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View Full Version : Don't bet against TEBOW!


The Moops
07-14-2011, 07:13 PM
Why Orton has no shot!

http://bit.ly/jWV7tK

Los Broncos
07-14-2011, 07:23 PM
I have my doubts about him, but will be pulling for him all the way.

TheReverend
07-14-2011, 07:25 PM
Repped for solid write up, man.

Quoydogs
07-14-2011, 07:25 PM
"When I hear parents tell their kids, 'It doesn't matter if you win or lose, as
long as you have fun,' I'm puzzled. That's just not how I'm wired. Bottom
line, losing simply isn't any fun."


This !:thumbsup::thumbs::notworthy

broncosteven
07-14-2011, 07:28 PM
I am sure "Through my eyes" is no "Failure is not an option" but I am going to reserve it at the library anyway.

broncosteven
07-14-2011, 07:30 PM
"When I hear parents tell their kids, 'It doesn't matter if you win or lose, as
long as you have fun,' I'm puzzled. That's just not how I'm wired. Bottom
line, losing simply isn't any fun."


This !:thumbsup::thumbs::notworthy

In team based games where your kid could get paired up with a poor talent you have to tell them something.

AK Broncomaniac
07-14-2011, 07:46 PM
I am sure "Through my eyes" is no "Failure is not an option" but I am going to reserve it at the library anyway.

You're right in your comparison, but it is a great read. That was a very well written article... Thanks for sharing, Moops. I like Orton and I agree that he was not the weakest link last year, but I definitely think Tebow's the man to start this season!

SoCalBronco
07-14-2011, 07:46 PM
I believe in and support Tebow 100%. His superhuman work ethic alone will be enough to make him an effective and very versatile NFL QB. When even a traditional, conservative coach like John Fox says that we'll have the most creative running game in the league, you know that he knows we've got a kid here that has the potential to truly redefine what it means to be a "dual threat" QB.

GB2.

tsiguy96
07-14-2011, 07:49 PM
I believe in and support Tebow 100%. His superhuman work ethic alone will be enough to make him an effective and very versatile NFL QB. When even a traditional, conservative coach like John Fox says that we'll have the most creative running game in the league, you know that he knows we've got a kid here that has the potential to truly redefine what it means to be a "dual threat" QB.

GB2.

good writeup by moops.


also, the one thing i keep hearing from people is "hes not playing against SEC linebackers anymore!" and my first thought is yea, but hes still bigger and stronger than a good amount of NFL linebackers as well...

how much will he have to dial in his running ability in the NFL is a major question i have about his play.

mustangtoby
07-14-2011, 07:53 PM
GO TIMMY!!!!!!!!

SoCalBronco
07-14-2011, 07:57 PM
good writeup by moops.


also, the one thing i keep hearing from people is "hes not playing against SEC linebackers anymore!" and my first thought is yea, but hes still bigger and stronger than a good amount of NFL linebackers as well...

how much will he have to dial in his running ability in the NFL is a major question i have about his play.

Yep, very good writeup by Moops.

Re: LB's...I think that's a fair criticism, but also Tebow has been bulking up too. He's constantly getting stronger. Based on some of those golfing pics, I'd say he's probably even more well built now than he was at Florida, so he's going to be a load for any LB, NFL or SEC (and the SEC ones weren't bad, themselves). I'd also note that it might not be accurate to say that most NFL LB's are these 6'5 265 behemoths. The general trend in NFL linebacking in the last 20 years has been towards smaller, but faster LB's and he can bowl those guys over. With the bigger ones (3-4 OLBs and some 4-3 old school SLB's), while some contact is inevitable, he'll be able to outrun many of them.

I'm not worried about Tebow's body not being up to taking the pounding. There's probably no one in the league that takes care of their body better than he does. He'll take it.....and he'll dish it, too.

tsiguy96
07-14-2011, 07:59 PM
Yep, very good writeup by Moops.

Re: LB's...I think that's a fair criticism, but also Tebow has been bulking up too. He's constantly getting stronger. Based on some of those golfing pics, I'd say he's probably even more well built now than he was at Florida, so he's going to be a load for any LB, NFL or SEC (and the SEC ones weren't bad, themselves). I'd also note that it might not be accurate to say that most NFL LB's are these 6'5 265 behemoths. The general trend in NFL linebacking in the last 20 years has been towards smaller, but faster LB's and he can bowl those guys over. With the bigger ones (3-4 OLBs and some 4-3 old school SLB's), while some contact is inevitable, he'll be able to outrun many of them.

I'm not worried about Tebow's body not being up to taking the pounding. There's probably no one in the league that takes care of their body better than he does. He'll take it.....and he'll dish it, too.

definitely, just wondering where that takes his game in general, if hes gonna dish away from more hits than he did in college (though i dont know if thats even in his DNA to coach him to shy away from contact). its a fair point that he is no longer playing SEC linebackers, hes playing the top 1% now, bigger faster and stronger, but at the same time so is he. hopefully he learns how to make and even initiate contact while avoiding big hits, though that seems as much luck as anything else.

TheReverend
07-14-2011, 08:06 PM
Yep, very good writeup by Moops.

Re: LB's...I think that's a fair criticism, but also Tebow has been bulking up too. He's constantly getting stronger. Based on some of those golfing pics, I'd say he's probably even more well built now than he was at Florida, so he's going to be a load for any LB, NFL or SEC (and the SEC ones weren't bad, themselves). I'd also note that it might not be accurate to say that most NFL LB's are these 6'5 265 behemoths. The general trend in NFL linebacking in the last 20 years has been towards smaller, but faster LB's and he can bowl those guys over. With the bigger ones (3-4 OLBs and some 4-3 old school SLB's), while some contact is inevitable, he'll be able to outrun many of them.

I'm not worried about Tebow's body not being up to taking the pounding. There's probably no one in the league that takes care of their body better than he does. He'll take it.....and he'll dish it, too.

I don't think the focus should be on Tebow vs LBers in size and athleticism.

Being an effective passer will force DE's out of contain and LB's out of spy.

That should be the focus. At that point, he can easily chew up 10 yards a clip when it's available when defenders are on their heels in coverage and ends are washed out of the play.

OABB
07-14-2011, 08:09 PM
Yep, very good writeup by Moops.

Re: LB's...I think that's a fair criticism, but also Tebow has been bulking up too. He's constantly getting stronger. Based on some of those golfing pics, I'd say he's probably even more well built now than he was at Florida, so he's going to be a load for any LB, NFL or SEC (and the SEC ones weren't bad, themselves). I'd also note that it might not be accurate to say that most NFL LB's are these 6'5 265 behemoths. The general trend in NFL linebacking in the last 20 years has been towards smaller, but faster LB's and he can bowl those guys over. With the bigger ones (3-4 OLBs and some 4-3 old school SLB's), while some contact is inevitable, he'll be able to outrun many of them.

I'm not worried about Tebow's body not being up to taking the pounding. There's probably no one in the league that takes care of their body better than he does. He'll take it.....and he'll dish it, too.

sec linebackers are better than nfl ones. Why do you think tebow is a better runner in the pros?

Broncobiv
07-14-2011, 08:11 PM
also, the one thing i keep hearing from people is "hes not playing against SEC linebackers anymore!"
Hello...this is an ADVANTAGE for us! The SEC is tougher than the NFL, so Tebow will dominate even more at this level!

DBroncos4life
07-14-2011, 08:23 PM
Hello...this is an ADVANTAGE for us! The SEC is tougher than the NFL, so Tebow will dominate even more at this level!

I just hope Tebow doesn't get bored playing down to the watered down NFL.

TheReverend
07-14-2011, 08:35 PM
I just hope Tebow doesn't get bored playing down to the watered down NFL.

He'll finally get to be overrated now like those guys in those stacked yet somehow dramatically inferior teams from other conferences.

oubronco
07-14-2011, 08:36 PM
Go Brady..........................DOH!!

DBroncos4life
07-14-2011, 08:42 PM
He'll finally get to be overrated now like those guys in those stacked yet somehow dramatically inferior teams from other conferences.

Just think what he could have done with OU's Oline! I know more of Florida's is in the NFL but everyone who knows anything about college football knows that OU had the best Oline in the game.

TheReverend
07-14-2011, 08:51 PM
Just think what he could have done with OU's Oline! I know more of Florida's is in the NFL but everyone who knows anything about college football knows that OU had the best Oline in the game.

Ugh, can you imagine the numbers he would've put up with Texas's defense on the schedule?!?!

strafen
07-14-2011, 09:28 PM
I'm excited to find out how much the efforts Tebow has put in this off-season will have paid off
I've got the feeling we're all going to be pleasantly surprised. He knows that by most accounts -fair or not- he will only be given one shot to succeed in he NFL and he's going to be on a mission to prove them wrong :thumbsup:

DBroncos4life
07-14-2011, 09:29 PM
Ugh, can you imagine the numbers he would've put up with Texas's defense on the schedule?!?!

400 rushing yards 14 TDs and that would just be the first half.

enjolras
07-14-2011, 09:31 PM
Yep, very good writeup by Moops.

Re: LB's...I think that's a fair criticism, but also Tebow has been bulking up too. He's constantly getting stronger.

It's not about size... it's about speed. In college Tebow would face MAYBE one or two linebackers on a defense that had NFL speed. You can't coach fast, and Tebow isn't particularly speedy.

I'd say that it's a very valid question mark. Does he have the speed to get that corner against NFL linebackers? Early indications are maybe at best.

SoCalBronco
07-14-2011, 09:36 PM
It's not about size... it's about speed. In college Tebow would face MAYBE one or two linebackers on a defense that had NFL speed. You can't coach fast, and Tebow isn't particularly speedy.

I'd say that it's a very valid question mark. Does he have the speed to get that corner against NFL linebackers? Early indications are maybe at best.

I think he's got very good functional speed for his size. If he couldn't run against NFL LB's, HTF did he get that 40 yard touchdown against Oakland? Give me a break. He can run and as Rev pointed out, as he improves as a passer, it will make it even harder for them to defend the run with the DE's and LB's.

TheReverend
07-14-2011, 09:38 PM
It's not about size... it's about speed. In college Tebow would face MAYBE one or two linebackers on a defense that had NFL speed. You can't coach fast, and Tebow isn't particularly speedy.

I'd say that it's a very valid question mark. Does he have the speed to get that corner against NFL linebackers? Early indications are maybe at best.

Oakland has one of the fastest and best LBer corps in the league.

TheReverend
07-14-2011, 09:38 PM
I think he's got very good functional speed for his size. If he couldn't run against NFL LB's, HTF did he get that 40 yard touchdown against Oakland? Give me a break. He can run and as Rev pointed out, as he improves as a passer, it will make it even harder for them to defend the run with the DE's and LB's.

Crap too late.

BroncoMan4ever
07-14-2011, 11:13 PM
my main comparison right now between the 2 and why I want Tebow more than Orton even though Orton is the safer choice is the scenario when everything breaks down, when there is a mistake, Orton lays down and takes the sack, Tebow makes something out of nothing.

like in his 1st start. taking a botched handoff and turning it into a 40 yard TD run. Orton makes that mistake he will lay down and take the sack and the team settles for a FG.

Tebow in my eyes, gives the team a chance in all conditions, Orton gives the team a good chance when everything is going well.

The Moops
07-15-2011, 07:23 AM
Tebow has plenty of speed for the NFL. He ran a 4.7 at the combine last year, good enough for 4th best. Remember, unlike most QBs, defenders won't be able to arm-tackle him!

"The University of Florida standout not only demonstrated his outstanding speed, but he also showed he can be a cheerleader. He consistently stood off the line about 5 yards to the left and yelled encouragement to his fellow competitors.

Here were the top eight finishers among quarterbacks in the 40:

West Virginia’s Jarrett Brown — 4.54 seconds
Central Michigan’s Dan LeFevour — 4.66 seconds
Oklahoma State’s Zac Robinson — 4.71 seconds
Tebow — 4.72 seconds
Texas’ Colt McCoy — 4.79 seconds
Duke’s Thaddeus Lewis — 4.84 seconds
Fordham’s John Skelton — 4.85 seconds
BYU’s Max Hall — 4.87 seconds"

HooptyHoops
07-15-2011, 09:14 AM
I don't think the focus should be on Tebow vs LBers in size and athleticism.

Being an effective passer will force DE's out of contain and LB's out of spy.

That should be the focus. At that point, he can easily chew up 10 yards a clip when it's available when defenders are on their heels in coverage and ends are washed out of the play.

For sure! Love this post. Makes total sense and let's all hope Tebow is working on being a prototype passer this offseason, as that is going to almost make Tebow unstoppable if he does that!!

TheReverend
07-15-2011, 10:02 AM
For sure! Love this post. Makes total sense and let's all hope Tebow is working on being a prototype passer this offseason, as that is going to almost make Tebow unstoppable if he does that!!

I assure you that post loves you too.

Bronco Yoda
07-15-2011, 10:26 AM
TGN could not have written a better piece :)

epicSocialism4tw
07-15-2011, 10:39 AM
Why Orton has no shot!

http://bit.ly/jWV7tK

Good stuff, Moops.

I'm excited to see what Tebow can do this season. He was full of surprises last season.

epicSocialism4tw
07-15-2011, 10:43 AM
Tebow has plenty of speed for the NFL. He ran a 4.7 at the combine last year, good enough for 4th best. Remember, unlike most QBs, defenders won't be able to arm-tackle him!

"The University of Florida standout not only demonstrated his outstanding speed, but he also showed he can be a cheerleader. He consistently stood off the line about 5 yards to the left and yelled encouragement to his fellow competitors.

Here were the top eight finishers among quarterbacks in the 40:

West Virginia’s Jarrett Brown — 4.54 seconds
Central Michigan’s Dan LeFevour — 4.66 seconds
Oklahoma State’s Zac Robinson — 4.71 seconds
Tebow — 4.72 seconds
Texas’ Colt McCoy — 4.79 seconds
Duke’s Thaddeus Lewis — 4.84 seconds
Fordham’s John Skelton — 4.85 seconds
BYU’s Max Hall — 4.87 seconds"

Didn't Tebow have exceptional explosiveness and agility? I seem to remember him having outstanding results in the short cone and the shuttle, as well as the jumping drills.

That's why it looks like he isn't blazing down the field, but it seems that nobody can catch him. He has great, quick feet. Not to mention his great vision.

Gcver2ver3
07-15-2011, 10:44 AM
print out this article and fold it up and leave it laying in front of coach Fox's doorstep...

epicSocialism4tw
07-15-2011, 10:51 AM
I don't think the focus should be on Tebow vs LBers in size and athleticism.

Being an effective passer will force DE's out of contain and LB's out of spy.

That should be the focus. At that point, he can easily chew up 10 yards a clip when it's available when defenders are on their heels in coverage and ends are washed out of the play.

That's pretty much what he was able to do at Florida, and its what made him frustrate and confound defenses.

I rooted against him in college because I wanted OU to succeed, and he just kept smashing my hopes over and over again until he did it ultimately in the title game. Tebow can and will make the big play on you with his feet or with his arm, but where he kills you is that he can get 5 yards whenever he wants to with his feet. Its frustrating because its a slow beating and it ends up taking the life out of the opponent.

The Moops
07-15-2011, 08:02 PM
yes, Tebow did incredibly well in quickness/agility drills at the combine last year ... even out jumping Michael Vick's record ...

"Tebow equaled the best vertical jump of any quarterback in combine history, 38.5 inches. Before you get too excited, it should be noted he tied a record set by Josh McCown, who hasn’t exactly dazzled anyone since, but still…

Consider this: Michael Vick jumped 38 inches when he was tested in 2001. So Tebow out-jumped him.

Tebow also led all quarterbacks in the three-cone drill (6.66 seconds), the 20-yard shuttle (4.17 seconds) and the 60-yard shuttle (11.27 seconds). What does it mean? Hard to say, but this much is clear: 1. Tebow is in great shape, and 2. he is very serious about playing at the next level."

Hogan11
07-15-2011, 08:12 PM
I have my doubts about him, but will be pulling for him all the way.

Probably gonna take another season for me to forget him wearing those ****ing FLA rags, helped along by any accomplishments he may attain.

Lomax
07-15-2011, 08:46 PM
If we're talking about who's starting, the question really has to be about his passing, because that's how this decision will be made by EFX. Right now, at this moment, Tebow does not make all of the NFL throws. In the pocket, he doesn't throw to his right, and he's not sound hitting short crossing routes, flats or outs. That's a massive gap in his game. That would be like taking the court in the French Open and not having a backhand. I don't care how fast or big you are, against pro level opponents, having limited throws you can make is a massive liability.

Love his fire and leadership, but until he is sound on 100% of the NFL throws, he's just a backup/gimmick QB who sells a lot of jerseys and books.

OABB
07-15-2011, 08:57 PM
If we're talking about who's starting, the question really has to be about his passing, because that's how this decision will be made by EFX. Right now, at this moment, Tebow does not make all of the NFL throws. In the pocket, he doesn't throw to his right, and he's not sound hitting short crossing routes, flats or outs. That's a massive gap in his game. That would be like taking the court in the French Open and not having a backhand. I don't care how fast or big you are, against pro level opponents, having limited throws you can make is a massive liability.

Love his fire and leadership, but until he is sound on 100% of the NFL throws, he's just a backup/gimmick QB who sells a lot of jerseys and books.

He totally plays like a rookie. Bust.

Lomax
07-15-2011, 09:18 PM
He totally plays like a rookie. Bust.

Didn't say he was a bust. Just said he shouldn't be starting unless he can make all of the throws consistently.

Revolutionary stuff, I know.

OABB
07-15-2011, 09:19 PM
Didn't say he was a bust. Just said he shouldn't be starting unless he can make all of the throws consistently.

Revolutionary stuff, I know.

It is revolutionary. Most people would let a rookie play to get better. Maybe your way works better?

TheReverend
07-15-2011, 09:26 PM
It is revolutionary. Most people would let a rookie play to get better. Maybe your way works better?

Let's stick with the incumbent.

Because he can make all the throws... :spit:

OABB
07-15-2011, 09:28 PM
Let's stick with the incumbent.

Because he can make all the throws... :spit:

His best throws are when he throws the games.

Zing!

TheReverend
07-15-2011, 09:29 PM
His best throws are when he throws the games.

Zing!

Arizona sent him a Christmas card.

s0phr0syne
07-15-2011, 09:40 PM
If we're talking about who's starting, the question really has to be about his passing, because that's how this decision will be made by EFX. Right now, at this moment, Tebow does not make all of the NFL throws. In the pocket, he doesn't throw to his right, and he's not sound hitting short crossing routes, flats or outs. That's a massive gap in his game. That would be like taking the court in the French Open and not having a backhand. I don't care how fast or big you are, against pro level opponents, having limited throws you can make is a massive liability.

Love his fire and leadership, but until he is sound on 100% of the NFL throws, he's just a backup/gimmick QB who sells a lot of jerseys and books.


Agreed.

Lomax
07-17-2011, 12:26 AM
It is revolutionary. Most people would let a rookie play to get better. Maybe your way works better?

1. Tebow isn't a rookie.
2. Most people might play a less capable QB "so he can get better".
3. Most people aren't NFL coaches.
4. NFL coaches are paid to put the best product on the field.
5. That product will be judged by passing ability. All the other stuff (scrambling, leadership, etc.) will be secondary.

Ergo...

If Tebow can't beat Orton in an open competition passing the ball, he stays on the bench, because NFL coaches like John Fox are smarter than most people when it comes to football.

Lomax
07-17-2011, 12:31 AM
Let's stick with the incumbent.

Because he can make all the throws... :spit:

I guarantee you, if Tebow still can't, he sits. You may not like it, but that's the way the cookie crumbles.

Lomax
07-17-2011, 12:40 AM
Agreed.

That makes two rational posters in this thread.

epicSocialism4tw
07-17-2011, 12:59 AM
That makes two rational posters in this thread.

You gotta love people who like to proclaim their rationality. Hilarious!

Agamemnon
07-17-2011, 09:53 PM
It's not about size... it's about speed. In college Tebow would face MAYBE one or two linebackers on a defense that had NFL speed. You can't coach fast, and Tebow isn't particularly speedy.

I'd say that it's a very valid question mark. Does he have the speed to get that corner against NFL linebackers? Early indications are maybe at best.

I keep trying to explain this to people and they just don't believe me. The biggest difference between the NFL and a top conference like the SEC is not speed or size. It's execution and awareness. Pretty much every starter on teams like Alabama, Georgia, Auburn, and LSU have NFL level measurables. The difference is almost entirely born of execution and on-field awareness. Those attributes are what really make separate NFL players from top conference college players. Not to say there isn't any difference physically, it's just not very big.

strafen
07-17-2011, 09:56 PM
TGN could not have written a better piece :):notworthy :thumbsup:

strafen
07-17-2011, 09:58 PM
Tebow in 2011 :wiggle:

Agamemnon
07-17-2011, 09:58 PM
1. Tebow isn't a rookie.
2. Most people might play a less capable QB "so he can get better".
3. Most people aren't NFL coaches.
4. NFL coaches are paid to put the best product on the field.
5. That product will be judged by passing ability. All the other stuff (scrambling, leadership, etc.) will be secondary.

Ergo...

If Tebow can't beat Orton in an open competition passing the ball, he stays on the bench, because NFL coaches like John Fox are smarter than most people when it comes to football.

Watching Tebow last season, I can't honestly believe anyone thinks his scrambling and leadership don't trump the likely possibility that Orton is still a bit better at passing from the pocket. I mean seriously?

Tebow was straight up better than Orton last season as a rookie. We scored more points and had more competitive fire as a team with Tebow on the field. But hey we had more passing yards with Orton right? ::)

OABB
07-17-2011, 10:45 PM
Tebow will start. Fox wants to win.