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maven
02-15-2011, 11:01 AM
From the Boston globe:

At one point in his career, James Farrior was considered a bust.

The eighth overall pick by the Jets in the 1997 draft, the linebacker out of Virginia did little damage in New York his first four seasons, playing as a part-time starter and averaging just 36.5 tackles a season.

His explosion in 2001, with a career high number of stops (116), was a sign of things to come. But not to the Jets, who released him at the end of the season.

-------------------

He was a reserve OLB playing out of position because the Jets didnt think he could play. It's the SAME reason they didnt even try to resign him. It's the SAME reason Pitt got him for pennies on the dollar.

I liked your assertion of "Doesnt matter he was a first round pick!"

Since that's all that matters, we must have had the best front 7 ever a few years ago when the only players that werent HIGH 1st rounders were Ian Gold and Mike Myers.

You wrote he "busted" as a Jet. Thanks for the article to prove my point he wasn't a bust with ny. Also, there's not two first round picks on the Pitt front 7, there's four including farrior.

TheReverend
02-15-2011, 11:10 AM
You wrote he "busted" as a Jet. Thanks for the article to prove my point he wasn't a bust with ny. Also, there's not two first round picks on the Pitt front 7, there's four including farrior.

Ha!

The article itself calls him a bust with NY! Jesus...

bendog
02-15-2011, 01:43 PM
Your stupidosity never ceases to amaze.

2010: 25th pass D, 31st run D

2009: 3rd pass D, 26th run D

2008: 26th pass D, 27th run D

2007: 7th pass D, 30th run D

I'm not disagreeing, but since Den's defense lays down faster against the run than hookers at a political convention, there's little reason to pass at all. So, it's possible our pass defense really does suck as bad as our run defense.

bronco0608
02-15-2011, 05:10 PM
Settle down on your rage issues bro. And the pro bowl argument was adorable. Do you have any idea how hard it is for a 3-4 DE to get into the pro bowl when theyre being judged against 4-3 DEs piling up sacks?

And it is easy for nose tackles to make the pro bowl when they are being judged against 4-3 DTs piling up sacks?

Casey Hampton has never had more than 45 tackles in a season and has a career total of 9 sacks. That's right, 9 sacks for his whole career, yet he has made 5 pro bowls.

The best argument for Keisel making the pro bowl is because offenses have to double team Hampton every play (thats why he has gone to 5 pro bowls) and try to contain Harrison with a tackle and a back, leaving Keisel one on one for the entire game.

Keisel is a fine player, no dobut. Be he is far from being the Steelers best DL. He got one pro bowl under has name, good for him.

Bob's your Information Minister
02-15-2011, 05:11 PM
I'll laugh if you guys draft a corner that high.

Complete waste of resources in the modern NFL.

TheReverend
02-15-2011, 05:14 PM
I'll laugh if you guys draft a corner that high.

Complete waste of resources in the modern NFL.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/1d/Tyson_Jackson.JPG/800px-Tyson_Jackson.JPG

Bob's your Information Minister
02-15-2011, 05:21 PM
That's a very good comparison.

Tyson Jackson was a completely wasted pick.

bronco0608
02-15-2011, 05:24 PM
Do you need me to repeat how I spot an ignoramus?

Look up these 2 words:

1-Fact
2-Opinion

Very simple: you make unsubstantiated claims, and when you get called out, you b****. Funny.

Let me give you some examples because I know you have trouble following along:

You say the Steelers avoid draft DL in the first round. I point you to their last 10 drafts and show you how you are wrong. Are you following? Baby steps here.

You then say that Patrick Peterson shut down AJ Green in their matchup against each other. I then point out to you an article/box score showing that Green had a 100 yards on 5 catches in the matchup. I then show that Peterson gave up two long plays in that game which totaled for over 80 yards. Following here, or are you confused?

Or the time you told the board about how the Jets shut down Brady in the playoffs by playing man-to-man. I then pointed out to you various articles stating that Jets confused Brady by playing zone that game, a departure from their earlier meetings, and that confused Brady. Brady stated as much.

And those are just three examples.

Do you even know what an opinion is? How about a fact?

In essence, you cannot back up anything with any articulable facts, and resort to posts like this when you are proven wrong with facts.

TheReverend
02-15-2011, 05:36 PM
That's a very good comparison.

Tyson Jackson was a completely wasted pick.

Drafting at #5 last year, KC selected a DB. It was a great pick, but let's not pretend Berry is the athlete/player Peterson is either.

Tombstone RJ
02-15-2011, 05:39 PM
Drafting at #5 last year, KC selected a DB. It was a great pick, but let's not pretend Berry is the athlete/player Peterson is either.

If Peterson is better than Berry, that is saying a lot. The Berry pick was a great one for the chefs... I still don't understand people who say you shouldn't spend a first round pick on a safety (or a top 10 pick) because he's the perfect example of why a great safety makes defense all that much better.

elsid13
02-15-2011, 05:43 PM
Bobo the ass clown think it stupid idea, thus it will be a brilliant move.

TheReverend
02-15-2011, 05:44 PM
If Peterson is better than Berry, that is saying a lot. The Berry pick was a great one for the chefs... I still don't understand people who say you shouldn't spend a first round pick on a safety (or a top 10 pick) because he's the perfect example of why a great safety makes defense all that much better.

Any great player makes their respective unit and team that much better.

Unless it's a ****ing kicker. Long live Al Davis.

Requiem
02-15-2011, 06:12 PM
Peterson versus Green and Jones in 2009. Check it out.

bronco0608
02-15-2011, 06:15 PM
Peterson versus Green and Jones in 2009. Check it out.

Sure, why not. In that game against Green, he gave up a 30 yard pass to Green and in crunch time, gave up a 50 yard pass to Tavaras King to setup Green's game winning touchdown.

Why in the world do people point to that game is beyond me.

Why.

Why.

Why.

footstepsfrom#27
02-15-2011, 06:23 PM
If Peterson is better than Berry, that is saying a lot. The Berry pick was a great one for the chefs... I still don't understand people who say you shouldn't spend a first round pick on a safety (or a top 10 pick) because he's the perfect example of why a great safety makes defense all that much better.
Couple years ago people in here were saying you don't draft a safety high because they're not worth it. Foolishness...now the same idiocy is predominate in the thinking about corners. Strangely, the trend toward using multiple receiver sets, which ought to strengthen the perceived value of CB's has had the oppposiite effect in the thinking of some fans. Peterson is a phenom, a physical freak who some scouts and coaches say could play any skill position in the NFL and perform at a pro bowl level. Mix in the return game and he's easily worth a top 5 pick.

Requiem
02-15-2011, 06:26 PM
Sure, why not. In that game against Green, he gave up a 30 yard pass to Green and in crunch time, gave up a 50 yard pass to Tavaras King to setup Green's game winning touchdown.

Why in the world do people point to that game is beyond me.

Why.

Why.

Why.

Jones?

Dedhed
02-15-2011, 06:56 PM
Very simple: you make unsubstantiated claims, and when you get called out, you b****. Funny.Is this like the time you pretended I said something and went as far as to to post a fake quote? One needs only look at this thread to see who the whiner in the group is.

Let me give you some examples because I know you have trouble following along:

You say the Steelers avoid draft DL in the first round. I point you to their last 10 drafts and show you how you are wrong. Are you following? Baby steps here.So 2 picks in the last ten years proves your point here? The fact that they spend 80% of their picks elsewhere is what you're resting your case on?The Steelers have drafted 3 DL in the first round since 1990. That's 20 years. You imagine that proves your point? You're not very good with numbers are you? You're going to need a better case than that if you want to become anything more than the whiny little wanna be lawyer that you are today.

You then say that Patrick Peterson shut down AJ Green in their matchup against each other. I then point out to you an article/box score showing that Green had a 100 yards on 5 catches in the matchup. I then show that Peterson gave up two long plays in that game which totaled for over 80 yards. Following here, or are you confused?Did you watch that game, or just look up the stats? BTW, I know the answer, and so do any informed people on the matter.

Or the time you told the board about how the Jets shut down Brady in the playoffs by playing man-to-man. I then pointed out to you various articles stating that Jets confused Brady by playing zone that game, a departure from their earlier meetings, and that confused Brady. Brady stated as much.False.


Do you even know what an opinion is?
I believe Peterson is the best defensive prospect in this draft; opinion
How about a fact?You're a whiny little troll; fact.

In essence, you cannot back up anything with any articulable facts, and resort to posts like this when you are proven wrong with facts.
Point to one true fact in your post above.

SonOfLe-loLang
02-15-2011, 07:06 PM
That's a very good comparison.

Tyson Jackson was a completely wasted pick.

except at this time 2 years ago, jackson was a second rounder. Fairley and Bowers are not/

bronco0608
02-15-2011, 07:11 PM
So 2 picks in the last ten years proves your point here? The fact that they spend 80% of their picks elsewhere is what you're resting your case on?

There are over nearly 17 positions in football to select from. Do you need me to supply the inferences for everything? You stated that the Steelers AVOID drafting defensive linemen in the 1st round. When you "avoid" something, you don't do it. I pointed out that they have drafted two defensive linemen in the first round.

Can't you think? What do the Steelers do? Draft QBs in the first round every year? RBs in the first round every year? Think for once, my goodness.

What team in the world selects the same position every year? NO ONE.

And how are you trying to prove your point? By stating, and get this, that over the past 10 years, eight times in the first round they didn't select a defensive lineman. Are you stupid?

bronco0608
02-15-2011, 07:25 PM
Jones?

Let's go at this from a different perspective. No team in the nfl plays man-to-man all game regardless of how good their CBs are. When we play cover three, tampa two - which we will do - how good will Peterson be in zone? Will his talents be utilized?

Because teams play zone a lot in games, corners value subsequently go down. That's the point.

Everyone is under the presumption that we put Peterson in the game, and he is going to be locked up man to man with the opposing team's best WR. That's not the case. It wasn't even the case in college for Peterson. See Aj Green's 100 yard game.

That's why corners are not as valuable and are never selected within the top four picks regardless of how talented they are. There is a reason for that, and its not because NFL GMs are stupid. They know what they are doing.

vancejohnson82
02-15-2011, 07:50 PM
Let's go at this from a different perspective. No team in the nfl plays man-to-man all game regardless of how good their CBs are. When we play cover three, tampa two - which we will do - how good will Peterson be in zone? Will his talents be utilized?

Because teams play zone a lot in games, corners value subsequently go down. That's the point.

Everyone is under the presumption that we put Peterson in the game, and he is going to be locked up man to man with the opposing team's best WR. That's not the case. It wasn't even the case in college for Peterson. See Aj Green's 100 yard game.

That's why corners are not as valuable and are never selected within the top four picks regardless of how talented they are. There is a reason for that, and its not because NFL GMs are stupid. They know what they are doing.

He's a smart corner who locks up guys in man and he plays zone very well. He's not a DeAngelo Hall type player that looks like a 4 year old lost in a Wal-Mart whenever he has to read patterns in zone

Bob's your Information Minister
02-15-2011, 07:51 PM
Drafting at #5 last year, KC selected a DB. It was a great pick, but let's not pretend Berry is the athlete/player Peterson is either.

Berry is a rare, rare talent, and he was the perfect pick for KC because we had nothing at safety.

Peterson is not Deion Sanders.

vancejohnson82
02-15-2011, 07:55 PM
Berry is a rare, rare talent, and he was the perfect pick for KC because we had nothing at safety.

Peterson is not Deion Sanders.

You're right....Peterson can tackle

Dedhed
02-15-2011, 08:56 PM
There are over nearly 17 positions in football to select from. Do you need me to supply the inferences for everything? You stated that the Steelers AVOID drafting defensive linemen in the 1st round. When you "avoid" something, you don't do it. I pointed out that they have drafted two defensive linemen in the first round.

Can't you think? What do the Steelers do? Draft QBs in the first round every year? RBs in the first round every year? Think for once, my goodness.

What team in the world selects the same position every year? NO ONE.

And how are you trying to prove your point? By stating, and get this, that over the past 10 years, eight times in the first round they didn't select a defensive lineman. Are you stupid?
Alright, genius, here we go. You argue that you build a defense from the DL back.

The Steelers have been known for defense since when? Forever. Right. You with me so far skippy?

The Steelers have used 5 first round draft picks IN THEIR 74 YEAR HISTORY on DL. One of which, Gabe Watson, is considered among the worst draft picks in the history of the NFL.

They've taken more DBs in the first round than DL, and there are more starting DL on a roster than CBs. How does that jive with your argument? It doesn't.

The Steelers draft the BPA every year. You're arguing the opposite, although you probably don't even realize it.

TheReverend
02-15-2011, 09:26 PM
Berry is a rare, rare talent, and he was the perfect pick for KC because we had nothing at safety.

Peterson is not Deion Sanders.

I'm not saying Berry wasn't a great selection. Berry is absolutely a rare, rare talent.

...who happens to be smaller, slower, not as quick, worse ball skills, worse return skills and worse in coverage than Peterson.

bronco0608
02-15-2011, 09:28 PM
Alright, genius, here we go. You argue that you build a defense from the DL back.

The Steelers have been known for defense since when? Forever. Right. You with me so far skippy?

The Steelers have used 5 first round draft picks IN THEIR 74 YEAR HISTORY on DL. One of which, Gabe Watson, is considered among the worst draft picks in the history of the NFL.

They've taken more DBs in the first round than DL, and there are more starting DL on a roster than CBs. How does that jive with your argument? It doesn't.

The Steelers draft the BPA every year. You're arguing the opposite, although you probably don't even realize it.

You're an idiot. Gabe Watson was a draft pick of the Cardinals and wasn't even a 1st round pick. Once again, you can never get your facts straight.

And LMAO you spent time documenting 74 years of Steelers draft history. Did you make a chart, too? Could you even read your chart? Where was Gabe Watson on there? Did you paint him pink or yellow? Did you draw fat guy wearing a Steelers uniform to make the connection?

And who in their right mind would think what the Steelers did 60, 50, 40, or even 30 years ago would be relevant to this discussion. I could give you a myriad of reasons, but you are not logical enough to understand them.

cutthemdown
02-15-2011, 09:34 PM
Peterson not the burner Sanders was. He's more a physical player. I think he is sort of avg at stopping super quick WR. I sort of think Broncos will pass on Peterson and take either AJ Green, Fairley.

Bob's your Information Minister
02-15-2011, 09:37 PM
I'm not saying Berry wasn't a great selection. Berry is absolutely a rare, rare talent.

...who happens to be smaller, slower, not as quick, worse ball skills, worse return skills and worse in coverage than Peterson.

He made the f'ing Pro Bowl.

Shut up.

BMarsh615
02-15-2011, 09:39 PM
He made the f'ing Pro Bowl.

Shut up.

Was he voted in or were Polomalu and Reed hurt? I personally don't think Berry had a very good season. Teams seemed to go after him a lot in the redzone.

Bob's your Information Minister
02-15-2011, 09:43 PM
I personally don't think Berry had a very good season.

That's because you're a ****ing moron.

TheReverend
02-15-2011, 09:45 PM
He made the f'ing Pro Bowl.

Shut up.

Good for him. Imagine what Peterson will do when inferior athletes and players are hitting the pro bowl in their first year.

SoCalBronco
02-15-2011, 10:38 PM
Peterson can play. Hopefully he can mature a little bit, too.

SonOfLe-loLang
02-15-2011, 11:04 PM
Peterson not the burner Sanders was. He's more a physical player. I think he is sort of avg at stopping super quick WR. I sort of think Broncos will pass on Peterson and take either AJ Green, Fairley.

You are on some amazing crack if you think the broncos are in the market for AJ Green

epicSocialism4tw
02-16-2011, 12:07 AM
Peterson can play. Hopefully he can mature a little bit, too.

I havent heard anything about this...can you explain further?

One of the reasons I like Bowers is that he seems like a really good kid. I hope the Broncos dont take a personality risk with this pick because those guys are the ones who dont work out alot of the time. Do you know much about Marcel Dareus?

cutthemdown
02-16-2011, 12:56 AM
You are on some amazing crack if you think the broncos are in the market for AJ Green

He's a super stud and Tebow will need weapons that are above and beyond avg. Right now who is going to be the broncos super stud at either WR/RB/TE?

I think you are kidding yourself if you think Green removed from the Broncos board. He's going in the first 5 picks for sure.

listopencil
02-16-2011, 02:46 AM
The Steelers have used 5 first round draft picks IN THEIR 74 YEAR HISTORY on DL. One of which, Gabe Watson, is considered among the worst draft picks in the history of the NFL.




Holy ****. I never would have guessed that.

Bob's your Information Minister
02-16-2011, 09:50 AM
The Broncos SHOULD be in the market for AJ Green.

Regardless of their numbers, Brandon Lloyd and Jabar Gaffney are not really scaring anyone.

Lloyd has had ONE good year in his career and this was on a team that was A) constantly behind and B) threw the ball 60 percent of the time.

If you pass on AJ Green because of a 30-year old receiver who has had one good year, I will laugh.

SonOfLe-loLang
02-16-2011, 10:31 AM
He's a super stud and Tebow will need weapons that are above and beyond avg. Right now who is going to be the broncos super stud at either WR/RB/TE?

I think you are kidding yourself if you think Green removed from the Broncos board. He's going in the first 5 picks for sure.

Mark my words: The Denver Broncos, the team riddled with defensive holes, now under a defensive coach, will not take a wide receiver with the first pick.

SonOfLe-loLang
02-16-2011, 10:31 AM
The Broncos SHOULD be in the market for AJ Green.

Regardless of their numbers, Brandon Lloyd and Jabar Gaffney are not really scaring anyone.

Lloyd has had ONE good year in his career and this was on a team that was A) constantly behind and B) threw the ball 60 percent of the time.

If you pass on AJ Green because of a 30-year old receiver who has had one good year, I will laugh.

I can think of 30 reasons the broncos should pass on AJ Green and only one of them is Brandon Lloyd

vancejohnson82
02-16-2011, 12:53 PM
oh my God....if any Broncos fan is around me and I hear them cheer the pick of AJ ****in Green, I'll smash a bottle over their face

there is no way it happens though

NFLBRONCO
02-16-2011, 03:07 PM
oh my God....if any Broncos fan is around me and I hear them cheer the pick of AJ ****in Green, I'll smash a bottle over their face

there is no way it happens though



While I agree we won't draft AJ Green because we need D. I surely would not scream that hard adding his talent to this team. DMT is out for 2011 and Royal is also recouping.

vancejohnson82
02-16-2011, 03:14 PM
While I agree we won't draft AJ Green because we need D. I surely would not scream that hard adding his talent to this team. DMT is out for 2011 and Royal is also recouping.

if we go anywhere but defense with that first pick I'm going to choke my dog

Requiem
02-16-2011, 05:48 PM
SoCal is just chapped with Peterson cause he dipped from the U commitment. I haven't heard anything about maturity issues with Peterson, but maybe he didn't mean it that way. ;)

Chris
02-16-2011, 05:58 PM
Was he voted in or were Polomalu and Reed hurt? I personally don't think Berry had a very good season. Teams seemed to go after him a lot in the redzone.

From what I saw he wasn't having a great season either. Then again, he was a rookie.

strafen
02-16-2011, 09:48 PM
He's a super stud and Tebow will need weapons that are above and beyond avg. Right now who is going to be the broncos super stud at either WR/RB/TE?

I think you are kidding yourself if you think Green removed from the Broncos board. He's going in the first 5 picks for sure.Not sure we'd go WR with our first pick, but I do agree with you.
Our receiving corps is inexperienced and not totally healthy.
Gaffney and Lloyd are the only healthy and experienced ones.
After that, we've got injuries and new players at the position...

We would have to deal to get extra draft pics.
We've only got 6 picks in the draft and we need help in a lot of areas...