PDA

View Full Version : fwiw


rugbythug
04-29-2011, 07:33 PM
Despite all the complaining about no defensive tackles. Every player we have drafted has a great chance of being a day 1 starter

footstepsfrom#27
04-29-2011, 07:35 PM
I'm gonne go out on a limb right now and predict that in the 2012 draft, we will not be drafting a defensive linemen of any kind in the top two rounds.

uplink
04-29-2011, 07:38 PM
Despite all the complaining about no defensive tackles. Every player we have drafted has a great chance of being a day 1 starter

Yeah you could not say this about D lineman drafted after round 1. Takes them awhile to develop.

lostknight
04-29-2011, 07:39 PM
I read a write up before that Fox doens't like drafting DTs. He prefers to use commodity DT's with elite DEs and elite LBs (lots of speed).

When you go back and look at the last three games last year, our defense was absolutely blistered by TEs and LBs.

KO5K
04-29-2011, 07:44 PM
I read a write up before that Fox doens't like drafting DTs. He prefers to use commodity DT's with elite DEs and elite LBs (lots of speed).

When you go back and look at the last three games last year, our defense was absolutely blistered by TEs and LBs.

When you go back and watch our last bazillion games, our defense was absolutely blistered by RBs.

Atwater His Ass
04-29-2011, 07:44 PM
People are just making excuses / changing their stories now to fit w/ what Denver has done. This board is notorious for it.

If you would have said before the draft that you'd be happy with no DL picks in the first 3 rounds...well, it wouldn't have been pretty. But now, it's all ok??

In any case, we can only hope that this strategy pays off and I can at least be somewhat happy that we improved 3 positions on the defense with some more picks tomorrow, and didn't take Bowers.

Cmac821
04-29-2011, 08:01 PM
People are just making excuses / changing their stories now to fit w/ what Denver has done. This board is notorious for it.

If you would have said before the draft that you'd be happy with no DL picks in the first 3 rounds...well, it wouldn't have been pretty. But now, it's all ok??

In any case, we can only hope that this strategy pays off and I can at least be somewhat happy that we improved 3 positions on the defense with some more picks tomorrow, and didn't take Bowers.

I was thinking DL was a the best thing to do after we drafted Peterson. But now after looking at it I can see where Fox could be going and it doesn't look to bad. Drafting starters seems good to me

broncosteven
04-29-2011, 08:11 PM
People are just making excuses / changing their stories now to fit w/ what Denver has done. This board is notorious for it.

If you would have said before the draft that you'd be happy with no DL picks in the first 3 rounds...well, it wouldn't have been pretty. But now, it's all ok??

In any case, we can only hope that this strategy pays off and I can at least be somewhat happy that we improved 3 positions on the defense with some more picks tomorrow, and didn't take Bowers.

I was terrified we were going to take Peterson, I much prefer building from the LB's (which are still front 7) out than taking a flyer on a CB just because he is BPA.

It is clear that our FO had a plan going into the draft and they executed it, rather than sit back and let BPA's on the board dictate their direction and trade up because a guy with potenital is within reach.

It was nice to see a patient FO execute a plan, get a top 5 player and still move back and stock pile some picks.

uplink
04-29-2011, 08:24 PM
Broncos took the 1st OLB, ILB, and S in the draft, so had their pick of the top guys at these positions.

footstepsfrom#27
04-29-2011, 08:24 PM
I was terrified we were going to take Peterson, I much prefer building from the LB's (which are still front 7) out than taking a flyer on a CB just because he is BPA.
Yeah...it's silly to draft talent just because it's sitting right there in front of you. Much better to figure out a way to draft someone not as good, then rationalize that.
It is clear that our FO had a plan going into the draft and they executed it, rather than sit back and let BPA's on the board dictate their direction and trade up because a guy with potenital is within reach.

It was nice to see a patient FO execute a plan, get a top 5 player and still move back and stock pile some picks.
And that "plan" somehow included ignoring our worst position in a draft that was deeper and more talented at that same position than any in recent memory.

Great plan...sounds like something McD would have hatched. :thumbs:

LongDongJohnson
04-29-2011, 08:26 PM
We had some pretty good defenses in 2002-2005 with random dudes at DT.

And I still like Kevin Vickerson. I think he will be a good starter for us.

eddie mac
04-29-2011, 08:28 PM
Broncos took the 1st OLB, ILB, and S in the draft, so had their pick of the top guys at these positions.

Shame though that ILB and S are the worst class in the last decade.

MagicHef
04-29-2011, 08:31 PM
I read a write up before that Fox doens't like drafting DTs. He prefers to use commodity DT's with elite DEs and elite LBs (lots of speed).

When you go back and look at the last three games last year, our defense was absolutely blistered by TEs and LBs.

Do you have a link to this writeup? It does make some sense, with the shorter playing life of DTs.

Moki01
04-29-2011, 08:37 PM
We now have several fast guys that can chase RB's who waltz untouched through the line.... yup we just got a lot better. ;(

DarkHorse
04-29-2011, 08:41 PM
People are just making excuses / changing their stories now to fit w/ what Denver has done. This board is notorious for it.

If you would have said before the draft that you'd be happy with no DL picks in the first 3 rounds...well, it wouldn't have been pretty. But now, it's all ok??

In any case, we can only hope that this strategy pays off and I can at least be somewhat happy that we improved 3 positions on the defense with some more picks tomorrow, and didn't take Bowers.

If we would have drafted Miller, Peterson, AJ Green, Ingram, Dareus and Fairley this collection of retards would be throwing a fit because we didn't draft a TE. Or LB, or corner, etc......

It's ALWAYS something.

footstepsfrom#27
04-29-2011, 08:51 PM
If we would have drafted Miller, Peterson, AJ Green, Ingram, Dareus and Fairley this collection of retards would be throwing a fit because we didn't draft a TE. Or LB, or corner, etc......

It's ALWAYS something.
Virtually every poster on this board was hoping against hope for d-line help in this draft, and once again...we got...NOTHING. Gotta love draft day...it's the time to come together and sing kumbaya together while we all swallow the koolaid that it really doesn't matter...trust the all knowing Pat Bowlen and his braintrust, since it could always be worse and they know more than we do and "they've got a plan"...blah blah blah...you're all as dissapointed as I am you just wont' allow youself the luxury of expressing it.

Plain and simple...we ****ed this up big time. Unless they scoop some amazing unknown stud DT out of the bottom of the barrel tomorrow who proves he's the steal of the draft, this draft will go down as a huge wasted opportunity. We literally could have fixed the entire d-line for the next 8 years with one draft...how is it possible we did NOTHING AT ALL to correct our biggest problem in the one draft where it was almost guaranteed we'd have the chance to make real progress?

DarkHorse
04-29-2011, 09:04 PM
Virtually every poster on this board was hoping against hope for d-line help in this draft, and once again...we got...NOTHING. Gotta love draft day...it's the time to come together and sing kumbaya together while we all swallow the koolaid that it really doesn't matter...trust the all knowing Pat Bowlen and his braintrust, since it could always be worse and they know more than we do and "they've got a plan"...blah blah blah...you're all as dissapointed as I am you just wont' allow youself the luxury of expressing it.

Plain and simple...we ****ed this up big time. Unless they scoop some amazing unknown stud DT out of the bottom of the barrel tomorrow who proves he's the steal of the draft, this draft will go down as a huge wasted opportunity. We literally could have fixed the entire d-line for the next 8 years with one draft...how is it possible we did NOTHING AT ALL to correct our biggest problem in the one draft where it was almost guaranteed we'd have the chance to make real progress?

I can promise you without a doubt that I am NOWHERE near as disappointed as you are. Not even close.

Disappointed? Yeah. But I don't have a noose around my neck with my finger on the submit button for my annual exit post from the 'Mane.

Players picked can, and should, be debated back and forth - but if you're going to knock the drafting strategy then you're crazy. We went all in to fix the ENTIRE defense and not just ONE position.

We didn't draft a f'ing WR that is still recovering from foot amputation. We didn't trade out of the top pick so we could acquire a slew of mediocre players. We didn't grossly overreach for any of our picks - we played it safe and drafted for long term need. Defense.

Argue the actual players all you want but I LOVE the priority of defense.

orange skier
04-29-2011, 09:09 PM
Nah......we're okay.........I was melting for a while, now I'm good with it........Defense will be much faster, and plenty mean........we've always built our good D around our linebackers......and now we've got some good ones to build with.......this safety is nice and nasty......and we're going to load up on some quality guesses tomorrow.........life is beautiful. Fox and Elway and Xanders are keeping the ball in the middle of the fairway...........

GoHAM
04-29-2011, 09:11 PM
I just can't believe that the 32nd ranked defense in the league failed to take an interior DL in the top 3 rounds yet again.

I refuse to believe it.

I'm in denial.

How many more stages do I have before I accept next year's ****ty run defense?

zdoor
04-29-2011, 09:16 PM
I'm pretty bummed we didn't get Paea. I was really hoping for that guy. I like our picks though. Just surprised we didn't go DL at all in top 3 rounds...

ayjackson
04-29-2011, 09:16 PM
Shame though that ILB and S are the worst class in the last decade.

And accordingly the first ILB and S were taken in the second and third rounds instead of the top 10 picks where they normally go.

DarkHorse
04-29-2011, 09:16 PM
I just can't believe that the 32nd ranked defense in the league failed to take an interior DL in the top 3 rounds yet again.

I refuse to believe it.

I'm in denial.

How many more stages do I have before I accept next year's ****ty run defense?

So are you in the group that feels that drafting 1 guy was going to magically fix our run defense immediately just because his position says DT?

Just curious - isn't the first post i've read today that implies this.

Draft any DT - just get a DT and our run defense will be fixed. Got it.

It's not like a scheme change, HC change and getting back Dumervil, moving Ayers to his proper position, etc.... is going to help our run defense game at all. We should have drafted anyone that plays DT - that's the instant fix.

listopencil
04-29-2011, 09:53 PM
I'm pretty bummed we didn't get Paea. I was really hoping for that guy. I like our picks though. Just surprised we didn't go DL at all in top 3 rounds...

We could have had Von Miller at Sam, Nate Irving at Mike, DJ Williams at Will, Ayers and Dumerville at DE, Paea and Austin playing side by side at DT. We would still have needed a Safety and a RT, but I would feel a lot more comfortable with them trying to find guys for those positions than DT's who can make an impact. So...yeah. They got some good players and we are headed in the right direction. I hope they prove me wrong, but I would still have rather they grabbed two DT's.

listopencil
04-29-2011, 09:54 PM
So are you in the group that feels that drafting 1 guy was going to magically fix our run defense immediately just because his position says DT?

Nope. I haven't seen anyone saying that. Read my last post before this one.

DarkHorse
04-29-2011, 10:01 PM
Nope. I haven't seen anyone saying that. Read my last post before this one.

With you on the post - I would like to have a DT as well. 2 even, but i'm not boo'hooing over this entire draft because the coaches, with all of the time and resources available to them, decide against that one position to address other positions in the big picture.

Doesn't seem to be many people on here willing to cheer the fact that the FO is moving in the right direction and attacking our weakest side of the ball. We're heavily drafting defense and implementing changes to fix our D and that's the fact.

We didn't take a DT - so what. They've already shown me that they're directly addressing the problem of defense. I might add that i'm sure they're a little more well informed on the prospects than we are.

Archer81
04-29-2011, 10:52 PM
Shame though that ILB and S are the worst class in the last decade.


Unless they end up being what you think they will be...then it does not matter how weak or strong the class was.


For the rest of the thread...the idea was to add talent to a defense that does not have alot of it. Denver to this point has done it. Not much to complain about.


:Broncos:

enjolras
04-30-2011, 01:23 AM
People are just making excuses / changing their stories now to fit w/ what Denver has done. This board is notorious for it.

If you would have said before the draft that you'd be happy with no DL picks in the first 3 rounds...well, it wouldn't have been pretty. But now, it's all ok??

In any case, we can only hope that this strategy pays off and I can at least be somewhat happy that we improved 3 positions on the defense with some more picks tomorrow, and didn't take Bowers.

Before the draft I was well on record in suggesting that our biggest position of need was Safety, which we at least attempted to address. I haven't changed my position. I wasn't sold on the second round tackles, and the Broncos agreed with me.

KipCorrington25
04-30-2011, 01:36 AM
Yeah, what where they thinking? We should have pulled a McCheat and traded back to then trade up and take reaches or injured guys at positions we didn't need! WTF I'm PISSED!

BowlenBall
04-30-2011, 01:57 AM
Before the draft I was well on record in suggesting that our biggest position of need was Safety, which we at least attempted to address. I haven't changed my position. I wasn't sold on the second round tackles, and the Broncos agreed with me.

Rahim Moore may end up being a stud for us, so I'll reserve judgement on him as a player. As far as roster management and draft theory goes, though....

1) We drafted a free safety in the 2nd round two years ago who's still on the roster;

2) We have a bigger need at strong safety IMHO;

3) Defensive line is generally regarded as a premium position, whereas most teams devalue the safety position comparatively;

and

4) Many of us thought that Champ would transition to FS in his twilight years, which no longer looks possible....

hmmm...

GoHAM
04-30-2011, 08:53 AM
So are you in the group that feels that drafting 1 guy was going to magically fix our run defense immediately just because his position says DT?

Just curious - isn't the first post i've read today that implies this.

Draft any DT - just get a DT and our run defense will be fixed. Got it.

It's not like a scheme change, HC change and getting back Dumervil, moving Ayers to his proper position, etc.... is going to help our run defense game at all. We should have drafted anyone that plays DT - that's the instant fix.

Nope, not saying that 1 DT would magically fix all holes on the defense and turn us into the '85 Bears.

However, investing a high draft pick in the interior DL would at least show a commitment to improving arguably the worst unit on our team. Maybe Orlando Franklin will become a perennial pro-bowler at RT, and it will have been a great value pick. But somehow I doubt his value at that spot was far greater than Paea or Austin's.

Hey, if Nate Irving turns into the next Ray Lewis, good for us and I'll be happy to be wrong, but it still doesn't address the terrible DT position for us. But what good is ILB if there aren't some decent fattys in front to at least slow down the o linemen on their way to the 'backers?

Rohirrim
04-30-2011, 08:55 AM
. But what good is ILB if there aren't some decent fattys in front to at least slow down the o linemen on their way to the 'backers?

Ay, there's the rub.

rugbythug
04-30-2011, 09:15 AM
But what good is ILB if there aren't some decent fattys in front to at least slow down the o linemen on their way to the 'backers?

While this is True. Poor ILB make fatties look bad. You need both.Al Wilson Made a bunch of OK guys look really good.

misturanderson
04-30-2011, 09:16 AM
Rahim Moore may end up being a stud for us, so I'll reserve judgement on him as a player. As far as roster management and draft theory goes, though....

1) We drafted a free safety in the 2nd round two years ago who's still on the roster;

2) We have a bigger need at strong safety IMHO;

3) Defensive line is generally regarded as a premium position, whereas most teams devalue the safety position comparatively;

and

4) Many of us thought that Champ would transition to FS in his twilight years, which no longer looks possible....

hmmm...
word for word, my thoughts exactly other than the fact that I also think the options on our team currently are significantly better than Moore.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
04-30-2011, 09:19 AM
Virtually every poster on this board was hoping against hope for d-line help in this draft, and once again...we got...NOTHING. Gotta love draft day...it's the time to come together and sing kumbaya together while we all swallow the koolaid that it really doesn't matter...trust the all knowing Pat Bowlen and his braintrust, since it could always be worse and they know more than we do and "they've got a plan"...blah blah blah...you're all as dissapointed as I am you just wont' allow youself the luxury of expressing it.

Plain and simple...we ****ed this up big time. Unless they scoop some amazing unknown stud DT out of the bottom of the barrel tomorrow who proves he's the steal of the draft, this draft will go down as a huge wasted opportunity. We literally could have fixed the entire d-line for the next 8 years with one draft...how is it possible we did NOTHING AT ALL to correct our biggest problem in the one draft where it was almost guaranteed we'd have the chance to make real progress?

Yeah, totally sucks that the draft is over.

TheReverend
04-30-2011, 09:20 AM
Personally, I LOVE the no picks on the DL if ONLY for the reason that it's making a bunch of people that feel you build from the front to back, but who don't even know the difference between 0,3,etc and different utilization to freak the **** out.

Fox has gotten some great players to work with and this is just gravy. Never change guys, never change.

mustangtoby
04-30-2011, 12:14 PM
I'll just admit that Fox/Elway know more than me, so I'm gonna trust what their doing. Maybe it will work out, maybe not. I don't know enough about it to say, but I do believe our D is gonna be WAY better next year than it has for a long time!

chadta
04-30-2011, 12:58 PM
I do believe our D is gonna be WAY better next year than it has for a long time!

and what an accomplishment that will be

oy vey