Hugo Chavez demands delivery of Venezuela's gold

[mhgaffney]

Must Watch!

Keiser Report: Bankers & Aliens

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article28926.htm

After what the bankers have done to Khadaffi -- do you think Hugo will get his gold? (He is next on the hit list.)

Three guesses.

[W*GS]

It figures you'd be slobbering over ol' Hugo...

[alkemical]

The goals, or the idea of the NWO is a good idea. But, you know that whole "best/intentions" thing.

[mhgaffney]

While there is probably no way to avert another financial meltdown -- maybe -- just maybe -- we can avoid the expanding war that will doubtless accompany it.

How to do this? Catherine Austin Fitts offers a suggestion in the second half of the Keiser Report -- when she says -- "Its about moving our money..." Words to that effect.

If you or your family are invested in any of the large NY Banks -- now is the time to bail. Pull out your money and help crash the NY banks. If we do this in unison -- we can help to effect a soft landing.

We need to crash the banks on our terms. We can get along nicely without the "too big to fail" banks. But we may not survive WW III -- so the answer -- obviously -- is a pre emptive run on the big banks.

Pull out!

[mhgaffney]

Please do not mis understand me. I am not talking about your friendly local bank.

I am talking about:

CitiGroup
Chase Manhattan
BoA
Wells Fargo
Bank of New York
Deutschbank
Goldman Sachs
Morgan Stanley
JP Morgan

and maybe a few others...

These are the criminal banks -- the head of the dragon that now must die.

[alkemical]

http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTbpRsb7DCi0ADHq05gGjr1s2fQz7g7z JVHutZOHhBRkgDgUMS4iw

[W*GS]

Pull out!

One of your (male) ancestors should have taken the same advice.

You're just spilling the same anti-Jewish garbage as you always have - just calling them "banksters" now. I mean, we all know that Jews control world finance, don't we...

http://www.jewishjournal.com/images/bloggers_auto/borse.jpg

[mosca]

GTFO. Criticizing the nefarious actions of banks now = being anti-Jewish? Negative.

[alkemical]

Werd.

[Garcia Bronco]

Hugo should be removed from office. He's a dictator eating at banquet while his people starve.

[alkemical]

Dictators are our friends.

[W*GS]

GTFO. Criticizing the nefarious actions of banks now = being anti-Jewish? Negative.

We all know that anti-Jewish folks believe that behind the financial industry are the Jews. They're so good with money and all, that being their obsession. gaffe is also anti-Jewish, but, as per his usual crap, he can't come out and say that, so now he's anti-banks.

Just more obfuscation from the lunacy of gaffe.

[mhgaffney]

Hugo should be removed from office. He's a dictator eating at banquet while his people starve.

Chavez survived an attempted CIA coup and also won two recall elections -- each time by a landslide.

Chavez -- for years -- gave free heating oil to poor Americans -- something Clinton and Bush never did.

Also curious that you fail to mention the rigged US election of 2000 -- which put the Bush crime family back into power. Compared with the US -- Venezuela is a flourishing democracy.

If I were a Venezuelan -- I'd be criticizing Chavez. But neither you nor I have that privilege.

[mhgaffney]

We all know that anti-Jewish folks believe that behind the financial industry are the Jews. They're so good with money and all, that being their obsession. gaffe is also anti-Jewish, but, as per his usual crap, he can't come out and say that, so now he's anti-banks.

Just more obfuscation from the lunacy of gaffe.

Gaffney loves Jesus -- yet is anti Jew?

[Requiem]

I love all people.

[W*GS]

Compared with the US -- Venezuela is a flourishing democracy.

By god, you're full of ****. You probably think Cuba is a democracy too.

Hugo's model isn't democracy, it's Fidel Castro.

If I were a Venezuelan -- I'd be criticizing Chavez. But neither you nor I have that privilege.

I have a good friend who is Venezuelan and when Hugo scurried off (both times) to Cuba to get his as-yet-mysterious illness treated, he told me that he wished ol' Hugo would die.

[W*GS]

Gaffney loves Jesus -- yet is anti Jew?

Yes, gaffe is anti-Jew. Anti-America too.

You're the only one here who ever whines and moans about "Zionism". Have you ever noticed that?

[cutthemdown]

Chavez survived an attempted CIA coup and also won two recall elections -- each time by a landslide.

Chavez -- for years -- gave free heating oil to poor Americans -- something Clinton and Bush never did.

Also curious that you fail to mention the rigged US election of 2000 -- which put the Bush crime family back into power. Compared with the US -- Venezuela is a flourishing democracy.

If I were a Venezuelan -- I'd be criticizing Chavez. But neither you nor I have that privilege.

Give me a break Chavez cuts the power to areas that aren't supporting him, has thugs intimidate opponents, squashes companies that don't support him and takes them over, and outright rigs elections. Even Carter said the election there has serious issues.

He's a Dictator pure and simple. As bad as Bush is he is gone because we do have a democracy. They will never get rid of Chavez until he dies, that = dictator. Name one democracy where the same guy rules for 30 yrs lol.

[mhgaffney]

There is a deposit of 99 tons of gold in a vault at the Bank of London -- which belongs to Venezuela. If they refuse to physically return it - then the cat is out of the bag.

This will expose the US - British bankers for the gangsters they truly are.

Hugo will have done all of us a great favor -- by outing the criminal nature of our present banking/economic model -- as Fits points out in the interview.

A brilliant move by Chavez to demand delivery of Venezuela's gold.

BTW, there are plenty of other cases -- where banks have refused to honor title -- Check out the Seagraves' book Gold Warriors. Some terrific reporting by the Seagraves.

[mhgaffney]

Must read!

Gold Warriors: America's Secret Recovery of Yama****a's Gold [Paperback] 2002
by Sterling and Peggy Seagrave (Author)

Here's one of many 5 star reviews:

In 1947, Gen. Douglas MacArthur ordered the immediate termination of all investigations of Japanese war crimes and the immediate suspension of the arrest of any suspected war criminals.
In June 2000, Sen. Orrin Hatch (Utah) said, "You mean our federal government can just say, 'To hell with you, Bataan Death Marchers, and you people who were mistreated (by the Japanese), we are just going to waive all your rights.'"

As disturbing and painful as it may be to read, this is a book all victims of the Japanese, and their next of kins, must read. It's documentation and research is beyond reproach. For many of us, this book will be our 'fall from innocence', if that is still possible.

Fred Baldassarre
Son of a Bataan Survivor

Here's another:

This book is earth-shattering and faith-shaking, a well-documented tale of deceit at the highest levels of the US government. So controversial and potentially explosive are the findings of this book, to wit, that the White House recovered most of the Nazi and Japanese loot and created a secret slush fund for covert political operations world-wide, that the authors go the extra mile and offer, at a nominal price, two CD-ROMS containing 60,000 pages of supporting documentation including the Japanese treasure maps used by the US to recover the gold and other valuables.
Major players include Presidents Truman, Eisenhower, and Nixon, both Allen and John Foster Dulles, Douglas MacArthur, John McCloy, and the famous unconventional warrior Edward Lansdale. What we learn from this book is that those writing about "blowback" (the consequences of unwise US actions) have barely scratched the surface. What we learn is that rather than truly seeking to help the Japanese, Chinese, and other looted nations recover in the aftermath of WWII, the most senior leaders of the US government, no doubt with the best of intentions, actually conspired with Nazi bankers and the Japanese imperial family to create a Black Eagle Trust controlled by a very select hand-picked cabal in Washington.

Originally used to fight communism, the Black Eagle Trust, according to the authors and as thoroughly documented by the book and the two CD-ROMS (which I am happy to have in hand), quickly became a global slush fund used to bribe national leaders and manipulate elections around the world. This fund remains in existence today, making the Swiss Holocaust funds seem like loose-change. According to the authors, major banks are "addicted" to the funds and would face collapse if public investigations resulted in a forced return of this gold and related certificates to the rightful owners.

The authors have produced a magnificent work of both scholarship and investigative journalism. They document the extent of Japanese looting of Korea (beginning in 1895) and China as well as the other countries in the "co-prosperity sphere." They document the manner in which Japan hid most of the gold in the Philippines (some in Indonesia), and were forced to leave it there from 1943 onwards, when US submarine interdiction became too effective to risk shipments homeward.

I found the level of detail in this book to be quite gripping. The ingenious nature of the Japanese burial sites, with caverns below the more obvious tunnels, with sea-water protection, with maps created in reverse--and the in-bred cruelty of the Japanese, thinking nothing of burying all of the US and other national slave labor *and the Japanese engineers* alive as the final stage of protecting the looted treasure, leave one stunned.

The authors document the central role played by Lansdale in recognizing the opportunity and then briefing MacArthur and then President Truman. According to the authors, the architects of the Black Eagle Trust were three advisors to President's Roosevelt's Secretary of War, Henry Stimson: John McCloy (later head of the World Bank), Robert Lovett (later Secretary of Defense), and Robert Anderson (later Secretary of the Treasury). They made the case to Roosevelt, and presumably to Truman after Roosevelt died, that it would be impractical to return the looted gold to the rightful owners, in part because many of the looted countries were now under Soviet control.

The authors, who conducted many interviews in support of the work, including interviews of former CIA deputy director Ray Cline, who they say was involved with Lansdale and the gold in the 1940's and remained involved with the black gold through the 1980's, provide copies of documents showing the redirection of the looted gold to 176 bank accounts in 42 countries. The gold was then used to support the creation of gold bearer certificates that were in turned used to bribe the most senior officials around the world.

The authors tell a shocking tale of how quickly MacArthur chose to collaborate with the very leadership of Japan that declared war on the USA and was responsible for genocide and looting in Asia on a scale rarely achieved by anyone else. Bringing the story up to date, the authors show how prior attempts to investigate the Black Eagle Trust have led to the ruin of individuals such as Norbert Schlei, at one time deputy attorney general to Presidents Kennedy and Johnson. While I have no direct knowledge and cannot be certain myself, I believe the authors have provided a sufficiently compelling case to warrant an international investigation concurrently with a General Accounting Office investigation to be chartered by Congress with unlimited supeona powers specifically directed against classified personalities and archives.

If this story is true, and I personally think that it is, then the US government, in active collusion with the very people the American people fought to defeat in WWII, has been guilty of fraud and depravity on a global scale and against the best interests of both the American people, and the against the rightful owners of the looted gold and other treasures. The authors may well have uncovered the last really big secret of the post-WW II era, and in so doing, opened the way for a restoration of the balance of power among diverse nations, and a sharp delimitation of the abuses that appear to characterize American leadership when it thinks it can rely on secret gold and stolen oil to engage in imperial adventures and domestic improprieties. As an American citizen and voter, and as a person of faith who believes that we must do unto others as we would have them do unto us, I find this book to be shocking, credible, and a basis for popular outrage and demands for truth and reconciliation.

[W*GS]

Here's one of the 1-star reviews on Amazon of this "book". Figures that gaffe gets all creamy over this kind of stuff.

Many of the earlier reviewers of "Gold Warriors" have admired the voluminous references presented by the Seagraves to support their incredible assertions. However, I'd like to point out that my personal investigations into a sample of their sources have exposed the Seagraves' quite cynical "research" methods. They are prepared to use sources that are laughably insubstantial, and then present these sources as if they are highly credible. The Seagraves also deliberately misrepresent the words of a source to make it fit the story that they wish to convey.

The whole of page 62 of "Gold Warriors" is given over to the Seagraves' theorising that nearly 400 Allied Prisoners of War were massacred after stowing gold bullion in a mine on Sado Island, Japan. This is outrageous. The source that they use, "Betrayal in High Places", is a book that looks extremely unreliable when first picked up, and its claims fail to be confirmed by any other historical source. In any case, "Betrayal in High Places" does not actually claim that any stolen gold was stored by the POWs!

I am one of the authors of a recent historical paper, published in the Journal of Military History, which has proven the Sado Island Massacre story to be pure fiction. The Seagraves are smart enough to have worked this out for themselves, but they have chosen to legitimise this fantasy in order to sell their books and CDs.

The Seagraves further illustrate their manipulative ways when they cite an innocent travel book as the source of their further assertion,
"more than a thousand Korean slave laborers ... on Sado Island also vanished without a trace" (bottom of p62).

This is just another dishonest misquote. The travel book (Waycott: "Sado: Japan's Island of Exile") actually says,
"...During these years, forced labor was certainly used: of the tens of thousands of Koreans imported to work for Imperial Japan, more than 1,000 are known to have been sent to Sado. Of these, 145 are said to have 'escaped' (but where to?) and a dozen or so - surely a low estimate - were killed. Their existence became public knowledge in 1991, after records were released of Mitsubishi's distribution of cigarette rations to its workers."

Westcott's travel book is actually quite pleasant and informative, and there is nothing dishonest about his speculation - but it's only a travel book! Historically, it's clear from post-war Korean records that many "escapes" were indeed successful (often into the local community, or by fishing boat back to nearby Korea). It's also true that a relatively small number of Koreans were killed in mining accidents, and that no "massacre" occurred. Waycott doesn't allege a massacre in any case - but the Seagraves do!
(Page 62 of "Gold Warriors" can be previewed online here on Amazon, for those who would care to check for themselves...)

The Seagraves are obviously misusing these sources quite deliberately. I think it's very reprehensible for modern authors to push this type of mean deception masquerading as history. This is not a victimless crime. (My mum's brother died as a prisoner of the Japanese in WW2, and it is upsetting to see authors such as the Seagraves take these liberties with the emotions of dead POWs' families.)

Not content with pocketing their customers' money for this book, the Seagraves also use their book to continually push their privately-sold CDs, which they claim contain the "evidence" to back up their assertions. In fact, most of the documents on the CDs are just correspondence between "treasure hunters" - who also make their money by selling their Treasure Maps to the gullible... These are hardly independent or authoritative people! Many of the "certificates", which have been laboriously translated (possibly to tire out the reader) can easily be seen to be fakes once you look at images of the "originals". They have cut-and-pasted values for the gold on deposit!

The CDs even torpedo the Seagraves' own assertions in some places. On CD#1 (Jones.PDF file, page 65), a 1997 letter from "R. A. Medland, Senior Manager, Commonwealth Bank Group Investigations/Security Dept." [Melbourne, Australia] says that the gold deposit certificates are, "utter rubbish"! There's also a scary-looking photo of a sleazy Indonesian "lawyer" displaying the "certificates", and a hilarious document very reminiscent of a "Nigerian Letter", purportedly from President Suharto of Indonesia, on the same CD.

Gee, it's a pity these Certificates are rubbish - they were for 420 tonnes and 120 tonnes of Gold !
(US total annual production in 1940 was 155 tonnes, just to show how incredibly unrealistic these numbers are.)

It does put me in the mood to watch "Goldfinger" again. I wish I had that Aston-Martin. Too ****ing cool!

[DenverBrit]

There is a deposit of 99 tons of gold in a vault at the Bank of London -- which belongs to Venezuela. If they refuse to physically return it - then the cat is out of the bag.

This will expose the US - British bankers for the gangsters they truly are.

Hugo will have done all of us a great favor -- by outing the criminal nature of our present banking/economic model -- as Fits points out in the interview.

A brilliant move by Chavez to demand delivery of Venezuela's gold.

BTW, there are plenty of other cases -- where banks have refused to honor title -- Check out the Seagraves' book Gold Warriors. Some terrific reporting by the Seagraves.

Link!!

[cutthemdown]

There is a deposit of 99 tons of gold in a vault at the Bank of London -- which belongs to Venezuela. If they refuse to physically return it - then the cat is out of the bag.

This will expose the US - British bankers for the gangsters they truly are.

Hugo will have done all of us a great favor -- by outing the criminal nature of our present banking/economic model -- as Fits points out in the interview.

A brilliant move by Chavez to demand delivery of Venezuela's gold.

BTW, there are plenty of other cases -- where banks have refused to honor title -- Check out the Seagraves' book Gold Warriors. Some terrific reporting by the Seagraves.

If it was me I would put it on a ship, then sink it in the deepest spot in the ocean and say there it is, safe and sound. Then tell him to kiss my ass. But it would be like the Die Hard movie, gold really at Fort Knox, **** YOU HUGO.

I doubt he's even telling the truth. He's a lying SOB, he probably has about 60 pounds of gold in teeth he took off the corpses.

[cutthemdown]

I jest I jest of course they do have a ton of gold and cash stored in other banks. But the reality is Chavev has decided to nationalize the gold of venezuala. His next move will be to claim all the gold anyone in Venezuela had and make it all govt gold.

Its not a good move because the money would be better off not in Venezuela where we can just take it after we invade them. Good move for us as EU and Russia would never give us that cash and gold after we are done with them.

If this was Sid Meir Civilization I would be getting my troops ready to attack. South America ripe for pillaging don't you think Gaff? :)

[cutthemdown]

Link!!

Actually the gold is spread out over several banks in Europe, and Russia I heard. Chavez basically knows this. If anyone ever really tries to take him out of power, through an election, through an uprising, he will use the military to put it down. He just saw his buddy Gaddaffi go down. He knows that he would have done the same thing, kill people to stay in power. If he brings the money home then he feels he has more control.

Smart move for a dictator, stupid move for a President. that tells you right there what he is first and foremost. A military style dictator that has taken over a democracy by using democracy. But now that he is in he most certainly would use his military to crack down, blame the Americans, and buy things from China with his gold.

I can't wait for the day we get to take this ****er out. It will happen, you watch, one day all hell breaks looks in Venezuela, like it has in the mideast, and no way America will sit on the sidelines when it happens on this continent.

[mhgaffney]

Link!!

I'm sick and tired of doing YOUR research for you. Do your own for a change.

[mhgaffney]

I jest I jest of course they do have a ton of gold and cash stored in other banks. But the reality is Chavev has decided to nationalize the gold of venezuala. His next move will be to claim all the gold anyone in Venezuela had and make it all govt gold.

Its not a good move because the money would be better off not in Venezuela where we can just take it after we invade them. Good move for us as EU and Russia would never give us that cash and gold after we are done with them.

If this was Sid Meir Civilization I would be getting my troops ready to attack. South America ripe for pillaging don't you think Gaff? :)

It was none other than FDR who nationalized US gold in the deeps of the Great Depression.

You are the last person qualified to judge Chavez. Your only law is might makes right.

That makes you a gorilla.

Your rightful home -- out of the wild -- is a zoo.

[Garcia Bronco]

Chavez survived an attempted CIA coup and also won two recall elections -- each time by a landslide.

Chavez -- for years -- gave free heating oil to poor Americans -- something Clinton and Bush never did.

Also curious that you fail to mention the rigged US election of 2000 -- which put the Bush crime family back into power. Compared with the US -- Venezuela is a flourishing democracy.

If I were a Venezuelan -- I'd be criticizing Chavez. But neither you nor I have that privilege.

At the tip of a sword. I know people that had to flee their homes because they would be jailed for disagreeing with him. Violating that principle alone is worth our contempt.

[mhgaffney]

I know of a key witness who had to flee the US after 9/11 -- for his life.

Another one, Willy Rodriguez, continues to speak out in the face of threats to his life.

You are no better than Cut -- a gorilla who justifies his views, as follows: "Well, we live in a jungle -- and I'm a gorilla - so what do you expect?"

I say -- back in your cage.

We can do better.

[W*GS]

I know of a key witness who had to flee the US after 9/11 -- for his life.

Who?

Another one, Willy Rodriguez, continues to speak out in the face of threats to his life.

Oh yeah - the Willy who said he heard thuds, but which has been automagically transformed into "explosions" by the troofer dickheads...

[W*GS]

I'm sick and tired of doing YOUR research for you. Do your own for a change.

In short...

"I got caught in a lie and I can't find the 'Stormfront' URL that proves me right!"

[cutthemdown]

It was none other than FDR who nationalized US gold in the deeps of the Great Depression.

You are the last person qualified to judge Chavez. Your only law is might makes right.

That makes you a gorilla.

Your rightful home -- out of the wild -- is a zoo.

FDR was a socialist for sure. Chavez is a joke, for someone like him to be something you feel the need to defend is a joke.

[W*GS]

Chavez is a joke, for someone like him to be something you feel the need to defend is a joke.

Chavez thinks the US is enemy #1, so of course gaffe blows him...

[DenverBrit]

I'm sick and tired of doing YOUR research for you. Do your own for a change.

LOL

Hey, it's your story.

You're bull****ing again.

Why would Venezuela deposit their gold into an Islamic bank??

[Garcia Bronco]

It was none other than FDR who nationalized US gold in the deeps of the Great Depression.

You are the last person qualified to judge Chavez. Your only law is might makes right.

That makes you a gorilla.

Your rightful home -- out of the wild -- is a zoo.

And you are an anti-american guerilla conspiracy nut, but none of that changes the fact that Hugo Chavez is a tyrant. Sic Semper Tyrannis.

[Arkie]

The 99 ton gold delivery from the Bank of England is just the first demand. He wants all the gold in Venezuela's name moved to Venezuela.

[mhgaffney]

And you are an anti-american guerilla conspiracy nut, but none of that changes the fact that Hugo Chavez is a tyrant. Sic Semper Tyrannis.

Hugo is no more of a tyrant than Bush or Obama -- much less so -- in fact -- given his land slide electoral victories.

As I said -- if I were a Venezuelan I'd be a strong Chavez critic.

But on this forum -- peopled by arrogant Americans -- I find myself compelled to defend Venezuela's sovereignty.

People like you make me truly ashamed of being an American. You are absent integrity or any higher moral standards. You live in denial across a range of issues -- Our nation has left a swathe of destruction across the planet. Everything we have touched -- we have destroyed.

This is a fact -- and you are part of the problem.

[W*GS]

But on this forum -- peopled by arrogant Americans -- I find myself compelled to defend Venezuela's sovereignty.

Amazing that a bulletin board devoted to an American football team is peopled by Americans, isn't it? Shocking.

You love Chavez because to him, America is a convenient boogeyman. Just like you:

Everything we have touched -- we have destroyed.

Baloney.

[alkemical]

You realize this is just an example of 5GW warfare.

[The Lone Bolt]

As I said -- if I were a Venezuelan I'd be a strong Chavez critic.


Really? Out of curiosity, what would you criticize him for?

[alkemical]

He doesn't know **** about wine.

[DenverBrit]

Hugo is no more of a tyrant than Bush or Obama -- much less so -- in fact -- given his land slide electoral victories.

As I said -- if I were a Venezuelan I'd be a strong Chavez critic.

But on this forum -- peopled by arrogant Americans -- I find myself compelled to defend Venezuela's sovereignty.

People like you make me truly ashamed of being an American. You are absent integrity or any higher moral standards. You live in denial across a range of issues -- Our nation has left a swathe of destruction across the planet. Everything we have touched -- we have destroyed.

This is a fact -- and you are part of the problem.

You're an apologist for corrupt elections.

The opposition is denouncing unfair pressure by the government against those governmental workers who might not want to support the president. They released a video that showed energy minister and head of PDVSA, Rafael Ramírez, telling state oil workers to back President Hugo Chávez or to leave their jobs. He also said PDVSA is red "from top to bottom"(PDVSA es roja, rojita de arriba abajo). He also said that PDVSA's "workers are with this revolution, and those who aren't should go somewhere else. Go to Miami". Opposition media outlets have been repeating the 14-minute video over and over again. President Chávez said he supported the PDVSA director and recommended him to make the same speech to oil workers 100 times a day.The CNE opened an investigation into Rafael Ramírez following the protests from the opposition[87] and Ramírez was eventually fined.

As for 'landslide', is getting a minority of the votes a 'landslide' in your little world? As usual, you're wrong, just as you were when you insisted Germany won WW1.

On Sunday, Venezuela held elections for 165 seats in the National Assembly -- a loose equivalent to the mid-term elections for Congress in the U.S. -- and Venezuelans took the first step toward building a future that is democratic, inclusive and hopeful.

The desire for change was clear: 52% of the people voted for alternative candidates, versus 48% for the Chavez-controlled Partido Socialista Unido de Venezuela, a.k.a. PSUV.

Equally clear, however, was the damage that has been done to our democratic systems by the ruling government. Even though the PSUV won less than 48% of the vote, it holds 60% of the seats. In Caracas, where the PSUV had less than 50% of the vote - it will keep 7 out of the 10 seats that were in play.

[W*GS]

Really? Out of curiosity, what would you criticize him for?

Not attacking the United States.

[baja]

RE the OP

how long before the US finds "evidence" of WMD in Venezuela?

[alkemical]

RE the OP

how long before the US finds "evidence" of WMD in Venezuela?

Do WMD's = Oil?

;)

[Garcia Bronco]

Hugo is no more of a tyrant than Bush or Obama -- much less so -- in fact -- given his land slide electoral victories.

As I said -- if I were a Venezuelan I'd be a strong Chavez critic.

But on this forum -- peopled by arrogant Americans -- I find myself compelled to defend Venezuela's sovereignty.

People like you make me truly ashamed of being an American. You are absent integrity or any higher moral standards. You live in denial across a range of issues -- Our nation has left a swathe of destruction across the planet. Everything we have touched -- we have destroyed.

This is a fact -- and you are part of the problem.

Bush and Obama aren't tyrants. Hugo is and gets elected on rigged elections. You get it...you just have decided to argue a point you've been beaten down about on this thread.

[baja]

Bush and Obama aren't tyrants. Hugo is and gets elected on rigged elections. You get it...you just have decided to argue a point you've been beaten down about on this thread.

Florida

Ohio

hanging chad

Oh and executive orders

[alkemical]

We vote for our oppressors here.

[Garcia Bronco]

Florida

Ohio

hanging chad

Oh and executive orders

Executive orders are not tyranny in and of themselves...nor was Florida or Ohio. Further...the day people are killed and starved because they didn't vote for Bush or Obama or agree with them...you might have a point.

[baja]

"Either you are with us or against us"

[alkemical]

"Violating the constitution is not unconstitutional...."

[baja]

"The Constitution is just a piece of paper" - GWB

[alkemical]

"The Constitution is just a piece of paper" - GWB

"You don't get everything you want. A dictatorship would be a lot easier." Describing what it's like to be governor of Texas.
(Governing Magazine 7/98)

-- From Paul Begala's "Is Our Children Learning?"

"I told all four that there are going to be some times where we don't agree with each other, but that's OK. If this were a dictatorship, it would be a heck of a lot easier, just so long as I'm the dictator," Bush joked.

-- CNN.com, December 18, 2000

"A dictatorship would be a heck of a lot easier, there's no question about it, " [Bush] said.

-- Business Week, July 30, 2001



His quotes prove he didn't get all the power he wanted. :D

[mhgaffney]

You're an apologist for corrupt elections.



As for 'landslide', is getting a minority of the votes a 'landslide' in your little world? As usual, you're wrong, just as you were when you insisted Germany won WW1.

You -- once again -- have swallowed the propaganda standard in the US media- - that Chavez is a tyrant and that his electoral victories were staged or corrupt.

Biut according to Wikipedia -- which is as far from being pro Chavez as you can get on the Internet -- every poll before the 2006 election predicted a landslide win for Chavez -- and the polls were correct.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venezuelan_presidential_election,_2006#Polls

[cutthemdown]

RE the OP

how long before the US finds "evidence" of WMD in Venezuela?

Not how it will go down at all. Mostly likely it will be after a farce election, or change to the constitution, whatever, that makes Chavez leader again even though the people don't want him. Violence will erupt, Chavez will try and quell it with the military but it gets ugly. Colombia goes on alert, USA gets antsy, civilians get killed and America says we can't allow this on our continent, goes in and removes him.

I doubt it will be over WMD.

[mhgaffney]

In 2009 a national referendum in Venezuela also delivered a stinging defeat to Chavez -- who wanted to amend the nation's constitution -- so he could remain in office for an extended period.

The people of Venezuela voted it down -- which suggests that that the democratic process in the country continues to be healthy.

https://nacla.org/node/5741

[cutthemdown]

In 2009 a national referendum in Venezuela also delivered a stinging defeat to Chavez -- who wanted to amend the nation's constitution -- so he could remain in office for an extended period.

The people of Venezuela voted it down -- which suggests that that the democratic process in the country continues to be healthy.

https://nacla.org/node/5741

He won't give it up. You watch when the time comes he will stay. He's a dictator that just hasn't had to go all the way yet. Give him time.

[mhgaffney]

Baloney.

BTW, you stated that Bush was bad - but that we replaced him in an election -- proving we are a democracy.

Are you really this shallow?

What we did was replace Tweedle Dee with Tweedle Dum.

When the polls turned against Bush (who was a Wall Street stooge) we replaced him with Obama (who was also a Wall Street stooge.)

Wall Street wins every time by controlling the process. It doesn't matter who wins the election -- the winner will be their guy.

Ron Paul threatens this control -- which explains why the corporate press ignores and downplays his campaign.

We are not a democracy -- we are a plutocracy.

They obscure this with the trappings and jargon of democracy -- but it's all an illusion.

How can you not know this in 2011?

[DenverBrit]

You -- once again -- have swallowed the propaganda standard in the US media- - that Chavez is a tyrant and that his electoral victories were staged or corrupt.

Biut according to Wikipedia -- which is as far from being pro Chavez as you can get on the Internet -- every poll before the 2006 election predicted a landslide win for Chavez -- and the polls were correct.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venezuelan_presidential_election,_2006#Polls

Yeah, Huffington Post is a nest of right wing vipers.

And the other info was from....Wikipedia.

[DenverBrit]

In 2009 a national referendum in Venezuela also delivered a stinging defeat to Chavez -- who wanted to amend the nation's constitution -- so he could remain in office for an extended period.

The people of Venezuela voted it down -- which suggests that that the democratic process in the country continues to be healthy.

https://nacla.org/node/5741

Go ahead and ignore the facts.

His party got 48% of the vote and 60% of the seats. That's your idea of 'healthy democracy'??

[The Lone Bolt]

Baloney.

BTW, you stated that Bush was bad - but that we replaced him in an election -- proving we are a democracy.

Are you really this shallow?

What we did was replace Tweedle Dee with Tweedle Dum.

When the polls turned against Bush (who was a Wall Street stooge) we replaced him with Obama (who was also a Wall Street stooge.)

Wall Street wins every time by controlling the process. It doesn't matter who wins the election -- the winner will be their guy.

Ron Paul threatens this control -- which explains why the corporate press ignores and downplays his campaign.

We are not a democracy -- we are a plutocracy.

They obscure this with the trappings and jargon of democracy -- but it's all an illusion.

How can you not know this in 2011?

Yet for some reason you predicted that bush would cancel the 2008 elections, declare martial law, and install himself as America's first absolute dictator.

Now you are saying that "Wall Street wins every time by controlling the process. It doesn't matter who wins the election -- the winner will be their guy"?

:kiddingme

[DenverBrit]

Yet for some reason you predicted that bush would cancel the 2008 elections, declare martial law, and install himself as America's first absolute dictator.

Now you are saying that "Wall Street wins every time by controlling the process. It doesn't matter who wins the election -- the winner will be their guy"?

:kiddingme

Did clown shoes really post that? Ha!

[The Lone Bolt]

Did clown shoes really post that? Ha!

Yep. And after he was proven wrong he apparently "discovered" that it doesn't matter who wins the elections. ::)

[DenverBrit]

Yep. And after he was proven wrong he apparently "discovered" that it doesn't matter who wins the elections. ::)

For someone who thinks he's always right, clown shoes rarely gets his facts straight.

[mhgaffney]

Yep. And after he was proven wrong he apparently "discovered" that it doesn't matter who wins the elections. ::)

There was a period -- after GW's re election -- when he was so power mad -- anything seemed possible.

Bush's sociopathic bent became so blatant - that it offended many within the US power elite who understand that appearances matter.

There must be the appearance of democracy -- if not the reality. So, they ditched Bush and brought in another Wall Street stooge -- with black skin so that he would have special appeal to liberals, who believed that supporting a black man for president was socially progressive.

Of course I mean: Obama.

The progressives who supported him were cruelly betrayed.

And where were you in 2008? Still making excuses for GW Bush. And to think -- you are a counselor who helps people in need.

God help those poor people who come to you for help!

[The Lone Bolt]

There was a period -- after GW's re election -- when he was so power mad -- anything seemed possible.

Bush's sociopathic bent became so blatant - that it offended many within the US power elite who understand that appearances matter.

There must be the appearance of democracy -- if not the reality. So, they ditched Bush and brought in another Wall Street stooge -- with black skin so that he would have special appeal to liberals, who believed that supporting a black man for president was socially progressive.

Of course I mean: Obama.

The progressives who supported him were cruelly betrayed.

And where were you in 2008? Still making excuses for GW Bush. And to think -- you are a counselor who helps people in need.

God help those poor people who come to you for help!

I work on a crisis line and at this point I've lost count of how many lives I've saved. How many lives have you saved Gaff?

But I do think you are in need. Please consider therapy and medications. You won't regret it.


Back to the issues at hand: so your explanation is that Bush was "power mad" and so was "ditched" by the "power elite" to keep up appearances of the democratic process, is that right?

So bush never had the power to pull off a coup as the "power elite" were really in control all along. So why were you warning of a coup?

[mhgaffney]

You indicated you were a psychotherapist -- and now we find out that you answer the telephone.

Why am I not surprised.

[DenverBrit]

You indicated you were a psychotherapist -- and now we find out that you answer the telephone.

Why am I not surprised.

Looking for a freebie, Gaffney??

While you're waiting, why don't you address your strange statement:

given his land slide electoral victories.

Which is a demonstrable lie. He got 48% of the vote, yet 60% of the seats. The only 'landslide' was his corruption of the electoral process.

You're a propagandist for a communist dictator.

[The Lone Bolt]

You indicated you were a psychotherapist -- and now we find out that you answer the telephone.

Why am I not surprised.

I'm a licensed mental health counselor. And you didn't answer my questions.

[cutthemdown]

There was a period -- after GW's re election -- when he was so power mad -- anything seemed possible.

Bush's sociopathic bent became so blatant - that it offended many within the US power elite who understand that appearances matter.

There must be the appearance of democracy -- if not the reality. So, they ditched Bush and brought in another Wall Street stooge -- with black skin so that he would have special appeal to liberals, who believed that supporting a black man for president was socially progressive.

Of course I mean: Obama.

The progressives who supported him were cruelly betrayed.

And where were you in 2008? Still making excuses for GW Bush. And to think -- you are a counselor who helps people in need.

God help those poor people who come to you for help!

They didn't ditch Bush he finished his 2 terms and was constitutionally bound to not run again. There is no scenario where he would have strayed in power, not one.

[mhgaffney]

They didn't ditch Bush he finished his 2 terms and was constitutionally bound to not run again. There is no scenario where he would have strayed in power, not one.

The US power elite ditched Bush by abandoning his heir designate, John McCain.

Wall Street lavished more campaign contributions on Obama than McCain.

This tells the tale.

[W*GS]

You're a propagandist for a communist dictator.

Surprised?

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

Why don't we just tell that turd burglar to come get it.

[cutthemdown]

The US power elite ditched Bush by abandoning his heir designate, John McCain.

Wall Street lavished more campaign contributions on Obama than McCain.

This tells the tale.

BS they looked at the polls and wanted to back the winner.

[mhgaffney]

BS they looked at the polls and wanted to back the winner.

If you think back -- despite Bush's sociopathic record -- the race between his heir McCain and Obama was neck in neck -- UNTIL the meltdown in late September.

Only at that point did the polls shift in favor of Obama.

[mhgaffney]

Looking for a freebie, Gaffney??

While you're waiting, why don't you address your strange statement:



Which is a demonstrable lie. He got 48% of the vote, yet 60% of the seats. The only 'landslide' was his corruption of the electoral process.

You're a propagandist for a communist dictator.

Bull shyte. In a parliamentary system, with multiple candidates, 48% of the vote was a huge majority.

I've made it very clear that if I were a Venezuelan I'd be a strong critic of Chavez -- but on this forum - loaded with rabid imperialists, fascists, sadistic A-holes, and assorted Nazis (i.e. W*gs) I feel obliged to defend Venezuela's sovereignty.

What about this is unclear?

It's especially important that people like me do so -- after what just happened to Libya.

Khadaffi;'s mistake was attempting to accommodate the West. He should have known better.

He should have acquired nuclear weapons. You can be sure -- his mistake will not be lost on other US adversaries. The only language the US understands is blunt force.

Just like with you bozos. The only language you understand is a fist in the mouth.

[W*GS]

Bull shyte. In a parliamentary system, with multiple candidates, 48% of the vote was a huge majority.

You can't do math. Too.

I've made it very clear that if I were a Venezuelan I'd be a strong critic of Chavez -- but on this forum - loaded with rabid imperialists, fascists, sadistic A-holes, and assorted Nazis (i.e. W*gs) I feel obliged to defend Venezuela's sovereignty.

*I'm* a Nazi? Nope - the only Jew-hater here is you, son.

You're not standing up for ol' Hugo because you find us so odious. You stand up for ol' Hugo because he spouts the same anti-American agitprop that you do, so of course, he's your BFF. It doesn't matter in the slightest to you that he has turned Venezuela into a near-communist state, with nearly all the levers of power controlled by ol' Hugo. That's just peachy with you, because he uses the same language as you do in regards to the US and private enterprise.

The only language you understand is a fist in the mouth.

You're no peace activist - you're a Jew-hating lover of dictators who dreams about physical violence.

You make a mockery of yourself with every post, you pathetic POS.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

Hugo Chavez is a freaking psychopath, and an enemy of our country. Let him come get his gold if he wants it.

[Spider]

and to think ron paul wants us back on the gold standard , and some of u retards agree with him

[mosca]

and to think ron paul wants us back on the gold standard , and some of u retards agree with him
Whatever, Spider. It's pretty obvious that you see Ron Paul as a threat to Obama and/or Hillary Clinton (who you've had a hard-on for a while) so you won't admit that he's a quality candidate.

[Spider]

Whatever, Spider. It's pretty obvious that you see Ron Paul as a threat to Obama and/or Hillary Clinton (who you've had a hard-on for a while) so you won't admit that he's a quality candidate.

oh yeah u nailed it , forget how ****ing stupid going back to the gold standard is , I see him as a threat to obama ..............:rofl:

[mosca]

oh yeah u nailed it , forget how ****ing stupid going back to the gold standard is , I see him as a threat to obama ..............:rofl:
Our resident financial guru known as Spider calling Ron Paul's economic ideas stupid. Priceless.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Our resident financial guru known as Spider calling Ron Paul's economic ideas stupid. Priceless.
Nah, you don't have to call them stupid to know they are........stupid.

In his "last run" he claimed he would eliminate government and income taxes and it wouldn't hurt the country.

This is only one many statements he has made that most people would call ................. stupid.

Not saying he doesn't have any good ideas, he does, just not much when it comes to the world economy, which we all are a part of.

[Spider]

Our resident financial guru known as Spider calling Ron Paul's economic ideas stupid. Priceless.

I know enough to know switching over to the gold standard is about as bright as hanging your underwear on your mirror while driving down the road trying to dry clean em