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DarkHorse30
06-24-2011, 10:41 AM
more off-season BS

That One Guy
06-24-2011, 10:42 AM
more off-season BS

Is that it?

Archer81
06-24-2011, 10:49 AM
Someone put out a APB on the WRP forum. Apparently its ****ing missing.


:Broncos:

bronco militia
06-24-2011, 10:50 AM
this country is full of lazy assholes.

get off your ass and work at mcdonalds until something better comes along.

jhns
06-24-2011, 10:52 AM
The fix is easy. Take out all tax breaks. Stop giving my money to the lazy. Economy fixed.

ant1999e
06-24-2011, 10:53 AM
Get rid of the uncertainty in the economy. Create some kind of stability in the economy so employers will feel comfortable hiring people.

Smiling Assassin27
06-24-2011, 11:02 AM
Switch our currency from the dollar to the ruble. Done and done.

cmhargrove
06-24-2011, 11:04 AM
No choices for legalize marijuana and tax internet porn?

That One Guy
06-24-2011, 11:06 AM
Is that it?

Oh... there wasn't a poll when I put this.

That One Guy
06-24-2011, 11:06 AM
What about eat the lazy? Can that be an option? I have more issues with lazy and stupid than I do with the rich.

Archer81
06-24-2011, 11:07 AM
Next time elect someone offering something more substantial than hope & change...


:Broncos:

RhymesayersDU
06-24-2011, 11:18 AM
No choices for legalize marijuana and tax internet porn?

And legalize/tax online gambling.

Requiem
06-24-2011, 11:19 AM
Christ.

There is a forum for this stuff.

Anyone else who starts threads about politics in the General Discussion portion of this thread get deported to Baja's plantation.

Kaylore
06-24-2011, 11:20 AM
The left has a three step plan to deal with this. It won't fix anything but they think it will address the issue.


1. Blame Bush. This is their go-to thing. All problems are Bush's fault.

2. Blame rich people for not being poor. It's easier to hate others who have money when you have less.

3. Explain that nothing can be done. The jobs are never coming back and then refer to steps 1 and 2.

Requiem
06-24-2011, 11:24 AM
^ Hardly, but a good generalization.

TonyR
06-24-2011, 11:46 AM
Roh had a great post on this:

Simple ****, really.

Supply side is a total, abject failure. Time to get over it.

Reinstitute the progressive tax code to its pre-Reagan dimensions.

Capital gains are income and should be taxed much higher than income actually earned by work.

The estate tax is a good thing, like most things, within reason.

Reinstate regulations on banks, credit and investment companies. They are out of control pirates.

Restructure the tax code so that it punishes those who hide assets overseas and profit from overseas investment. Reward those who invest in America and build new businesses that create products in America. Protectionism within moderate limits is not an evil. The first job of government is to serve the general welfare of the people, as it says in the preamble. Selling our souls to the ideology of "free markets" while watching our country go down the toilet is not a good thing. Some globalism is okay. Don't make a religion out of it.

All elections should be publicly funded.

Write an amendment to the Constitution: Corporations are not persons and do not have the rights of persons.

Put everybody on Medicare. Health care costs began to spiral out of control when Kaiser talked Nixon into making the health insurance industry "for profit." Massive error. That is where all the out of control spending started. Get rid of it. If every working person in America who pays for insurance now paid half for Medicare, everybody would be covered. Of course there would have to be restrictions on physicians over-treating the elderly in order to rake in bucks, and fraud would have to be vigorously pursued, but nothing is perfect. Some things are just better than others. If there is any profit to made in health care, let the health care providers (doctors, nurses, hospitals) make it. Not insurance men.

Reduce the military budget by half and bring our troops home. Close the majority of bases around the world. We don't need them and we shouldn't be paying to defend other countries. Let them pay for themselves.

Start using all the money created by the programs above to invest in education, infrastructure and scientific research across a broad spectrum of disciplines.

Simple ****. Really.
http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?p=3201662&highlight=tax#post3201662

broncocalijohn
06-24-2011, 01:09 PM
I learned if the media calls it bad then it will stay bad so let us all start saying how great the economy is and then it will be aaaaaw betta.

DarkHorse30
06-24-2011, 01:12 PM
Roh had a great post on this:


http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?p=3201662&highlight=tax#post3201662

I thought it was a really sucky post. Government FAILS at everything it tries......so give it MORE power? How did Jimmy Carter's 70% tax rate work? Remember the "misery index"? You know why? Because Obama has us right back in the same pile of poop.

Pie in the sky idealists have GREAT ideas.....that don't work in the real world.

Our economy does not have a revenue problem....it is a spending problem. Taxing the rich MORE will not fix the economy, spending less will. And please no more gov't "fixes" or playing around with the money supply.

Kaylore
06-24-2011, 01:27 PM
Roh had a great post on this:


http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?p=3201662&highlight=tax#post3201662

:rofl: Yeah that's it. The one group that has shown they have no clue how to fix the problem, government, should be given more of our money to jack things up even more.

Please.

Pony Boy
06-24-2011, 01:28 PM
Start with baby steps........require anyone on welfare or unemployment to pass a drug test.

oubronco
06-24-2011, 01:32 PM
Pull the troops out of the middle east that would save Billions, those poeple have been fighting their war forever and they aren't quit anytime soon

Kaylore
06-24-2011, 01:41 PM
Pull the troops out of the middle east that would save Billions, those poeple have been fighting their war forever and they aren't quit anytime soon

Yeah I could have lived with staying, but I don' think anyone expected him to move on to Libya. Now Yemen might be next. That isn't reducing costs.

peacepipe
06-24-2011, 02:05 PM
The left has a three step plan to deal with this. It won't fix anything but they think it will address the issue.


1. Blame Bush. This is their go-to thing. All problems are Bush's fault.

2. Blame rich people for not being poor. It's easier to hate others who have money when you have less.

3. Explain that nothing can be done. The jobs are never coming back and then refer to steps 1 and 2.

I actually blame reagon for getting us started down this path.

BroncoInferno
06-24-2011, 02:11 PM
:rofl: Yeah that's it. The one group that has shown they have no clue how to fix the problem, government, should be given more of our money to jack things up even more.

Please.

Government fixes problems all the time. There are literally countless examples. It's sad to see folks like you parroting ignorant garbage like this.

Jay3
06-24-2011, 02:14 PM
Reduce the size of government. Reduce spending. Reduce government borrowing. Reduce the debt. Strengthen the dollar.

Convert Social Security to an ownership-based, 401(k) type of account. Reap the rewards of a society that behaves like owners instead of just earners.

Inject a culture of choice into the health care system, placing the selection of services in the hands of patients so that a functioning price-setting mechanism can be revived. Do it with a 50 state market for insurance, and unbundling services connected with hospital care. Make it to where we are incentivized to make cost/benefit decisions on our own health care.

Invest in education that is individualized for each student using computer technology, using the power and reach of the internet to deliver a customized curriculum to each student.

BroncoInferno
06-24-2011, 02:16 PM
I thought it was a really sucky post. Government FAILS at everything it tries......so give it MORE power? How did Jimmy Carter's 70% tax rate work? Remember the "misery index"? You know why? Because Obama has us right back in the same pile of poop.

Pie in the sky idealists have GREAT ideas.....that don't work in the real world.

Our economy does not have a revenue problem....it is a spending problem. Taxing the rich MORE will not fix the economy, spending less will. And please no more gov't "fixes" or playing around with the money supply.

Those were actually Richard Nixon's 70% rates, dufus. The income tax on the rich was 90% under Eisenhower. Taxing the rich worked very well for decades.

Doggcow
06-24-2011, 02:18 PM
Colleges aren't charging enough? Are you ****ing kidding me?

Tuition has been raising double digits like crazy, while cutting majors...

ant1999e
06-24-2011, 02:22 PM
Government fixes problems all the time. There are literally countless examples. It's sad to see folks like you parroting ignorant garbage like this.

You're joking right?Hilarious!

That One Guy
06-24-2011, 02:23 PM
Those were actually Richard Nixon's 70% rates, dufus. The income tax on the rich was 90% under Eisenhower. Taxing the rich worked very well for decades.

It was a different world back then. Recall the recent news story about wealthy Chinese all trying to leave their country. For those with wealth, leaving is a more realistic option then it once was.

Not to say they absolutely will but it's much more a possibility with the internet. You can run a business in Indonesia just the same as you could in the US. That wasn't possible 30 years ago.

BroncoInferno
06-24-2011, 02:24 PM
You're joking right?Hilarious!

Polio vaccine anyone? The highway system? National parks? The internet? Just off the top of my head.

Ratboy
06-24-2011, 02:29 PM
The fix is easy. Take out all tax breaks. Stop giving my money to the lazy. Economy fixed.

+ pull out of these stupid conflicts.

jhns
06-24-2011, 02:29 PM
Polio vaccine anyone? The highway system? National parks? The internet? Just off the top of my head.

All Al Gore.

pricejj
06-24-2011, 03:02 PM
Fundamentally change the U.S.A. into Greece...?

pricejj
06-24-2011, 03:24 PM
5 step plan to instant economic turnaround:

1. DO NOT raise the debt ceiling
2. End the wars
3. Repeal Obamacare
4. BALANCE THE BUDGET (drastically reduce deficit spending).
5. Lower the Corporate tax rate from 35% to 25%, close the loopholes (make it even lower depending on how many jobs you want to come flooding back).

Of course this will require Ron Paul to be president, 2/3 House Republicans, and 51 Senate Republicans (with Tea Party leadership).

That One Guy
06-24-2011, 03:31 PM
5 step plan to instant economic turnaround:

1. DO NOT raise the debt ceiling
2. End the wars
3. Repeal Obamacare
4. BALANCE THE BUDGET (drastically reduce deficit spending).
5. Lower the Corporate tax rate from 35% to 25%, close the loopholes (make it even lower depending on how many jobs you want to come flooding back).

Of course this will require Ron Paul to be president, 2/3 House Republicans, and 51 Senate Republicans (with Tea Party leadership).

We need a pretty serious catastrophe to happen before the people will accept any radical changes. People will start paying attention if it impacts them. Until then, no politician will be concerned with losing his meal ticket by implementing any craziness. They'll keep kicking the can down the road to the next guy.

Kaylore
06-24-2011, 03:33 PM
You know what's hilarious is how two-faced the lefties around here are. They were whining and screaming to pull out of Iraq, Afghanistan and shut down Guantanamo. Now you don't here a peep about it. Look at this thread and others. Not one of these hypocrites will call out Obama for expanding this. I know they don't like it deep down because the lefty sites are ripping him for it.

That One Guy
06-24-2011, 03:40 PM
You know what's hilarious is how two-faced the lefties around here are. They were whining and screaming to pull out of Iraq, Afghanistan and shut down Guantanamo. Now you don't here a peep about it. Look at this thread and others. Not one of these hypocrites will call out Obama for expanding this. I know they don't like it deep down because the lefty sites are ripping him for it.

You know, I think we'd have a discussion on Obama if everyone the Rs were currently offering didn't have SIGNIFICANT question marks. I've hated just about everything Obama's done and the R candidate might be better but the last election was freaking Mccain and Palin as the best the Rs could offer. I'm intrigued by Paul but I think he's too easy to ruin in the public eye once the mud slinging begins. Who else is there really? The architect of Romneycare? A bunch of Yahoos who either haven't really been a factor on the national scale or have been but they're ultimately part of the mess we're currently in?

I don't follow this stuff anywhere near as closely as some do but so far, it seems like we're looking at the quality of Bush-Kerry all over again. You're getting a retard out of the election and just get to pick which disability you'd prefer. Give them someone to consider otherwise and I think the Obama support would be gone entirely. Not many are too happy with what he's done.

elsid13
06-24-2011, 03:43 PM
5 step plan to instant economic turnaround:

1. DO NOT raise the debt ceiling
2. End the wars
3. Repeal Obamacare
4. BALANCE THE BUDGET (drastically reduce deficit spending).
5. Lower the Corporate tax rate from 35% to 25%, close the loopholes (make it even lower depending on how many jobs you want to come flooding back).

Of course this will require Ron Paul to be president, 2/3 House Republicans, and 51 Senate Republicans (with Tea Party leadership).

So you want to destroy the country's credit rating and default on millions of Americans' retirements and savings? That what at stake here.

The top holders of US T-bonds are China, US Pension funds, the FED, Mutual Funds, Banks (for individuals) State and Local Governments.

That One Guy
06-24-2011, 03:48 PM
So you want to destroy the country's credit rating and default on millions of Americans' retirements and savings? That what at stake here.

The top holders of US T-bonds are China, US Pension funds, the FED, Mutual Funds, Banks (for individuals) State and Local Governments.

If we do that, things crash hard but maybe we see a turn around in my lifetime. If we don't, MAYBE we see one before my kids or grandkids are in the ground.

They've had quite a while to fix the debt issue and it just keeps going. Should we play the "Who was the last president to pay off the nation's debt?" game again?

Rigs11
06-24-2011, 03:59 PM
1.give more tax cuts to the corporations
2.spend more money on defense
3.get rid of all social programs
4.less regulation
5.get rid of npr funding
6.decimate the unions
7.get rid of the gays
8.ban abortion
9.get rid of the muslims
:yayaya:

Dr. Broncenstein
06-24-2011, 04:00 PM
Higher taxes, more regulation, and more spending.

errand
06-24-2011, 04:10 PM
government needs to get out of the way of entrepenuers. Jobs are created when someone decides to take a risk and starts a business.

We the people are the economy, our lives are better if we have more of our hard earned money in our pockets, thereby creating more disposable income to buy goods and services from other americans. The ****ing government can't even pave streets or deliver mail in a timely manner....in fact save for the US military I doubt anyone could name one solitary government agency or program that worked

Work hard america...millions on welfare depend on you

errand
06-24-2011, 04:18 PM
Higher taxes, more regulation, and more spending.

How is sticking it to a rich guy gonna help the poor guy? How does spending more money help you get outta a hole whenn you already owe more than you bring in?

the federal government is loaded with regulations that make it virtually impossible for the average joe to start a business, which means it increases his risk, which means he then decides not to risk his life savings or take out a loan to start a new business, because the risk/reward ratio isn't in his favor.

simple budget math....increase your income or lower your expenses....the fastest way for a business to increase his profits is to lower his expenses, not increase his sales. If you want to increase your profits by $100,000, it's easier to cut out 100K in expenses than it is to increase your sales by $1,000,000.00 net that 100K.

Government needs to quit spending like a drunk sailor (no offense to drunk sailors intended)

errand
06-24-2011, 04:20 PM
...on a side note....get the ****ing labor **** settled so we can argue football instead

Dr. Broncenstein
06-24-2011, 04:21 PM
How is sticking it to a rich guy gonna help the poor guy? How does spending more money help you get outta a hole whenn you already owe more than you bring in?

the federal government is loaded with regulations that make it virtually impossible for the average joe to start a business, which means it increases his risk, which means he then decides not to risk his life savings or take out a loan to start a new business, because the risk/reward ratio isn't in his favor.

simple budget math....increase your income or lower your expenses....the fastest way for a business to increase his profits is to lower his expenses, not increase his sales. If you want to increase your profits by $100,000, it's easier to cut out 100K in expenses than it is to increase your sales by $1,000,000.00 net that 100K.

Government needs to quit spending like a drunk sailor (no offense to drunk sailors intended)

One of us has a broken sarcasm detector.

Hulamau
06-24-2011, 04:24 PM
You know what's hilarious is how two-faced the lefties around here are. They were whining and screaming to pull out of Iraq, Afghanistan and shut down Guantanamo. Now you don't here a peep about it. Look at this thread and others. Not one of these hypocrites will call out Obama for expanding this. I know they don't like it deep down because the lefty sites are ripping him for it.

The thing is, Obama was never a pure lefty. That was clear during his campaign, as much as the far right-wing knuckle-draggers would love to paint him so. Yes, he's more to the left than anyone on the R ticket, but much more middle of the road than the radical left had hoped for as well ... More or less, about where he should be in ideology, but need to show better leadership and clarity.

And in a time like now where the debate is so polarized he was sure to disappoint a lot on both extremes.

That said, he has had a steep learning curve with a huge number of very difficult problems on his desk all at once, and has made his share of mistakes, but there certainly was no one on the ticket last time and certainly no one, so far, this time that is even close to as well-balanced ... and now at last as experienced as he has become. Ron Paul is a decent guy but no chance in hell is he electable and I don't view him as a guy that could stand up as a good leader. He is more a principled voice in the debate, but not really a guy I can see who could get much done in the trenches.

Anyone of the uninspiring Republican wannabes who have their hat in the ring now who might in a long shot unseat him is going to have to go through the same rookie term learning curve on the job while likely screwing up far more than Obama has and would in a second term in which Obama likely gathers momentum from his experience so far.

And he has done a number of good things too, dropping Bin Laden's body off the back of a carrier being only one of them, and seems to finally be finding his voice a bit ... time will tell.

Unless he really screws the pooch the next 18 months, odds are high he'll get a second term to show what he has learned. Don't underestimate his skill on the campaign trial when he starts to come out from the cloister of the White House more and gets into the teeth of the campaign.

One thing I fault him for so far was being too locked behind the ivory tower trying to work on all the details and not being an effective enough leader and communicator of what he was trying to do and how he sees things, and thus instead allowing some of the most far-right mouth-breathers to redefine a lot of the dialogue.

My bet is he does better in communication when the campaign heats up and the contrast between him and the folks currently being offered as alternatives will be more starkly underlined for everyone to see. Should be interesting nonetheless...

Hulamau
06-24-2011, 04:27 PM
...on a side note....get the ****ing labor **** settled so we can argue football instead

Now you're talkin! :strong:

elsid13
06-24-2011, 04:35 PM
If we do that, things crash hard but maybe we see a turn around in my lifetime. If we don't, MAYBE we see one before my kids or grandkids are in the ground.

They've had quite a while to fix the debt issue and it just keeps going. Should we play the "Who was the last president to pay off the nation's debt?" game again?

We won't see a turn around in your lifetime if we do that. We end up in America like Gaffey and Baja are predicting, if we fail to raise the debt ceiling.

barryr
06-24-2011, 04:38 PM
The economy will not improve until more people have jobs and I mean real jobs, not temporary BS that looks good on paper in DC. So whatever measures are needed to help in that area should be first in consideration to help the economy.

cutthemdown
06-24-2011, 04:39 PM
The thing is, Obama was never a pure lefty. That was clear during his campaign, as much as the far right-wing knuckle-draggers would love to paint him so. Yes, he's more to the left than anyone on the R ticket, but much more middle of the road than the radical left had hoped for as well ... More or less, about where he should be in ideology, but need to show better leadership and clarity.

And in a time like now where the debate is so polarized he was sure to disappoint a lot on both extremes.

That said, he has had a steep learning curve with a huge number of very difficult problems on his desk all at once, and has made his share of mistakes, but there certainly was no one on the ticket last time and certainly no one, so far, this time that is even close to as well-balanced ... and now at last as experienced as he has become. Ron Paul is a decent guy but no chance in hell is he electable and I don't view him as a guy that could stand up as a good leader. He is more a principled voice in the debate, but not really a guy I can see who could get much done in the trenches.

Anyone of the uninspiring Republican wannabes who have their hat in the ring now who might in a long shot unseat him is going to have to go through the same rookie term learning curve on the job while likely screwing up far more than Obama has and would in a second term in which Obama likely gathers momentum from his experience so far.

And he has done a number of good things too, dropping Bin Laden's body off the back of a carrier being only one of them, and seems to finally be finding his voice a bit ... time will tell.

Unless he really screws the pooch the next 18 months, odds are high he'll get a second term to show what he has learned. Don't underestimate his skill on the campaign trial when he starts to come out from the cloister of the White House more and gets into the teeth of the campaign.

One thing I fault him for so far was being too locked behind the ivory tower trying to work on all the details and not being an effective enough leader and communicator of what he was trying to do and how he sees things, and thus instead allowing some of the most far-right mouth-breathers to redefine a lot of the dialogue.

My bet is he does better in communication when the campaign heats up and the contrast between him and the folks currently being offered as alternatives will be more starkly underlined for everyone to see. Should be interesting nonetheless...

You fail to consider the prospect that Obama is as left as he can get away with. IMO he is very left, but also not very principled so he was easily drug right as he lost power in Congress.

TonyR
06-24-2011, 06:00 PM
Because Obama has us right back in the same pile of poop.

Oh? He has us in pretty much the same "poop" Bush had us in for 8 years. Same historically low tax rates. How has that worked out? I hate to break it to you but the only possible way out of this mess is massive spending cuts coupled with increased tax revenues. Tax increases aren't the monster the right wing rhetoric you immerse yourself in suggests. See link below, for example.

http://www.thefiscaltimes.com/Columns/2011/06/24/Will-Higher-Taxes-Tank-the-Economy.aspx

Play2win
06-24-2011, 06:07 PM
Cough, cough... Outsourcing...

That One Guy
06-24-2011, 06:39 PM
The thing is, Obama was never a pure lefty. That was clear during his campaign, as much as the far right-wing knuckle-draggers would love to paint him so. Yes, he's more to the left than anyone on the R ticket, but much more middle of the road than the radical left had hoped for as well ... More or less, about where he should be in ideology, but need to show better leadership and clarity.

And in a time like now where the debate is so polarized he was sure to disappoint a lot on both extremes.

That said, he has had a steep learning curve with a huge number of very difficult problems on his desk all at once, and has made his share of mistakes, but there certainly was no one on the ticket last time and certainly no one, so far, this time that is even close to as well-balanced ... and now at last as experienced as he has become. Ron Paul is a decent guy but no chance in hell is he electable and I don't view him as a guy that could stand up as a good leader. He is more a principled voice in the debate, but not really a guy I can see who could get much done in the trenches.

Anyone of the uninspiring Republican wannabes who have their hat in the ring now who might in a long shot unseat him is going to have to go through the same rookie term learning curve on the job while likely screwing up far more than Obama has and would in a second term in which Obama likely gathers momentum from his experience so far.

And he has done a number of good things too, dropping Bin Laden's body off the back of a carrier being only one of them, and seems to finally be finding his voice a bit ... time will tell.

Unless he really screws the pooch the next 18 months, odds are high he'll get a second term to show what he has learned. Don't underestimate his skill on the campaign trial when he starts to come out from the cloister of the White House more and gets into the teeth of the campaign.

One thing I fault him for so far was being too locked behind the ivory tower trying to work on all the details and not being an effective enough leader and communicator of what he was trying to do and how he sees things, and thus instead allowing some of the most far-right mouth-breathers to redefine a lot of the dialogue.

My bet is he does better in communication when the campaign heats up and the contrast between him and the folks currently being offered as alternatives will be more starkly underlined for everyone to see. Should be interesting nonetheless...

When he knew he was losing the house, what did he concern himself with? A budget? Nah... Hmm... Permanently doing away with tax cuts for the rich or corporations? No, that wasn't it... Hmm... what was the most important thing facing us that he had to squeeze through before the majority was lost... hmm... Ah! That's it! Gays in the military! THAT was the thing we absolutely had to focus on before the window closed.

Obama would be so far left, he'd redefine the scale if we let him. Remember, single payer, God save the poor and curse the rich, gays deserve all the rights of everyone else....

pricejj
06-24-2011, 07:45 PM
You know what's hilarious is how two-faced the lefties around here are. They were whining and screaming to pull out of Iraq, Afghanistan and shut down Guantanamo. Now you don't here a peep about it. Look at this thread and others. Not one of these hypocrites will call out Obama for expanding this. I know they don't like it deep down because the lefty sites are ripping him for it.

It's not just Obama. Hillary Clinton and the rest of the Democrats have voted overwhelmingly in favor of every war: Iraq, Afghanistan, and now Libya. What a joke.

pricejj
06-24-2011, 07:49 PM
So you want to destroy the country's credit rating and default on millions of Americans' retirements and savings? That what at stake here.

The top holders of US T-bonds are China, US Pension funds, the FED, Mutual Funds, Banks (for individuals) State and Local Governments.

Balancing the budget would make the dollar INCREDIBLY strong. If we balanced the budget, we wouldn't have to raise the debt ceiling.

Revenue - Expenses = 0

What the federal balance sheet needs to be for our country to be sustainable.

Requiem
06-24-2011, 08:25 PM
You fail to consider the prospect that Obama is as left as he can get away with. IMO he is very left, but also not very principled so he was easily drug right as he lost power in Congress.

Re-think your belief, because you are quite wrong.

Boomhauer
06-24-2011, 08:56 PM
Eat the Terrorism Industrial Complex = DHS, most of State, parts of DoJ/DoD, all US contractors/civilian employees, etc.

Replace gas/diesel/avgas/brewed ethanol with carbon neutral ethanol (via syngas or direct algae), biodiesel and infrastructure.

Close tax loopholes/breaks/refunds/deductions/etc and raise capital gains/dividend taxes as part of a tax code overhaul.

Combine Medicaid/Medicare/VetHealth into one program and Welfare/SocialSecurity/FedPensions into another program.

Consolidate the Government to just Ten Departments that also absorb all major Independent Agencies and Administrations.

Cap total spending/fundraising by individual politicians per year (dependent on local/office) including contributing party/groups.

UltimateHoboW/Shotgun
06-24-2011, 09:11 PM
Polio vaccine anyone? The highway system? National parks? The internet? Just off the top of my head.

Dude do your reseach. Google Polio and the internet and who invented them and nothing about the government comes up. And have you been to a national park. They suck! And you mention the highway system. You know that they were made by private contractors right. But I should except a guy that swollows the stuff that passes as info from the left.

Jetmeck
06-24-2011, 09:19 PM
Oh? He has us in pretty much the same "poop" Bush had us in for 8 years. Same historically low tax rates. How has that worked out? I hate to break it to you but the only possible way out of this mess is massive spending cuts coupled with increased tax revenues. Tax increases aren't the monster the right wing rhetoric you immerse yourself in suggests. See link below, for example.

http://www.thefiscaltimes.com/Columns/2011/06/24/Will-Higher-Taxes-Tank-the-Economy.aspx

Taking away health care has got to be the answer and medicare...surely Obama the devil should spend on something that would increase the wallet size of the rich and corporations WHOSE FREAKIN POCKET HAS BEEN SWELLING SINCE THE EIGHTIES AND THE MIDDLE CLASS HAS BEEN LOSING JOBS AND WAGES AND BUYING POWER EVER SINCE. Things have been lopsided for 30 freakin years so lets keep piling the dough where its needed....on the rich and corporations.

They have plenty already and if they wanted to create jobs they could already, so guess what dumbass rightties they will just pocket any tax breaks you give them like they have been doing. Like big oil for example.....................this isn't right or left.

This is right or wrong and common sense which most so called righties were never taught. Shame on any of you working people voting for this BS..................

Requiem
06-24-2011, 09:37 PM
Eat the Terrorism Industrial Complex = DHS, most of State, parts of DoJ/DoD, all US contractors/civilian employees, etc.

I agree with this, especially the contractors -- but regular government employees are getting the shaft these days. Money being taken out of their pensions to keep the government running. Quite crazy.

serious hops
06-24-2011, 10:51 PM
No choices for legalize marijuana and tax internet porn?

Those are just givens-- no need to vote on them.


We should also make Tebow the next President.

:strong:

elsid13
06-25-2011, 04:19 AM
Balancing the budget would make the dollar INCREDIBLY strong. If we balanced the budget, we wouldn't have to raise the debt ceiling.

Revenue - Expenses = 0

What the federal balance sheet needs to be for our country to be sustainable.

Balancing the budget means paying off the debt not just walking away from it. The reason countries and individuals buy US treasure bonds is because it is the least risk finical options out there, by default on the debt we can downgrade in all the credit markets and T-Bond would become junk bonds. That rating would affect all US federal, state and local governments, it would be near impossible to get anything done if that happens.

Inkana7
06-25-2011, 05:05 AM
1) Dude do your reseach. Google Polio and the internet and who invented them and nothing about the government comes up. 2) And have you been to a national park. They suck! 3) And you mention the highway system. You know that they were made by private contractors right. But I should except a guy that swollows the stuff that passes as info from the left.

1) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polio_vaccine

Soon after Salk's vaccine was licensed in 1955 children's vaccination campaigns were launched. In the U.S, following a mass immunization campaign promoted by the March of Dimes, the annual number of polio cases fell from 35,000 in 1953 to 5,600 by 1957.[27] By 1961 only 161 cases were recorded in the United States.[28]

2) This is easily the worst argument against anything I've ever seen.

3) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal-Aid_Highway_Act_of_1956

You are dumb.

UltimateHoboW/Shotgun
06-25-2011, 08:41 AM
1) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polio_vaccine



2) This is easily the worst argument against anything I've ever seen.

3) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal-Aid_Highway_Act_of_1956

You are dumb.

Nice try. March of Dimes is NOT a government agency. Next, I guess you like thing that suck. Dude read your own link. It say Federal Aid Highway Act. That mean that the government did biuld it themselves. It means the CONTRACTED out. Which is what I SAID!

UltimateHoboW/Shotgun
06-25-2011, 08:43 AM
http://dailycaller.com/2011/06/24/van-jones-building-left-wing-tea-party-says-the-country-isnt-broke/


"The “Rebuild the Dream” website once echoed the same meme. “MoveOn Civic Action & The Other 98% teamed up to keep the message going: We Are Being Lied To,” read the movement’s mission statement on rebuildthedream.com. “The country isn’t broke and the last thing we should be doing is gutting workers’ rights and cutting vital services American families depend on.”


Yeah!

UltimateHoboW/Shotgun
06-25-2011, 08:49 AM
http://www.pjtv.com/s/GM3DINI

bombay
06-25-2011, 10:24 AM
I actually blame reagon for getting us started down this path.


The Father of big government debt.

He was such a scumbag.

Kaylore
06-25-2011, 10:26 AM
Balancing the budget means paying off the debt not just walking away from it. The reason countries and individuals buy US treasure bonds is because it is the least risk finical options out there, by default on the debt we can downgrade in all the credit markets and T-Bond would become junk bonds. That rating would affect all US federal, state and local governments, it would be near impossible to get anything done if that happens.

The Federal budget and the national debt are not the same thing. Debt isn't bad per se. Most of that is owed to ourselves. Balancing the budget is a great start, though. You can balance the budget and still have debt that is working for you.

elsid13
06-25-2011, 10:59 AM
The Federal budget and the national debt are not the same thing. Debt isn't bad per se. Most of that is owed to ourselves. Balancing the budget is a great start, though. You can balance the budget and still have debt that is working for you.

They are linked at the hip. Linked is the graph showing where the funds go.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/special/politics/budget-2010/

He proposed that US default on the debt payment. That means that we stop paying on the Treasure Bonds as the come to value. That is economic suicide. And over 55% of those bonds are held US citizens (directly/via pension funds/via mutual funds,ect), the Fed and state/local governments.

Lolad
06-25-2011, 11:44 AM
You fail to consider the prospect that Obama is as left as he can get away with. IMO he is very left, but also not very principled so he was easily drug right as he lost power in Congress.

Even before repubs controlled the house, he was trying to pass laws that republicans touted as the next best thing. That's when all of a sudden they jumped ship and called it mud.

BroncoInferno
06-25-2011, 12:09 PM
Dude do your reseach. Google Polio and the internet and who invented them and nothing about the government comes up. And have you been to a national park. They suck! And you mention the highway system. You know that they were made by private contractors right. But I should except a guy that swollows the stuff that passes as info from the left.

The discovery of the polio vaccine was the result of government funded research, you dip****. The highway system was payed for with government money. Yes, they hired private contractors to do the work, which created jobs. Sounds good to me. And I visit national parks all the time, as do millions of other people who get enjoyment out of them. Dopes like you complain about everything. But, yeah, you guys are right, the government never, literally NEVER, does ANYTHING that's good Uhh

Play2win
06-25-2011, 12:18 PM
The National Parks... they could be America's best idea...

schaaf
06-25-2011, 12:47 PM
I'm pretty sure this is Bush's problem and will be for the next fifteen years :) hahaha I love that statement

elsid13
06-25-2011, 03:28 PM
The discovery of the polio vaccine was the result of government funded research, you dip****. The highway system was payed for with government money. Yes, they hired private contractors to do the work, which created jobs. Sounds good to me. And I visit national parks all the time, as do millions of other people who get enjoyment out of them. Dopes like you complain about everything. But, yeah, you guys are right, the government never, literally NEVER, does ANYTHING that's good Uhh

People seem to miss the fact that almost 90% of basic R&D is because of US Federal Government grants and programs. They whine and complain about the Federal Government, until something happens and then they need it.

Cito Pelon
06-25-2011, 04:03 PM
Let's see, only 28 years with the Presidency since 1968 is not enough. The GOP can turn this thing around. :wave:

UberBroncoMan
06-25-2011, 05:38 PM
Reduce the size of government. Reduce spending. Reduce government borrowing. Reduce the debt. Strengthen the dollar.

Convert Social Security to an ownership-based, 401(k) type of account. Reap the rewards of a society that behaves like owners instead of just earners.

Inject a culture of choice into the health care system, placing the selection of services in the hands of patients so that a functioning price-setting mechanism can be revived. Do it with a 50 state market for insurance, and unbundling services connected with hospital care. Make it to where we are incentivized to make cost/benefit decisions on our own health care.

Invest in education that is individualized for each student using computer technology, using the power and reach of the internet to deliver a customized curriculum to each student.

I like, but unfortunately that means less power for the fat cats so it won't fly.

Tombstone RJ
06-25-2011, 06:00 PM
Reduce the size of government. Reduce spending. Reduce government borrowing. Reduce the debt. Strengthen the dollar.

Convert Social Security to an ownership-based, 401(k) type of account. Reap the rewards of a society that behaves like owners instead of just earners.

Inject a culture of choice into the health care system, placing the selection of services in the hands of patients so that a functioning price-setting mechanism can be revived. Do it with a 50 state market for insurance, and unbundling services connected with hospital care. Make it to where we are incentivized to make cost/benefit decisions on our own health care.

Invest in education that is individualized for each student using computer technology, using the power and reach of the internet to deliver a customized curriculum to each student.

:strong:

no way the monsters in DC will ever go for this, they likes their job security... no way the colleges and universities will like this, they loves their money... no way the health insurance lobby will let this happen, they needs our diseases...

cutthemdown
06-25-2011, 07:33 PM
Let's see, only 28 years with the Presidency since 1968 is not enough. The GOP can turn this thing around. :wave:

America has been a superpower and kicked ass through most of those years so we were doing something right. Not speaking politically just as Americans. I still think we have a lot to be proud of and won't be giving up the bully pulpit anytime soon.

Cito Pelon
06-26-2011, 07:12 AM
The Federal budget and the national debt are not the same thing. Debt isn't bad per se. Most of that is owed to ourselves. Balancing the budget is a great start, though. You can balance the budget and still have debt that is working for you.

Actually, paying interest on the national debt takes a big chunk of the Federal budget every year.

The GOP and the Dems have to start working together to get the budget balanced and pay down the debt. The country is pretty evenly divided btwn GOP-voting and Dem-voting, one party or the other can't keep trying to lord it over the other one.

elsid13
06-26-2011, 07:51 AM
Actually, paying interest on the national debt takes a big chunk of the Federal budget every year.

The GOP and the Dems have to start working together to get the budget balanced and pay down the debt. The country is pretty evenly divided btwn GOP-voting and Dem-voting, one party or the other can't keep trying to lord it over the other one.

The problem is that both sides are so tied to their own political dogma, that hurting us. Both sides are going to have give something up, but when folks take a hard stance and refuse to move from that position you end up with gridlock.

Cito Pelon
06-26-2011, 08:04 AM
The problem is that both sides are so tied to their own political dogma, that hurting us. Both sides are going to have give something up, but when folks take a hard stance and refuse to move from that position you end up with gridlock.

Yup.

That One Guy
06-26-2011, 08:27 AM
The problem is that both sides are so tied to their own political dogma, that hurting us. Both sides are going to have give something up, but when folks take a hard stance and refuse to move from that position you end up with gridlock.

But, at the same time, I think there's some reality to the Rs position over the Ds right now. The Ds have the White House, the Ds are ultimately the ones maintaining the most power, and the Rs believe the Ds will be held ultimately responsible for the deal not going through. The Rs have a little more leverage in that facet. Ds should've never let it get to this point.

Mr. Elway
06-26-2011, 08:32 AM
Dude do your reseach. Google Polio and the internet and who invented them and nothing about the government comes up. And have you been to a national park. They suck! And you mention the highway system. You know that they were made by private contractors right. But I should except a guy that swollows the stuff that passes as info from the left.

The Internet was most certainly invented by the federal government and by publically funded institutions. You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.

That One Guy
06-26-2011, 08:40 AM
The Internet was most certainly invented by the federal government and by publically funded institutions. You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.

While I completely get the point everyone is going for, the government does help develop a lot of technologies but surely wastes a lot of money on things that never come to fruition as well. To act like they're some wonderful force behind new inventions would be fair if they were private but is kinda misleading when you consider the amount of our money surely wasted.

Cito Pelon
06-26-2011, 08:58 AM
But, at the same time, I think there's some reality to the Rs position over the Ds right now. The Ds have the White House, the Ds are ultimately the ones maintaining the most power, and the Rs believe the Ds will be held ultimately responsible for the deal not going through. The Rs have a little more leverage in that facet. Ds should've never let it get to this point.

Sure, but that's not effective government, that's just playing the blame game to gain power.

Both parties are guilty of trying to paint the other as the bad guy. That's not gonna work. I'm sick and tired of it, and I think a lot of other people are also.

Both parties have stuck their foot into this dog turd, and the turd stinks the same no matter whose foot it's on.

The real turds are these politicians grandstanding, gladhanding, and circle-jerking to gain power. Neither one - Dems or GOP - has all the answers.

They need to start working together, get off of the "I know better than you" crap which we all know is not true for either side. Each party has roughly 50% of the country's support, so they better put their personality conflicts aside to avoid the gridlock Elsid referred to in order to form an effective government.

Mr. Elway
06-26-2011, 09:21 AM
While I completely get the point everyone is going for, the government does help develop a lot of technologies but surely wastes a lot of money on things that never come to fruition as well. To act like they're some wonderful force behind new inventions would be fair if they were private but is kinda misleading when you consider the amount of our money surely wasted.

I don't disagree that they waste a lot of money - as do many private concerns. How much money has gone down the tubes trying to start small businesses or in throwing money after bad business decisions?

The interesting thing about the Internet in this discussion is that if it had somehow been developed by a private enterprise it would never have become the cheap, publically available service that it is (in b4 complaint about Comcast bill). If you accept that, consider then the billions upon billions of dollars of economic vitality that the invention of the Internet has ignited. Companies like Google and Facebook are directly attributable to the web, as are the success of other technology companies like Apple, Microsoft, IBM - and the list goes on. These great American companies are the envy of the technological world. We have the best programmers and the best computer technology in the world. This simply would not have happened had the government not invented the Internet and made it publically available. If you accept that, then think about your average small-govt Republican in the 1970's. How worthwhile would the investment of millions of public dollars into a something obsure and random like a "packet switched communications network" have seemed to someone who had never seen a computer?

It's not a serious argument to say "lol @ the lefties, the government sucks at everything!" Everyone seems to think our military is pretty well-run, though somehow that gets exempted (by many) from that section of the talking points. If you think we need to cut spending - fine, but let's agree it's not so easy to do once you get down to it. Balance the budget? Hey, we all agree. But let's not play this game of "we don't need the government, they don't do anything right," because it's simply not true.

barryr
06-26-2011, 11:45 AM
I don't disagree that they waste a lot of money - as do many private concerns. How much money has gone down the tubes trying to start small businesses or in throwing money after bad business decisions?

The interesting thing about the Internet in this discussion is that if it had somehow been developed by a private enterprise it would never have become the cheap, publically available service that it is (in b4 complaint about Comcast bill). If you accept that, consider then the billions upon billions of dollars of economic vitality that the invention of the Internet has ignited. Companies like Google and Facebook are directly attributable to the web, as are the success of other technology companies like Apple, Microsoft, IBM - and the list goes on. These great American companies are the envy of the technological world. We have the best programmers and the best computer technology in the world. This simply would not have happened had the government not invented the Internet and made it publically available. If you accept that, then think about your average small-govt Republican in the 1970's. How worthwhile would the investment of millions of public dollars into a something obsure and random like a "packet switched communications network" have seemed to someone who had never seen a computer?

It's not a serious argument to say "lol @ the lefties, the government sucks at everything!" Everyone seems to think our military is pretty well-run, though somehow that gets exempted (by many) from that section of the talking points. If you think we need to cut spending - fine, but let's agree it's not so easy to do once you get down to it. Balance the budget? Hey, we all agree. But let's not play this game of "we don't need the government, they don't do anything right," because it's simply not true.

The military is great, as long as you don´t get hurt. The military´s healthcare is not well run. I found that out the hard way. Not being able to walk without pain for over a year and told nothing is wrong and only thing to help me is some pills and to lie down on the floor for a month and hope the disc in my back goes back into place was so much fun. I was not able to walk without pain until well after leaving the military. Thankfully they did not do surgery or who knows the shape I would have been in since I saw results of some sugeries and not good.

That One Guy
06-26-2011, 12:24 PM
Sure, but that's not effective government, that's just playing the blame game to gain power.

Both parties are guilty of trying to paint the other as the bad guy. That's not gonna work. I'm sick and tired of it, and I think a lot of other people are also.

Both parties have stuck their foot into this dog turd, and the turd stinks the same no matter whose foot it's on.

The real turds are these politicians grandstanding, gladhanding, and circle-jerking to gain power. Neither one - Dems or GOP - has all the answers.

They need to start working together, get off of the "I know better than you" crap which we all know is not true for either side. Each party has roughly 50% of the country's support, so they better put their personality conflicts aside to avoid the gridlock Elsid referred to in order to form an effective government.

The question I have, though, comes down to whether it's better to let one side fully implement their scheme or to always insist on a bit of everyone's scheme if we accept that the two are almost opposites.

That One Guy
06-26-2011, 12:35 PM
I don't disagree that they waste a lot of money - as do many private concerns. How much money has gone down the tubes trying to start small businesses or in throwing money after bad business decisions?

The interesting thing about the Internet in this discussion is that if it had somehow been developed by a private enterprise it would never have become the cheap, publically available service that it is (in b4 complaint about Comcast bill). If you accept that, consider then the billions upon billions of dollars of economic vitality that the invention of the Internet has ignited. Companies like Google and Facebook are directly attributable to the web, as are the success of other technology companies like Apple, Microsoft, IBM - and the list goes on. These great American companies are the envy of the technological world. We have the best programmers and the best computer technology in the world. This simply would not have happened had the government not invented the Internet and made it publically available. If you accept that, then think about your average small-govt Republican in the 1970's. How worthwhile would the investment of millions of public dollars into a something obsure and random like a "packet switched communications network" have seemed to someone who had never seen a computer?

It's not a serious argument to say "lol @ the lefties, the government sucks at everything!" Everyone seems to think our military is pretty well-run, though somehow that gets exempted (by many) from that section of the talking points. If you think we need to cut spending - fine, but let's agree it's not so easy to do once you get down to it. Balance the budget? Hey, we all agree. But let's not play this game of "we don't need the government, they don't do anything right," because it's simply not true.

The military, as a whole, is a steaming pile of waste. I don't know how many times I've heard "I have XXX thousands of dollars to spend by tomorrow or I lose it." How many completely incompetent people I've worked with who were just waiting on retirement and wanted to contribute nothing until then. It's a bureaucracy and they always fail. If any other government threw anything close to as much money at their defense forces as we do, we'd actually have to face our failures. Luckily they don't and we don't.

Cito Pelon
06-26-2011, 01:01 PM
The question I have, though, comes down to whether it's better to let one side fully implement their scheme or to always insist on a bit of everyone's scheme if we accept that the two are almost opposites.

Always insist on a bit of everyone's scheme. That's how we move forward. Getting stuck in a rut is a bad thing.

epicSocialism4tw
06-26-2011, 01:06 PM
this country is full of lazy a-holes.

get off your ass and work at mcdonalds until something better comes along.

That's about what a college degree will get you nowadays! Ha!

Vegas_Bronco
06-26-2011, 01:36 PM
Go go china and dismiss our debt...this can be done by one stroke of the presidents pen. At the same time this happens, propose a new budget with significant reductions in federal govt. Privatize fannie and freddie. Increase tarriffs on imported goods whcich will spur industrial production. There will be years of empty stores...but that is going to happen regardless. Do everything we can to shorten the stagflation process. Require citizens of the usa to work even if they are disabled to receive benefits. Campaign finance reform so these idiots quit lying and are forced to face the public withtheir true motives. Keep healthcare the same but allow pas and dns to practice as doctors do increasing competition. Offer incetives to families that stay together and care for the elderly and keep their damn marriage together. Give all unemployed individuals 2.5 acres to farm and produce an acceptable crop...to payoff their debts. This peasantville will quickly lead to public backed reform. Simply making people accountable for the freedom they are taking advantage of will go a long way to getting this country back on track. We must learn that we aren't entitled to a damn thing w/out earning it...and that includes your citizenship. If you hire illegal citizens to increase profit, you go to prison. Run this country like your grandpa would for the next 50 years with a shovel and some grit...it'll be the source of world industry, innovation within 1-2 generations.

L.A. BRONCOS FAN
06-27-2011, 05:35 AM
Start with baby steps........require anyone on welfare or unemployment to pass a drug test.

:stupid:

Right, because if someone is unemployed or on welfare, it can only be because he/she is a druggie.

BTW, programs like welfare only account for a miniscule percentage of government spending. If you really want to make some meaningful cuts, then why don't you go after defense spending, subsidies for big business, etc.

L.A. BRONCOS FAN
06-27-2011, 05:44 AM
Blame Bush. This is their go-to thing. All problems are Bush's fault.


Your problem is one of denial.

You simply can't take an honest look at the true extent of the damage Bush and his junta did during their eight-year crime spree.

In your skewed view of things, all of Bush's failures, frauds, and felonies are the fault of either his predecessor or successor.

L.A. BRONCOS FAN
06-27-2011, 05:48 AM
Roh had a great post on this:
Simple ****, really.

Supply side is a total, abject failure. Time to get over it.

Reinstitute the progressive tax code to its pre-Reagan dimensions.

Capital gains are income and should be taxed much higher than income actually earned by work.

The estate tax is a good thing, like most things, within reason.

Reinstate regulations on banks, credit and investment companies. They are out of control pirates.

Restructure the tax code so that it punishes those who hide assets overseas and profit from overseas investment. Reward those who invest in America and build new businesses that create products in America. Protectionism within moderate limits is not an evil. The first job of government is to serve the general welfare of the people, as it says in the preamble. Selling our souls to the ideology of "free markets" while watching our country go down the toilet is not a good thing. Some globalism is okay. Don't make a religion out of it.

All elections should be publicly funded.

Write an amendment to the Constitution: Corporations are not persons and do not have the rights of persons.

Put everybody on Medicare. Health care costs began to spiral out of control when Kaiser talked Nixon into making the health insurance industry "for profit." Massive error. That is where all the out of control spending started. Get rid of it. If every working person in America who pays for insurance now paid half for Medicare, everybody would be covered. Of course there would have to be restrictions on physicians over-treating the elderly in order to rake in bucks, and fraud would have to be vigorously pursued, but nothing is perfect. Some things are just better than others. If there is any profit to made in health care, let the health care providers (doctors, nurses, hospitals) make it. Not insurance men.

Reduce the military budget by half and bring our troops home. Close the majority of bases around the world. We don't need them and we shouldn't be paying to defend other countries. Let them pay for themselves.

Start using all the money created by the programs above to invest in education, infrastructure and scientific research across a broad spectrum of disciplines.

Simple ****. Really.

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?p=3201662&highlight=tax#post3201662

He nailed it.

That's exactly what needs to happen.

It's how we fixed things the last time the same class of reverse Robin Hood swindlers hosed the economy.

Too bad Obama isn't the sort of man who has the cojones to act.

TonyR
06-27-2011, 07:29 AM
Clearly the solution, as always, is to drink more beer.

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2011/06/20/chug_for_growth#.Tf9Kf-Tk0VI;twitter

...mounting evidence suggests that beer in particular, and the beer industry that surrounds it, may be as good for growth as excess sobriety. In some of the world's toughest investment climates, beer companies today are building factories, creating jobs, and providing vital public services, all in the pursuit of new customers for a pint. It's the brewery as economic stimulus: a formula even a frat boy could love.

chawknz
06-27-2011, 09:06 AM
Go back to 1999 and prevent Bush from destroying it.

oubronco
06-27-2011, 09:12 AM
For the love of God when does football start

TailgateNut
06-27-2011, 09:14 AM
this country is full of lazy a-holes.

get off your ass and work at mcdonalds until something better comes along.

are you going to send all the illegals home?

TailgateNut
06-27-2011, 09:20 AM
5 step plan to instant economic turnaround:

1. DO NOT raise the debt ceiling
2. End the wars
3. Repeal Obamacare
4. BALANCE THE BUDGET (drastically reduce deficit spending).
5. Lower the Corporate tax rate from 35% to 25%, close the loopholes (make it even lower depending on how many jobs you want to come flooding back).

Of course this will require Ron Paul to be president, 2/3 House Republicans, and 51 Senate Republicans (with Tea Party leadership).


LOL

Garcia Bronco
06-27-2011, 09:30 AM
Go back to 1999 and prevent Bush from destroying it.

Bush didn't destroy the economy...that's dog****. It would be more accurate to say congress ****ed up the economy and it didn't happen in the oughts. But that's in the past and like in golf...you can only worry about your next stroke...no tthe one you just made. Obama and the Democrats are not helping things because their ideas create to much uncertainty in the market(aka business). Business can't make proper business asumptions because of this uncertainty.

Meck77
06-27-2011, 09:34 AM
Convert all the man hours wasted on the internet discussing politics into actual productivity. This would never happen though. Too man people love to blame others for their own personal problems. That's all they really are.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
06-27-2011, 09:35 AM
Bush didn't destroy the economy...that's dog****. It would be more accurate to say congress ****ed up the economy and it didn't happen in the oughts. But that's in the past and like in golf...you can only worry about your next stroke...no tthe one you just made. Obama and the Democrats are not helping things because their ideas create to much uncertainty in the market(aka business). Business can't make proper business asumptions because of this uncertainty.

What an absolute load of dog****.

Business has been given more tax breaks, more credits, more opportunities to create jobs than ever before. And what are they doing? Nothing.

Uncertainty. That's ****ing retarded.

Tombstone RJ
06-27-2011, 09:36 AM
Convert all the man hours wasted on the internet discussing politics into actual productivity. This would never happen though. Too man people love to blame others for their own personal problems. That's all they really are.

so you're telling me I need to get back to work? Damnit! :D

alkemical
06-27-2011, 09:43 AM
Convert all the man hours wasted on the internet discussing politics into actual productivity. This would never happen though. Too man people love to blame others for their own personal problems. That's all they really are.

Well.....

Productivity has been rising at a great rate here in the US labor market. Yet, pay has gone down or stayed stagnant. So, where's the incentive?

Garcia Bronco
06-27-2011, 09:43 AM
What an absolute load of dog****.

Business has been given more tax breaks, more credits, more opportunities to create jobs than ever before. And what are they doing? Nothing.

Uncertainty. That's ****ing retarded.

I don't agree to that, but....

It doesn't matter...if the business owner(s)/administrators feel uncertain about their economic future then that will change the way they do business. It'll change compensation and hiring practices and as well as new business growth and innovation around those efforts.

alkemical
06-27-2011, 09:45 AM
this country is full of lazy a-holes.

get off your ass and work at mcdonalds until something better comes along.

I will not deny there's some lazy MF'ers around. No doubt, at the same time though - it seems the only jobs around are McD's.

I did it though, I took a $10/hr job when needed - sucks balls. I would have made $800/mo more on unemp - but I had something to prove in sales. (personal motivation).

DenverBrit
06-27-2011, 09:48 AM
Sure, but that's not effective government, that's just playing the blame game to gain power.

Both parties are guilty of trying to paint the other as the bad guy. That's not gonna work. I'm sick and tired of it, and I think a lot of other people are also.

Both parties have stuck their foot into this dog turd, and the turd stinks the same no matter whose foot it's on.

The real turds are these politicians grandstanding, gladhanding, and circle-jerking to gain power. Neither one - Dems or GOP - has all the answers.

They need to start working together, get off of the "I know better than you" crap which we all know is not true for either side. Each party has roughly 50% of the country's support, so they better put their personality conflicts aside to avoid the gridlock Elsid referred to in order to form an effective government.

+1

TheElusiveKyleOrton
06-27-2011, 10:07 AM
I don't agree to that, but....

It doesn't matter...if the business owner(s)/administrators feel uncertain about their economic future then that will change the way they do business. It'll change compensation and hiring practices and as well as new business growth and innovation around those efforts.

Okay, Garcia. Differing opinions are always welcome.

That said, what is it that would make business owners/administrators "feel certain" about the economic future enough to change the way they do business? What's it going to take?

And as a follow up, what could Obama do -- being serious here, so try to leave the sarcasm and the petty politics out of it -- to make business owners feel certain about the economic future of the country?

That One Guy
06-27-2011, 11:33 AM
I currently have about a year and a half's income in savings. I REALLY want a boat. Until I have an idea what the future holds though, I can't buy a boat. If things go harder down the drain, I might need that savings to support myself on. It's the same logic that kept me, ultimately, from buying a house.

Gotta have confidence in the economy to worry about anything beyond staying afloat. I envision businesses holding a similar theory.

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 11:44 AM
I currently have about a year and a half's income in savings. I REALLY want a boat. Until I have an idea what the future holds though, I can't buy a boat. If things go harder down the drain, I might need that savings to support myself on. It's the same logic that kept me, ultimately, from buying a house.

Gotta have confidence in the economy to worry about anything beyond staying afloat. I envision businesses holding a similar theory.

You should give the money to your local union and ask for a return on it when Obama kicks the next bailout cash their way.

pricejj
06-27-2011, 12:36 PM
I will not deny there's some lazy MF'ers around. No doubt, at the same time though - it seems the only jobs around are McD's.


About 85% of the employees working at the McDonald's in my neighborhood are illegal immigrants. The management knows about it and hides it. Meanwhile, American teenagers can't find work.

pricejj
06-27-2011, 12:39 PM
And as a follow up, what could Obama do -- being serious here, so try to leave the sarcasm and the petty politics out of it -- to make business owners feel certain about the economic future of the country?

1. Get rid of Obamacare
2. Stop threatening to raise taxes

TheElusiveKyleOrton
06-27-2011, 12:41 PM
1. Get rid of Obamacare
2. Stop threatening to raise taxes

1. Most of Obamacare hasn't been enacted yet. FAIL.

2. Obama has LOWERED taxes. Look it up.

Say, where are all those jobs the GOP promised when they were running for office in 2010? They said Obama was managing the economy wrong, said they were running on "jobs, jobs, jobs," and yet... nothing. No job legislation whatsoever.

That One Guy
06-27-2011, 12:57 PM
1. Most of Obamacare hasn't been enacted yet. FAIL.

2. Obama has LOWERED taxes. Look it up.

Say, where are all those jobs the GOP promised when they were running for office in 2010? They said Obama was managing the economy wrong, said they were running on "jobs, jobs, jobs," and yet... nothing. No job legislation whatsoever.

A lot of those that won were the small government types. How exactly would you expect them to "legislate" jobs?

Meanwhile, they think lower taxes will help. What is it that's holding up a new debt ceiling? They're adamant refusal of any new taxes.

Whether they're accurate or not in their beliefs, they're hardly at fault for not magically creating jobs. The problem right now is the gridlock in DC.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
06-27-2011, 01:02 PM
A lot of those that won were the small government types. How exactly would you expect them to "legislate" jobs?

Meanwhile, they think lower taxes will help. What is it that's holding up a new debt ceiling? They're adamant refusal of any new taxes.

Whether they're accurate or not in their beliefs, they're hardly at fault for not magically creating jobs. The problem right now is the gridlock in DC.

When you run on a platform of "we're going to create jobs," shouldn't you have a plan for how you're going to create those jobs?

Oh, right. The important part was just to take office. The country can actually go **** itself. It is, after all, the Republican way.

We still have the lowest tax burden we've had in DECADES... but taxes are completely off the table? While we're trying to lower the deficit?

How can anyone defend that **** policy?

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 01:18 PM
A lot of those that won were the small government types. How exactly would you expect them to "legislate" jobs?

Meanwhile, they think lower taxes will help. What is it that's holding up a new debt ceiling? They're adamant refusal of any new taxes.

Whether they're accurate or not in their beliefs, they're hardly at fault for not magically creating jobs. The problem right now is the gridlock in DC.

The dems have never passed a budget on their own with Obama in office...and we wonder why people are holding back investment.

If the economy is an issue for any voter, they would be extremely poorly served by investing their vote in a democrat, who it should be clear do not care about the economy as much as they care about taxing carbon.

Garcia Bronco
06-27-2011, 01:35 PM
Okay, Garcia. Differing opinions are always welcome.

That said, what is it that would make business owners/administrators "feel certain" about the economic future enough to change the way they do business? What's it going to take?

And as a follow up, what could Obama do -- being serious here, so try to leave the sarcasm and the petty politics out of it -- to make business owners feel certain about the economic future of the country?

When you own or run a business you must make a business plan and in this plan are going to be your assumptions. If you think taxes are going to go up(this is just an example) then in your assumptions you are going to plan for that...usually by saving cash flow. There is little government or anyone can do to mitigate that.

In all honesty there is little the President can do except to appear very business friendly. Whihc he is starting to do. Congress on the other hand can do a great deal...first and foremost by cutting spending and not raising taxes.

pricejj
06-27-2011, 02:08 PM
1. Most of Obamacare hasn't been enacted yet. FAIL.
2. Obama has LOWERED taxes. Look it up.

Say, where are all those jobs the GOP promised when they were running for office in 2010? They said Obama was managing the economy wrong, said they were running on "jobs, jobs, jobs," and yet... nothing. No job legislation whatsoever.

1. The pending individual mandate set to be inacted in 2013 is keeping employers from hiring.
2. While Dems controlled the entire government (which wasn't short enough), they kept threatening to raise taxes for ALL taxpayers, but never did for fear of the voter backlash.

There has been plenty of pro-job legislation that has come out of the House (Obamacare Repeal, the Ryan Plan, etc.), but it has all been shot down by the Democrat-controlled Senate and the President.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
06-27-2011, 02:11 PM
1. The pending individual mandate set to be inacted in 2013 is keeping employers from hiring.
2. While Dems controlled the entire government (which wasn't short enough), they kept threatening to raise taxes for ALL taxpayers, but never did for fear of the voter backlash.

There has been plenty of pro-job legislation that has come out of the House (Obamacare Repeal, the Ryan Plan, etc.), but it has all been shot down by the Democrat-controlled Senate and the President.

You do know that the Ryan plan cuts 700,000 jobs, yes?

Mountain Bronco
06-27-2011, 02:14 PM
You start taxing me more and I am buying less, ****ing simple really. Pre-Regan tax rates, are you kidding me?

Wealth envy seems like it is as big of a problem as the economy.

I don't think there are any quick fixes, but grind it out for the next 10 years until this country is stablized. We were way out of hand with salaries, housing, stock values debt etc... and it needs time to stablize and we will all pay the price during that stabalization period.

Inkana7
06-27-2011, 02:18 PM
Taxes are the lowest they've been since the '50s.

pricejj
06-27-2011, 02:44 PM
Sadly, the best thing this administration can do to create jobs is to get out of office as soon as possible, while creating as small amount of damage as possible (no QE3, no more bailouts, no new taxes, DRASTICALLY reduce spending anywhere possible).

How to right the ship:

1. Republican President (I would prefer Ron Paul, but Michele Bachmann is probably the best we can get, considering the inability of most Americans to comprehend the direness of the situation).
2. Republican majority Senate
3. 2/3 Republican House with Tea Party leadership

If ALL of those things happen, the U.S. economy will turn around. If not, be prepared for more of the same, or worse.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
06-27-2011, 02:52 PM
Sadly, the best thing this administration can do to create jobs is to get out of office as soon as possible, while creating as small amount of damage as possible (no QE3, no more bailouts, no new taxes, DRASTICALLY reduce spending anywhere possible).

How to right the ship:

1. Republican President (I would prefer Ron Paul, but Michele Bachmann is probably the best we can get, considering the inability of most Americans to comprehend the direness of the situation).
2. Republican majority Senate
3. 2/3 Republican House with Tea Party leadership

If ALL of those things happen, the U.S. economy will turn around. If not, be prepared for more of the same, or worse.

What's the weather like in ImaginationLand today? Is it sunny?

What you set out to "right the ship" would do irreversible damage to this country.

That One Guy
06-27-2011, 02:53 PM
Sadly, the best thing this administration can do to create jobs is to get out of office as soon as possible, while creating as small amount of damage as possible (no QE3, no more bailouts, no new taxes, DRASTICALLY reduce spending anywhere possible).

How to right the ship:

1. Republican President (I would prefer Ron Paul, but Michele Bachmann is probably the best we can get, considering the inability of most Americans to comprehend the direness of the situation).
2. Republican majority Senate
3. 2/3 Republican House with Tea Party leadership

If ALL of those things happen, the U.S. economy will turn around. If not, be prepared for more of the same, or worse.

Never underestimate the power of a politician to take advantage of a situation. You think they'd ever TRULY stick to their guns and do any major spending cuts?

Newsflash : In today's America, funneling money to the voters gets you elected. That's all it takes and all they're concerned with. It's nice to see you with such confidence though, maybe I'm a cynic.

That One Guy
06-27-2011, 02:54 PM
What's the weather like in ImaginationLand today? Is it sunny?

What you set out to "right the ship" would do irreversible damage to this country.

Irreversible? No such thing. We're headed downhill as is so the option are keep doing what we're doing, fix it, or just speed up the process. Fix it is the only one that takes us anywhere other than where we're already headed.

pricejj
06-27-2011, 02:54 PM
You do know that the Ryan plan cuts 700,000 jobs, yes?

From which government agency? Government spending NEEDS to be drastically reduced. This countries debt is exponentially increasing.

I know you probably want increased corporate and individual income tax rates to gain more revenue to pay for all the various social programs, but the U.S. already has the highest corporate income tax rate (35%) in the world.

How can we compete? The fact is, this is a MUCH more competitive global economy than any that has ever existed before. American companies can just pick up and go anywhere to decrease costs. If we are to bring back jobs to the U.S. we NEED to make the cost of doing business here competitive globally.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
06-27-2011, 02:59 PM
From which government agency? Government spending NEEDS to be drastically reduced. This countries debt is exponentially increasing.

I know you probably want increased corporate and individual income tax rates to gain more revenue to pay for all the various social programs, but the U.S. already has the highest corporate income tax rate (35%) in the world.

How can we compete? The fact is, this is a MUCH more competitive global economy than any that has ever existed before. American companies can just pick up and go anywhere to decrease costs. If we are to bring back jobs to the U.S. we NEED to make the cost of doing business here competitive globally.

Nobody is arguing that spending doesn't need to be reduced. it does. From ALL sides of government.

How about we start with the military? If we cut our defense budget in half, we'd STILL spend more money than every country in the world combined minus TWO... and our spending would STILL double up on those two countries' spending. It is absurd.

There are plenty of cuts to be made. There's also some tax loopholes that could be closed, you know, to actually collect that 35% tax revenue figure that you like to trot out in every argument. What good is a tax rate that collects no money?

Michele Bachmann is a Christian extremist. She's the Christian equivalent of the Muslim extremists that you so despise... and you want her running our government. Incredibly ****ing stupid.

How smart is it to have people who hate government running the government anyway? That must be the dumbest ****ing idea anyone has ever come up with.

Play2win
06-27-2011, 03:01 PM
Well.....

Productivity has been rising at a great rate here in the US labor market. Yet, pay has gone down or stayed stagnant. So, where's the incentive?

This economy is the punchline to all the "worker productivity" talk that went on over the previous decade.

pricejj
06-27-2011, 03:03 PM
Fortunately, all is not lost. Realistically we could reduce the corporate income tax rate (and close the loopholes) to compete with any country in the world.

However, federal deficit spending needs to be eliminated.. Europe is in a much worse situation, as most of their government spending is institutionalized, and the debt has become too large in many countries.

That One Guy
06-27-2011, 03:05 PM
Nobody is arguing that spending doesn't need to be reduced. it does. From ALL sides of government.

How about we start with the military? If we cut our defense budget in half, we'd STILL spend more money than every country in the world combined minus TWO... and our spending would STILL double up on those two countries' spending. It is absurd.

There are plenty of cuts to be made. There's also some tax loopholes that could be closed, you know, to actually collect that 35% tax revenue figure that you like to trot out in every argument. What good is a tax rate that collects no money?

Michele Bachmann is a Christian extremist. She's the Christian equivalent of the Muslim extremists that you so despise... and you want her running our government. Incredibly ****ing stupid.

How smart is it to have people who hate government running the government anyway? That must be the dumbest ****ing idea anyone has ever come up with.

I can agree with all the bolded. Got anyone in mind who would enact that as president?

That One Guy
06-27-2011, 03:06 PM
Fortunately, all is not lost. Realistically we could reduce the corporate income tax rate (and close the loopholes) to compete with any country in the world.

However, federal deficit spending needs to be eliminated.. Europe is in a much worse situation, as most of their government spending is institutionalized, and the debt has become too large in many countries.

It can be salvaged but it's gonna be a very bumpy road to get there. We gotta leave the smooth pavement and take some dirt roads to get where we need to be.

I wanna go fishin...

Garcia Bronco
06-27-2011, 03:20 PM
Taxes are the lowest they've been since the '50s.

That's the problem with the loophole tax system. Close the right loop holes and we can get revenue back up without raising the rate. Cut defense and health and human services spending as well.

pricejj
06-27-2011, 03:21 PM
Nobody is arguing that spending doesn't need to be reduced. it does. From ALL sides of government.

How about we start with the military? If we cut our defense budget in half, we'd STILL spend more money than every country in the world combined minus TWO... and our spending would STILL double up on those two countries' spending. It is absurd.

There are plenty of cuts to be made. There's also some tax loopholes that could be closed, you know, to actually collect that 35% tax revenue figure that you like to trot out in every argument. What good is a tax rate that collects no money?

Michele Bachmann is a Christian extremist. She's the Christian equivalent of the Muslim extremists that you so despise... and you want her running our government. Incredibly ****ing stupid.

How smart is it to have people who hate government running the government anyway? That must be the dumbest ****ing idea anyone has ever come up with.

1. I am a muslim.
2. I don't hate government. I believe government has specific functions, that is to create an environment for a free market economy to exist, provide for basic infrastructure, defense, etc. Although the U.S. Constitution is not a perfect document, I am a firm believer in it.
3. Michele Bachmann is a Christian. Christian, is not by definition, extremist.
4. I love charity, as do most American's. However, government intervention into free markets (i.e. healthcare) spirals the costs out of control for everyone.
5. Democrats were voted into office, beginning in 2006. They even achieved super-majority. The wars have escalated and military spending has increased. I have never voted for anyone who I thought would kill innocent people, and I never will. I didn't vote for Obama or Bush.
6. If Ron Paul were voted in, ALL government programs (including military) would be cut.

pricejj
06-27-2011, 03:30 PM
I can agree with all the bolded. Got anyone in mind who would enact that as president?

Ron Paul definitely, maybe Michele Bachmann...

What Democrat's don't understand, is that Paul Ryan's plan actually reduces military spending. He calls for a military spending level at 20% of the federal budget. If this year's federal budget were approximately $2T (to keep in line with $2T in income tax revenues), that would mean a $400b military budget, which would basically cut military expenses in half.

pricejj
06-27-2011, 03:31 PM
I am telling you, the pieces are out there to fix this...

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 03:34 PM
Ron Paul definitely, maybe Michele Bachmann...

What Democrat's don't understand, is that Paul Ryan's plan actually reduces military spending. He calls for a cap on military spending at 20% of the federal budget. If this year's federal budget were approximately $2T (to keep in line with $2T in income tax revenues), that would mean a $400b military budget, which would basically cut military expenses in half.

Some people are so wrapped up in the dem diversion talking points (tea party are crazy racists, ron paul is crazy, bachmann is crazy, everyone is crazy except for who the DNC labels as sane) that they can't see through those emotive diversions to vote in their own best interest. The DNC has convinced alot of people that the only important thing is to be on the "cool" team, and that voting democrat puts you on the "cool" team. People need to wake up and realize that being subjugated to bureaucratic overlords isn't cool at all. People need to shed those parasites and live freely.

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 03:36 PM
I am telling you, the pieces are out there to fix this...

Yes, but will people vote in their own best interest?

We're closer to that than ever, and that's why the populist movements are being shouted down from all the megaphones that the big government bureaucrats can muster.

BroncoMan4ever
06-27-2011, 03:45 PM
reduce spending on public assistance programs. cases like welfare, medicaid, disability benefits, food stamps all need to be better regulated or gotten rid of completely.

medicaid needs to have limits. i did IT work in a hospital and these people on medicaid with basically completely free health care, go to the emergency room for everything. stomach aches, ingrown nail, headaches. by limiting what these people can get you would save a ton of money. there was a statistic in the paper that said 1% of the people on this form of health care are responsible for a third of all the spending on medicaid. by limiting the number of visits to hospitals on these people you cut out the needless visits and save money.

disability benefits need to be reformed. if you are truly physically or mentally handicapped, i have no problem with you receiving benefits. but if you are for all intents and purposes healthy you shouldn't get a single cent. being fat, is not a disability that should be covered, high choloesterol should not be covered, heart disease should not be covered. things that for the most part an individual is responsible for doing to themselves should not be eligible for disability benefits.

food stamps need to be changed completely. i remember while in college working at wal mart seeing these customers on food stamps coming through the checkout with good steaks, expensive name brand items, fresh seafood. while i worked my ass off, but remained broke due to bills and lived off of Raman noodles and uncle ben's rice. there is an assistance programs called WIC, which is for Women, Infants and Children. this program pays for single unemployed or under employed mothers to get the bare essentials to support themselves and their family. they are allowed eggs, generic cheese, generic corn flakes, baby formula, generic canned fruits and vegetables, and milk. just the bare minimum absolutely necessary items for survival, is what this program gives. that is how it should be on Food Stamps as well. hell you can take food stamps to 7-11 and get a slurpee and nachos. limit what you can buy on food stamps and you can cut a large portion of the money you give for food stamps.

america needs to stop coddling the weak.

drug laws should be altered. we are imprisoning small time offenders at a cost of something around 20,000 a year. 70% of the american prison occupants are incarcerated for drug violations. by changing the laws to stop imprisoning people who break drug laws you save a lot of money as well as help out prisons which are overpopulated anyway. only serious offenders should be imprisoned. trafficers that are illegally bringing in mass quantities into the country should be imprisoned, manufacturers and distributors of hard narcotics should be imprisoned, but small time dealers, or dealers working with things like weed, should get fined and go the **** home.

BroncoMan4ever
06-27-2011, 03:59 PM
Ron Paul definitely, maybe Michele Bachmann...

What Democrat's don't understand, is that Paul Ryan's plan actually reduces military spending. He calls for a military spending level at 20% of the federal budget. If this year's federal budget were approximately $2T (to keep in line with $2T in income tax revenues), that would mean a $400b military budget, which would basically cut military expenses in half.

funny thing about our military spending is that the USA actually spends more on its defense budget alone than every other country in the world spends on its entire budget. our defense budget is actually higher than every other nation in the world combined.

with a budget like that, i still can't understand how our troops are under equipped?

DarkHorse30
06-27-2011, 04:06 PM
1. I am a muslim.
2. I don't hate government. I believe government has specific functions, that is to create an environment for a free market economy to exist, provide for basic infrastructure, defense, etc. Although the U.S. Constitution is not a perfect document, I am a firm believer in it.
3. Michele Bachmann is a Christian. Christian, is not by definition, extremist.
4. I love charity, as do most American's. However, government intervention into free markets (i.e. healthcare) spirals the costs out of control for everyone.
5. Democrats were voted into office, beginning in 2006. They even achieved super-majority. The wars have escalated and military spending has increased. I have never voted for anyone who I thought would kill innocent people, and I never will. I didn't vote for Obama or Bush.
6. If Ron Paul were voted in, ALL government programs (including military) would be cut.

Great post. The dems have already taken credit for our horrible economy (Wasserman says "the dems own it"), but they have no clue how to do anything but try to snow people into voting for them.

So far Obama has done nothing but make the economy worse. Any republican (except a non-starter like McCain or Huntsman) would annihilate him in a race. I can't wait for the Republicans to duke it out and come up with our next president.

BroncoMan4ever
06-27-2011, 04:28 PM
Great post. The dems have already taken credit for our horrible economy (Wasserman says "the dems own it"), but they have no clue how to do anything but try to snow people into voting for them.

So far Obama has done nothing but make the economy worse. Any republican (except a non-starter like McCain or Huntsman) would annihilate him in a race. I can't wait for the Republicans to duke it out and come up with our next president.

i agree, but Palin and Bachmann scare the **** out of me.

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 04:29 PM
i agree, but Palin and Bachmann scare the **** out of me.

:D

Afraid of women?

cutthemdown
06-27-2011, 04:36 PM
Nobody is arguing that spending doesn't need to be reduced. it does. From ALL sides of government.

How about we start with the military? If we cut our defense budget in half, we'd STILL spend more money than every country in the world combined minus TWO... and our spending would STILL double up on those two countries' spending. It is absurd.

There are plenty of cuts to be made. There's also some tax loopholes that could be closed, you know, to actually collect that 35% tax revenue figure that you like to trot out in every argument. What good is a tax rate that collects no money?

Michele Bachmann is a Christian extremist. She's the Christian equivalent of the Muslim extremists that you so despise... and you want her running our government. Incredibly ****ing stupid.

How smart is it to have people who hate government running the government anyway? That must be the dumbest ****ing idea anyone has ever come up with.

To do that we would have to cut the troop levels so low we wouldn't be able to police our empire. How does that improve our economy?

That One Guy
06-27-2011, 04:40 PM
Ron Paul definitely, maybe Michele Bachmann...


I don't know much about Bachmann. Ron Paul is the hypothetical that seems to fit the bill.

I was just curious to see what he thinks. Honest curiosity.

BroncoMan4ever
06-27-2011, 04:43 PM
:D

Afraid of women?

i love women, but Palin makes Bush look like a Rhodes Scholar. i would actually feel more comfortable with the chick that does the Palin porn movies in office than i would the actual Palin.

Bachmann on the other hand, is so bold and out there, that i have my doubts that she'd be able to follow through on anything she says. sort of the same as Obama in a way with the big talk, but i worry the big talk will turn into nothing like it has under Obama. my reasoning against Bachmann is also why i am not big on Ron Paul.

Gingrich is another republican i am against.

Cito Pelon
06-27-2011, 04:45 PM
Taxes are the lowest they've been since the '50s.

This got my attention.

Cito Pelon
06-27-2011, 04:50 PM
Taxes are the lowest they've been since the '50s.

This got my attention.

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 05:04 PM
i love women, but Palin makes Bush look like a Rhodes Scholar. i would actually feel more comfortable with the chick that does the Palin porn movies in office than i would the actual Palin.

Bachmann on the other hand, is so bold and out there, that i have my doubts that she'd be able to follow through on anything she says. sort of the same as Obama in a way with the big talk, but i worry the big talk will turn into nothing like it has under Obama. my reasoning against Bachmann is also why i am not big on Ron Paul.

Gingrich is another republican i am against.

Gingrich sucks. Smart guy to a degree, but he's an establishment guy that wants things to stay as they are.

TonyR
06-27-2011, 05:44 PM
...Michele Bachmann is probably the best we can get...

LOL I will now light myself on fire.

Archer81
06-27-2011, 06:15 PM
Kind of surprised this thread is still on the main forum...

Anyhoo...I'm happy Bachmann announced. It makes the field more interesting. Now we will see who survives the bloodsport that is the primary. And then whoever wins that better be able to challenge Obama on his record.

Make it interesting, GOP.

:Broncos:

That One Guy
06-27-2011, 06:22 PM
Kind of surprised this thread is still on the main forum...

Anyhoo...I'm happy Bachmann announced. It makes the field more interesting. Now we will see who survives the bloodsport that is the primary. And then whoever wins that better be able to challenge Obama on his record.

Make it interesting, GOP.

:Broncos:

I wonder if this is the time people actually start avoiding the mud-slinging in the primary to save the candidate for the general election. It's been something that's baffled me for quite some time and from the way people spoke of the first debate, seems they're making it peaceful.

Archer81
06-27-2011, 06:25 PM
I wonder if this is the time people actually start avoiding the mud-slinging in the primary to save the candidate for the general election. It's been something that's baffled me for quite some time and from the way people spoke of the first debate, seems they're making it peaceful.


The democrat primary in 2008 was pretty brutal. Funny how party members who know each other personally can cut eachother up that much. Scary thought: they have done worse things (GOP and Dem) that we never hear about.


:Broncos:

TonyR
06-27-2011, 07:24 PM
BACHMANN: "It's ironic and sad that the president released all of the oil from the strategic oil reserve. ... There's only a limited amount of oil that we have in the strategic oil reserve. It's there for emergencies." — On CBS' "Face the Nation" on Sunday.

THE FACTS: Obama did not empty all the oil from the strategic reserve, as Bachmann said. He approved the release of 30 million barrels, about 4 percent of the 727 million barrels stored in salt caverns along the Texas and Louisiana coasts. It's true that the U.S. normally taps the reserve for more dire emergencies than exist today, and that exposes Obama to criticism that he acted for political gain. But the reserve has never been fuller; it held 707 million barrels when last tapped, after 2008 hurricanes.

___

BACHMANN: "One. That's the number of new drilling permits under the Obama administration since they came into office." — Comment to a conservative conference in Iowa in March.

THE FACTS: The Obama administration issued more than 200 new drilling permits before the Gulf oil spill alone. Over the past year, since new safety standards were imposed, the administration has issued more than 60 shallow-water drilling permits. Since the deep water moratorium was lifted in October, nine new wells have been approved.

http://old.news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110627/ap_on_el_ge/us_bachmann_fact_check

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 07:25 PM
How to fix Obama's crappy economy...

Vote someone else in to do the job. We can't afford more of his failure.

UltimateHoboW/Shotgun
06-27-2011, 07:26 PM
The ham sandwich did a better job.

TonyR
06-27-2011, 07:33 PM
Most analysts say economic growth will perk up in the second half of the year. The reason is that the main causes of the slowdown -- high oil prices and manufacturing delays because of the disaster in Japan -- have started to fade.

"Some of the headwinds that caused us to slow are turning into tail winds," said Mark Zandi, chief economist at Moody's Analytics.

For an economy barely inching ahead two years after the Great Recession ended, the first half of 2011 can't end soon enough. Severe storms and rising gasoline prices held growth in January, February and March to a glacial annual rate of 1.9 percent.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Why-economists-see-a-stronger-apf-3447087896.html?x=0&sec=topStories&pos=main&asset=&ccode=

That One Guy
06-27-2011, 07:34 PM
BACHMANN: "It's ironic and sad that the president released all of the oil from the strategic oil reserve. ... There's only a limited amount of oil that we have in the strategic oil reserve. It's there for emergencies." — On CBS' "Face the Nation" on Sunday.

THE FACTS: Obama did not empty all the oil from the strategic reserve, as Bachmann said. He approved the release of 30 million barrels, about 4 percent of the 727 million barrels stored in salt caverns along the Texas and Louisiana coasts. It's true that the U.S. normally taps the reserve for more dire emergencies than exist today, and that exposes Obama to criticism that he acted for political gain. But the reserve has never been fuller; it held 707 million barrels when last tapped, after 2008 hurricanes.

___

BACHMANN: "One. That's the number of new drilling permits under the Obama administration since they came into office." — Comment to a conservative conference in Iowa in March.

THE FACTS: The Obama administration issued more than 200 new drilling permits before the Gulf oil spill alone. Over the past year, since new safety standards were imposed, the administration has issued more than 60 shallow-water drilling permits. Since the deep water moratorium was lifted in October, nine new wells have been approved.

http://old.news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110627/ap_on_el_ge/us_bachmann_fact_check

That's sad. Both that they can't get their facts straight and that the campaign seems to have to ride on the back of someone else's failures.

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 07:34 PM
The ham sandwich did a better job.

If we just hired Obama's teleprompter, we'd probably get better results.

Rigs11
06-27-2011, 07:35 PM
BACHMANN: "It's ironic and sad that the president released all of the oil from the strategic oil reserve. ... There's only a limited amount of oil that we have in the strategic oil reserve. It's there for emergencies." — On CBS' "Face the Nation" on Sunday.

THE FACTS: Obama did not empty all the oil from the strategic reserve, as Bachmann said. He approved the release of 30 million barrels, about 4 percent of the 727 million barrels stored in salt caverns along the Texas and Louisiana coasts. It's true that the U.S. normally taps the reserve for more dire emergencies than exist today, and that exposes Obama to criticism that he acted for political gain. But the reserve has never been fuller; it held 707 million barrels when last tapped, after 2008 hurricanes.

___

BACHMANN: "One. That's the number of new drilling permits under the Obama administration since they came into office." — Comment to a conservative conference in Iowa in March.

THE FACTS: The Obama administration issued more than 200 new drilling permits before the Gulf oil spill alone. Over the past year, since new safety standards were imposed, the administration has issued more than 60 shallow-water drilling permits. Since the deep water moratorium was lifted in October, nine new wells have been approved.

http://old.news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110627/ap_on_el_ge/us_bachmann_fact_check
Good gawd this woman is dense.can't believe there are yahoos that will actually admit that they will vote for her.the GOP is really in disarray.there i go being sexist again...

UltimateHoboW/Shotgun
06-27-2011, 07:43 PM
If we just hired Obama's teleprompter, we'd probably get better results.

I love how everybody forgot about the "dot com" bubble, 9/11, and the Clinton ression.

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 08:02 PM
there i go being sexist again...

What's new?

DarkHorse30
06-27-2011, 08:51 PM
LOL I will now light myself on fire.

....and you were happy with Hillary? Do you mind getting real for just one or two minutes?

DarkHorse30
06-27-2011, 08:56 PM
Good gawd this woman is dense.can't believe there are yahoos that will actually admit that they will vote for her.the GOP is really in disarray.there i go being sexist again...

And Joe Biden is the example of somebody that is "smart enough" to be president?

You lefties are stupid enough to vote for 57 and dumbo......and then criticize anybody on the right. It's laughable and predictable.

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 09:01 PM
And Joe Biden is the example of somebody that is "smart enough" to be president?

You lefties are stupid enough to vote for 57 and dumbo......and then criticize anybody on the right. It's laughable and predictable.

Obama sending DVD's to England was the biggest gaffe a president could ever make.

Why doesnt he just send some pulled pork sandwiches to the Saudis?

DenverBrit
06-27-2011, 09:39 PM
LOL Still beating that dead horse.



Now this WAS embarrassing!!
http://thegrandnarrative.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/bush-sexual-harassment.jpg

L.A. BRONCOS FAN
06-27-2011, 10:09 PM
How to fix Obama's crappy economy...

Vote someone else in to do the job. We can't afford more of his failure.

You mean the crappy economy Obama inherited from Bush?

Or are you too far gone on the revisionist Kool-Aid to even acknowledge that much?

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 10:11 PM
You mean the crappy economy Obama inherited from Bush?

It's hard to believe, but Obama took an economy that was bad and made it horrible.

At this rate, a second term would result in abject depression.

Time to right the ship. Obama has proven that he's not up to the job.

Meck77
06-27-2011, 10:11 PM
That's right RJ. Work. Hard mother ****in work. There is no substitute.

L.A. BRONCOS FAN
06-27-2011, 10:14 PM
Good gawd this woman is dense.can't believe there are yahoos that will actually admit that they will vote for her.

They voted for the Kennebunkport Cowboy, didn't they?

If they were dumb enough to vote for Bush, they're dumb enough to vote for any ridiculous figurehead the GOP nominates.

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 10:15 PM
They voted for the Kennebunkport Cowboy, didn't they?

If they were dumb enough to vote for Bush, they're dumb enough to vote for any ridiculous figurehead the GOP nominates.

It is being proven day after day that people had a major brain fart when they cast a vote for Obama.

His nickname should be "Bankrupt"

L.A. BRONCOS FAN
06-27-2011, 10:16 PM
It's hard to believe, but Obama took an economy that was bad and made it horrible.

At this rate, a second term would result in abject depression.

Time to right the ship. Obama has proven that he's not up to the job.

Bottom line: Righties like you would never support the sort of steps that need to be taken in order to right the economy. Not in million years.

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 10:18 PM
Bottom line: Righties like you would never support the sort of steps that need to be taken in order to right the economy. Not in million years.

The lefties can't even pass a budget! They have spent all their time trying to swindle the American people with Obamacare and Cap & Tax!

And they wonder what the problem is?

The left has run this govt like a bunch of spoiled teenage girls with daddy's credit card in hot topic. They maxed it out in about 10 minutes and didn't care in the least about the bind that they put the American people in.

UltimateHoboW/Shotgun
06-27-2011, 10:21 PM
Bottom line: Righties like you would never support the sort of steps that need to be taken in order to right the economy. Not in million years.

You know its been, what, 800 days since the last time the "D"s have passed a budget. Right. Or do you just have the right side blinders on.

L.A. BRONCOS FAN
06-27-2011, 10:22 PM
I love how everybody forgot about the "dot com" bubble...

...and yet Clinton left a budget surplus.



9/11...

The Bush lemming's universal "get out of jail free" card.



...and the Clinton ression.

ROFL!

I'll bet if you did an anonymous poll, you wouldn't find too many people who wouldn't trade the Bush economy and its aftermath for the Clinton economy.

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 10:28 PM
...and yet Clinton left a budget surplus.

The Bush lemming's universal "get out of jail free" card.

I'll bet if you did an anonymous poll, you wouldn't find too many people who wouldn't trade the Bush economy and its aftermath for the Clinton economy.

You're too wrapped up in Bush and Clinton.

Right now we have a disaster president who needs to be voted out and replaced for the good of the nation. Your precious party is not more important than this country.

L.A. BRONCOS FAN
06-27-2011, 10:28 PM
The lefties can't even pass a budget!

Nice dodge.

Notice you didn't deny my observation that righties like you would never support the kind of steps that would actually be necessary to balance the budget.

You wouldn't think of putting the interests of middle class and working Americans ahead of Wall Street and the corporate crooks whose interests you invariably place first.

The left has run this govt like a bunch of spoiled teenage girls with daddy's credit card in hot topic. They maxed it out in about 10 minutes and didn't care in the least about the bind that they put the American people in.

OMG - the irony in the foregoing paragraph is just too much!

Where were you when Bush and the GOP Congress were borrowing and spending American into oblivion during their "trifecta?"

That's right - you were crying "don't criticize the president!"

UltimateHoboW/Shotgun
06-27-2011, 10:32 PM
...and yet Clinton left a budget surplus.




The Bush lemming's universal "get out of jail free" card.



ROFL!

I'll bet if you did an anonymous poll, you wouldn't find too many people who wouldn't trade the Bush economy and its aftermath for the Clinton economy.

http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/images/2008/inflation_9_2_08_image002.jpg

And here it is. Opppps. I guess it was something your hive mind didn't tell you.

UltimateHoboW/Shotgun
06-27-2011, 10:34 PM
Its not a dodge. THE LEFT HAVE NO SOLUTIONS. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAAHAHAHHAAHAHHAHAHAHAAHH. Wake up!

L.A. BRONCOS FAN
06-27-2011, 10:34 PM
You're too wrapped up in Bush and Clinton.

Right now we have a disaster president who needs to be voted out and replaced for the good of the nation. Your precious party is not more important than this country.

Bush was the "disaster president."

Obama simply inherited the eviscerated economy Bush and the republi-cons left behind.

Has Obama done enough to fix the mess Bush created?

Not even close, but who could or would at this juncture?

The entire system has been hijacked by private interests.

They're not going to allow anyone who wants to change the status quo to get near the levers of power.

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 10:35 PM
Nice dodge.

Notice you didn't deny my observation that righties like you would never support the kind of steps that would actually be necessary to balance the budget.

You wouldn't think of putting the interests of middle class and working Americans ahead of Wall Street and the corporate crooks whose interests you invariably place first.

OMG - the irony in the foregoing paragraph is just too much!

Where were you when Bush and the GOP Congress were borrowing and spending American into oblivion during their "trifecta?"

That's right - you were crying "don't criticize the president!"

Hop in, bro. Set the dial to "June 28, 2011"
http://murphymac.com/slib/images/time-machine-observations.jpg
1997 was a good year, but come on. Livin' in the past can't be all that satisfying.

L.A. BRONCOS FAN
06-27-2011, 10:37 PM
Its not a dodge. THE LEFT HAVE NO SOLUTIONS. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAAHAHAHHAAHAHHAHAHAHAAHH. Wake up!

Solutions to problems your *president and your party created.

Funny - when these problems were in the process of being created, we never heard a word of protest from people like you.

Now that Bush is out of office, you've suddenly discovered deficits, debt, etc.

There's nothing that's anything more than politics as usual for people like you.

L.A. BRONCOS FAN
06-27-2011, 10:39 PM
Hop in, bro. Set the dial to "June 28, 2011"
http://murphymac.com/slib/images/time-machine-observations.jpg
1997 was a good year, but come on. Livin' in the past can't be all that satisfying.

I'll take that as the usual "I'm not about to argue with anything you said in your post" response.

No surprise there.

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 10:39 PM
Solutions to problems your *president and your party created.

Funny - when these problems were in the process of being created, we never heard a word of protest from people like you.

Now that Bush is out of office, you've suddenly discovered deficits, debt, etc.

There's nothing that's anything more than politics as usual for people like you.

Leftist "solutions":
http://thecia.com.au/reviews/s/images/stealing-harvard-6.jpg

UltimateHoboW/Shotgun
06-27-2011, 10:40 PM
Bush was the "disaster president."

Obama simply inherited the eviscerated economy Bush and the republi-cons left behind.

Has Obama done enough to fix the mess Bush created?

Not even close, but who could or would at this juncture?

The entire system has been hijacked by private interests.

They're not going to allow anyone who wants to change the status quo to get near the levers of power.

I love how you think Big "o" haas done any thing to fix things. You know that stimulus thing that was so important that it had to be passed without reading back in 09. Well for you info. IT STILL HASN'T ALL BEEN SPENT! Now I want you to take your time with this one. Why hasn't that money been spent yet? I mean if this thing is so bad and sooooooooo deeeeeeeeepppp. $816 Billion is what it take to fix things and time is an issue. Why string this thing out fopr the last 3 YEARS!

L.A. BRONCOS FAN
06-27-2011, 10:42 PM
And here it is. Opppps. I guess it was something your hive mind didn't tell you.

This from a ditto sheep whose argument is "Clinton was responsible for the Bush economy?"

That's priceless! ROFL!

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 10:44 PM
This from a ditto sheep whose argument is "Clinton was responsible for the Bush economy?"

That's priceless!

That was weak, brosephine. Better go hit the leftist talking points webpage again and get back at it from another angle.

L.A. BRONCOS FAN
06-27-2011, 10:44 PM
I love how you think Big "o" haas done any thing to fix things.

Got reading comprehension?

(Or basic literacy, for that matter?)

I said Obama hadn't even come close to doing enough to fix the mess Bush created.

UltimateHoboW/Shotgun
06-27-2011, 10:45 PM
Defleccccctioooooon

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 10:45 PM
I said Obama hadn't even come close to doing enough to fix the mess.

That's all you needed to say.

L.A. BRONCOS FAN
06-27-2011, 10:46 PM
That was weak, brosephine. Better go hit the leftist talking points webpage again and get back at it from another angle.

Is this the part where you start randomly regurgitating Rehab Rush talking points and hope some of them are applicable to the discussion?

UltimateHoboW/Shotgun
06-27-2011, 10:47 PM
I said Obama hadn't even come close to doing enough to fix the mess Bush created.

Why you defending the guy then? The Hive Mind has you.

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 10:47 PM
Is this the part where you start randomly regurgitating Rehab Rush talking points and hope some of them are applicable to the discussion?

Ha!

Oh nooooooo! A "Rehab Rush" reference! Ha!

L.A. BRONCOS FAN
06-27-2011, 10:47 PM
That's all you needed to say.

Not at all.

Your selective memory re: the Bush years needs to be fixed.

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 10:48 PM
Why you defending the guy then? The Hive Mind has you.

LABF is just a propaganda drone.

L.A. BRONCOS FAN
06-27-2011, 10:49 PM
Why you defending the guy then? The Hive Mind has you.

Pointing out your lies and attempts to revise history isn't the same thing as defending someone.

Why do righties have such trouble with distinctions such as these?

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 10:50 PM
the Bush years needs to be fixed.

Now, the Bush years AND the Obama years need to be fixed.

Thanks for nothing, Barack.

Depression-level unemployent rates, a disasterous border, a new war that nobody knows why we are in, crazy socialist policies that stifle the economy...Obama's been so terrible that it looks like he's trying to fail.

L.A. BRONCOS FAN
06-27-2011, 10:50 PM
LABF is just a propaganda drone.

EpicFail is just an ostrich who files all inconvenient facts and uncomfortable realities under "propaganda."

UltimateHoboW/Shotgun
06-27-2011, 10:51 PM
Ha!

Oh nooooooo! A "Rehab Rush" reference! Ha!

I love how the left thinks we can't think for our selves. They think we think like they think. hahahahahahhhahahahha

L.A. BRONCOS FAN
06-27-2011, 10:52 PM
Now, the Bush years AND the Obama years need to be fixed.

Thanks for nothing, Barack.

Depression-level unemployent rates, a disasterous border, a new war that nobody knows why we are in, crazy socialist policies that stifle the economy...Obama's been so terrible that it looks like he's trying to fail.

Do you honestly think your boy McCain or any other GOP candidate would be any different?

If so, then I have some oceanfront property in Kansas you might be interested in.

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 10:52 PM
I love how the left thinks we can't think for our selves. They think we think like they think. hahahahahahhhahahahha

They just do as they're told. Not alot of thinking for most of the far-left extremist guys here. A couple of them think just fine, but then again that minority doesn't visit threads like these.

L.A. BRONCOS FAN
06-27-2011, 10:54 PM
I love how the left thinks we can't think for our selves. They think we think like they think. hahahahahahhhahahahha

Right on cue with the "I am rubber - you are glue" comeback.

I know third-grade kids who have more game (and a better handle on basic literacy) than you.

UltimateHoboW/Shotgun
06-27-2011, 10:54 PM
Pointing out your lies and attempts to revise history isn't the same thing as defending someone.

Why do righties have such trouble with distinctions such as these?

They Hive Mind has you.

http://theinsanityreport.com/home/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/bbnf4B.jpg

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 10:54 PM
Do you honestly think your boy McCain or any other GOP candidate would be any different?

If so, then I have some oceanfront property in Kansas you might be interested in.

McCain is just another political class lifetime establishment progressive politician who would sell his soul for another government pension. You're right in comparing he and Obama. They both suck.

L.A. BRONCOS FAN
06-27-2011, 10:56 PM
They just do as they're told. Not alot of thinking for most of the far-left extremist guys here. A couple of them think just fine, but then again that minority doesn't visit threads like these.

You have no clue re: what constitutes an "extremist."

(Hint: start by looking in the mirror.)

You have insufficient historical perspective.

According to the metric used by you and your fellow Bush Youth, Eisenhower, Nixon, and Ford were socialists.

UltimateHoboW/Shotgun
06-27-2011, 10:56 PM
Right on cue with the "I am rubber - you are glue" comeback.

I know third-grade kids who have more game (and a better handle on basic literacy) than you.

Dude. you've been debating the two of us. You keep repeating yourself. We come to you with new stuff. Who the one with the 3rd grade tactics here. Hmmmmmmm.

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 10:57 PM
You have no clue re: what constitutes an "extremist."

(Hint: start by looking in the mirror.)

You have insufficient historical perspective.

According to the metric used by you and your fellow Bush Youth, Eisenhower, Nixon, and Ford were socialists.

You are certainly a far-left extremist. I have no doubts about that.

L.A. BRONCOS FAN
06-27-2011, 10:57 PM
We come to you with new stuff.

Hilarious!

Thigh-slapper of the day!

L.A. BRONCOS FAN
06-27-2011, 10:58 PM
You are certainly a far-left extremist. I have no doubts about that.

Then, according to your metric, so were the republican presidents I just named.

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 11:02 PM
Then, according to your metric, so were the republican presidents I just named.

Bush certainly had a progressive liberal bend.

L.A. BRONCOS FAN
06-27-2011, 11:04 PM
Bush certainly had a progressive liberal bend.

Then why did you carry his water for eight years?

L.A. BRONCOS FAN
06-27-2011, 11:06 PM
They(sic) Hive Mind has you.



This from an unthinking lemming who still isn't willing to concede that trickle-down economics was an abject failure?

That's comedy gold. Ha!

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 11:08 PM
Then why did you carry his water for eight years?

:spit:

Good one, bro! ^5

http://sg.wsj.net/public/resources/images/ED-AJ102_1obama_NS_20090302200015.gif

L.A. BRONCOS FAN
06-27-2011, 11:11 PM
:spit:

Good one, bro! ^5



Hmmm.....maybe I just missed the half dozen new threads you created each day to criticize Bush when the court-appointed pinhead was in office.


Oh wait...

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 11:13 PM
Hmmm.....maybe I just missed the half dozen new threads you created each day to criticize Bush when the court-appointed pinhead was in office.


Oh wait...

^5

U Myyyy BRROOOOOOOOOOOO!!!

Inkana7
06-27-2011, 11:28 PM
:spit:

Good one, bro! ^5

http://sg.wsj.net/public/resources/images/ED-AJ102_1obama_NS_20090302200015.gif

****, is it still 2009? Oh man I must have hit my head or something.

epicSocialism4tw
06-27-2011, 11:38 PM
****, is it still 2009? Oh man I must have hit my head or something.

You probably hit your head on the bottom of that chart in 2009 when you realized that Obama's policies drained what little energy there was left right out of the economy immediately after he got into office and the left started pushing their agenda.

cutthemdown
06-27-2011, 11:44 PM
Eventually the economy will get better. Even the Romans ebbed and flowed before they got split up. We still have some raping and pillaging to do boys! We ain't done yet.

Jetmeck
06-28-2011, 12:22 AM
You probably hit your head on the bottom of that chart in 2009 when you realized that Obama's policies drained what little energy there was left right out of the economy immediately after he got into office and the left started pushing their agenda.

Do you ever grow up and face reality ?
Chit was still rolling downhill when Obama took over and you damn well know it. Bush threw the grenade and Obama jumped on it.

Be a man and admit the truth. Everyone knows this is what happened.

Obama may not be perfect but if he would have been handed the golden key dip**** was we wouldn't be in this cluster**** we are now !!!!!!!!!!

epicSocialism4tw
06-28-2011, 12:34 AM
Do you ever grow up and face reality ?
Chit was still rolling downhill when Obama took over and you damn well know it. Bush threw the grenade and Obama jumped on it.

Be a man and admit the truth. Everyone knows this is what happened.

Obama may not be perfect but if he would have been handed the golden key dip**** was we wouldn't be in this cluster**** we are now !!!!!!!!!!

Ha!

Right!

Obama giving billions of dollars to public unions really picked the economy up, didn't it?

Let me help you with that one...

Nope.

Jetmeck
06-28-2011, 12:44 AM
Ha!

Right!

Obama giving billions of dollars to public unions really picked the economy up, didn't it?

Let me help you with that one...


Nope.

Look Obama did not write any union contracts and they were in place BEFORE HE TOOK OFFICE and billions were for a fact given away by Bush and Cheny to big oil, big business and war profiteers .

MAYBE SOME money should flow to the working class for a change, funneling it all into the rich and corporations has worked so well....you know that trickle down bull**** you repubs like and want to double down on now even though we have thirty freakin years that PROVE that chit don't work.


But **** it lets lower the tax even more and give more tax breaks, keep doinG what DOESN'T WORK ????????????????????

mhgaffney
06-28-2011, 03:13 AM
McCain is just another political class lifetime establishment progressive politician who would sell his soul for another government pension. You're right in comparing he and Obama. They both suck.

McCain a progressive?

You are obviously clueless. No, Ralph Nader is the progressive. McCain is a right wing war monger.

mhgaffney
06-28-2011, 03:15 AM
Eventually the economy will get better. Even the Romans ebbed and flowed before they got split up. We still have some raping and pillaging to do boys! We ain't done yet.

Very funny.

No -- things will get a lot worse -- then fall apart --

After WW III things might get better -- but (assuming some of us survive the cataclysm) that will be a different age -- not the one we live in.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
06-28-2011, 06:00 AM
Awesome that this is on page 9 and STILL on the front page. Great job, Mods! You guys rule school!

That One Guy
06-28-2011, 07:03 AM
Awesome that this is on page 9 and STILL on the front page. Great job, Mods! You guys rule school!

I laughed when I see the ones still here while Gaff's "What is under DIA" made it to the WRP.

Kaylore
06-28-2011, 07:13 AM
Keep banging on that "Bush broke it too much for us to fix" drum lefties. I really, really, hope you're playing that song come election time so you can see how much the pissed off families out of work care.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
06-28-2011, 07:21 AM
Keep banging on that "Bush broke it too much for us to fix" drum lefties. I really, really, hope you're playing that song come election time so you can see how much the pissed off families out of work care.

Keep banging that "it's not our fault, and if we cut more taxes for corporations, we'll TOTALLY get your jobs back, because that worked so well in '08. Remember '08? When everything was peachy keen except the economy which was in free fall? Also, thanks for electing the most obstructing congress in the history of the country. Let's do more of that" drum.

That One Guy
06-28-2011, 07:24 AM
Keep banging that "it's not our fault, and if we cut more taxes for corporations, we'll TOTALLY get your jobs back, because that worked so well in '08. Remember '08? When everything was peachy keen except the economy which was in free fall? Also, thanks for electing the most obstructing congress in the history of the country. Let's do more of that" drum.

I think if they keep it simple and stick to a "They just want to keep catering to the rich" mantra against the "They just want to blame Bush for all their problems", it could be competitive. I think it's quite naive to think the Ds wont face a little extra pressure after having had the presidency though.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
06-28-2011, 07:32 AM
I think if they keep it simple and stick to a "They just want to keep catering to the rich" mantra against the "They just want to blame Bush for all their problems", it could be competitive. I think it's quite naive to think the Ds wont face a little extra pressure after having had the presidency though.

I think there will be extra pressure, and there should be. As far as their argument goes, we're not going to see much more than "they just want to cater to the rich" until there's a nominee for a couple of reasons. First, it's true; and second, because there's no single entity to attack. I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to see the R's string out the nomination process for as long as possible to ensure there isn't one target for the D's to go after, but many, and the generic "they're just going to cater to the corporations and rich" will have to go for longer. It would be a smart strategy.

However, I think it's imperative that the right offer up someone who isn't a HUGE social leap to the right, like a Bachmann. Indies won't go for her, neither will anyone who is for gay unions (which, polls find, is most of the country). Mitt is the R's best shot, as he could actually attract votes from people like me.

epicSocialism4tw
06-28-2011, 07:34 AM
Keep banging on that "Bush broke it too much for us to fix" drum lefties. I really, really, hope you're playing that song come election time so you can see how much the pissed off families out of work care.

There are some far lefties here who think that there really aren't people who are out of work...that they're just whipped up into a fervor by talk radio.

It's sad that those people are so out of touch that they haven't the slightest idea of what its like for many people in this country.

And why would they think anything else? Its not like the Dems have actually done anything about the economy. They made sure that a couple of the unions were afloat, but other than that...everyone's SOL unless they work for the Dem party.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
06-28-2011, 07:37 AM
There are some far lefties here who think that there really aren't people who are out of work...that they're just whipped up into a fervor by talk radio.

It's sad that those people are so out of touch that they haven't the slightest idea of what its like for many people in this country.

And why would they think anything else? Its not like the Dems have actually done anything about the economy. They made sure that a couple of the unions were afloat, but other than that...everyone's SOL unless they work for the Dem party.

What's the Republican party done about the job situation, the economy? Oh, right! Nothing!

Keep legislating morality though. That'll totally turn things around.

pricejj
06-28-2011, 07:52 AM
The House of Representatives has passed legislation aimed at creating jobs. Why has the Democrat controlled Senate shot it down?

Do we really have to go over all this again in the same thread?

pricejj
06-28-2011, 07:57 AM
What's the Republican party done about the job situation, the economy? Oh, right! Nothing!

Keep legislating morality though. That'll totally turn things around.

You brought this up yesterday??!!!

Dude, lay off the ganja. Short term memory is your friend.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
06-28-2011, 08:09 AM
You broght this up yesterday??!!!

Dude, lay off the ganja. Short term memory is your friend.

It was just as relevant yesterday as it is today.

Logic is your friend. You should try using it sometime.

Kaylore
06-28-2011, 08:19 AM
I think if they keep it simple and stick to a "They just want to keep catering to the rich" mantra against the "They just want to blame Bush for all their problems", it could be competitive. I think it's quite naive to think the Ds wont face a little extra pressure after having had the presidency though.

LOL Yeah they'll but that. Like I said all you guys have is 1. Blame Bush. 2. Point out how rich people have more than you and hope that makes people jealous enough to vote vindictively. 3. Keep referring back to points 1 and 2 whenever someone asks what your party did with a super-majority in the senate, both houses of congress and the Presidency.

Seriously, Democrats suck. They really do. The leadership is ineffectual and the constituents are hypocrites. I am pretty disgusted with how your own party has clearly let you guys down with things on your OWN agenda (higher taxes, reduce military involvement) and you suddenly don't have a problem with any of it, or at least won't even admit it's at the very least, disappointing. I mean the voting populace gave you guys a heavy mandate to make things happen and you squandered it. If the tables were turned and we did that little with that much power, I know I'd be ripping my party to shreds, and I already don't care for them as is.

But good luck with the class warfare thing. It might work in some cases, but most people know rich people didn't steal their jobs.

pricejj
06-28-2011, 08:23 AM
It was just as relevant yesterday as it is today.

Logic is your friend. You should try using it sometime.

You must love losing, because you lose every single day.

In a way, I feel sorry for you.

epicSocialism4tw
06-28-2011, 08:24 AM
LOL Yeah they'll but that. Like I said all you guys have is 1. Blame Bush. 2. Point out how rich people have more than you and hope that makes people jealous enough to vote vindictively. 3. Keep referring back to points 1 and 2 whenever someone asks what your party did with a super-majority in the senate, both houses of congress and the Presidency.

Seriously, Democrats suck. They really do. The leadership is ineffectual and the constituents are hypocrites. I am pretty disgusted with how your own party has clearly let you guys down with things on your OWN agenda (higher taxes, reduce military involvement) and you suddenly don't have a problem with any of it, or at least won't even admit it's at the very least, disappointing. I mean the voting populace gave you guys a heavy mandate to make things happen and you squandered it. If the tables were turned and we did that little with that much power, I know I'd be ripping my party to shreds, and I already don't care for them as is.

But good luck with the class warfare thing. It might work in some cases, but most people know rich people didn't steal their jobs.

Rich peeple R steeling R jooooobzz!!!!!!11!!!1

(exsept 4 teh rich demorcats, theyz givin uz jobz!1!!! 7.50 n hour!!!11!!!)

pricejj
06-28-2011, 08:30 AM
Now Democrats are trying to rewrite established business accounting methods (LIFO) in order to raise taxes and the debt ceiling?

Hilarious!

What spending have Democrats EVER cut? EVER?

Garcia Bronco
06-28-2011, 08:38 AM
Democrats have been in control of the purse strings for almost 5 years....it'll be 6 in 2012. There is little excuse for them and their inability to control spending.

Garcia Bronco
06-28-2011, 08:40 AM
What's the Republican party done about the job situation, the economy? Oh, right! Nothing!

Keep legislating morality though. That'll totally turn things around.

Liberals/Democrats legislate morality as well.

55CrushEm
06-28-2011, 08:41 AM
What's the Republican party done about the job situation, the economy? Oh, right! Nothing!


Seriously? The Dems have held both chambers of congress since 2006. They DO own this economy now....no matter how much you still want to blame Bush.

The R's have onlyl held the house for 5 months now.

But hey, you think another trillion dollar "stimulus" is all we need?

epicSocialism4tw
06-28-2011, 08:45 AM
Seriously? The Dems have held both chambers of congress since 2006. They DO own this economy now....no matter how much you still want to blame Bush.

The R's have onlyl held the house for 5 months now.

But hey, you think another trillion dollar "stimulus" is all we need?

Yeah, dump a bunch more money into union management pockets so that it makes its way back into Dem campaign fund coffers.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
06-28-2011, 09:04 AM
You must love losing, because you lose every single day.

In a way, I feel sorry for you.

Aren't you adorable.

In your world, cutting jobs = creating jobs. And I lose every day?

With that kind of logic, I'm shocked you've lived this long.

TonyR
06-28-2011, 09:37 AM
Neither Bush nor Obama is directly to blame for the mess our economy is in. But the Bush tax cuts and the wars we got ourselves into are huge drags on the economy. Obama didn't start those messes, but he is guilty of continuing them. Oh, and this thread sucks.

55CrushEm
06-28-2011, 09:57 AM
Neither Bush nor Obama is directly to blame for the mess our economy is in. But the Bush tax cuts and the wars we got ourselves into are huge drags on the economy. Obama didn't start those messes, but he is guilty of continuing them. Oh, and this thread sucks.

Please explain how tax cuts are a drag on the economy.

Garcia Bronco
06-28-2011, 10:04 AM
People can say what they want about the Bush tax cuts...but it's the only tax cuts in the modern era that applied to 100 percent of the tax paying public. The second set of cuts were passed in June of 2001. Then we were attacked.

DarkHorse30
06-28-2011, 10:14 AM
Obama/Pelosi's failed economy needs spending cuts, not revenue....oh and how about some jobs that AREN'T connected to the gov't that has about a 10% approval rating.

Drill baby drill....we could fix the economy with about a year of drilling. I can't believe Obama is carter/stupid.

That One Guy
06-28-2011, 10:14 AM
LOL Yeah they'll but that. Like I said all you guys have is 1. Blame Bush. 2. Point out how rich people have more than you and hope that makes people jealous enough to vote vindictively. 3. Keep referring back to points 1 and 2 whenever someone asks what your party did with a super-majority in the senate, both houses of congress and the Presidency.

Seriously, Democrats suck. They really do. The leadership is ineffectual and the constituents are hypocrites. I am pretty disgusted with how your own party has clearly let you guys down with things on your OWN agenda (higher taxes, reduce military involvement) and you suddenly don't have a problem with any of it, or at least won't even admit it's at the very least, disappointing. I mean the voting populace gave you guys a heavy mandate to make things happen and you squandered it. If the tables were turned and we did that little with that much power, I know I'd be ripping my party to shreds, and I already don't care for them as is.

But good luck with the class warfare thing. It might work in some cases, but most people know rich people didn't steal their jobs.

What the crap? Maybe I wasn't clear on my post.

I just think the mantras will be:

Republicans: "They just want to blame Bush for all their failures"

Democrats: "They just want to cozy up to the rich"

I think if they do that, the D position will be bought into more (face it, a lot of Americans love to hate the rich) but the Ds will also face the consequences for things not being as good as they could be under Obama's presidency.

Kaylore
06-28-2011, 10:24 AM
What the crap? Maybe I wasn't clear on my post.

I just think the mantras will be:

Republicans: "They just want to blame Bush for all their failures"

Democrats: "They just want to cozy up to the rich"

I think if they do that, the D position will be bought into more (face it, a lot of Americans love to hate the rich) but the Ds will also face the consequences for things not being as good as they could be under Obama's presidency.

Actually when things are bad, the party of the sitting president usually loses, fair or not. Now you can pick up 7-10% of the vote if you make clear plan to navigate out of the mess. Historically voters are more likely to vote for a candidate that has a plan than one who runs on rhetoric.

I think the Democrats will be facing a huge credibility issue on the economy. Partly because Republicans are considered the party of business and more people will want jobs than to cornhole the rich. Face it, most people want to go back to work and any screwing of the rich isn't going to get you employed. And partly because if the Dems come with a new plan, the natural response will be "well why haven't you been doing this?" so the third option which you're kind of seeing is dressing up the pig and pretending its a beauty queen. That's basically saying "hey! The plan is working and things aren't that bad! The media is just blowing it out of proportion!"

pricejj
06-28-2011, 10:28 AM
Aren't you adorable.

In your world, cutting jobs = creating jobs. And I lose every day?

With that kind of logic, I'm shocked you've lived this long.

Federal government intervention into private markets escalates costs for everyone. Unlimited government programs and entitlements kills the private sector economy, the very people who pay taxes. What about that don't you understand?

In your world, there are daily riots in the breadlines (i.e. Greece).