going into this game as I recall and Denver was +0 or some such. That played out tonight right before our eyes. That's hard to fix unless you change the culture of a team, and I just don't see that happening in the year or two Manning has left.

.
Just remember back. The 97/98 team defense was the weak link in the team. They were not a bad unit but definitely a bend but not break. The key element for that group was their ability to generate turnovers and provide tight coverage. They also had some real physical toughness with Romanowski and Atwater (97). Our current group doesn't produce turnovers, does not lay any wood on the opponent and except for DRC is soft in coverage. Very few times do you see a safety effectively pick up recievers in coverage.

rolandftw 02-03-2014 01:34 AM

If he doesn't, he's making a big mistake. I tend to agree, he won't fire him. This team is not winning a championship with John Fox as the coach.

I thought the heart attack might actually make him less conservative, with a new outlook on life but he goes into turtle mode even more so then he did before.


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