PDA

View Full Version : Nightmares of Bob Slowik's defense


Kaylore
09-01-2011, 10:57 PM
So that's where the Slowik's team went. It all was so horribly familiar. Conversions on 3rd and 10 plus. Linebackers horribly out of position on running downs and flailing around in coverage. The only thing missing is the stupid dancing after tackling a nine yard run.

McBath is gone. So is Mohamed and whoever was wearing 47.

Taco John
09-01-2011, 11:00 PM
Man, if you get cut from this defense, you really need to consider what you're doing with your life.

Punisher
09-01-2011, 11:03 PM
One of the main reason shanny got fired was cause of him ****ing waste

KevinJames
09-01-2011, 11:05 PM
You didn't hear Fox and Allen let Wink Martindale coach the defense one last time tonight because they felt bad for him.

Agamemnon
09-01-2011, 11:16 PM
And there were some claiming our depth wasn't that bad prior to this game... Hilarious!

Kaylore
09-01-2011, 11:31 PM
And there were some claiming our depth wasn't that bad prior to this game... Hilarious!

Who?

DBroncos4life
09-01-2011, 11:53 PM
Who?

No one.

Agamemnon
09-01-2011, 11:55 PM
Who?

Not really feeling like digging through threads to find names.

I just remember some people saying stuff like "every team's backups are bad" etc. The fact is that we may well have the worst depth in the league. God help us if we get hit with the injury bug this year.

Our starting lineup is good enough to have an outside shot at the playoffs. Unfortunately, teams don't just play with their starters usually. So I'm still rather pessimistic about this season.

Agamemnon
09-01-2011, 11:56 PM
No one.

No one claimed we had good depth. There were some that acted like it wasn't that bad though.

DBroncos4life
09-01-2011, 11:59 PM
Not really feeling like digging through threads to find names.

I just remember some people saying stuff like "every team's backups are bad" etc. The fact is that we may well have the worst depth in the league. God help us if we get hit with the injury bug this year.

Our starting lineup is good enough to have an outside shot at the playoffs. Unfortunately, teams don't just play with their starters usually. So I'm still rather pessimistic about this season.

How is saying every teams back ups are bad even close to being the same as our back ups are not that bad?

Archer81
09-02-2011, 12:04 AM
I think both Irving and Mohamed make it. 47 is gone. Hunter sticks because he can play DE. Woodyard stays too.

:Broncos:

Agamemnon
09-02-2011, 12:12 AM
How is saying every teams back ups are bad even close to being the same as our back ups are not that bad?

That was what was implied. Listen, I don't have the quotes and don't feel like searching. I just remember some downplaying our depth problems a bit. That's all.

Agamemnon
09-02-2011, 12:13 AM
I think both Irving and Mohamed make it. 47 is gone. Hunter sticks because he can play DE. Woodyard stays too.

:Broncos:

Yeah we can't cut everyone who played poorly in this game. We do need to cut the people who played poorly in every preseason game (Nate Jones I'm looking at you).

Archer81
09-02-2011, 12:18 AM
Yeah we can't cut everyone who played poorly in this game. We do need to cut the people who played poorly in every preseason game (Nate Jones I'm looking at you).


With both Irving and Mohamed I saw them make the right read...a second later than they needed to. Indicates to me that they are thinking a bit much and with time should be able to make plays. Hunter looked like a man possessed. 47...I dont even remember his name. Not a good sign.

On the d-line Unrein(sp) impressed. He got pretty steady push. He might make it because of injury problems at DT.

Secondary...I think Cox made the squad because Sid'Quan looks like he really f'ed up his foot. Safeties are harder to read. Moore and Dawkins, obviously. McCarthy more than probably. carter and McBath made a good case. I think with those two its a coin flip. Bruton...nice knowing you.

:Broncos:

DBroncos4life
09-02-2011, 12:21 AM
That was what was implied. Listen, I don't have the quotes and don't feel like searching. I just remember some downplaying our depth problems a bit. That's all.

Maybe it depends on the position they were talking about. Still one or two posters out of thousands doesnt speak for the mass.

DBroncos4life
09-02-2011, 12:23 AM
Yeah we can't cut everyone who played poorly in this game. We do need to cut the people who played poorly in every preseason game (Nate Jones I'm looking at you).

Nate Jones has been cut already. You would know that if the Nate Jones has been cut thread said something about Tebow in it.

Agamemnon
09-02-2011, 12:24 AM
Maybe it depends on the position they were talking about. Still one or two posters out of thousands doesnt speak for the mass.

Thus the use of the word "some" in my original post. I never claimed it was a widely held opinion.

Agamemnon
09-02-2011, 12:25 AM
Nate Jones has been cut already. You would know that if the Nate Jones has been cut thread said something about Tebow in it.

Haven't been on the boards today, so I missed that. No need to be an ass.

Good news all the same. :yayaya:

DBroncos4life
09-02-2011, 12:28 AM
Haven't been on the boards today, so I missed that. No need to be an ass.

Good news all the same. :yayaya:

There is always reasons to be a ass on the Mane :clown:

maher_tyler
09-02-2011, 04:11 AM
If any of our starters get hurt...we're in trouble. Especially on the Oline...Tebow has had no time to throw from the pocket. I finally saw first hand how bad the 2nd or third string oline was/is. The stats he has put up with what he's had to work with is impressive in my book. That TD throw was money!

LongDongJohnson
09-02-2011, 04:13 AM
Atleast we stuffed the **** out of the cardinals running game with all out blitzes.

mhgaffney
09-02-2011, 04:54 AM
The Cards have a running game? Since when.

EmpireOrange
09-02-2011, 05:22 AM
So that's where the Slowik's team went.

Dude, I was think the same thing. The play last night looked frightenly familar. I can't believe I'm saying this but I'm with Mike Evans on this, with the exception of one or two Denver needs to cut the whole mess of them that played last night. Take your chances on other teams scrubs. Depth is an issue, it most certainly is.

theAPAOps5
09-02-2011, 06:37 AM
Haven't been on the boards today, so I missed that. No need to be an ass.

Good news all the same. :yayaya:

He was cut three days ago! Glorious news that rang from the mountain tops! :sunshine:

ND Bronco Fan
09-02-2011, 06:56 AM
Mohammed really looked stiff and slow to me..........was not impressed.

BroncoInferno
09-02-2011, 07:02 AM
Our backups are wretched on both offense and defense. Hopefully, we can stay relatively heathly this season.

Rock Chalk
09-02-2011, 07:06 AM
I think we are OK if we dont have a lot of injuries. One or two backups in teh game and we can cover them. But if this **** gets like it did last year on defnese with the injuries we are ****ed.

Proper ****ed.

Kaylore
09-02-2011, 07:23 AM
I think we are OK if we dont have a lot of injuries. One or two backups in teh game and we can cover them. But if this **** gets like it did last year on defnese with the injuries we are ****ed.

Proper ****ed.

And there aren't many teams where that isn't the case.

BroncoInferno
09-02-2011, 07:25 AM
And there aren't many teams where that isn't the case.

yeah, but our backups look especially ****ty. More than the norm.

Agamemnon
09-02-2011, 07:27 AM
yeah, but our backups look especially ****ty. More than the norm.

A lot of our 2nd stringers are 3rd stringers on most teams. That's not winning.

Kaylore
09-02-2011, 07:39 AM
A lot of our 2nd stringers are 3rd stringers on most teams. That's not winning.

Some of those guys were starters last year which explains a lot. We were 4-12 last year and the quality of the depth on the team is a reflection of that record. It will take a few years to re-stock the cupboard.

Abqbronco
09-02-2011, 07:42 AM
So that's where the Slowik's team went. It all was so horribly familiar. Conversions on 3rd and 10 plus. Linebackers horribly out of position on running downs and flailing around in coverage. The only thing missing is the stupid dancing after tackling a nine yard run.

McBath is gone. So is Mohamed and whoever was wearing 47.

Hunter came really close last night. I even said something to my kid about it. Down by 20+ points and bouncing around and screaming like he just made a Superbowl winning sack.

Br0nc0Buster
09-02-2011, 07:52 AM
Outside of Irving, Carter, Riley, Minor, and maybe Hunter our depth is a huge pile of crap

And Riley and Minor prolly go on the PS

MileHighMagic
09-02-2011, 08:00 AM
Mohammed is awful. Unless he is a ST asset, I dont see how they keep him.

gyldenlove
09-02-2011, 08:13 AM
Mohammed is awful. Unless he is a ST asset, I dont see how they keep him.

Irving makes it, he is not ready to be a starting MLB but at least there is some potential there. Mohamed is gone, he is slow to read and react and physically slow as well (the worst combo). Mccarthy right now would make the squad based on the 1st and 2nd preseason games, he looked out of position on every play I saw last night. Carter looks like a good box safety, he is aggressive against the run, but I didn't see him do one thing right in coverage.

Cox makes it because of Thompsons injury, although I didn't see any of them look good yesterday.

Right now I believe we will try to pick up a LB, two or three offensive linemen and maybe a CB when rosters are cut - the sad truth is that other peoples garbage is likely better than our keepers.

TonyR
09-02-2011, 08:56 AM
I didn't see or hear the game but the box shows that Mohamed had 11 tackles (8 solo) and a TFL. I realize stats don't begin to tell the whole story but was he really that bad?

Kaylore
09-02-2011, 08:58 AM
I didn't see or hear the game but the box shows that Mohamed had 11 tackles (8 solo) and a TFL. I realize stats don't begin to tell the whole story but was he really that bad?

Yes.

gyldenlove
09-02-2011, 09:00 AM
I didn't see or hear the game but the box shows that Mohamed had 11 tackles (8 solo) and a TFL. I realize stats don't begin to tell the whole story but was he really that bad?

He was when I saw him - he is basicly Nate Webster without the dreds and flying helmet.

ludo21
09-02-2011, 09:15 AM
I was at the game and it was just as bad in person as on tv. I really have no clue how the D only gave up 2 td's... Mohammed is gone, he was slooowwwww and behin everything.

Irving looks like a future starter for us. I liked what I saw from him.

It looked like the coaches were going suuupperr basis on offense and defense and just letting the players try to win the 1-1 battles and we werent winning them.

btw. the Cards crowd got just as loud to boo Tebow as when they scored a TD lol.

elsid13
09-02-2011, 09:36 AM
It's 4th preseason game, when coaches didn't gameplan and it was full of bunch of scrubs. I think folks are reading to much into it.

alkemical
09-02-2011, 09:38 AM
It's 4th preseason game, when coaches didn't gameplan and it was full of bunch of scrubs. I think folks are reading to much into it.

Not here! ;)

Play2win
09-02-2011, 09:47 AM
Watching this year's second team is like watching last year's 1st team.

This last pre-season game was a bitter reminder of where we came from and how bad we were. Next week will be a showing of where we are going and how good we can be.

Short answer: Rush the passer and all your problems go away.

Archer81
09-02-2011, 09:54 AM
I was at the game and it was just as bad in person as on tv. I really have no clue how the D only gave up 2 td's... Mohammed is gone, he was slooowwwww and behin everything.

Irving looks like a future starter for us. I liked what I saw from him.

It looked like the coaches were going suuupperr basis on offense and defense and just letting the players try to win the 1-1 battles and we werent winning them.

btw. the Cards crowd got just as loud to boo Tebow as when they scored a TD lol.


He looked slow and behind as well. Rookies tend to look like that. It will make saturday interesting.

:Broncos:

gyldenlove
09-02-2011, 10:08 AM
He looked slow and behind as well. Rookies tend to look like that. It will make saturday interesting.

:Broncos:

I didn't see Irving look slow, he looked late to read and react on several plays but that is being a rookie MLB with very little game experience, his athletic ability and speed both looked decent to me.

broncocalijohn
09-02-2011, 10:16 AM
Haven't been on the boards today, so I missed that. No need to be an ass.

Good news all the same. :yayaya:

Dude, you backpedal better than a safety. First, Nate Jones got cut days ago so it wasn't today. That thread was on the Mane page for days. 2nd, your "everyone" got proved down and if only a couple of people at the Mane mentions our depth not being that bad, why bring it up. TWO PEOPLE does not warrant a strong opinion on YEAH for our depth.

Archer81
09-02-2011, 10:20 AM
I didn't see Irving look slow, he looked late to read and react on several plays but that is being a rookie MLB with very little game experience, his athletic ability and speed both looked decent to me.


I saw Irving and Mohamed make the read about a second late, and because of that be a second late to getting where they need to be. I think both stick because I'd like to see them just play without overthinking.


:Broncos:

vancejohnson82
09-02-2011, 10:55 AM
Not really feeling like digging through threads to find names.

I just remember some people saying stuff like "every team's backups are bad" etc. The fact is that we may well have the worst depth in the league. God help us if we get hit with the injury bug this year.

Our starting lineup is good enough to have an outside shot at the playoffs. Unfortunately, teams don't just play with their starters usually. So I'm still rather pessimistic about this season.

You? Pessimistic?

Get out of town

TheElusiveKyleOrton
09-02-2011, 10:56 AM
Man, if you get cut from this defense, you really need to consider what you're doing with your life.

Succinct and to the point. Flawless post.

gyldenlove
09-02-2011, 11:23 AM
I saw Irving and Mohamed make the read about a second late, and because of that be a second late to getting where they need to be. I think both stick because I'd like to see them just play without overthinking.


:Broncos:

In situations where they made the read at the same time Irving got there, Mohamed would be behind because he is not only slow to read and react (which they both are), he is also physically slow.

Look at the play on the 2nd drive where Irving tackles the runner in the backfield, Irving sits back and Mohamed shoots the gap at the snap, despite Mohamed being in the backfield right after the handoff he just can not get to the RB because he is not atheltic enough, Irving is several yards behind the line at the time of handoff but because he is fast he gets through the line and into the backfield to make the tackle before Mohamed can do so.

Mohamed also stumbled at least twice in coverage, he is just not athletic enough.

Lestat
09-02-2011, 12:09 PM
this defense is gonna struggle this season. this was always known to the fans regardless of who was the DC.
this team will be mostly built through the draft and dip into FA some from what we've seen and has been said by EFX.

hopefully we'll be able to see meaningful gains of improvement throughout the season and continue to build the D in the next draft and off season.

razorwire77
09-02-2011, 12:26 PM
Mohamed does not have the athletic ability to play LB at the NFL level. It's not just his speed, but he also plays stiff and upright, which hurts his lateral movement. Irving showed flashes, but looked like he was thinking too much. He also needs to get stronger. Hunter is decent as a situational goal line thumper and special teams player, so I think he's safe.

Paul Finebaum PWNS!
09-02-2011, 12:27 PM
Martindale was worse than Slowik.

Mediator12
09-02-2011, 12:35 PM
Watching this year's second team is like watching last year's 1st team.

This last pre-season game was a bitter reminder of where we came from and how bad we were. Next week will be a showing of where we are going and how good we can be.

Short answer: Rush the passer and all your problems go away.

No, Stop the run and you get to rush the passer. If you stop the run, this team will be 8-8.

However, their DL still sucks at controlling the run. And Anyone who said Dumervil was playing the run better is full of ****. I just watched the SEA and ARI games back to back and that muppet is a one trick pony right now. Lost contain and get ragdolled when the defenders were not pass protecting.

Also, where are they playing Miller? He was mostly a DE last night. I just hope they do not overutilize him out of being productive once the season starts.

broncocalijohn
09-02-2011, 01:23 PM
Martindale was worse than Slowik.

Slowik **** the bed on two teams. Slowik the worst of the two.

elsid13
09-02-2011, 01:30 PM
No, Stop the run and you get to rush the passer. If you stop the run, this team will be 8-8.

However, their DL still sucks at controlling the run. And Anyone who said Dumervil was playing the run better is full of ****. I just watched the SEA and ARI games back to back and that muppet is a one trick pony right now. Lost contain and get ragdolled when the defenders were not pass protecting.

Also, where are they playing Miller? He was mostly a DE last night. I just hope they do not overutilize him out of being productive once the season starts.

I am very afraid the OC are going to attack the edges this season. Add in fact that DJ is out and we have mini-LB behind Dumervil and that becomes a freeway to the endzone.

gyldenlove
09-02-2011, 01:42 PM
No, Stop the run and you get to rush the passer. If you stop the run, this team will be 8-8.

However, their DL still sucks at controlling the run. And Anyone who said Dumervil was playing the run better is full of ****. I just watched the SEA and ARI games back to back and that muppet is a one trick pony right now. Lost contain and get ragdolled when the defenders were not pass protecting.

Also, where are they playing Miller? He was mostly a DE last night. I just hope they do not overutilize him out of being productive once the season starts.

Dumervil didn't play at all against Arizona, and was on the field for 9 rushes against Seattle, the defense gave up a total of 18 yards on this 9 plays, 3 of those plays went for more than 2 yards and 4 plays went for 0 or negative yards. There were 2 runs to Dumervil's side, one went for 10 yards the other went for 2 yards. I think you need to rewatch those games once more dude.

I went ahead and got the numbers for the Buffalo game, 9 rushes, 38 yards total, they rushed for 0 or negative yards 5 times, had 2 long runs both on the opposite side of the field from Dumervil, they rushed 3 times at Dumervil, gained a total of 3 yards to his side.

Miller plays DE in the nickel, since we play the nickel about 40% of the time that is how often he is lined up at DE since he has no place as a cover corner it is the only way to get him on the field in that situation.

Mediator12
09-02-2011, 02:52 PM
Dumervil didn't play at all against Arizona, and was on the field for 9 rushes against Seattle, the defense gave up a total of 18 yards on this 9 plays, 3 of those plays went for more than 2 yards and 4 plays went for 0 or negative yards. There were 2 runs to Dumervil's side, one went for 10 yards the other went for 2 yards. I think you need to rewatch those games once more dude.

I went ahead and got the numbers for the Buffalo game, 9 rushes, 38 yards total, they rushed for 0 or negative yards 5 times, had 2 long runs both on the opposite side of the field from Dumervil, they rushed 3 times at Dumervil, gained a total of 3 yards to his side.

Miller plays DE in the nickel, since we play the nickel about 40% of the time that is how often he is lined up at DE since he has no place as a cover corner it is the only way to get him on the field in that situation.

Dumervil was getting ragdolled and Turned inside when he had the edge on every single running play I saw. The play were DJ got hurt was his contain. If he makes the RB turn inside, DJ deos not get hurt. The only time he made plays was in the passing game and several of those were busts in protection/snap count/backup TE trying to block him idiocy. He did not play last night but he did the previous games and I saw the same thing.

What is concerning is the amount of heavy run blitzing this team does, to protect the DL. That tendency will get abused once teams have the film and can block it one on one with the lack of talent in the front seven. That scheme needs playmakers, and this front seven is devoid of running game playmakers. I worry more about this now than even last year because their hurt and new.

Cito Pelon
09-02-2011, 03:30 PM
No, Stop the run and you get to rush the passer. If you stop the run, this team will be 8-8.

However, their DL still sucks at controlling the run. And Anyone who said Dumervil was playing the run better is full of ****. I just watched the SEA and ARI games back to back and that muppet is a one trick pony right now. Lost contain and get ragdolled when the defenders were not pass protecting.

Also, where are they playing Miller? He was mostly a DE last night. I just hope they do not overutilize him out of being productive once the season starts.

Dumervil and Miller didn't play a snap at ARI last night. You must have got some kind of alternative history feed.

Mediator12
09-02-2011, 03:38 PM
Dumervil and Miller didn't play a snap at ARI last night. You must have got some kind of alternative history feed.

Sorry, I watched them together last night, but the points are still valid even though neither played in the ARI game. Normally, I do not leave holes like that when I post. However, I have way too much to do and my proofreading obviously sucks today.


The point is this defense still has to stop the run, to get to needing a pass rush. And, the Pass rush has been feasting on subpar OL's in the preseason. I LOVE the scheme Dennis Allen has installed the same way I love to watch Greg Williams scheme. However, you need players to do it in the front seven and I am still wating to see that from the preseason tape when all the protections and run schemes were extremely vanilla for the most part.

Archer81
09-02-2011, 03:44 PM
Sorry, I watched them together last night, but the points are still valid even though neither played in the ARI game. Normally, I do not leave holes like that when I post. However, I have way too much to do and my proofreading obviously sucks today.


The point is this defense still has to stop the run, to get to needing a pass rush. And, the Pass rush has been feasting on subpar OL's in the preseason. I LOVE the scheme Dennis Allen has installed the same way I love to watch Greg Williams scheme. However, you need players to do it in the front seven and I am still wating to see that from the preseason tape when all the protections and run schemes were extremely vanilla for the most part.


I think the Broncos defense will be better against the run, but there will be games where gaps are missed and they get gashed.

:Broncos:

OrangeSe7en
09-03-2011, 05:49 AM
And there were some claiming our depth wasn't that bad prior to this game... Hilarious!

Depth means there is someone who can play with the first stringers should someone go down. Having 2nd or 3rd unit that doesnt play well together doesnt necessarily suggest a lack of depth. The more imporant issue is whether there are a handful of guys who can step up if someone goes down. Currently, since they're playing on units that arent playing well together, it may be less obvious as to who those players are. But that doesnt mean there arent a handful of guys who wouldnt be able to step in.

OrangeSe7en
09-03-2011, 05:54 AM
Sorry, I watched them together last night, but the points are still valid even though neither played in the ARI game. Normally, I do not leave holes like that when I post. However, I have way too much to do and my proofreading obviously sucks today.


The point is this defense still has to stop the run, to get to needing a pass rush. And, the Pass rush has been feasting on subpar OL's in the preseason. I LOVE the scheme Dennis Allen has installed the same way I love to watch Greg Williams scheme. However, you need players to do it in the front seven and I am still wating to see that from the preseason tape when all the protections and run schemes were extremely vanilla for the most part.

Not necessarily. Last year, Denver was also last in sacks. That means when they had a chance to get off the field on 3rd down, it wasnt happening. This means the opponents were able to keep the ball and run for more yards after converting numerous 3rd downs.

Its like because we gave up a lot of rushing yards, people assume the opponents were converting all 3rd and 1s. This isn't necessarily the case. It's as much a function of having a bad overall defense, which included not being able to pressure the QBs on 3rd downs.

Cito Pelon
09-03-2011, 08:04 AM
Sorry, I watched them together last night, but the points are still valid even though neither played in the ARI game. Normally, I do not leave holes like that when I post. However, I have way too much to do and my proofreading obviously sucks today.


The point is this defense still has to stop the run, to get to needing a pass rush. And, the Pass rush has been feasting on subpar OL's in the preseason. I LOVE the scheme Dennis Allen has installed the same way I love to watch Greg Williams scheme. However, you need players to do it in the front seven and I am still wating to see that from the preseason tape when all the protections and run schemes were extremely vanilla for the most part.

Like I've said for each of the past few years, the D will be improved this year. I hope I'm correct for once. :yayaya:

Agamemnon
09-03-2011, 08:27 AM
Depth means there is someone who can play with the first stringers should someone go down. Having 2nd or 3rd unit that doesnt play well together doesnt necessarily suggest a lack of depth. The more imporant issue is whether there are a handful of guys who can step up if someone goes down. Currently, since they're playing on units that arent playing well together, it may be less obvious as to who those players are. But that doesnt mean there arent a handful of guys who wouldnt be able to step in.

You see units that don't play well together. I see units that have virtually no talent. I wonder which one of us is right...

OrangeSe7en
09-03-2011, 08:30 AM
You see units that don't play well together. I see units that have virtually no talent. I wonder which one of us is right...

See you're wrong and you need to go re-read what I wrote. I was giving no assurance that we have a handful of players who can step up. What I'm saying is that it's easy to judge individual players on how their overall unit performs.

Agamemnon
09-03-2011, 08:34 AM
See you're wrong and you need to go re-read what I wrote. I was giving no assurance that we have a handful of players who can step up. What I'm saying is that it's easy to judge individual players on how their overall unit performs.

I get it. But with backup units that's the way it is. They don't generally have much chemistry because there's so much instability in the 2nd and 3rd string. All you can look at is individual players and how they play. Currently we have virtually no quality backups at most positions from what I've seen.

OrangeSe7en
09-03-2011, 08:54 AM
I get it. But with backup units that's the way it is. They don't generally have much chemistry because there's so much instability in the 2nd and 3rd string. All you can look at is individual players and how they play. Currently we have virtually no quality backups at most positions from what I've seen.

But what happens is, at least on defense, is that you might have a capable backup who looks worse than he normally would because he's playing along side players who arent executing their assignments and so he tries to do more than he should. Conversely, if he plays with the first string that has better players and more cohesion, he doesn't feel like he has to do too much and can simply execute his assignment and not more.

Also, without knowing what the assignments were, there could be some guys who are doing a good job at executing their assignments but you wouldnt know it because other guys arent following through and they all end up looking bad. When a defense gets gashed for a 12 yard run, does anyone on the defense look good. The truth is, there might have been a handful of guys performing their assignments on plays where the defense gets gashed for 12 yards. But everyone ends up looking bad.

dizz
09-03-2011, 08:54 AM
I think both Irving and Mohamed make it. 47 is gone. Hunter sticks because he can play DE. Woodyard stays too.

:Broncos:

I think you're right

The Joker
09-03-2011, 08:59 AM
It's hard to go from being an absolutely wretched defense in every facet of the game to having both a good pass rush and quality run defense in one offseason. If we can have either of them this year I'll consider that a very nice step forward.

I think we're going to have to accept that we're not going to have a good run defense this year. Teams are going to bust off some big runs on us because we're going to be playing overly aggressive run defense and on occasion we're going to get outsmarted.

However, I'd rather see the D give up a few 20+ yard runs a game because we're being too aggressive than let teams just march down the field 5 yards at a time because we're afraid of the big play.

A big key for us will be tackling in the secondary IMO. We need our DB's to stop the 20 yard gains from becoming 50 yarders on a regular basis. If we can do that I think the aggressive style should produce enough good plays to force our opponents into some passing downs and give us some chances to get off the field on 3rd down.

Bronx33
09-03-2011, 06:57 PM
Thanks for bringing back that pain chris.

gyldenlove
09-03-2011, 07:11 PM
Dumervil was getting ragdolled and Turned inside when he had the edge on every single running play I saw. The play were DJ got hurt was his contain. If he makes the RB turn inside, DJ deos not get hurt. The only time he made plays was in the passing game and several of those were busts in protection/snap count/backup TE trying to block him idiocy. He did not play last night but he did the previous games and I saw the same thing.

What is concerning is the amount of heavy run blitzing this team does, to protect the DL. That tendency will get abused once teams have the film and can block it one on one with the lack of talent in the front seven. That scheme needs playmakers, and this front seven is devoid of running game playmakers. I worry more about this now than even last year because their hurt and new.

So based on your sample of 9 plays, of which he was in good position and took on his blocker at least twice, he is horrific in the run game? I would call that a sample size that is way too small to judge anything.

Bronx33
09-03-2011, 07:13 PM
I think we are OK if we dont have a lot of injuries. One or two backups in teh game and we can cover them. But if this **** gets like it did last year on defnese with the injuries we are ****ed.

Proper ****ed.


This is a HUGE key to any success this season all i know is i am keeping this season in perspective.

OrangeSe7en
09-03-2011, 07:24 PM
Slowik was worse as a DC. He was the DC on a team with a better offense. Last year, Denver had virtually no running game and the offense didnt really score a lot with Orton, which put more pressure on the defense.

Archer81
09-03-2011, 07:43 PM
I think you're right


Naturally.


:Broncos:

gyldenlove
09-03-2011, 09:25 PM
Slowik was worse as a DC. He was the DC on a team with a better offense. Last year, Denver had virtually no running game and the offense didnt really score a lot with Orton, which put more pressure on the defense.

And the defense dutifully delivered the worst season ever by a Broncos defense.

Mediator12
09-04-2011, 07:00 AM
So based on your sample of 9 plays, of which he was in good position and took on his blocker at least twice, he is horrific in the run game? I would call that a sample size that is way too small to judge anything.

No, actually it would be a sample size of several years worth of tape that no recent Preseason games have shown any change in his abaility to stop the run. In fact, he still gets turned inside when he has outside contain and he still gets moved off the POA like a cone.

People here were saying he had gotten better and was actually doing a nice job on run plays. I say that is hogwash. He is NOT doing a good job technique wise or ability wise on runs right at him. Wishful thinking is not a sample size either!

alkemical
09-04-2011, 09:21 AM
Med -

You make it sound like Elvis is a role player.

Mediator12
09-04-2011, 11:57 AM
Med -

You make it sound like Elvis is a role player.

No he is Dwight Freeney/light version. Freeney is a notoriously poor run defender who keeps getting voted all-pro RDE. The guys who vote obviously do not take Run stopping as an NFL skill ROFL!

I just said he is not a better run stopper in this defense all the sudden. I had heard that from multiple sources through camp and after the preseason games. He does not execute in the running game. Neither does Freeney, but he is an All-pro RDE.

This DL scares me just as much as it did before Training camp. 3rd and 2 is not third and eight let the DE's rush the passer situation. That is seriously where they are headed on this defense against solid running teams right now.

OrangeSe7en
09-04-2011, 12:09 PM
No he is Dwight Freeney/light version. Freeney is a notoriously poor run defender who keeps getting voted all-pro RDE. The guys who vote obviously do not take Run stopping as an NFL skill ROFL!

I just said he is not a better run stopper in this defense all the sudden. I had heard that from multiple sources through camp and after the preseason games. He does not execute in the running game. Neither does Freeney, but he is an All-pro RDE.

This DL scares me just as much as it did before Training camp. 3rd and 2 is not third and eight let the DE's rush the passer situation. That is seriously where they are headed on this defense against solid running teams right now.

Im not sure Doom isn't better than Dwight Freeney. I know Freeney plays on a stronger team that gets more love nationally but, if I had to choose, I would actually probably take Doom. He's been getting a lot of sacks in spite of playing on some bad teams, and he's also played OLB. Freeney, playing with Manning, has been in more positions where the other team is in obvious passing situations trying to play from behind.

alkemical
09-04-2011, 01:36 PM
No he is Dwight Freeney/light version. Freeney is a notoriously poor run defender who keeps getting voted all-pro RDE. The guys who vote obviously do not take Run stopping as an NFL skill ROFL!

I just said he is not a better run stopper in this defense all the sudden. I had heard that from multiple sources through camp and after the preseason games. He does not execute in the running game. Neither does Freeney, but he is an All-pro RDE.

This DL scares me just as much as it did before Training camp. 3rd and 2 is not third and eight let the DE's rush the passer situation. That is seriously where they are headed on this defense against solid running teams right now.

My observation of that, is he's one dimensional and he's only good at rushing the passer. Would he fair better at OLB?

Mediator12
09-04-2011, 01:58 PM
Im not sure Doom isn't better than Dwight Freeney. I know Freeney plays on a stronger team that gets more love nationally but, if I had to choose, I would actually probably take Doom. He's been getting a lot of sacks in spite of playing on some bad teams, and he's also played OLB. Freeney, playing with Manning, has been in more positions where the other team is in obvious passing situations trying to play from behind.

Not yet. He will surely pass him soon, but Dumervil is still a speed rusher with little counter moves. He uses his hands extremely well and he does surprise some with his speed.

Freeney has three signature pass rush moves. He has the speed, the spin, and the bull rush that he can unleash. When he is healthy, he is downright impossible to block one on one.

Both are pretty worthless against the run as far as RDE's go. The last 4 years they rank in the bottom 5% in YPA being run at the POA. However, they do get some blowup tackles for loss occasionally, but more often than not, they really struggle to play the run. Most of it is attitude. Some of it is blindly rushing the passer. Sacks make money, not a solid run defense grade as a RDE.

OrangeSe7en
09-04-2011, 02:39 PM
Not yet. He will surely pass him soon, but Dumervil is still a speed rusher with little counter moves. He uses his hands extremely well and he does surprise some with his speed.

Freeney has three signature pass rush moves. He has the speed, the spin, and the bull rush that he can unleash. When he is healthy, he is downright impossible to block one on one.

Both are pretty worthless against the run as far as RDE's go. The last 4 years they rank in the bottom 5% in YPA being run at the POA. However, they do get some blowup tackles for loss occasionally, but more often than not, they really struggle to play the run. Most of it is attitude. Some of it is blindly rushing the passer. Sacks make money, not a solid run defense grade as a RDE.

And like I said, because he has played for the Colts he has had the benefit of playing if far more obvious passing downs than Doom. In addition to that, he has had the benefit of playing opposite Robert Mathis. It's hard to double team both. In the end, a sack is a sack, whether its by bull rush, speed, spin, or reverse suplex.

TheReverend
09-04-2011, 07:09 PM
By design this is going to look a lot like Slowik's defense, actually.

Hopefully with the personnel to be much more successful with it, but high risk to try for high reward (which we rarely got in 08) all the same

Bronx33
09-04-2011, 07:35 PM
By design this is going to look a lot like Slowik's defense, actually.

Hopefully with the personnel to be much more successful with it, but high risk to try for high reward (which we rarely got in 08) all the same

Hopefully the play calling will be a NFL level.

Kaylore
09-04-2011, 09:45 PM
By design this is going to look a lot like Slowik's defense, actually.

Hopefully with the personnel to be much more successful with it, but high risk to try for high reward (which we rarely got in 08) all the same

The difference is our defensive coaching staff actually knows how to coach defense and wont have their idiot son running one of the squads.

And by the way, where have you been?

Mogulseeker
09-04-2011, 10:27 PM
Not really feeling like digging through threads to find names.

I just remember some people saying stuff like "every team's backups are bad" etc. The fact is that we may well have the worst depth in the league. God help us if we get hit with the injury bug this year.

Our starting lineup is good enough to have an outside shot at the playoffs. Unfortunately, teams don't just play with their starters usually. So I'm still rather pessimistic about this season.

This is true. There's also the injury bug.

broncocalijohn
09-04-2011, 10:31 PM
By design this is going to look a lot like Slowik's defense, actually.

Hopefully with the personnel to be much more successful with it, but high risk to try for high reward (which we rarely got in 08) all the same

So we can expect our CB to be 8 yards off the receiver when it is 3rd and 3?

TheReverend
09-04-2011, 11:12 PM
The difference is our defensive coaching staff actually knows how to coach defense and wont have their idiot son running one of the squads.

And by the way, where have you been?

Vacation #387 this year.

Was amazing.

Bronx33
09-05-2011, 10:11 PM
Vacation #387 this year.

Was amazing.


You must be in politics ROFL!

Kaylore
09-06-2011, 04:16 AM
You must be in politics ROFL!

Or a time traveler. More vacations than days of the year?

The Joker
09-06-2011, 05:08 AM
Be awesome if Rev travelled through time on his lobster, starting flame wars with famous figures from the past.

"OK Hitler brb just going to the synagogue real quick."

Kaylore
09-06-2011, 06:50 AM
Be awesome if Rev travelled through time on his lobster, starting flame wars with famous figures from the past.

"OK Hitler brb just going to the synagogue real quick."

LOL

Totally invading Russia tomorrow. Heard its cold so just brought some old blankets just in case.

BRB rolling eyes right now.