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spdirty
02-07-2011, 07:56 AM
If you were depressed about football being over, you probably shouldn't read this. Might as well call him Pat Monfort now. Actually, not even that. Even the Monforts are spending money now. Weird now you have the Broncos, and Avs/Nuggets owners going cheap while the Monforts are opening their wallets for the good of the team.

Uggh. Depressing, :(


Krieger: Finances may sway Broncos

Now that the big game is over, the bigger game can begin. For the Broncos, it's not a minute too soon.

If you believe John Elway, whether the Broncos exercise or trade the second pick in the NFL's April draft may depend on if a new collective bargaining agreement is achieved by then.

Asked about the pick last week, here's what Elway told the NFL Network:

"We're in the process of setting that board up. The board is set, but as far as where we're going to go with it, we don't really know until we find out what's going to go on the collective bargaining agreement, because obviously that second pick is an expensive pick if it stays as it is.

"That's what we're hoping, that the collective bargaining agreement comes together quickly, and then once that comes together we can kind of figure out our philosophy going into this draft. Because where we are, we've got three picks in the top 46 picks, so we've got to make sure those hit, especially that second pick."
Read more: Krieger: Finances may sway Broncos - The Denver Post http://www.denverpost.com/krieger/ci_17314668#ixzz1DHy5Snij
Read The Denver Post's Terms of Use of its content: http://www.denverpost.com/termsofuse


http://www.denverpost.com/krieger/ci_17314668

bronco militia
02-07-2011, 08:00 AM
depressing? just more speculating.

FYI, Bowlen has been broke for years Ha!

BroncoInferno
02-07-2011, 08:01 AM
If the salary structure of the top picks doesn't change, Elway won't be able to unload that pick if he wants to.

HEAV
02-07-2011, 08:08 AM
Ya ya ya....and the Broncos would go cheap on a head-coach....

oubronco
02-07-2011, 08:09 AM
You want the best players you got to pay for them

schaaf
02-07-2011, 08:15 AM
This is all speculation.. Both Elway and Xanders have both said publicly they will be very active in Free Agency.

Why pay all your players as much as you can to get to the salary cap? You first of all have to get a quality player to get in free agency and then give him money

Killericon
02-07-2011, 08:21 AM
I continue to not buy a single ounce of this "Bowlen is Broke" bull****, because there's no proof of it whatsoever.

If you were depressed about football being over, you probably shouldn't read this. Might as well call him Pat Monfort now. Actually, not even that. Even the Monforts are spending money now. [/URL]

Name one instance out of the last 3 years where Bowlen 'cheaped out'. Was it when he signed a bunch of Free Agents for McDaniels? Was it when he gave Dawkins more money than anyone thought he should get? Was it when he let Champ's contract run its natural course, doling out $13 Million last year? Was it when he gave Dumervil a huge extension? Or Maybe it was when he gave Orton a huge raise? What about that time he signed Kuper to a big extension? Maybe it was when he told McDaniels to hire cheap assistants, like Mike ****ing Nolan? How about that time that he let that big ticket Broncos free agent walk like...Umm....

Name a single instance of Bowlen being 'cheap'. I dare you.

This "Bowlen is broke" thing is the most ludicrous things on this board. Elway makes one remark about how the rookie pay structure is kind of insane, and you start saying Bowlen is cheap. Bowlen being broke fits into the "Bowlen ruined the team" narrative that half the forum subscribes to, and so you blindly take any line, no matter what the context or intent behind it was, and use it to prop up your argument.

I hope you realize that Pat Bowlen owns a ****ing NFL franchise. (http://www.itsalloverfatman.com/broncos/entry/on-bubbles)

Smilin Assassin
02-07-2011, 08:21 AM
I will now make a list of things teams say that you should believe prior to the NFL draft:

1)
2)
3)
4)
5)

meangene
02-07-2011, 08:21 AM
I think what Elway is really referring to is, if there is no CBA and a presumed rookie wage scale, the second overall pick will be an expensive player which will affect our allocation of financial resources to other areas - i.e. free agency. Krieger seems to think lack of a CBA would encourage us to trade down rather than exercise the pick because of cost. In fact, lack of a CBA makes it more difficult to trade the pick. So, I think he has it backwards. We are more likely to trade back in the event of a CBA, not because we would be trying to avoid spending money but, rather, to accumulate more picks due to needs. I think we are more likely to retain Champ and be active in free agency as well.

gunns
02-07-2011, 08:24 AM
I continue to not buy a single ounce of this "Bowlen is Broke" bull****, because there's no proof of it whatsoever.



Name one instance out of the last 3 years where Bowlen 'cheaped out'. Was it when he signed a bunch of Free Agents for McDaniels? Was it when he gave Dawkins more money than anyone thought he should get? Was it when he let Champ's contract run its natural course, doling out $13 Million last year? Was it when he gave Dumervil a huge extension? Or Maybe it was when he gave Orton a huge raise? What about that time he signed Kuper to a big extension? Maybe it was when he told McDaniels to hire cheap assistants, like Mike ****ing Nolan? How about that time that he let that big ticket Broncos free agent walk like...Umm....

Name a single instance of Bowlen being 'cheap'. I dare you.

This "Bowlen is broke" thing is the most ludicrous thing on this board. Elway makes one remark about how the rookie pay structure is kind of insane, and you start saying Bowlen is cheap. Bowlen being broke fits into the "Bowlen ruined the team" narrative that half the forum subscribes to, and so you blindly take any line, no matter what the context or intent behind it was, and use it to prop up your argument.

I hope you realize that Pat Bowlen owns a ****ing NFL franchise. (http://www.itsalloverfatman.com/broncos/entry/on-bubbles)

No ****! If you consider yourself that "broke" and aren't willing to spend the money, sell.

HAT
02-07-2011, 08:48 AM
I continue to not buy a single ounce of this "Bowlen is Broke" bull****, because there's no proof of it whatsoever.



Name one instance out of the last 3 years where Bowlen 'cheaped out'. Was it when he signed a bunch of Free Agents for McDaniels? Was it when he gave Dawkins more money than anyone thought he should get? Was it when he let Champ's contract run its natural course, doling out $13 Million last year? Was it when he gave Dumervil a huge extension? Or Maybe it was when he gave Orton a huge raise? What about that time he signed Kuper to a big extension? Maybe it was when he told McDaniels to hire cheap assistants, like Mike ****ing Nolan? How about that time that he let that big ticket Broncos free agent walk like...Umm....

Name a single instance of Bowlen being 'cheap'. I dare you.

This "Bowlen is broke" thing is the most ludicrous things on this board. Elway makes one remark about how the rookie pay structure is kind of insane, and you start saying Bowlen is cheap. Bowlen being broke fits into the "Bowlen ruined the team" narrative that half the forum subscribes to, and so you blindly take any line, no matter what the context or intent behind it was, and use it to prop up your argument.

I hope you realize that Pat Bowlen owns a ****ing NFL franchise. (http://www.itsalloverfatman.com/broncos/entry/on-bubbles)

R.E.P.

primetime714
02-07-2011, 09:11 AM
Xanders in a recent interview alluded to value of the draft pick in a trade should the CBA be signed. The 2nd pick in the draft hasn't been traded in years because of the salary you need to give a #2 pick along with the cost in picks it takes to acquire that guy. Its simply too much to invest in one player, so no one ever ponies up enough to trade for it. With a new CBA with a rookie wage scale in place that pick becomes a lot more valuable since the cost to move up is mostly draft pick based.

enjolras
02-07-2011, 09:19 AM
So this is what it's like to be the Lions. Everything is negative. Everything is awful. The owner is broke. The front office is in shambles. The stadium blows.

Until it's not I suppose.

spdirty
02-07-2011, 09:33 AM
I continue to not buy a single ounce of this "Bowlen is Broke" bull****, because there's no proof of it whatsoever.



Name one instance out of the last 3 years where Bowlen 'cheaped out'. Was it when he signed a bunch of Free Agents for McDaniels? Was it when he gave Dawkins more money than anyone thought he should get? Was it when he let Champ's contract run its natural course, doling out $13 Million last year? Was it when he gave Dumervil a huge extension? Or Maybe it was when he gave Orton a huge raise? What about that time he signed Kuper to a big extension? Maybe it was when he told McDaniels to hire cheap assistants, like Mike ****ing Nolan? How about that time that he let that big ticket Broncos free agent walk like...Umm....

Name a single instance of Bowlen being 'cheap'. I dare you.

This "Bowlen is broke" thing is the most ludicrous things on this board. Elway makes one remark about how the rookie pay structure is kind of insane, and you start saying Bowlen is cheap. Bowlen being broke fits into the "Bowlen ruined the team" narrative that half the forum subscribes to, and so you blindly take any line, no matter what the context or intent behind it was, and use it to prop up your argument.


I don't have an argument here. We were 4-12 and I'm feeling pretty ****ing negative over how this franchise has been run the past few years. And the arguments I'll give you are Sundquist saying they have money issues every time he gets on the air, and our payroll the last 2 years. Your saying that being 20 something mil under the cap is being as competitive as you possibly can be? Having the 27th highest payroll is really throwing it out there eh?

Go, every year I remember us worrying about how much cap room we had left because we were always up against it. That was back when we made, or were at least very close to making the playoffs annually.

Hell, we did lock up Doom, and sign Dawk, Orton, Kuper to big money, and we were STILL bottomfeeders in the league in payroll. How bad would it be if we didn't?


Bottom line, I hope Bowlen reads this column and says "Bull****!" and gets active in free agency, and signs the right free agents that help this team win soon. I wish they would have gone after a GM from outside the organization, like a De Costa. I hope they put that 4 year deal back on the table for Champ. Will any of that happen? Right now I don't know. And the not knowing is what pisses me off.

I hope you realize that Pat Bowlen owns a ****ing NFL franchise. (http://www.itsalloverfatman.com/broncos/entry/on-bubbles)

So does Bill Bidwell, Mike Brown, and Jerry Richardson.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
02-07-2011, 09:37 AM
You should probably calm down and just see what happens.

Oh, and realize that Bowlen isn't going to do anything because a newspaper column alluded that he should.

spdirty
02-07-2011, 09:40 AM
BTW, I actually think that our low player payroll is more a result terrible personnel decisions rather than being cheap. I didn't start to say "WTF?" until they pulled the Champ extension off the table. Now we will just have to see what the franchise does moving forward. When we get to free agency, that will tell a lot as to what this franchise's priorities are.

spdirty
02-07-2011, 09:43 AM
You should probably calm down and just see what happens.

Yeah, until we see what we do this offseason, the discovery of this franchise's priorities are a wait and see. Letting Champ walk would be unforgivable, IMO.

Oh, and realize that Bowlen isn't going to do anything because a newspaper column alluded that he should.

And why did he flip flop so quickly on McDaniels?

TheElusiveKyleOrton
02-07-2011, 09:45 AM
And why did he flip flop so quickly on McDaniels?

Uh, probably because there's more to Spygate II than we'll ever know. I don't believe for a second that, after a year and a half of negative press towards his coach, that he suddenly read the Post one morning and said "Damn! People don't like him! I'm firing him today!"

jhns
02-07-2011, 09:49 AM
I continue to not buy a single ounce of this "Bowlen is Broke" bull****, because there's no proof of it whatsoever.



Name one instance out of the last 3 years where Bowlen 'cheaped out'. Was it when he signed a bunch of Free Agents for McDaniels? Was it when he gave Dawkins more money than anyone thought he should get? Was it when he let Champ's contract run its natural course, doling out $13 Million last year? Was it when he gave Dumervil a huge extension? Or Maybe it was when he gave Orton a huge raise? What about that time he signed Kuper to a big extension? Maybe it was when he told McDaniels to hire cheap assistants, like Mike ****ing Nolan? How about that time that he let that big ticket Broncos free agent walk like...Umm....

Name a single instance of Bowlen being 'cheap'. I dare you.

This "Bowlen is broke" thing is the most ludicrous things on this board. Elway makes one remark about how the rookie pay structure is kind of insane, and you start saying Bowlen is cheap. Bowlen being broke fits into the "Bowlen ruined the team" narrative that half the forum subscribes to, and so you blindly take any line, no matter what the context or intent behind it was, and use it to prop up your argument.

I hope you realize that Pat Bowlen owns a ****ing NFL franchise. (http://www.itsalloverfatman.com/broncos/entry/on-bubbles)

Good post. Bowlen proves he isn't broke or cheap all the time and people still try claiming it. I will never understand their logic.

Beantown Bronco
02-07-2011, 09:52 AM
No ****! If you consider yourself that "broke" and aren't willing to spend the money, sell.

To be fair, it would be all but impossible to sell an NFL team right now.

spdirty
02-07-2011, 09:52 AM
Uh, probably because there's more to Spygate II than we'll ever know. I don't believe for a second that, after a year and a half of negative press towards his coach, that he suddenly read the Post one morning and said "Damn! People don't like him! I'm firing him today!"
Good point.

Beantown Bronco
02-07-2011, 09:52 AM
Your saying that being 20 something mil under the cap is being as competitive as you possibly can be?

How can we be 20 mil under the cap when there is no cap?

spdirty
02-07-2011, 09:57 AM
How can we be 20 mil under the cap when there is no cap?

2 years ago we were. And last year we were 27th in payroll.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
02-07-2011, 10:01 AM
2 years ago we were. And last year we were 27th in payroll.

Spending money just to spend money or just because you "can" isn't a smart move either. Look at the Redskins. Among the highest payroll every year, and that team is a mess.

nickademus
02-07-2011, 10:16 AM
I don't have an argument here. We were 4-12 and I'm feeling pretty ****ing negative over how this franchise has been run the past few years. And the arguments I'll give you are Sundquist saying they have money issues every time he gets on the air, and our payroll the last 2 years. Your saying that being 20 something mil under the cap is being as competitive as you possibly can be? Having the 27th highest payroll is really throwing it out there eh?
Go, every year I remember us worrying about how much cap room we had left because we were always up against it. That was back when we made, or were at least very close to making the playoffs annually.

Hell, we did lock up Doom, and sign Dawk, Orton, Kuper to big money, and we were STILL bottomfeeders in the league in payroll. How bad would it be if we didn't?


Bottom line, I hope Bowlen reads this column and says "Bull****!" and gets active in free agency, and signs the right free agents that help this team win soon. I wish they would have gone after a GM from outside the organization, like a De Costa. I hope they put that 4 year deal back on the table for Champ. Will any of that happen? Right now I don't know. And the not knowing is what pisses me off.



So does Bill Bidwell, Mike Brown, and Jerry Richardson.

The last year there was a cap we had a ****ton of dead money thanks to shanny. yea we were low on payroll this past year but why pay guys for the next season if your are not sure there will be a next season. I understand why we didnt shell out this year and was surprised by the orton move. but I bet we are one of the most active teams in FA because we will have the space to be assuming there is once again a salary cap.

Vegas_Bronco
02-07-2011, 11:02 AM
This is one of those threads that is all foam and no beer...so off base it begins to be stupidity. Elway taken way out of context and Bowlens pocketbook has nothing to do with how much we pay our players.

footstepsfrom#27
02-07-2011, 03:27 PM
I continue to not buy a single ounce of this "Bowlen is Broke" bull****, because there's no proof of it whatsoever.
Name one instance out of the last 3 years where Bowlen 'cheaped out'. Was it when he signed a bunch of Free Agents for McDaniels? Was it when he gave Dawkins more money than anyone thought he should get? Was it when he let Champ's contract run its natural course, doling out $13 Million last year? Was it when he gave Dumervil a huge extension? Or Maybe it was when he gave Orton a huge raise? What about that time he signed Kuper to a big extension? Maybe it was when he told McDaniels to hire cheap assistants, like Mike ****ing Nolan? How about that time that he let that big ticket Broncos free agent walk like...Umm....

Name a single instance of Bowlen being 'cheap'. I dare you.

This "Bowlen is broke" thing is the most ludicrous things on this board. Elway makes one remark about how the rookie pay structure is kind of insane, and you start saying Bowlen is cheap. Bowlen being broke fits into the "Bowlen ruined the team" narrative that half the forum subscribes to, and so you blindly take any line, no matter what the context or intent behind it was, and use it to prop up your argument.

I hope you realize that Pat Bowlen owns a ****ing NFL franchise. (http://www.itsalloverfatman.com/broncos/entry/on-bubbles)
Did anyone ever claim he was broke? If so...who? What's been stated is that Bowlen's financing terms that he purchased the team with are unduly burdensome and impacting his bottom line considerably. If you doubt that, you've not been paying attention to how the sale went down when he bought the team. Fact is...Bowlen needed this stadium to remain competitive and probably solvent. "Bowlen is broke" is a straw man used to distort what the facts really are.

Bowlen's finances would be entirely unknown had Kaiser not taken him to court. Since he did, they're not.

tsiguy96
02-07-2011, 03:30 PM
denver is a top 10 revenue team in NFL. big contracts do not equal superbowls

cutthemdown
02-07-2011, 05:09 PM
read between the lines. What he really means is if no CBA then no team will trade for the 2nd pick in the draft. It's too expensive to give up picks, and tons of millions for a player. Now rookie salary cap comes along tons of teams will be offering up picks.

Kreiger just cant see what Elway is really saying.

I have faith people. Come on how often do I say that? Don't worry Elway won't screw it up he's a smart man and a winner. A winner in life and on the field.

Hamrob
02-07-2011, 05:30 PM
Here's a couple thoughts:

1. Could the fact that the Broncos don't have big $ to spend on players have been a reason that many coaching candidates weren't interested in the Broncos?

2. Does spending money really equate to wins? The Packers are the 2nd youngest team in the NFL. I can't believe they are in the top 10 teams in terms of players salaries.

Bob's your Information Minister
02-07-2011, 05:49 PM
I will laugh my ass off if the Broncos trade that pick.

You need big time playmakers, game changers, in the worst way.

You currently have....count 'em...0.

Trading that pick would be a colossal mistake, especially if AJ Green is on the board.

Punisher
02-07-2011, 05:54 PM
depressing? just more speculating.

FYI, Bowlen has been broke for years Ha!

He would of made alot of money from the Playoff games we had this year. OH WAIT i forgot he hire a whats that name i'm looking for a dumbass yea a dumbass Coach.

spdirty
02-07-2011, 05:55 PM
My whole point is give me an owner that puts winning (within the rules of course) above all else. I'm not asking Bowlen to be 1st in ****ing payroll every year. What I'm saying is, sniff around and at least be interested in a stud like Peppers. I can understand to a point why they got rid of Marshall. Because it sucks to give a guy a ton of money when you don't know whether or not he will be suspended for a year. OK fine. Bt a guy like Champ Bailey's status SHOULD NOT be an issue. The guy is down right one of the top 5 dbacks in this league right now, a lock for the hall of fame, and I've never heard of a sniff of him getting into any trouble.

Get active in free agency, get Champ locked down for the rest of his career, and get this team back on track. This 4-12, out of playoff contention in October bull**** can not be a recurring theme with this team.

spdirty
02-07-2011, 05:59 PM
Or just do what I do in Madden. Sign top ticket big name free agents to massive 1 year deals, at the end of the season tell them you will convert them to fullback, their value all of a sudden drops like a rock, then sign em to 7 year, 3 million dollar deals. Easy.:clown:
I bet my left nut some jackass comes on here bitching about how the NFL isn't a video game.

FireFly
02-07-2011, 06:24 PM
If the salary structure of the top picks doesn't change, Elway won't be able to unload that pick if he wants to.

You're exactly right. IMO the value of our #2 pick actually goes up quite a bit if the price tag comes down.

enjolras
02-07-2011, 06:35 PM
I will laugh my ass off if the Broncos trade that pick.

You need big time playmakers, game changers, in the worst way.

You currently have....count 'em...0.

Trading that pick would be a colossal mistake, especially if AJ Green is on the board.

2009 NFL sack leader says "huh?"

Bob's your Information Minister
02-07-2011, 07:07 PM
2009 NFL sack leader says "huh?"

Dumervil isn't going to be the same player in a 4-3...hell, is he even going to be on the team?

TheElusiveKyleOrton
02-07-2011, 07:22 PM
Dumervil isn't going to be the same player in a 4-3...hell, is he even going to be on the team?

Shut up fatboy.

You know he got 9 sacks in '08 in the 4-3, right? Oh you didn't? Because you don't know anything at all about football?

That's what I thought.

Bob's your Information Minister
02-07-2011, 08:10 PM
9 sacks =/ dominant, game-changer.

Broncos don't have any.

broncosteven
02-07-2011, 08:14 PM
Uh, probably because there's more to Spygate II than we'll ever know. I don't believe for a second that, after a year and a half of negative press towards his coach, that he suddenly read the Post one morning and said "Damn! People don't like him! I'm firing him today!"

I think Bowlen asked John his opinion about mCd , just a gut feeling but right after John started showing up at Investco and telling mCd that it might be a good idea to script plays a couple weeks later mCd is creeping out of Dove Valley.

I don't think spygate helped but the franchise was spiraling out of control John shows up talks to mCd an a couple weeks later the dude is gone.

cutthemdown
02-07-2011, 08:28 PM
Doom can rush in a 4-3 just fine. He will get run at just like he did at OLB but at least wont have to cover anymore at all. Not that he did much of that anyways.

For doom to be effective in a 4-3 he needs what every 4-3 end needs and that is an inside presence to stop the run. 2 big DT. Then we line up doom wide like Colts have with Freeney. He could be very difficult to stop in that situation.

Once again boob tries to use some stats to make a point. Stats rarely do though unless you apply them objectively. When used only to troll they are very unreliable.

Punisher
02-07-2011, 08:41 PM
9 sacks =/ dominant, game-changer.

Broncos don't have any.

Doom is a beast shut up for i bust a nut on your hair

cutthemdown
02-07-2011, 10:00 PM
Heck I will take doom getting 9 sacks next yr lol. For our anemic pass rush that would be MVP. As we add more pass rushers, which hopefully Broncos will, Doom would be even more effective at DE.

We need at least one DT who can push the pocket.

Archer81
02-07-2011, 10:14 PM
Heck I will take doom getting 9 sacks next yr lol. For our anemic pass rush that would be MVP. As we add more pass rushers, which hopefully Broncos will, Doom would be even more effective at DE.

We need at least one DT who can push the pocket.


What is odd is if you compare this year's sack stats and last years, they are nearly the same if you remove Doom's 2009 sack total.

Denver 2010: 23 sacks
Denver 2009: 39 sacks (22 with doom's 17 removed)

I'd hope Denver would push to get more pass rushers, and couple that with Doom's return at least give the defense some ability to get to the passer. That alone should improve the pass defense...at least I hope.

:Broncos:

Bob's your Information Minister
02-07-2011, 10:20 PM
You don't even know if Dumervil will be the same player after his injury.

Broncos are a big giant question mark right now. The whole roster is going to be in flux for at least one year.

You guys need to settle in and get comfortable. If your front office doesn't want to spend money on high picks it's gonna be a lonnnnnnnng road back.

FireFly
02-07-2011, 11:32 PM
If we get stout in the middle - and I mean DT - we'll be fine imo.

I honestly believe that if we had 2 good DT's we'd be in a position to win twice as many games as we did this year :)

cutthemdown
02-08-2011, 12:05 AM
No team will even want to trade into the top 3 spots if there isn't a rookie salary cap. The draft has about 7-8 players that could fill out the top 5 so no reason for any team to pay what it would take to move up to the 2nd spot.

I do think drafts first round seems deep with DE which teams love. You could see teams at the bottom trying to move into the 15 range to get one that falls.

Without a new CBA broncos will be forced to use the 2nd pick. With a new cba the 2nd pick is now cheaper and worth more to other teams. If that happens we could get a team like the Cards to want to move up from the 5 hole etc etc.

No need to worry Broncos have 3 really good picks in 1 and 2nd round. They will get some talent and then like any pick you just hope they can play.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
02-08-2011, 05:41 AM
9 sacks =/ dominant, game-changer.

Broncos don't have any.

Considering he had 17 sacks in '09, leading the NFL, with all but two of them coming with his hand in the dirt, I once again come to the conclusion that you do not know what you're talking about.

Shut up. Fat boy.