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View Full Version : Bowers or a Defensive Tackle with 2a?


OrangeSe7en
04-28-2011, 09:53 PM
Bowers has really slid. As many has noted, he must have a glaring red flag. But is the first pick of the 2nd the spot where the upside is worth the risk? Or do you take a DT, which is a greater need?

Dukes
04-28-2011, 09:56 PM
We have pass rushers. Now we need a couple fresh fat guys

TheElusiveKyleOrton
04-28-2011, 09:57 PM
Fatbodies. Like Fat Booby. Only skinnier.

Doggcow
04-28-2011, 09:58 PM
I'm happy with austin or bowers or aaron williams (this guy can play safety too which we direly need)

Peae is ok I guess. Sucks that wilkerson, taylor, jordan all bounced off the board so fast :(

Dedhed
04-28-2011, 09:59 PM
DT- There is enough concern with Bowers' health that he would be completely off my board.

BroncoInferno
04-28-2011, 10:05 PM
I love Bowers, but he doesn't fit. He's an edge rusher. With Doom and Miller as the edge rushers, there's simply nowhere to play him. Plus, he has top 5 talent, so the fact that he's still available means that the knee issue must be pretty serious. We don't need to draft another injury risk. Austin or Paea at #36.

OCBronco
04-28-2011, 10:05 PM
If we come away with Bowers, Peaea or Jurrell Casey with 2a, I'll be happy.

UberBroncoMan
04-28-2011, 10:06 PM
We have Doom, Miller and Ayers...no reason to draft a DE when we have **** at DT. Get two studs in the middle and we may have something special next year.

epicSocialism4tw
04-28-2011, 10:06 PM
Best available for Denver:

Bowers
Paea
Austin
Aaron Williams
Kendall Hunter
Drake Nevis
Christian Ballard
Brandon Harris
Jerrell Powe
Kyle Rudolph
Jarvis Jenkins

Two of those guys will likely be available when the Broncos pick at 36 and 46.

orange crusher
04-28-2011, 10:06 PM
Marvin Austin with 2a please. No to Bowers.

BroncoInferno
04-28-2011, 10:07 PM
Best available for Denver:

Bowers
Paea
Austin
Aaron Williams
Kendall Hunter
Drake Nevis
Christian Ballard
Brandon Harris
Jerrell Powe
Kyle Rudolph
Jarvis Jenkins

Two of those guys will likely be available when the Broncos pick at 36 and 46.

Austin is better than Paea, and there is nowhere to play Bowers with Doom and Miller as the edge guys.

OBF1
04-28-2011, 10:09 PM
I'm happy with austin or bowers or aaron williams (this guy can play safety too which we direly need)

Peae is ok I guess. Sucks that wilkerson, taylor, jordan all bounced off the board so fast :(

Dog, You are kidding right? These guys have been 1st round graded for months, just because you hope they fall to Denver does not mean they should have been 2nd rounders.

Any of the following this round would be great:
Bowers
Austin
Paea
Ayers
Rahim Moore is we go safety
Martez Wilson
Ijalana
Houston
Bailey

BroncoInferno
04-28-2011, 10:13 PM
Dog, You are kidding right? These guys have been 1st round graded for months, just because you hope they fall to Denver does not mean they should have been 2nd rounders.

Any of the following this round would be great:
Bowers
Austin
Paea
Ayers
Rahim Moore is we go safety
Martez Wilson
Ijalana
Houston
Bailey

Does no one get that even if Bowers is healthy, there is nowhere to play him? He's an edge rusher....we have to Doom already established as one of those guys and Miller was drafted to be the other. I love Bowers, but he doesn't fit. Austin or Paea.

Doggcow
04-28-2011, 10:14 PM
Dog, You are kidding right? These guys have been 1st round graded for months, just because you hope they fall to Denver does not mean they should have been 2nd rounders.

Any of the following this round would be great:
Bowers
Austin
Paea
Ayers
Rahim Moore is we go safety
Martez Wilson
Ijalana
Houston
Bailey

I know. But they fell further than expected, thus, I think it would have been worth a trade up to snag a fatsnack. Also, easier.

White Horses Inc.
04-28-2011, 10:15 PM
#4 Austin ...1st round talent
#14 Paea ....strong like bull! 48 bench reps

Is that possible? Don't see a larger hole than DT...other than safety....no offense please!

Doggcow
04-28-2011, 10:16 PM
#4 Austin ...1st round talent
#14 Paea ....strong like bull! 48 bench reps

Is that possible? Don't see a larger hole than DT...other than safety....no offense please!

I would jizz in my pants if we got both.

Then maybe DJ Williams in the 3rd or whoever the best TE is.

orange crusher
04-28-2011, 10:17 PM
Dog, You are kidding right? These guys have been 1st round graded for months, just because you hope they fall to Denver does not mean they should have been 2nd rounders.

Any of the following this round would be great:
Bowers
Austin
Paea
Ayers
Rahim Moore is we go safety
Martez Wilson
Ijalana
Houston
Bailey

If they're going Safety, I'd rather take Aaron Williams CB/S over Moore.

Doggcow
04-28-2011, 10:20 PM
If they're going Safety, I'd rather take Aaron Williams CB/S over Moore.

This! I like williams as well. A hawk. He can cover a lot of area for us.

sgbfan
04-28-2011, 10:21 PM
I will be mad if we don't get a DT in this round. Either Austin or Paea. Then either another DT or the best S available. Then MLB or TE in round 3. But can't decide who I would rather have, Paea or Austin.

BroncoInferno
04-28-2011, 10:22 PM
Don't take a safety early. It's a need, but a poor draft for the position. Take Ahamd Black in the 6th (if available). Not much risk at that point, awesome production in college, worst case he's a special teams ace.

BroncoInferno
04-28-2011, 10:25 PM
I will be mad if we don't get a DT in this round. Either Austin or Paea. Then either another DT or the best S available. Then MLB or TE in round 3. But can't decide who I would rather have, Paea or Austin.

Austin would have been a top 5 pick had he not had to sit out a year. The character flags don't bother me because I think A LOT of top prospect collegians are guilty of the same thing without getting caught. Take him if he's there. Paea is great if he isn't (and I'm OK with him even if Austin IS still there, though I think I'd be a missed opportunity at getting greatness).

Gcver2ver3
04-28-2011, 10:26 PM
i don't care what anyone says, if bowers is available at 36, take him...

screw it, i'm swinging for the fences if i'm xanders and crew...

bpa baby....you can never have too many playmakers on defense, esp pass rushers...

besides, its not exactly set in stone ayers is our answer at DE...perhaps bowers beats him out...

Doggcow
04-28-2011, 10:27 PM
Does no one get that even if Bowers is healthy, there is nowhere to play him? He's an edge rusher....we have to Doom already established as one of those guys and Miller was drafted to be the other. I love Bowers, but he doesn't fit. Austin or Paea.

There's always a place. You play 60 minutes at full speed and tell me you're not tired.

BroncoInferno
04-28-2011, 10:28 PM
i don't care what anyone says, if bowers is available at 36, take him...

bpa baby....you can never have too many playmakers on defense, esp pass rushers...

besides, its not exactly set in stone ayers is our answer at DE...perhaps bowers beats him out...

Bowers top skill set is as an edge rusher...where the hell do you play him with Miller and Doom on the edge? Simply not a good fit. You can't even get creative with him with Doom and Miller already there.

sgbfan
04-28-2011, 10:30 PM
Austin would have been a top 5 pick had he not had to sit out a year. The character flags don't bother me because I think A LOT of top prospect collegians are guilty of the same thing without getting caught. Take him if he's there. Paea is great if he isn't (and I'm OK with him even if Austin IS still there, though I think I'd be a missed opportunity at getting greatness).

I would love both. Haven't seen enough of either of them though. I watched Paea a bit and really liked him. I think he was a top 20 pick if he could have worked out.

BroncoInferno
04-28-2011, 10:31 PM
There's always a place. You play 60 minutes at full speed and tell me you're not tired.

Even if you're right (and I don't think you are in this case), we can't afford to take a risk on his knee. I mean, we're talking about a guy who some analysts had #1 overall when the draft process started slipping out of the 1st round...the knee issues MUST be pretty damn serious. How can we justify the risk given what has just happened to BeyBey?

Gcver2ver3
04-28-2011, 10:31 PM
Bowers top skill set is as an edge rusher...where the hell do you play him with Miller and Doom on the edge? Simply not a good fit. You can't even get creative with him with Doom and Miller already there.

miller plays the SAM unless obvious passing downs...

Bowers is an every down 4-3 end...

its not hard to figure this one out...

and on passing downs rotate them all or play one of them inside...

fairly easy question to answer...

BroncoInferno
04-28-2011, 10:34 PM
miller plays the SAM unless obvious passing downs...

Bowers is an every down 4-3 end...

its not hard to figure this one out...

and on passing downs rotate them all or play one of them inside...

fairly easy question to answer...

Actually, you answered it very poorly. None of the three are guys who can pash rush on the inside. A completely different skill set is involved with an edge rusher versus an interior rusher. Doom, Miller, and Bowers are all STRICTLY edge rushers. Bowers is factually a poor fit for us.

Gcver2ver3
04-28-2011, 10:37 PM
Actually, you answered it very poorly. None of the three are guys who can pash rush on the inside. A completely different skill set is involved with an edge rusher versus an interior rusher. Doom, Miller, and Bowers are all STRICTLY edge rushers. Bowers is factually a poor fit for us.

i didnt answer it poorly at all, you just have your own idea of things and appear unable to entertain any other views...

Bowers is strictly a pass rusher?...yeah okay...

carry on...

SonOfLe-loLang
04-28-2011, 10:39 PM
I'd definitely be tempted to take him, but im not a doctor. Some serious talent though

RADRHATR
04-28-2011, 10:40 PM
Aaron Williams is the pick here, Plug him in at Corner or Safety day one. This kid can play.

GoBroncos84
04-28-2011, 10:42 PM
Stephen Paea or Marvin Austin

RhymesayersDU
04-28-2011, 10:42 PM
i didnt answer it poorly at all, you just have your own idea of things and appear unable to entertain any other views...

Bowers is strictly a pass rusher?...yeah okay...

carry on...

do you....

have some sort of learning disability??....

why do you feel the need....

to completely disregard grammar, sentence structure, and basic english?.....

BroncoInferno
04-28-2011, 10:43 PM
i didnt answer it poorly at all, you just have your own idea of things and appear unable to entertain any other views...

Bowers is strictly a pass rusher?...yeah okay...

carry on...

That's his greatest value as a top round pick, yes. Fact. He has the ability to stop the run, but if you can't fit him into your pass rush packages (and we CANT with two edge rushers already highly invested in on the roster) which is his greatest asset, then he isn't a good fit.

Gcver2ver3
04-28-2011, 10:43 PM
Actually, you answered it very poorly. None of the three are guys who can pash rush on the inside. A completely different skill set is involved with an edge rusher versus an interior rusher. Doom, Miller, and Bowers are all STRICTLY edge rushers. Bowers is factually a poor fit for us.
NFL.COM COMBINE PREVIEW

Bowers has the ability to become a franchise NFL defensive end with the potential to dominate against the run and pass. Appears capable of playing DE in different front alignments or inside at defensive tackle in pass rushing situations. Really came into his own as a pass rusher this fall terrorizing ACC opponents to the tune of 16 sacks. Can beat offensive lineman with his athleticism or power. A complete player against the run who can hold up at the point of attack or chase down plays from the backside. Bowers has been dealing with a knee injury, which has caused him to slide from once being considered a No. 1 overall candidate. But he is still one of this year’s truly elite prospects.

you might wanna try reading a scouting report before commenting...

thanks...

Agamemnon
04-28-2011, 10:43 PM
We absolutely MUST pick a DT with one of the next two picks. To do otherwise would be a catastrophe.

That One Guy
04-28-2011, 10:44 PM
I think this is the year we finally get a fatbody. Do it!

sgbfan
04-28-2011, 10:45 PM
i didnt answer it poorly at all, you just have your own idea of things and appear unable to entertain any other views...

Bowers is strictly a pass rusher?...yeah okay...

carry on...

I wouldn't mind bowers actually. It would give us a pretty strong DE combo with Doom, Ayers, and Bowers. Use Bowers and Ayers for obvious rushing downs. Move Ayers inside and Have Bowers and Doom rushing from the outside. Miller would always be a threat to Blitz. It could work. Don't know how they plan on using Miller on third downs though.

tsiguy96
04-28-2011, 10:45 PM
i think hes off denvers draft board:

“@ProfessorHooch: @mortreport @AdamSchefter I gotta know does Denver have shot at Bowers at 36 >> I don't think he passed their physical

Gcver2ver3
04-28-2011, 10:46 PM
do you....

have some sort of learning disability??....

why do you feel the need....

to completely disregard grammar, sentence structure, and basic english?.....

um...because its a message board and not a school paper or a corporate email, maybe?...

u arent really serious, right?...

gunns
04-28-2011, 10:47 PM
Stephen Paea or Marvin Austin

What is Paea's injury and where is he as far as recovery?

razorwire77
04-28-2011, 10:47 PM
Bowers didn't drop from top 5 to top 40 because of some minor knee issue. He has some sort of degenerative knee problem. We've got two legitimate guys to blow up the quarterback (Miller and Doom). Let's get a strong fatty like Pea with 2A and BPA with 2B and call winner, winner chicken dinner.

RhymesayersDU
04-28-2011, 10:47 PM
um...because its a message board and not a school paper or a corporate email, maybe?...

u arent really serious, right?...

So in your off time....

your brain immediately defaults to moron??....

that is....

interesting.. get help soon... for your...

sake...

BroncoInferno
04-28-2011, 10:48 PM
NFL.COM COMBINE PREVIEW


you might wanna try reading a scouting report before commenting...

thanks...

**** you. I am a Clemson fan and watched the guy in literally every game he ever played in on the college level. He is NOT an elite interior rusher. Clemson almost NEVER had him rush from the DT spot....ever! He probably CAN do it to a degree, but not at a level worthy of a top selection. He's a DE edge rusher, PERIOD. Even if his knee wasn't ****ed up (which it must clearly be given his fall from a top 5 pick to out of the 1st), there is NOWHERE to take advantage of his greatest asset....rushing off the edge. You don't take a decent interior rusher (which is the maximum of his interior rush ability) at 2a when guys like Paea and Austin (MUCH more proven at interior rushing) are available.

JCMElway
04-28-2011, 10:49 PM
Let's get M Austin and then trade down!

Gcver2ver3
04-28-2011, 10:51 PM
I wouldn't mind bowers actually. It would give us a pretty strong DE combo with Doom, Ayers, and Bowers. Use Bowers and Ayers for obvious rushing downs. Move Ayers inside and Have Bowers and Doom rushing from the outside. Miller would always be a threat to Blitz. It could work. Don't know how they plan on using Miller on third downs though.

Bowers could be moved inside as well...allowing miller to edge rush...

bigger picture though, its not a must to play all of them at once....

many times they would be coming in for eachother at times...its a rotation...

pass rushers don't grow on trees, and i wouldnt pass them up...

Fox made it a point to remind everyone that we can use free agency for position needs...draft will be all about bpa...

thats a sound strategy...

BroncoInferno
04-28-2011, 10:52 PM
Bowers could be moved inside as well...



No, he couldn't (not a 2nd round level at any rate), no matter how many times you make the claim.

epicSocialism4tw
04-28-2011, 10:53 PM
Bowers' agent's open letter to NFL GM's about his knee:

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/04/12/daquan-bowers-agent-responds-to-reports-of-long-term-knee-issues/

Chondroplasty:
http://www.kneeguru.co.uk/KNEEnotes/chondroplasty

Apparently the fear is that if he hurts that knee in a game, that he'll need microfracture surgery, which is iffy.

But as for being able to play in 2011, it sounds like Bowers is good to go.

OBF1
04-28-2011, 10:54 PM
On the topic of not doing anything.... Austin has not played in over a year and a half.

Gcver2ver3
04-28-2011, 10:55 PM
So in your off time....

your brain immediately defaults to moron??....

that is....

interesting.. get help soon... for your...

sake...

a poster actaully attempting to correct one's grammar on an internet message board...

wow, i thought that was phased out about a decade ago...

okay man, you're on top of things...

lol...

cutthemdown
04-28-2011, 10:57 PM
Rudolph probably won't last until the 2nd pick in the 2nd round, but I sure would like to see him in Denver. He could really give Tebow a much much better chance and after all Tebow being successful means broncos will be good. He just gets down the field so quick, is huge, has big hands, and can block.

Gcver2ver3
04-28-2011, 10:57 PM
No, he couldn't (not a 2nd round level at any rate), no matter how many times you make the claim.

yeah you're right, what do expert scouts know...

you know its not the end of the world to actually admit when you're wrong once in a while...

you should try it sometimes...believe me, you won't die...

*WARHORSE*
04-28-2011, 10:58 PM
Bowers can play both inside and outside.

OrangeSe7en
04-28-2011, 11:01 PM
That's his greatest value as a top round pick, yes. Fact. He has the ability to stop the run, but if you can't fit him into your pass rush packages (and we CANT with two edge rushers already highly invested in on the roster) which is his greatest asset, then he isn't a good fit.

If Bowers can recover from the injury, he's far more explosive than Ayers was. Ayers hasnt done squat. Sure, there's a risk, but theres also enormous uside and Ayers really hasnt shown anything that would make you not never consider upgrading at LE. The injury issue is obviously the big variable though. You can't have too many guys who can rush the passer. And the other thing is that drafting Bowers, doesnt mean Ayers cant still play. But if Bowers helps you get sacks, turnovers, or off the field on 3rd downs, you really should look at it long and hard depending on his health.

Doggcow
04-28-2011, 11:01 PM
**** it. Just read tons on bowers' knee. I'm fine with picking him. Worst case scenario he's a 2nd that busts. Who cares. He could also be a superstar for years to come.

Gcver2ver3
04-28-2011, 11:02 PM
**** it. Just read tons on bowers' knee. I'm fine with picking him. Worst case scenario he's a 2nd that busts. Who cares. He could also be a superstar for years to come.

pretty much this......

BroncoInferno
04-28-2011, 11:02 PM
yeah you're right, what do expert scouts know...

you know its not the end of the world to actually admit when you're wrong once in a while...

you should try it sometimes...believe me, you won't die...

You posted one scout...how many made the claim the he was an elite interior pass rusher? Even the one you posted only said he COULD do it, not that he would be eilte at it. Clemson ALWAYS had him rushing from the edge, maybe a handful of nondescript plays on the interior. I've literally every one of his games. He had essentiakly no valuable interior experior. Even if you don't think I can judge his interior talent (which is certainly fair enough), you can't question the observational fact that he was rarely asked to perform that function. Drafting him at 36 to be an interior rusher would be projection at best, and down right criminal when the clearly serious knee issue is factored in.

BroncoInferno
04-28-2011, 11:05 PM
If Bowers can recover from the injury, he's far more explosive than Ayers was. Ayers hasnt done squat. Sure, there's a risk, but theres also enormous uside and Ayers really hasnt shown anything that would make you not never consider upgrading at LE. The injury issue is obviously the big variable though. You can't have too many guys who can rush the passer. And the other thing is that drafting Bowers, doesnt mean Ayers cant still play. But if Bowers helps you get sacks, turnovers, or off the field on 3rd downs, you really should look at it long and hard depending on his health.

I love this line of reasoning. "Ayers hasn't done squat," but yet an undrafted rookie is somehow a porven commodity? Let me try again. Miller and Doom are our edge rushers. Miller is going to play SAM on running downs, and side to outside rusher on passing downs. Can someone tell me where we put Bowers, who even if healthy is an edge rusher (and no, he's not an interior rusher, has practically no experience doing that).

That One Guy
04-28-2011, 11:06 PM
**** it. Just read tons on bowers' knee. I'm fine with picking him. Worst case scenario he's a 2nd that busts. Who cares. He could also be a superstar for years to come.

Mind giving a quick rundown? I thought it was more likely that he'd never take the field than that he'd play health for 5+ years. Haven't really read into it though, just what I've picked up.

Dedhed
04-28-2011, 11:06 PM
Worst case scenario he's a 2nd that busts. Who cares. He could also be a superstar for years to come.
I care. Do you mean like 1 year before his knee falls off?

The fact that he fell out of the 1st round entirely means the knee is toast.

RaiderH8r
04-28-2011, 11:06 PM
We pull Bowers and then Paea along with Miller that immediately upgrades our front 7 in a way we haven't seen in decades in Denver. Put Doom into that rotation and Ayers too and you can start to do some very interesting things with packages and coverages given the talent and athleticism up front. I like paea if for no other reason than he's stronger than a rabid ox on steroids and he can overtake players in one on one situations and can thus command double teams. I like Bowers because he commands double team. I like Doom because he has to be accounted for on every play and can command a double team. I like Miller because he can just show up in the backfield to knock a QB's dick stiff. These are good things men. Good things.

BroncoInferno
04-28-2011, 11:08 PM
I care.

Me too. Check the posts, I was all about Bowers a few months ago. But given the selection of Miler coupled with this obviously serious knee injury, we can't afford the risk. Hell, even if we took the risk we don't have a spot available where his greatest asset (edge rushing) could be utilized.

That One Guy
04-28-2011, 11:09 PM
We pull Bowers and then Paea along with Miller that immediately upgrades our front 7 in a way we haven't seen in decades in Denver. Put Doom into that rotation and Ayers too and you can start to do some very interesting things with packages and coverages given the talent and athleticism up front. I like paea if for no other reason than he's stronger than a rabid ox on steroids and he can overtake players in one on one situations and can thus command double teams. I like Bowers because he commands double team. I like Doom because he has to be accounted for on every play and can command a double team. I like Miller because he can just show up in the backfield to knock a QB's dick stiff. These are good things men. Good things.

LOL

Gotta say, that never happened to me. Thankfully.

Gcver2ver3
04-28-2011, 11:12 PM
You posted one scout...how many made the claim the he was an elite interior pass rusher? Even the one you posted only said he COULD do it, not that he would be eilte at it. Clemson ALWAYS had him rushing from the edge, maybe a handful of nondescript plays on the interior. I've literally every one of his games. He had essentiakly no valuable interior experior. Even if you don't think I can judge his interior talent (which is certainly fair enough), you can't question the observational fact that he was rarely asked to perform that function. Drafting him at 36 to be an interior rusher would be projection at best, and down right criminal when the clearly serious knee issue is factored in.

okay man, it's all good...

i've never watched him play but i've read numerous scoouting reports...so you know the ONE scouting report i pasted was literally the one and only one i looked up...i typed "Daquan bowers scouting report" and clicked the first one i saw and pasted the results...so unless thats an amazing coincidence in my favor, my guess is i could find plenty more to support my argument...

but it doesnt really matter...i actually respect your opinion, i just didnt feel you truly entertained mine so i brought a little evidence to stumble you up a bit...but if you watched him play that does carry merit with me...

if we pass on bowers i won't be upset esp if we nab a DT....

but bear in mind we still have free agency to address needs...a player like Bowers was potentially a #1 pick...the upside may be worth the risk...you really THAT ceratin ayers will pan out?...i am game for giving him some competition and a guy like bowers will want nothing more than to prove the league wrong for passing him up in the 1st round...

just think about it is all i'm saying...

SonOfLe-loLang
04-28-2011, 11:12 PM
Me too. Check the posts, I was all about Bowers a few months ago. But given the selection of Miler coupled with this obviously serious knee injury, we can't afford the risk. Hell, even if we took the risk we don't have a spot available where his greatest asset (edge rushing) could be utilized.

Miller and Doom wont be playing every play, and this is assuming they stay healthy for 16 games. If you are worried about his knee, ok fine i can obviously understand that. But if you're worry about a fit, i dont think it matters because, as you said, he has elite skill. You can never have too many D-linemen, especially beasts like bowers. A guy like that is always a fit.

Borks147
04-28-2011, 11:12 PM
We pull Bowers and then Paea along with Miller that immediately upgrades our front 7 in a way we haven't seen in decades in Denver. Put Doom into that rotation and Ayers too and you can start to do some very interesting things with packages and coverages given the talent and athleticism up front. I like paea if for no other reason than he's stronger than a rabid ox on steroids and he can overtake players in one on one situations and can thus command double teams. I like Bowers because he commands double team. I like Doom because he has to be accounted for on every play and can command a double team. I like Miller because he can just show up in the backfield to knock a QB's dick stiff. These are good things men. Good things.

I agree - super boner if we get Bowers and Paea. All this safety talk...let the guys we just drafted develop for ****s sake!

OrangeSe7en
04-28-2011, 11:13 PM
I love this line of reasoning. "Ayers hasn't done squat," but yet an undrafted rookie is somehow a porven commodity? Let me try again. Miller and Doom are our edge rushers. Miller is going to play SAM on running downs, and side to outside rusher on passing downs. Can someone tell me where we put Bowers, who even if healthy is an edge rusher (and no, he's not an interior rusher, has practically no experience doing that).

I dont think they know with certainty what theyre going to do with Miller yet. It could turn out that he's better suited and more effective playing on the weakside or on the same side as Doom. Mays could struggle at the Mike and they may realize that Miller and Williams at the Will and Mike is better than DJ and Mays at the Will and Mike.

You're looking at it like Miller was drafted to play Sam when Miller was actually drafted to make plays. However that sorts itself out, has yet to be determined. Bowers is another guy who can make plays if he ends up recovering from his injury. You cant have too many guys who can make plays. Ayers hasnt demonstrated the ability to make plays at all. Maybe he'll turn the corner in that regard but its not like he has been this awesome player where you shouldnt consider upgrading...or trying to.

SonOfLe-loLang
04-28-2011, 11:14 PM
I agree - super boner if we get Bowers and Paea. All this safety talk...let the guys we just drafted develop for ****s sake!

I have to admit this would be a john holmes size boner

The Joker
04-28-2011, 11:14 PM
I want Austin if he's there, think he could be special.

Doggcow
04-28-2011, 11:15 PM
Mind giving a quick rundown? I thought it was more likely that he'd never take the field than that he'd play health for 5+ years. Haven't really read into it though, just what I've picked up.

I think a lot of the scare is that every team has gone "omg those other guys passed on him, ****!"

Sure he could bust, but how often do you get this kind of upside in the 2nd?

BroncoInferno
04-28-2011, 11:19 PM
okay man, it's all good...

i've never watched him play but i've read numerous scoouting reports...so you know the ONE scouting report i pasted was literally the one and only one i looked up...i typed "Daquan bowers scouting report" and clicked the first one i saw and pasted the results...so unless thats an amazing coincidence in my favor, my guess is i could find plenty more to support my argument...

but it doesnt really matter...i actually respect your opinion, i just didnt feel you truly entertained mine so i brought a little evidence to stumble you up a bit...

if we oassm on bowers i won;t be upset esp if we nab a DT....

but bear nin mind we still have free agency to address needs...a player like Bowers was potentially a #1 pick...the upside may be worth the risk...you really THATY ceratin ayers will pan out?...i am game for giving him some competition and a guy like bowers will want nothing more than to prove the league wrong for passing him up in the 1st round...

just think about it is all i'm saying...

OK, man. Sorry if I was being a being a little harsh. Believe me, I WISH TO GOD Bowers made sense at #36. I am a Clemson homer through and through. Hell, I thought we should have drafted James Davis in the 2nd round a couple of years ago (thank god we didn't). But Bowers was strictly an edge guy at Clemson. MAYBE he can rush on the interior, but he certainly wasn't asked to do that at Clemson. Then you have the knee. I mean, this guy was McShay's number 1 propsect a couple of months ago, and now he's out of the 1st? That knee MUST be in bad shape. Even if we could find a spot to take advantage of his skills, the knee would be a MIGHTY big risk.

KevinJames
04-28-2011, 11:21 PM
We need a 3 technique bad Fox says he likes explosive players we gotta get Marvin Austin and at 46 grab Paea if hes there if not grab the BPA S/DT/DE

Dedhed
04-28-2011, 11:22 PM
I want Austin if he's there, think he could be special.I don't see it from Austin at all. I've tried to like him and get excited, but I'm just completely underwhelmed every time I see him on film.

BroncoInferno
04-28-2011, 11:24 PM
Miller and Doom wont be playing every play, and this is assuming they stay healthy for 16 games. If you are worried about his knee, ok fine i can obviously understand that. But if you're worry about a fit, i dont think it matters because, as you said, he has elite skill. You can never have too many D-linemen, especially beasts like bowers. A guy like that is always a fit.

Yeah, but then you are picking Bowers to play what? 30% of the snaps at best? It's just not an efficient pick when the need AND value fits at #36 with Austin or Paea.

KevinJames
04-28-2011, 11:25 PM
I really think Aaron Williams would be a good look at Safety too should Austin be gone.

SonOfLe-loLang
04-28-2011, 11:30 PM
Yeah, but then you are picking Bowers to play what? 30% of the snaps at best? It's just not an efficient pick when the need AND value fits at #36 with Austin or Paea.

I would love either of those guys, but we don't know exactly how we're going to use miller other than, i assume, a lot of zone blitzing. With this in mind, all three of them would be rushing the quarterback, often sending Miller along with Bowers and Doom (overloading sides). Trust me, Miller will be able to beat any lineman with a bit of space, so he'll do fine rushing in or out especially when its spread. As far as third down is concerned, who knows, but im sure any coach would love the possibility to work with all that talent.

Would you really be UPSET if they drafted Bowers?

lostknight
04-28-2011, 11:31 PM
DT and Safety.

OrangeSe7en
04-28-2011, 11:32 PM
I want Austin if he's there, think he could be special.

I dont get the Austin love. Kenrick Ellis actually seems like the better prospect when I watch them.

misturanderson
04-28-2011, 11:33 PM
I think a lot of the scare is that every team has gone "omg those other guys passed on him, ****!"

Sure he could bust, but how often do you get this kind of upside in the 2nd?

Or maybe it's that every team's doctor looked at his knee and the way he performed at his pro day and recognized that he will never be the same player again. That is why they have doctors on staff. Pretty sure the teams aren't passing on a #1 overall talent because other teams passed on him.

epicSocialism4tw
04-28-2011, 11:33 PM
Paea suffered a torn lateral meniscus at the Senior bowl.

Thats not a good injury either.

I'm wondering how that is effecting his fall.

sgbfan
04-28-2011, 11:33 PM
I agree - super boner if we get Bowers and Paea. All this safety talk...let the guys we just drafted develop for ****s sake!

Who did we draft? A fifth round special teamer and a guy thats injured more than greg oden?

Dedhed
04-28-2011, 11:36 PM
Paea suffered a torn lateral meniscus at the Senior bowl.

Thats not a good injury either.

I'm wondering how that is effecting his fall.

A torn meniscus doesn't compare to a bone-on-bone condition. Paea is probably 100% at this point, and if not certainly will be by training camp. Bowers may never be 100% again.

They're not comparable situations.

LongDongJohnson
04-28-2011, 11:36 PM
Ryan Mallet please.

schaaf
04-28-2011, 11:40 PM
Ryan Mallet please.

You're ****ing retarded.

epicSocialism4tw
04-28-2011, 11:40 PM
A torn meniscus doesn't compare to a bone-on-bone condition. Paea is probably 100% at this point, and if not certainly will be by training camp. Bowers may never be 100% again.

There not comparable situations.

I wasnt comparing their situations.

A torn meniscus takes alot of time and rehab as well.

Paladin
04-28-2011, 11:41 PM
I would love either of those guys, but we don't know exactly how we're going to use miller other than, i assume, a lot of zone blitzing. With this in mind, all three of them would be rushing the quarterback, often sending Miller along with Bowers and Doom (overloading sides). Trust me, Miller will be able to beat any lineman with a bit of space, so he'll do fine rushing in or out especially when its spread. As far as third down is concerned, who knows, but im sure any coach would love the possibility to work with all that talent.

Would you really be UPSET if they drafted Bowers?

Yes. It was reported that Bowers' knee was described as "bone-on-bone) and probably degenerative. No surgery is going to repair the knee. Who wants a busted knee? Especially when you can get a healthy Austin or Paea? Or both?

OrangeSe7en
04-28-2011, 11:42 PM
I would love either of those guys, but we don't know exactly how we're going to use miller other than, i assume, a lot of zone blitzing. With this in mind, all three of them would be rushing the quarterback, often sending Miller along with Bowers and Doom (overloading sides). Trust me, Miller will be able to beat any lineman with a bit of space, so he'll do fine rushing in or out especially when its spread. As far as third down is concerned, who knows, but im sure any coach would love the possibility to work with all that talent.

Would you really be UPSET if they drafted Bowers?

Yes. It was reported that Bowers' knee was described as "bone-on-bone) and probably degenerative. No surgery is going to repair the knee. Who wants a busted knee? Especially when you can get a healthy Austin or Paea? Or both?

What makes Austin better than Kenrick Ellis?

Dedhed
04-28-2011, 11:46 PM
I wasnt comparing their situations.

A torn meniscus takes alot of time and rehab as well.
Well, if you didn't before, you just did here by saying "as well". You can't rehab a bone-on-bone condition.

epicSocialism4tw
04-28-2011, 11:48 PM
Well, if you didn't before, you just did here by saying "as well". You can't rehab a bone-on-bone condition.

No, but there are athletes who have had successful surgery and continued to have great careers. Amare Stoudemire and Jason Kidd are two off the top of my head that had full on microfractures. Stoudemire had two I believe. Kidd is like 38 and is still playing.

Bowers is just coming off of the chondroplasty.

You just dont know what you're talking about.

Dedhed
04-28-2011, 11:51 PM
No, but there are athletes who have had successful surgery and continued to have great careers. Amare Stoudemire and Jason Kidd are two off the top of my head that had full on microfractures. Stoudemire had two I believe. Kidd is like 38 and is still playing.

Bowers is just coming off of the chondroplasty.

You just dont know what you're talking about.

Introducing the NBA into your take does not impress me.

Dedhed
04-28-2011, 11:52 PM
You just dont know what you're talking about.

I know that Bowers would have been off the board in the top 10 if he had Paea's knee.

epicSocialism4tw
04-28-2011, 11:54 PM
I know that Bowers would have been off the board in the top 10 if he had Paea's knee.

:rofl:

Right.

Dedhed
04-29-2011, 12:01 AM
:rofl:

Right.

That's about par for you.

epicSocialism4tw
04-29-2011, 12:05 AM
That's about par for you.

Disregarding your baseless, unproveable assertions? Yeah, I'd say thats about par for the course. Eagle sometimes.

Quit being so sensitive. We're just talking football. We're not talking about how the Grateful Dead are darn near unlistenable to anyone who hasnt ingested lysergic acid diethylamide.

OrangeSe7en
04-29-2011, 12:05 AM
That's about par for you.

You're overposting and most of them, like this one, suck.

Cut it out.

LongDongJohnson
04-29-2011, 12:10 AM
You're ****ing retarded.

You wont be saying that when Mallet becomes a probowl QB.

Dedhed
04-29-2011, 12:11 AM
You're overposting and most of them, like this one, suck.

Cut it out.
Got any more "Phil Taylor in the 3rd" gems for us?

OrangeSe7en
04-29-2011, 12:15 AM
Got any more "Phil Taylor in the 3rd" gems for us?

Again, you should really stop posting. You really add little value to discussion.

Dedhed
04-29-2011, 12:19 AM
Disregarding your baseless, unproveable assertions? Yeah, I'd say thats about par for the course. Eagle sometimes.I think it's pretty provable that you don't rehab a bone-on-bone condition. You engage in ever more aggressive surgical options in an attempt to reconstruct a workable joint.

Quit being so sensitive. We're just talking football. We're not talking about how the Grateful Dead are darn near unlistenable to anyone who hasnt ingested lysergic acid diethylamide.
Correction we were talking football right up to this post. Again, about par for you. Whenever you're asked to put an argument together you whine and resort to this kind of crap.

Dedhed
04-29-2011, 12:20 AM
Again, you should really stop posting. You really add little value to discussion.

What are you adding to this discussion, exactly?

OrangeSe7en
04-29-2011, 12:23 AM
What are you adding to this discussion, exactly?

It was my topic, you POS. You've posted in this thread numerous times so dont start acting like its a waste of time.

epicSocialism4tw
04-29-2011, 12:23 AM
I think it's pretty provable that you don't rehab a bone-on-bone condition. You engage in ever more aggressive surgical options in an attempt to reconstruct a workable joint.

You have no idea what the dynamics of his injury are.

Correction we were talking football right up to this post. Again, about par for you. Whenever you're asked to put an argument together you whine and resort to this kind of crap.

The best thing about Deadheads is that they take their stench over to the Haight and leave Ocean Beach to the rest of us. ;D

Dedhed
04-29-2011, 12:26 AM
You have no idea what the dynamics of his injury are.
It was talked about all day pre-draft as a "bone-on-one" situation. The surgery he had is a first step in trying to regenerate tissue that can alleviate a bone-on-bone condition.

BroncoMan4ever
04-29-2011, 12:27 AM
Bowers has really slid. As many has noted, he must have a glaring red flag. But is the first pick of the 2nd the spot where the upside is worth the risk? Or do you take a DT, which is a greater need?

this team needs starters, and if all 32 teams were willing to pass on a guy who at one point mere months ago was almost a unanimous choice to be the number 1 overall pick, there is no way we should take him at 36.

we need solid picks that don't have the injury red flags.

also, considering we now have Doom coming back and Miller the best pass rusher in the draft, we need some fat boys in the middle of the line demanding double teams to let those 2 do what they do best.

listopencil
04-29-2011, 12:44 AM
Austin is better than Paea, and there is nowhere to play Bowers with Doom and Miller as the edge guys.

Really? I was thinking Paea was better. I either way I really want a DT for 2a. I would rather not have Bowers.

epicSocialism4tw
04-29-2011, 12:52 AM
It was talked about all day pre-draft as a "bone-on-one" situation. The surgery he had is a first step in trying to regenerate tissue that can alleviate a bone-on-bone condition.

I provided a link that describes the surgery.

cutthemdown
04-29-2011, 01:06 AM
Broncos may go Safety, TE in the 2nd round. There is huge value there.

pricejj
04-29-2011, 02:46 AM
Stephen Paea - DT - Oregon State

1. All-American
2. Better production than Dareus (45 tackles, 6 sacks this year).
3. Best UT available (Austin had little production before he was suspended).
4. Strong as an ox (49 bench reps 225 lbs. at the combine, combine record).
5. Has only played football for 3 years (started at Oregon State, used to be a rugby player, still learning the position).
6. Great run stuffer because he is short, stout, and gets leverage (6'1" 303 lbs.)
7. Hard-working, easily coachable player, with a good attitude.

IF his knee is fine...

Is exactly what we need at #36, provided Cincy doesn't take him at #35.

A run stuffing DT, who can collapse the pocket and rush the passer. Haloti Ngata Jr.

@ #46:
Kenrick Ellis (NT), Ben Ijalana (OT), or BPA

ol#7
04-29-2011, 03:44 AM
I hope we land Paea as well, but if they swung for the fences on Bowers in the 2nd I wouldnt be upset. Not like they moved back into the first to take him. Also not quite a bone on bone situation as Dedhead makes it seem but it must be really serious for everyone to pass in the 1st. Still, if he comes back, you could generate wicked pressure without having to blitz. Giants proved you can never have too many pass rushers a few years ago. Just dont think its That big a risk in the 2nd round.

BroncoInferno
04-29-2011, 06:50 AM
Really? I was thinking Paea was better. I either way I really want a DT for 2a. I would rather not have Bowers.

Austin would have been a top 15 pick had he played last season. Paea would be a good pick though if Austin is off the board or if the staff deems the character flags on Austin as too risky.

BroncoInferno
04-29-2011, 06:51 AM
Hell, with a little luck, maybe we can get both Austin AND Paea.

BroncoInferno
04-29-2011, 06:57 AM
I would love either of those guys, but we don't know exactly how we're going to use miller other than, i assume, a lot of zone blitzing. With this in mind, all three of them would be rushing the quarterback, often sending Miller along with Bowers and Doom (overloading sides). Trust me, Miller will be able to beat any lineman with a bit of space, so he'll do fine rushing in or out especially when its spread. As far as third down is concerned, who knows, but im sure any coach would love the possibility to work with all that talent.

Would you really be UPSET if they drafted Bowers?

I guess I'm coming around to it. I trust that if they select him they will do so with a plan for how to utilize everyone. I just don't think we can afford to take a risk on that knee. Our 1st round pick from last season is already on the shelf with a serious, potential career ruining injury.

To me, it would make a lot of sense for the Pats to roll the dice on him. They have a ton of picks and not a lot of needs, so it won't be huge deal if it doesn't work for them.

jhns
04-29-2011, 07:03 AM
Bowers top skill set is as an edge rusher...where the hell do you play him with Miller and Doom on the edge? Simply not a good fit. You can't even get creative with him with Doom and Miller already there.

I didn't get past the first page, so maybe this has been said. It is easy to get them on the field. In a 4-3, you have two ends and three LBers. That means those three can be on the field without any of them being out of position. I'm not understanding your take.

I woupd take Bowers if he is there. The upside is just to great to pass up. Even if it takes a while to get the knee healthy, I think he would prove to be worth it in the long run. With that said, I would also love to see some DTs taken in the second.

BroncoInferno
04-29-2011, 07:08 AM
I didn't get past the first page, so maybe this has been said. It is easy to get them on the field. In a 4-3, you have two ends and three LBers. That means those three can be on the field without any of them being out of position. I'm not understanding your take.

I woupd take Bowers if he is there. The upside is just to great to pass up. Even if it takes a while to get the knee healthy, I think he would prove to be worth it in the long run.

Miller's greatest value is rushing the passer off the edge in passing situations, same as Doom and Bowers. You can only bring two guys off the edge at a time. How do we utilize all three? None of those guys have inside rush skills, so you can't really slide anyone inside. You aren't going to have Miller covering a TE at LB on 3rd down

Anyway, I'm starting to warm up to the idea after sleeping on it. I trust that if they pick him they will do so with some kind of plan to utilize everyone. I just don't think we can afford to risk our 2nd pick on that knee when our 1st rounder from last season is on the shelf with an injury that could potential ruin his career.

Traveler
04-29-2011, 07:24 AM
Miller's greatest value is rushing the passer off the edge in passing situations, same as Doom and Bowers. You can only bring two guys off the edge at a time. How do we utilize all three? None of those guys have inside rush skills, so you can't really slide anyone inside. You aren't going to have Miller covering a TE at LB on 3rd down

Anyway, I'm starting to warm up to the idea after sleeping on it. I trust that if they pick him they will do so with some kind of plan to utilize everyone. I just don't think we can afford to risk our 2nd pick on that knee when our 1st rounder from last season is on the shelf with an injury that could potential ruin his career.

BI,

Say we do land Austin at 36. How would you feel if Bowers was there at #46?

No disrespect, but I do find it amusing the argument that we would have too many pass rushers when that's what we've been longing for for years. Nice dilema to have, don't you think?

I believe it was you that made some pretty valid points about drafting for value, regardless of position. The value would be off the charts if we could land Bowers at #46.

As long as we address the DT position at #36, I wouldn't be upset if we took a chance on him. Truth be told, I'm not even sure we keep the pick at #46.

gunns
04-29-2011, 07:32 AM
I really think Aaron Williams would be a good look at Safety too should Austin be gone.

Kiper has us taking Williams at 36 and Christian Ballard at 46. (Which maybe a good reason NOT to take either). No one has wanted a safety more than me, for years, but I'm more concerned with the DL at this point and one will not cut it.

Steve Sewell
04-29-2011, 07:43 AM
I hope we land Paea as well, but if they swung for the fences on Bowers in the 2nd I wouldnt be upset. Not like they moved back into the first to take him. Also not quite a bone on bone situation as Dedhead makes it seem but it must be really serious for everyone to pass in the 1st. Still, if he comes back, you could generate wicked pressure without having to blitz. Giants proved you can never have too many pass rushers a few years ago. Just dont think its That big a risk in the 2nd round.

This whole Bowers situation reminds me of Courtney Brown's. We all know how that turned out.

BroncoInferno
04-29-2011, 07:45 AM
BI,

Say we do land Austin at 36. How would you feel if Bowers was there at #46?

No disrespect, but I do find it amusing the argument that we would have too many pass rushers when that's what we've been longing for for years. Nice dilema to have, don't you think?

I believe it was you that made some pretty valid points about drafting for value, regardless of position. The value would be off the charts if we could land Bowers at #46.

As long as we address the DT position at #36, I wouldn't be upset if we took a chance on him. Truth be told, I'm not even sure we keep the pick at #46.

Oh, I'm all for having a deep rotation of pass rushers. Don't misunderstand me on that point. But those are depth type picks. I'm all for BPA, but the hope is, of course, that the need aligns with the talent. That is the situation we'll be in at 36 unless Paea and Austin both come off the board in the three picks before our selection this evening. Now, if Bowers knee had the green light, he's far and away the BPA, so you snatch him up and worry about about how to use everyone later. Even #46 is too big a risk in my book...if he were to free fall all the way into the 3rd, I'd be fine with pulling the trigger at that point.

IHaveALight
04-29-2011, 07:47 AM
Stephen Paea - DT - Oregon State

1. All-American
2. Better production than Dareus (45 tackles, 6 sacks this year).
3. Best UT available (Austin had little production before he was suspended).
4. Strong as an ox (49 bench reps 225 lbs. at the combine, combine record).
5. Has only played football for 3 years (started at Oregon State, used to be a rugby player, still learning the position).
6. Great run stuffer because he is short, stout, and gets leverage (6'1" 303 lbs.)
7. Hard-working, easily coachable player, with a good attitude.

IF his knee is fine...

Is exactly what we need at #36, provided Cincy doesn't take him at #35.

A run stuffing DT, who can collapse the pocket and rush the passer. Haloti Ngata Jr.

@ #46:
Kenrick Ellis (NT), Ben Ijalana (OT), or BPA

Paea and Ellis FTW!

55CrushEm
04-29-2011, 07:51 AM
OK.....for our next pick, I'm officially on the Stephen Paea bandwagon....for what it's worth (not much), NFL.com has Paea #6 of all prospects remaining.....Austin is WAY below that....again not worth much. But I love this overview.....

"Paea is a powerful run stuffer that plays angry and should contribute immediately at the next level. He is as strong as an ox and consistently knocks lineman back on their heels. He takes on double teams and is near impossible to move out of the hole. He lacks refined pass rushing skills, but has heavy hands and a good burst to eventually become a weapon on third down. He is still learning the finer points of the game, but he has unparalleled toughness and a tireless work ethic. Paea will likely not last past the middle of the first round."

Now we need run-D. Give me some, please !!!

strafen
04-29-2011, 07:53 AM
I'd take my chances with Bowers.
1st round talent, not worth the 1st round because of injury, but definitely a steal on the 2nd round.
We need linemen! we do every year!!!

Drek
04-29-2011, 07:55 AM
I'd take my chances with Bowers.
1st round talent, not worth the 1st round because of injury, but definitely a steal on the 2nd round.
We need linemen! we do every year!!!

If he needs micro-frac surgery he isn't worth a second either.

oubronco
04-29-2011, 07:56 AM
Austin would have been a top 5 pick had he not had to sit out a year. The character flags don't bother me because I think A LOT of top prospect collegians are guilty of the same thing without getting caught. Take him if he's there. Paea is great if he isn't (and I'm OK with him even if Austin IS still there, though I think I'd be a missed opportunity at getting greatness).

Sounds like Marcus Thomas v2.0

55CrushEm
04-29-2011, 07:56 AM
If he needs micro-frac surgery he isn't worth a second either.

Exactly. He's not a "steal" in ANY round, if his knee is junk.

55CrushEm
04-29-2011, 07:57 AM
Sounds like Marcus Thomas v2.0

Yup. That's why I want Paea......"tireless work ethic and unparalleled toughness."

RaiderH8r
04-29-2011, 08:06 AM
paea at 36 and bowers at 46 then rb in the 3rd...that's right rb. we need depth behind chandelier man moreno and there's value there.

Beantown Bronco
04-29-2011, 08:11 AM
I'd definitely be tempted to take him, but im not a doctor.

<iframe width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/iEmbG5G-jgE" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Old Dude
04-29-2011, 08:21 AM
About the Safety spot ....

We've got Champ signed for awhile to come, and the thinking seems to be that he'll move to safety in a couple of years. That would be free safety, wouldn't it?

Dawkins seems to be on his last legs at strong safety. So isn't that what we should be looking for?

As for the D-Line ...

I think if Austin is still there at 2a, he'll be hard to pass up. If he's gone, I wouldn't be surprised to see them try to trade down. It's not like there's any one guy that they absolutely positively have to have.

mwill07
04-29-2011, 08:29 AM
Would y'all be happy with trading 2A for a 2012 first rounder?

Beantown Bronco
04-29-2011, 08:32 AM
Would y'all be happy with trading 2A for a 2012 first rounder?

If it's to what we presume is going to be a crappy team this year, then definitely yes. If to a consistent playoff team, I'd say they need to give us back something later on this year. 3rd or 4th maybe? We need more picks this year.

BowlenBall
04-29-2011, 08:32 AM
1 - Von Miller, OLB
2a - Stephen Paea, DT
2b - Marvin Austin, DT
3a - Dontay Moch, OLB

please please please please please please please please please please

BowlenBall
04-29-2011, 08:34 AM
Would y'all be happy with trading 2A for a 2012 first rounder?

I like the spot, and I like the player's that'll be there (Paea or Austin). Since it's such a high #2, don't really like the idea of trading for a future #1.

However, if we get a 2011 late 2, 3, and 4, then maybe....

Broncoman13
04-29-2011, 08:37 AM
Would y'all be happy with trading 2A for a 2012 first rounder?

I would be a little surprised if they did. Elway has said numerous times that they need 4 starters with the first four picks. I think more than likely you will see them trade 36 for a 4th and move back a few picks.

I think NE will trade 33 to someone that likes Dalton that wants to get in front of Cincy. If Kapernick is available at 36 we are golden! Trade down a few picks and get that 4th rounder.

Broncoman13
04-29-2011, 08:38 AM
I like the spot, and I like the player's that'll be there (Paea or Austin). Since it's such a high #2, don't really like the idea of trading for a future #1.

However, if we get a 2011 late 2, 3, and 4, then maybe....

I would also take athat deal!

Chris
04-29-2011, 08:41 AM
Someone will probably reach for Mock because of his speed. Jokeland?

Broncoman13
04-29-2011, 08:41 AM
If it's to what we presume is going to be a crappy team this year, then definitely yes. If to a consistent playoff team, I'd say they need to give us back something later on this year. 3rd or 4th maybe? We need more picks this year.

Exactly. If Miami offers up a 3rd this year and #1 next year, you take it. If the Jets call with the same deal, you pass!

SonOfLe-loLang
04-29-2011, 08:47 AM
1 - Von Miller, OLB
2a - Stephen Paea, DT
2b - Marvin Austin, DT
3a - Dontay Moch, OLB

please please please please please please please please please please

Moch would just be a redundancy. Wouldnt mind Paea and Austin though.

listopencil
04-29-2011, 09:16 AM
We pull Bowers and then Paea along with Miller that immediately upgrades our front 7 in a way we haven't seen in decades in Denver. Put Doom into that rotation and Ayers too and you can start to do some very interesting things with packages and coverages given the talent and athleticism up front. I like paea if for no other reason than he's stronger than a rabid ox on steroids and he can overtake players in one on one situations and can thus command double teams. I like Bowers because he commands double team. I like Doom because he has to be accounted for on every play and can command a double team. I like Miller because he can just show up in the backfield to knock a QB's dick stiff. These are good things men. Good things.

Lol, yeah. Pretty much.

Rohirrim
04-29-2011, 09:19 AM
I would like Paea or Jenkins at the first pick. I wouldn't touch Austin. Not only has he had issues, but he carries the worst red flag of all - his work ethic has been questioned. Don't forget, his coach suspended him before agent pay thing got him suspended. What was that about? Another possibility is Kyle Rudolph. The Broncos have a gaping hole at the TE position and there will still be some good Dline players at 46. There are some good CBs at 36 too. Aaron Williams is still on the board.

listopencil
04-29-2011, 09:20 AM
1 - Von Miller, OLB
2a - Stephen Paea, DT
2b - Marvin Austin, DT
3a - Dontay Moch, OLB

please please please please please please please please please please


Moch is a OLB? Well, ****. For some reason I was thinking he played inside. I'm not liking that pick then.

listopencil
04-29-2011, 09:22 AM
I would like Paea or Jenkins at the first pick. I wouldn't touch Austin. Not only has he had issues, but he carries the worst red flag of all - his work ethic has been questioned. Don't forget, his coach suspended him before agent pay thing got him suspended. What was that about? Another possibility is Kyle Rudolph. The Broncos have a gaping hole at the TE position and there will still be some good Dline players at 46. There are some good CBs at 36 too. Aaron Williams is still on the board.

Can anyone give a more in depth rundown on Austin? I've seen some wildly different takes on the guy and have been wanting Paea over him.

55CrushEm
04-29-2011, 09:22 AM
Paea better be the pick!

Bring on the crazy Samoan!!!!!

TheElusiveKyleOrton
04-29-2011, 09:26 AM
Paea better be the pick!

Bring on the crazy Samoan!!!!!

This. This all day.

Cleo McDowell
04-29-2011, 09:27 AM
yes

ColoradoDarin
04-29-2011, 09:27 AM
this team needs starters, and if all 32 teams were willing to pass on a guy who at one point mere months ago was almost a unanimous choice to be the number 1 overall pick, there is no way we should take him at 36.

we need solid picks that don't have the injury red flags.

also, considering we now have Doom coming back and Miller the best pass rusher in the draft, we need some fat boys in the middle of the line demanding double teams to let those 2 do what they do best.

This. The 2nd round isn't where our team needs to be taking fliers on injury risks. The Pats, Packers, Steelers - teams full of talent can do that. We need to hit on starters with our first 3 picks.

Gcver2ver3
04-29-2011, 09:28 AM
Can anyone give a more in depth rundown on Austin? I've seen some wildly different takes on the guy and have been wanting Paea over him.

i agree...

some experts have austin significantly higher graded than Paea, and others the exact opposite...

55CrushEm
04-29-2011, 09:28 AM
This. This all day.

I would have been OK if we had traded back yesterday. BUT NOT TODAY! Impact players are gonna be fewer and fewer as the day goes on......Paea, to me, sounds like the best run-stuffing DT on the board right now. I really hope we use #36 and #46 today.....as well as #67

Then we can get another DT in FA.

Gcver2ver3
04-29-2011, 09:29 AM
I would like Paea or Jenkins at the first pick. I wouldn't touch Austin. Not only has he had issues, but he carries the worst red flag of all - his work ethic has been questioned. Don't forget, his coach suspended him before agent pay thing got him suspended. What was that about? Another possibility is Kyle Rudolph. The Broncos have a gaping hole at the TE position and there will still be some good Dline players at 46. There are some good CBs at 36 too. Aaron Williams is still on the board.

he may be too good to pass up at #36...

i wouldnt be mad...

Rohirrim
04-29-2011, 09:32 AM
Can anyone give a more in depth rundown on Austin? I've seen some wildly different takes on the guy and have been wanting Paea over him.

Here's more than you'd ever want to know. ;D

http://www.itsalloverfatman.com/broncos/entry/talegating-marvin-austin

listopencil
04-29-2011, 09:32 AM
i agree...

some experts have austin significantly higher graded than Paea, and others the exact opposite...

I don't know. Is Austin more the penetration DT and Paea more the stuffer?

Doggcow
04-29-2011, 09:35 AM
Moch is a OLB? Well, ****. For some reason I was thinking he played inside. I'm not liking that pick then.

I like moch a lot but idk if we have room for him now. He's got tons of raw talent and I like his measurables. But with doom and miller, we need fatties or dline bad.

55CrushEm
04-29-2011, 09:35 AM
I don't know. Is Austin more the penetration DT and Paea more the stuffer?

That's the way I'm interpreting it.....but I could be wrong. And what I posted on Paea on the previous page, certainly doesn't make it sound like he's a BAD pass rusher....just needs a bit more work.

Again, I'll take the "tireless work ethic" guy over the questionable work ethic guy any day of the week.

listopencil
04-29-2011, 09:41 AM
Here's more than you'd ever want to know. ;D

http://www.itsalloverfatman.com/broncos/entry/talegating-marvin-austin

Thanks, that was a really good read. I would be happy with Paea at 2a and Austin at 2b.


"Austin probably won’t go in the first round as he was once expected to do, but either of Denver's picks in the second round (more likely the later one, but either is fine) would be a good way for the Broncos to pick up Von Miller in the first and still walk away with two solid DL players in, say, Marvin Austin and Stephen Paea. Austin is more of a single-gap penetrator, and Paea more of a two-gap run stuffer, although each is far from only that. Miller is the kind of linebacker that doesn’t come about all that often, and Denver needs newer and better LB material as much as better DL material. Both could be managed, although Denver won’t solve all their problems in one draft.."


Damn. These guys at Fat Man are just crazy good.

listopencil
04-29-2011, 09:42 AM
That's the way I'm interpreting it.....but I could be wrong. And what I posted on Paea on the previous page, certainly doesn't make it sound like he's a BAD pass rusher....just needs a bit more work.

Again, I'll take the "tireless work ethic" guy over the questionable work ethic guy any day of the week.



Grabbing both of them in the second sounds pretty good to me if we can pull it off. Sounds like they would be good playing side-by-side.

Rohirrim
04-29-2011, 09:49 AM
That's the way I'm interpreting it.....but I could be wrong. And what I posted on Paea on the previous page, certainly doesn't make it sound like he's a BAD pass rusher....just needs a bit more work.

Again, I'll take the "tireless work ethic" guy over the questionable work ethic guy any day of the week.

Paea is a much better pass rusher than people think, IMO. Oregon State just didn't use him that way. But some scouts put him close to Alualu as far as quickness. He's got major league strength.

BTW, he's not Samoan. He's a Maori, from New Zealand, and then moved to Tonga where he made a name for himself playing rugby before coming to the U.S. at 16 where he learned football.

Cito Pelon
04-29-2011, 09:52 AM
Well, Paea could last to #46. Denver could grab Austin at 36 AND Paea.

I'm still wondering if Denver is looking at Kaepernick with one of the 2nd rounders. One of the QB-hungry teams that passed on QB in round one might be looking at him - Washington, Seattle, Cleveland, Arizona.

listopencil
04-29-2011, 09:56 AM
Paea is a much better pass rusher than people think, IMO. Oregon State just didn't use him that way. But some scouts put him close to Alualu as far as quickness. He's got major league strength.

BTW, he's not Samoan. He's a Maori, from New Zealand, and then moved to Tonga where he made a name for himself playing rugby before coming to the U.S. at 16 where he learned football.

That would work well. I like the idea of one DT being more of a stuffer and one being more of a penetrator but the best situation is to have two guys that are good enough at both that they can't be simply eliminated by the blocking scheme.

listopencil
04-29-2011, 09:59 AM
Well, Paea could last to #46. Denver could grab Austin at 36 AND Paea.

I'm still wondering if Denver is looking at Kaepernick with one of the 2nd rounders. One of the QB-hungry teams that passed on QB in round one might be looking at him - Washington, Seattle, Cleveland, Arizona.

I hope not unless we get a trade for Orton that gives us another 2nd.

Chris
04-29-2011, 10:02 AM
Thanks, that was a really good read. I would be happy with Paea at 2a and Austin at 2b.

Damn. These guys at Fat Man are just crazy good.

It's my buddy's site (along with a few other guys). I'll share all the praise with him.

listopencil
04-29-2011, 10:04 AM
It's my buddy's site (along with a few other guys). I'll share all the praise with him.

I love that site. The articles are well written and the content is great. I'm pretty sure that there are a lot of other people here that feel the same way I do.

Rohirrim
04-29-2011, 10:07 AM
If I were to guess how the first three picks will go tonight:

33. Patriots - Aaron Williams, CB
34. Bills - Ras I Dowling, CB
35. Bengals - Da'Quan Bowers, DE

Dedhed
04-29-2011, 10:18 AM
Paea is a much better pass rusher than people think, IMO. Oregon State just didn't use him that way. But some scouts put him close to Alualu as far as quickness. He's got major league strength.

BTW, he's not Samoan. He's a Maori, from New Zealand, and then moved to Tonga where he made a name for himself playing rugby before coming to the U.S. at 16 where he learned football.I agree on Paea. I see a guy who's tremendously quick off the ball and has tremendous strength. He can hold up against a double team, and he can toss a single guard around. I think he's more of a penetrator than people give him credit for, and he's amazingly fluid in space and in pursuit for a 300 pounder.

Add in a Maori motor and a rugby mentality, and he's a player who I don't think will disappoint.

listopencil
04-29-2011, 10:21 AM
I agree on Paea. I see a guy who's tremendously quick off the ball and has tremendous strength. He can hold up against a double team, and he can toss a single guard around. I think he's more of a penetrator than people give him credit for, and he's amazingly fluid in space and in pursuit for a 300 pounder.

Add in a Maori motor and a rugby mentality, and he's a player who I don't think will disappoint.

I think I can now officially say that if we get Paea and Austin in the 2nd round I will JIMP.

Gcver2ver3
04-29-2011, 10:23 AM
If I were to guess how the first three picks will go tonight:

33. Patriots - Aaron Williams, CB
34. Bills - Ras I Dowling, CB
35. Bengals - Da'Quan Bowers, DE

looks like bengals going QB...

cmhargrove
04-29-2011, 10:27 AM
Well, Paea could last to #46. Denver could grab Austin at 36 AND Paea.

I'm still wondering if Denver is looking at Kaepernick with one of the 2nd rounders. One of the QB-hungry teams that passed on QB in round one might be looking at him - Washington, Seattle, Cleveland, Arizona.

I'm not arguing with the possibility, but i sure hope not. I would much rather take two DT's, or a pass catching TE, a RT, or a starting Free Safety. Please God, no quarterbacks this draft.

listopencil
04-29-2011, 10:27 AM
...or, suppose trades begin before this round and we can trade Orton to MINN for their 2nd and get Paea, Bowers, Austin?

listopencil
04-29-2011, 10:28 AM
Goddammit I have had way too much coffee this morning.

Cito Pelon
04-29-2011, 10:33 AM
I hope not unless we get a trade for Orton that gives us another 2nd.

That would be nice. Kind of a gamble to go into a season with two unseasoned QB's and Brady Quinn, but sometimes you have to roll the dice and pray. And they'd still get a decent DT prospect.

listopencil
04-29-2011, 10:34 AM
http://www.merchandisingplaza.co.uk/images/products/27710/img2.jpg



"With one hundred seventy four picks in the second round, the Denver Broncos pick EVERY ****ING DEFENSIVE LINEMAN STILL AVAILABLE! Aaaaaauuugh!"

srphoenix
04-29-2011, 10:39 AM
...or, suppose trades begin before this round and we can trade Orton to MINN for their 2nd and get Paea, Bowers, Austin?

With MINN taking Ponder in the 1st there is no way Orton is going there. I'm hoping the Cardinals might be willing to give up their 2nd but at this point I'll be happy if we get a 3rd out of Orton.

I really hope we take Paea at 2a though, if not him it better be Austin. We might end up having a pretty scary D after all next year

Cito Pelon
04-29-2011, 10:41 AM
There's still quite a few BPA's available. Maybe not "need" positions, but good roster-builders.

Mikel LeShoure, Kyle Rudolph.

Breaker
04-29-2011, 10:44 AM
I want us to grab Marvin Austin with the 34 and then get Raheem Moore with the next one. If Austin and Bowers are gone .. Moore is absolutely the guy

Dedhed
04-29-2011, 10:47 AM
There's still quite a few BPA's available. Maybe not "need" positions, but good roster-builders.

Mikel LeShoure, Kyle Rudolph.

I would rate them as follows BPA:

Paea>Rudolph>LeShoure>Austin

Hercules Rockefeller
04-29-2011, 10:48 AM
If I were to guess how the first three picks will go tonight:

33. Patriots - Aaron Williams, CB
34. Bills - Ras I Dowling, CB
35. Bengals - Da'Quan Bowers, DE

Michael Smith said this morning he thought the Pats would take a pass rusher, forgot the 2 he named, but it wasn't anyone that people want the Broncos to take.

Bengals tried to acquire the Pack pick at #32 last night to take a QB, would assume they take one tonight.

Wouldn't be shocked if the Bills take a QB either, no matter what they say about Edwards.

Hercules Rockefeller
04-29-2011, 10:49 AM
...or, suppose trades begin before this round and we can trade Orton to MINN for their 2nd and get Paea, Bowers, Austin?

Ponder

RaiderH8r
04-29-2011, 10:56 AM
WAS picked up a second rounder in their move back yesterday...they need a QB...

Hercules Rockefeller
04-29-2011, 10:59 AM
WAS picked up a second rounder in their move back yesterday...they need a QB...

41, 144, and 155 for 36

RaiderH8r
04-29-2011, 11:03 AM
41, 144, and 155 for 36

That's not too shabby but how much risk do we run at not getting any of the DL help we need by jumping back those 5 spots? WAS may want to jump up to grab Dalton if Cincy doesn't go for him.

tsiguy96
04-29-2011, 11:04 AM
denver has multiple offers to move down if the guy is on the board. patriots i can almost gaurantee will pick up a 1 next year. giving them 3 #1s. and a future of SBs.

Hercules Rockefeller
04-29-2011, 11:06 AM
That's not too shabby but how much risk do we run at not getting any of the DL help we need by jumping back those 5 spots? WAS may want to jump up to grab Dalton if Cincy doesn't go for him.

Not sure if #36 is the pick I want them to move down from, but I want them to trade down at least once today to get a 4th or 5th, so there isn't a gap from the early 3rd until the mid-6th.

TheReverend
04-29-2011, 11:08 AM
41, 144, and 155 for 36

We won't be getting the best of Mike. Ever.

He just bent Jax over. I'll bet Snyder likes being on the right side of that for once.

Kerrigan would've been a GREAT player for Jacksonville and somehow he jedi mind tricked them into a flashy product of Mike Mayock while grabbing their 2nd rounder and the player they really wanted.

FML I miss him.

The Moops
04-29-2011, 11:10 AM
I would trade up with first 2nd to try and get bowers. If they get him, then use the second 2nd to move down . . .

Chris
04-29-2011, 11:12 AM
I think if we could we'd trade Orton to the Cards for their 2nd rounder.

Inkana7
04-29-2011, 11:17 AM
We won't be getting the best of Mike. Ever.

He just bent Jax over. I'll bet Snyder likes being on the right side of that for once.

Kerrigan would've been a GREAT player for Jacksonville and somehow he jedi mind tricked them into a flashy product of Mike Mayock while grabbing their 2nd rounder and the player they really wanted.

FML I miss him.

Yeah his great draft choices will surely be missed.

/starts Shanahan flame war

55CrushEm
04-29-2011, 11:17 AM
Paea is a much better pass rusher than people think, IMO. Oregon State just didn't use him that way. But some scouts put him close to Alualu as far as quickness. He's got major league strength.

BTW, he's not Samoan. He's a Maori, from New Zealand, and then moved to Tonga where he made a name for himself playing rugby before coming to the U.S. at 16 where he learned football.

Whoops. Ha!

ColoradoDarin
04-29-2011, 11:19 AM
I don't mind moving down from 46, but I'd rather we just stick and draft Paea at 36 if he's there.

Cito Pelon
04-29-2011, 11:20 AM
WAS picked up a second rounder in their move back yesterday...they need a QB...

So, that would be Mallet, Andy Dalton, or Kaepernick?

TheReverend
04-29-2011, 11:21 AM
Yeah his great draft choices will surely be missed.

/starts Shanahan flame war

Not taking bait.

TheReverend
04-29-2011, 11:22 AM
So, that would be Mallet, Andy Dalton, or Kaepernick?

I think Mike is going after Mallet tonight.

Arkie
04-29-2011, 11:22 AM
Bowers may be the steal of the draft. At this point he's a great value. He's the BPA, and Denver said they would go BPA and not reach for a need.

Cito Pelon
04-29-2011, 11:25 AM
We won't be getting the best of Mike. Ever.

He just bent Jax over. I'll bet Snyder likes being on the right side of that for once.

Kerrigan would've been a GREAT player for Jacksonville and somehow he jedi mind tricked them into a flashy product of Mike Mayock while grabbing their 2nd rounder and the player they really wanted.

FML I miss him.

Just curious, who runs the show now in WASH - Bruce Allen or Shanny?

Cito Pelon
04-29-2011, 11:28 AM
Not sure if #36 is the pick I want them to move down from, but I want them to trade down at least once today to get a 4th or 5th, so there isn't a gap from the early 3rd until the mid-6th.

I don't know about that, doesn't sound like a good idea. Too many good players available with 36 and 46.

Dedhed
04-29-2011, 11:30 AM
FML I miss him.

Shanny would have taken Bowers at #2.

Dedhed
04-29-2011, 11:31 AM
Bowers may be the steal of the draft. At this point he's a great value. He's the BPA, and Denver said they would go BPA and not reach for a need.He's not the BPA if he can't play.

Requiem
04-29-2011, 11:32 AM
Bowers the steal of the draft? Shut up.

He isn't a steal when most teams have removed him from their board because he has a bone on bone degenerative knee condition.

Hulamau
04-29-2011, 11:33 AM
Bowers top skill set is as an edge rusher...where the hell do you play him with Miller and Doom on the edge? Simply not a good fit. You can't even get creative with him with Doom and Miller already there.

I do see youir point BI and I agree we have more pressing needs now. But technically having Bowers and Doom at DE doenst at al lerpclude letting Miller loose from the outside .. or inside ... edge as well. That is what no doubt Deniins Allen has in mind with Miller, Ayers and Doom now!

The Offense simply cant block all three one or more will hardly be touched! Pick your poison!

However, I concur with you that with a first round pick locked up in Ayers and with him coming into year 3 of maturation it makes no sense to add another pass rusher when we have more wide body, LB and safety needs.

ColoradoBuff
04-29-2011, 11:40 AM
I wouldn't be surprised if Denver doesn't take DT Jarvis Jenkins with one of the 2nd round picks. They are really high on him.

Arkie
04-29-2011, 11:40 AM
He's not the BPA if he can't play.

He's top 5 if he can play. It's a gamble. Let's say he has a 30% chance of reaching his potential. It's worth taking a chance at a top 5 pick at some point in the draft, no matter how slim the chances.

Broncoman13
04-29-2011, 11:40 AM
I think Mike is going after Mallet tonight.

5.2 40 and not very athletic to boot... I think you can count on Mike going after Kapernick!

Broncoman13
04-29-2011, 11:42 AM
I wouldn't be surprised if Denver doesn't take DT Jarvis Jenkins with one of the 2nd round picks. They are really high on him.

Wait, what?

TheReverend
04-29-2011, 11:44 AM
Just curious, who runs the show now in WASH - Bruce Allen or Shanny?

I have no idea. I wish I could follow them and Chicago closer, but I spend way too much time of my free time on Denver and a lot on the Cardinals as well. That trade reeked of Mike though, imo. As did their "lol we're not saying anything other than we like 4 guys" leading up to the draft.

Dedhed
04-29-2011, 11:46 AM
He's top 5 if he can play. It's a gamble. Let's say he has a 30% chance of reaching his potential. It's worth taking a chance at a top 5 pick at some point in the draft, no matter how slim the chances.

It's a gamble for a franchise with a solid roster. It's an absurdity for a franchise in full blown rebuilding mode. We can't afford that kind of gamble AT ALL.

KO5K
04-29-2011, 11:47 AM
Paea please.

ColoradoBuff
04-29-2011, 11:56 AM
got this off of a podcast....

Lots of buzz that Denver will take Jarvis Jenkins to fill their DT hole in the 2nd round. He's a guy who has really flown under the radar, but is a legit top 40 pick.

Dedhed
04-29-2011, 11:57 AM
Paea please.

I want me a Paea/Ijalana 2nd round.

Rohirrim
04-29-2011, 12:00 PM
got this off of a podcast....

Lots of buzz that Denver will take Jarvis Jenkins to fill their DT hole in the 2nd round. He's a guy who has really flown under the radar, but is a legit top 40 pick.

Paea and Jenkins works for me. :thumbs:

Dedhed
04-29-2011, 12:05 PM
Paea and Jenkins works for me. :thumbs:

I'd prefer that to having Austin in the mix.

Carmelo15
04-29-2011, 12:27 PM
Jenkins is more of a 4-3 nose right?

bpc
04-29-2011, 12:29 PM
Leshoure, Martinez, Paea, and J. Casey all in play IMO. Take the BPA. We need to protect the QB with a powerful running threat and I think Mikel is the best HB in the draft.

TheReverend
04-29-2011, 12:32 PM
Jenkins is more of a 4-3 nose right?

Doesn't matter

schaaf
04-29-2011, 12:32 PM
That would be amazing if Jenkins was drafted before Bowers... never could have guessed that

Bronco Yoda
04-29-2011, 12:37 PM
I vote NO on Bowers.

Chris
04-29-2011, 01:24 PM
I do see youir point BI and I agree we have more pressing needs now. But technically having Bowers and Doom at DE doenst at al lerpclude letting Miller loose from the outside .. or inside ... edge as well. That is what no doubt Deniins Allen has in mind with Miller, Ayers and Doom now!

The Offense simply cant block all three one or more will hardly be touched! Pick your poison!

However, I concur with you that with a first round pick locked up in Ayers and with him coming into year 3 of maturation it makes no sense to add another pass rusher when we have more wide body, LB and safety needs.

lerpclude.

new.

favourite.

word.

listopencil
04-29-2011, 01:25 PM
Ponder

Oh ****, forgot about him. Yeah that would've been really nice.

55CrushEm
04-29-2011, 02:17 PM
Compare Paea and Austin......

Paea......

Positives: "Explosive, one-gap defensive tackle who plays with great intensity. Fires off the snap with a terrific first step, plays with outstanding pad level and gets leverage on opponents. Built low to the ground, keeps his feet driving up the field, and works hard until the whistle blows. Knifes through blocks on the inside, fluid changing direction and displays an array of moves with his hands getting off blocks. Slides laterally down the line to make plays, rarely off his feet, and draws extra attention from opponents."

Negatives: Easily out-positioned or neutralized at the point by a single blocker. Lacks great bulk on the inside. Did not improve as much as a senior as most scouts thought was possible.

Analysis: "Paea is a tremendous college defensive lineman who plays with a nonstop motor. Size is a limiting factor yet if put in a position to best use his talents, he will undoubtedly produce at the next level as a starter. He would be best as a three-technique lineman or one-gap tackle."



Austin......

Positives: "Athletic defensive line prospect who can dominate the action when focused on the task at hand. Breaks down well, plays with balance, and rarely knocked off his feet. Works his hands throughout the action, fluid changing direction, and shows a burst of speed pursuing from the back side. Flashes power in his lower body, bullrushes blockers off the line, and will collapse the pocket. Shows the ability to drop into space and get depth on pass drops during zone blitzes. Effectively makes plays in space on occasion."

Negatives: Easily blocked at the point by ordinary opponents too often. Seems disinterested at times. Will make a dominant play then disappear for stretches. Marginally productive on the college level and never met expectations late in his North Carolina career.

Analysis: "Austin is a prospect who passes the eyeball test and flashes the ability to dominate opponents, as is normal for elite prospects. But he lacks consistency and leaves scouts thinking he's capable of much more. He has a skill to be a productive starter in the NFL as a conventional defensive tackle yet must make football a priority, decide to play hard for 60 minutes, and stay away from off-the-field distractions to have a long career."


PLEASE GIVE ME SOME PAEA !!!!

And as far as the size being a limiting factor.......where have we heard that before?? Zach Thomas? Al Wilson? Elvis Dumervil? Give me the high-motor guy that wants to dominate every play.....he'll overcome any "size" issues.

cmhargrove
04-29-2011, 02:30 PM
Paea may weigh less than some of his counterparts, but I'll assume that much of the difference is body fat. 49 bench reps is twice as much as many other d-linemen put up, so the size thing shouldn't be an issue. He's a damn Polynesian, he could be whatever weight we asked him to be

55CrushEm
04-29-2011, 02:35 PM
I have to say, at #36, if we don't get Paea.....I'll be disappointed.

If it makes sense....MORE disappointed than if we hadn't gotten Miller at #2 (because there were a couple other players I'd have been ecstatic with at that spot).

I really want a young DT that can grow with the team and that busts his balls every play.

Please, please, please......let the #36 pick be Paea!!!!

55CrushEm
04-29-2011, 02:37 PM
Dude's legs are massive as well

Yeah, his strength must be off the charts ridiculous......the leg drive that the analysis mentioned, as well as his bench......the dude is just STRONG.

oubronco
04-29-2011, 02:39 PM
Paea Highlights

http://youtu.be/Ky_zxdQ75Lw

Bronco Yoda
04-29-2011, 02:42 PM
I vote Yes on Paea.

Rohirrim
04-29-2011, 02:42 PM
This would be my dream draft for the second and third:

2a. Paea
2b. Jenkins
3. Colin McCarthy

Then, we come out with a front seven of Ayers, Paea, Jenkins, Doom with a LB corps of Miller, Colin and DJ.

KO5K
04-29-2011, 02:46 PM
This would be my dream draft for the second and third:

2a. Paea
2b. Jenkins
3. Colin McCarthy

Then, we come out with a front seven of Ayers, Paea, Jenkins, Doom with a LB corps of Miller, Colin and DJ.

It's crazy how we could go from such a garbage front 7 to one to get really excited about in just one off season.

Carmelo15
04-29-2011, 02:47 PM
This would be my dream draft for the second and third:

2a. Paea
2b. Jenkins
3. Colin McCarthy

Then, we come out with a front seven of Ayers, Paea, Jenkins, Doom with a LB corps of Miller, Colin and DJ.

Would love this! Colin McCarthy has been compared to Dan Morgan. John Fox knows a little something about that!

cutthemdown
04-29-2011, 02:48 PM
If DJ Williams even on Broncos next yr. He could be a late subtraction via trade at some point. I doubt Elway thinks he is a hard worker. He is an underachieving partier who fails to make big plays. I think we would be better off moving him and letting Miller play the weakside.

TheReverend
04-29-2011, 02:50 PM
This would be my dream draft for the second and third:

2a. Paea
2b. Jenkins
3. Colin McCarthy

Then, we come out with a front seven of Ayers, Paea, Jenkins, Doom with a LB corps of Miller, Colin and DJ.

Interesting thought. I'd like Socal's opinion on McCarthy

Carmelo15
04-29-2011, 02:52 PM
If DJ Williams even on Broncos next yr. He could be a late subtraction via trade at some point. I doubt Elway thinks he is a hard worker. He is an underachieving partier who fails to make big plays. I think we would be better off moving him and letting Miller play the weakside.

I don't get this constant D.J. bashing. Is he as good as he could be? No he could be every bit as good as Jonathan Vilma. But besides Elvis & Champ he's the best player we have on defense. Our defense is terrible. Why trade on of the few decent players we have?

KO5K
04-29-2011, 02:52 PM
If DJ Williams even on Broncos next yr. He could be a late subtraction via trade at some point. I doubt Elway thinks he is a hard worker. He is an underachieving partier who fails to make big plays. I think we would be better off moving him and letting Miller play the weakside.

He's looking at a suspension as well.

Carmelo15
04-29-2011, 03:03 PM
Paea Highlights

http://youtu.be/Ky_zxdQ75Lw

Holy crap this guy is scary! Did you see what he did to USC? You just converted me to a Paea fan. Take him over Austin please.

Rohirrim
04-29-2011, 03:07 PM
It's crazy how we could go from such a garbage front 7 to one to get really excited about in just one off season.

Plus, there would be youth on the D across the board.

Chris
04-29-2011, 03:08 PM
In anticipation of Paea being our pick

<iframe width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/c-lrE2JcO44" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

BowlenBall
04-29-2011, 03:12 PM
Holy crap this guy is scary! Did you see what he did to USC? You just converted me to a Paea fan. Take him over Austin please.

That was a pretty amazing video -- dude's strength is pretty impressive.

Sigh... now I'm gonna be pissed when we pass on him....

pricejj
04-29-2011, 03:30 PM
I think I can now officially say that if we get Paea and Austin in the 2nd round I will JIMP.

Paea and Austin play the same position... Under Tackle, the pass rushing tackle in a 40 front. Austin's scouting report claims he is a better pass rusher than Paea, but he isn't. Paea has more sacks in his career (13 over 3 years) (including 6 this year), than Austin (9 over 3 years). Plus Paea is a GREAT run stuffer, and he has only been playing football for 3 YEARS!

Jarvis Jenkins would be too light for an NT at 310 lbs. (on a VERY small line as it is). Plus he doesn't have much production at the college level.

#36 Paea
#46 Kenrick Ellis (NT, 6'5" 346 lbs.), Ben Ijalana (OT), or BPA
~rest of draft - BPA

Rohirrim
04-29-2011, 03:52 PM
Paea and Austin play the same position... Under Tackle, the pass rushing tackle in a 40 front. Austin's scouting report claims he is a better pass rusher than Paea, but he isn't. Paea has more sacks in his career (13 over 3 years) (including 6 this year), than Austin (9 over 3 years). Plus Paea is a GREAT run stuffer, and he has only been playing football for 3 YEARS!

Jarvis Jenkins would be too light for an NT at 310 lbs. (on a VERY small line as it is). Plus he doesn't have much production at the college level.

#36 Paea
#46 Kenrick Ellis (NT, 6'5" 346 lbs.), Ben Ijalana (OT), or BPA
~rest of draft - BPA

That's odd.

Best of defensive line prospects: Jarvis Jenkins, Clemson, 6-4, 310, 2-3...Jenkins has been overshadowed by Bowers but that hasn't limited his production. After leading all Clemson defensive linemen with 69 tackles (11 for loss) in 2009, Jenkins backed that up with a first-team All-ACC senior season that included 51 tackles (nine for loss), to go along with 16 quarterback pressures. He also displayed special-teams acumen with a Clemson-record four blocked kicks during his career. Jenkins has excellent size and strength, and will fit in a number of schemes, including outside in a 3-4.
Derek Harper & Jeff Reynolds, The Sports Xchange

Come to think of it, I won't be a bit surprised if Jenkins is the first guy off the board tonight, to the Pats.