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View Full Version : Another reason to disregard what Mel Kiper Jr says


ZONA
02-05-2011, 11:22 PM
I know some people really think this guy has got some really good football smarts. He is known for his college scouting and player evaluation but recently I've been listening to a weekend morning sports radio show and there is a segment on there called (well I can't remember the name) but basically people call in and go head to head with Mel.

All sounds good right? Well, until last week when he said, and I quote "Al Davis was an NFL genius for so many years and I think he's still one of the best NFL minds in the game today", more or less anyway. I think he went on for about 2 straight minutes on how he thinks Al Davis still, even to this day, has one of the best NFL minds there is.

That morning I lost all respect (not that I had much to begin with) for any of his evaluations. I mean, if he thinks Al Davis is one of the top NFL minds today, good lord, how can I put any worth on his college player evaluations?

IHaveALight
02-05-2011, 11:40 PM
If you disregard everyone for saying something that you highly disagree with you'll end up with no one left to heed. ;)

schaaf
02-06-2011, 01:06 AM
I think Al Davis used to have a very good football mind.

He's just lost it in the last decade though. I found it funny when Taco had the thread about the 10 year anniversary I was looking at a forum from 02 and there were jokes going on about how Al was going to die at any time.. I think that guy has gone through the embalming process about 4 times.

Riley
02-06-2011, 01:09 AM
I think Al Davis used to have a very good football mind.

He's just lost it in the last decade though. I found it funny when Taco had the thread about the 10 year anniversary I was looking at a forum from 02 and there were jokes going on about how Al was going to die at any time.. I think that guy has gone through the embalming process about 4 times.

Yep. Al is been singlehandedly crippling his own team for years....
Look at the successs they just had... and he goes and fires the HC..
I guess he is just used to saying.... "You're Fired!"

ZONA
02-06-2011, 01:29 AM
If you disregard everyone for saying something that you highly disagree with you'll end up with no one left to heed. ;)

I don't disregard everyone for saying something I disagree with. But when somebody says Al Davis is still one of the top NFL minds today, yeah, I pretty much have to disregard that person.

schaaf
02-06-2011, 01:39 AM
http://cache.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/2010/10/custom_1287001642204_melkiper.jpg

"Like A Boss"

footstepsfrom#27
02-06-2011, 01:56 AM
I do'nt really need another reason to discount Kiper. The ones I have work fine.

✡✡ JOSHUA ✡✡
02-06-2011, 02:11 AM
I mean, if he thinks Al Davis is one of the top NFL minds today, good lord, how can I put any worth on his college player evaluations?

This might be the wrong time to question Al Davis' college player evaluations. His 2010 draft (McClain, Houston, Ford, Valdheer) was one of the best in the NFL.

cutthemdown
02-06-2011, 03:54 AM
I know some people really think this guy has got some really good football smarts. He is known for his college scouting and player evaluation but recently I've been listening to a weekend morning sports radio show and there is a segment on there called (well I can't remember the name) but basically people call in and go head to head with Mel.

All sounds good right? Well, until last week when he said, and I quote "Al Davis was an NFL genius for so many years and I think he's still one of the best NFL minds in the game today", more or less anyway. I think he went on for about 2 straight minutes on how he thinks Al Davis still, even to this day, has one of the best NFL minds there is.

That morning I lost all respect (not that I had much to begin with) for any of his evaluations. I mean, if he thinks Al Davis is one of the top NFL minds today, good lord, how can I put any worth on his college player evaluations?

Well Davis still really smart. Look at how no one can beat him in a lawsuit. Dude is a top notch legal mind. One reason Shanny never forced the issue on the money was because he knew in court he would lose, just like everyone always does.

Some of there moves haven't worked out but recently they grabbed some talented players. I get how we make fun of him for being so old, for losing a lot lately, but lets not forget this guys accomplishments.

cutthemdown
02-06-2011, 03:55 AM
Al davis still knows more about football then any of us and would make you look silly arguing football. He would bury all of you with all he knows about the game.

Garcia Bronco
02-06-2011, 04:22 AM
I do'nt really need another reason to discount Kiper. The ones I have work fine.

lol..this

Boomhauer
02-06-2011, 04:41 AM
I do'nt really need another reason to discount Kiper. The ones I have work fine.

This. (From OP) "He is known for his college scouting and player evaluation"
That's all he's know for and does a piss-poor job at it. Maybe a quarter of his evaluations are half-right. The rest are a waste to listen to. There are hundfreds of other scouting and draft sources that are better than him and I've often wondered why ESPN kept his sorry butt around.

mikey555
02-06-2011, 07:47 AM
I do'nt really need another reason to discount Kiper. The ones I have work fine.

The best reason to discount mel kiper is..... well he's Mel Kiper!!:spit:

Dedhed
02-06-2011, 07:48 AM
This. (From OP) "He is known for his college scouting and player evaluation"
That's all he's know for and does a piss-poor job at it. I've often wondered why ESPN kept his sorry butt around.Because it's ESPN. They're more interested in things like big hair and how loud you can talk than they are with anything of substance.

Kiper has always been a complete joke of a scout, but he has a TV persona, and that's all you really need in order to pass the smell test at ESPN.

spdirty
02-06-2011, 07:51 AM
http://www.dickipedia.org/dick.php?title=Mel_Kiper%2C_Jr.

Though a dick, Mel Kiper is an infallible genius when it comes to scouting future NFL talent.

He once snidely remarked of the Colts, "That's why [they] keep picking number two every year," after their 1994 second overall selection. Kiper was widely critical of the Colts’ pick that year, Marshall Faulk, who turned out to be such a bust that he is expected to be inducted into the NFL Hall of Fame in the near future.



In 2005, Kiper praised 8th overall selection, wide receiver Mike Williams, saying, "I'll see you at his Hall of Fame induction." Many people have yet to fully recognize the abilities Kiper saw in Williams. These people include coaches, fans, analysts, referees, the players on the teams he played for and against, and anyone else who has seen him in a football jersey. Williams’ journey to the Hall of Fame suffered a slight detour in 2007 when he stopped playing football and no one wanted to sign him.



In 1999, he touted the potential of Oregon quarterback Akili Smith to exceed at the professional level. Fans have high hopes for Smith to have a great season this year and to make a big statement in his league (http://www.cfl.ca/).



In 1998, Kiper argued that Ryan Leaf, 2nd overall pick, had an attitude that would be an asset in the NFL. He has since become one of professional football's most notable quarterbacks (http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/espn25/story?page=listranker/25biggestflops).



In 2001, Kiper predicted a dismal 0-16 season for the New England Patriots. The team finished slightly better than that prediction, managing to win just one Super Bowl the entire season.

WolfpackGuy
02-06-2011, 08:23 AM
I saw Kiper scurrying out of the ESPN Zone in Baltimore once.

He's a midge, so there's a reason his hair is that high.

spdirty
02-06-2011, 08:26 AM
I wouldn't have drafted JaMarcus Russel 1st overall. I would have traded for Schaub and drafted Calvin Johnson. But thats just me.

tsiguy96
02-06-2011, 08:29 AM
Al davis still knows more about football then any of us and would make you look silly arguing football. He would bury all of you with all he knows about the game.

thats wonderful, hows it relevant?

RhymesayersDU
02-06-2011, 08:34 AM
http://www.dickipedia.org/dick.php?title=Mel_Kiper%2C_Jr.

More recently, he was in LOVE with Jimmy Clausen, and while the jury is obviously still out on Clausen, he did not play well last year.

Haroldthebarrel
02-06-2011, 08:34 AM
http://www.dickipedia.org/dick.php?title=Mel_Kiper%2C_Jr.

What about the projections he was actually right at?

Not that i like Kiper at all, but it is sloppy just to bring up all that he missed and not look at where he hit as well.

spdirty
02-06-2011, 08:38 AM
What about the projections he was actually right at?

<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="640" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/B3lLYOGDsts" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

jossjeff
02-06-2011, 08:53 AM
http://www.dickipedia.org/dick.php?title=Mel_Kiper%2C_Jr.

I may be wrong here but I believe that quote towards the Colts had nothing to do with Marshall. Think the Colts had taken a DT or LB or something and left Dilfer on the board. Still a horrible call but nonetheless.....

And as far as the Al Davis talking...well nobody has been harder on the guy than me. That being said however I'll never understand oldsmack. It seems to me that geting old is inevitable for all of us, if we are lucky anyway.

Dude has made many questionable decisions over the last few decades, dont consider aging one of them.

Haroldthebarrel
02-06-2011, 08:54 AM
<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="640" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/B3lLYOGDsts" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

that was actually a hilarious reply. he he.

But I am certain you got my point. The draft is a crapshot for any team but the Steelers and Ravens it seems. They hit on their first and second rounders all the time.

Haroldthebarrel
02-06-2011, 08:56 AM
I may be wrong here but I believe that quote towards the Colts had nothing to do with Marshall. Think the Colts had taken a DT or LB or something and left Dilfer on the board. Still a horrible call but nonetheless.....

And as far as the Al Davis talking...well nobody has been harder on the guy than me. That being said however I'll never understand oldsmack. It seems to me that geting old is inevitable for all of us, if we are lucky anyway.

Dude has made many questionable decisions over the last few decades, dont consider aging one of them.

The old man is excellent at finding young coaching talent. It is just that he doesnt have the patience to let them learn their trade. Thus, he is basically "coaching" them up for the other teams.

misturanderson
02-06-2011, 09:14 AM
that was actually a hilarious reply. he he.

But I am certain you got my point. The draft is a crapshot for any team but the Steelers and Ravens it seems. They hit on their first and second rounders all the time.

Same can be said of the packers and the colts. In fact they've been better than anyone the last 5 or so years.

Arkie
02-06-2011, 09:16 AM
"Al Davis was an NFL genius for so many years and I think he's still one of the best NFL minds in the game today"

The first part is true. They hired Al Davis at age 33 in 1963 to be head coach. Over the next 30 years, the Raiders had the best record in pro sports. Al still thinks he can make all the decisions even though he's been senile and has been ruining his team the last decade.

spdirty
02-06-2011, 09:19 AM
I could be wrong, but I think the guy had Clausen as a top 10 pick, and Tebow as a 4th-5th rounder. And Mayock had Tebow as a high second rounder.

I really try not to watch or pay any attention to his draft analysis.

That One Guy
02-06-2011, 09:36 AM
One of the biggest issues with Kiper is there's been a lot of talk lately that he overinflates the stock of people for reasons other than their football capabilities. There's been accusations of fluffing up his agent's clients and whatnot. That's shady.

Gort
02-06-2011, 09:45 AM
I know some people really think this guy has got some really good football smarts. He is known for his college scouting and player evaluation but recently I've been listening to a weekend morning sports radio show and there is a segment on there called (well I can't remember the name) but basically people call in and go head to head with Mel.

All sounds good right? Well, until last week when he said, and I quote "Al Davis was an NFL genius for so many years and I think he's still one of the best NFL minds in the game today", more or less anyway. I think he went on for about 2 straight minutes on how he thinks Al Davis still, even to this day, has one of the best NFL minds there is.

That morning I lost all respect (not that I had much to begin with) for any of his evaluations. I mean, if he thinks Al Davis is one of the top NFL minds today, good lord, how can I put any worth on his college player evaluations?

i think Mel Kiper is an idiot. but in fairness to crazy Al, he does draft a lot of talented players. the problem the Raiders have is:

1) they draft knuckleheads who get in trouble or who are lazy or who are malcontents. he seems to see only their talent and not their intangibles (or lack thereof).
2) he pays his draft picks too much money. laziness and $30M is a bad combination for a 22 year old kid.
3) he interferes too much with his coaching staff and changes it too frequently and hires "yes" men.

Crazy Al and the Raiders are a mess as a franchise, but they do know how to draft talent. look at how overmatched the Broncos were this year against them if you don't believe me.

Cito Pelon
02-06-2011, 09:53 AM
More recently, he was in LOVE with Jimmy Clausen, and while the jury is obviously still out on Clausen, he did not play well last year.

Yah, he couldn't stop talking about how Clausen was the most NFL-ready QB after Bradford. But it wasn't much of a QB draft in 2010. Hell, only 13 QB's drafted (Carolina drafted two - Clausen in round 2 and Tony Pike in round 6)

Only 4 QB's drafted in the first 3 rounds, and the 3rd rounder for Cleveland Colt McCoy outplayed Clausen.

So maybe he was almost right.

That One Guy
02-06-2011, 02:37 PM
i think Mel Kiper is an idiot. but in fairness to crazy Al, he does draft a lot of talented players. the problem the Raiders have is:

1) they draft knuckleheads who get in trouble or who are lazy or who are malcontents. he seems to see only their talent and not their intangibles (or lack thereof).
2) he pays his draft picks too much money. laziness and $30M is a bad combination for a 22 year old kid.
3) he interferes too much with his coaching staff and changes it too frequently and hires "yes" men.

Crazy Al and the Raiders are a mess as a franchise, but they do know how to draft talent. look at how overmatched the Broncos were this year against them if you don't believe me.

Maybe people perceive Oakland to always have talent but for years, that was the place over the hill players went to play out the ends of their career. They've had some talent here or there but to say they've consistently had talent is an overstatement, I think. Also, though, just as you said, even much of the talent they've been able to muster has been people with big question marks that other teams didn't want to mess with.

Until someone can reasonably explain the Javon Walker signing, I'll never believe Al is anything but full blown crazy.

Jay3
02-06-2011, 02:42 PM
Kiper is just a media figure. He has no credibility in the league. He's a giant echo chamber.

Jay3
02-06-2011, 02:44 PM
Yah, he couldn't stop talking about how Clausen was the most NFL-ready QB after Bradford.

Kiper rated Clausen ahead of Bradford, and had him rated as the fourth best player available over all.

The projections you saw with Bradford #1 were Kiper's board predictions. His own rating had Clausen #1 among QB's.

NhocCuteGirlz
02-06-2011, 02:44 PM
If you disregard everyone for saying something that you highly disagree with you'll end up with no one left to heed. images/smilies/wink.gif
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Dedhed
02-06-2011, 02:44 PM
Yah, he couldn't stop talking about how Clausen was the most NFL-ready QB after Bradford. But it wasn't much of a QB draft in 2010. Hell, only 13 QB's drafted (Carolina drafted two - Clausen in round 2 and Tony Pike in round 6)

Only 4 QB's drafted in the first 3 rounds, and the 3rd rounder for Cleveland Colt McCoy outplayed Clausen.

So maybe he was almost right.
He was not at all right. He pined every chance he got about how NFL ready Clausen was. Deserved to be a top 10 pick, etc.

He proved not only to be nowhere near NFL ready, but a reach as a second rounder.

That One Guy
02-06-2011, 02:47 PM
Kiper rated Clausen ahead of Bradford, and had him rated as the fourth best player available over all.

The projections you saw with Bradford #1 were Kiper's board predictions. His own rating had Clausen #1 among QB's.

That's what I thought I saw as well. That was when the stuff really got questionable about the agent-client back scratching.

bronco0608
02-06-2011, 02:58 PM
Clownish. Every draft analyst has busts. Hell, Bill Polian busts for the Colts and he is the best. But let's just try to sift though the BS and try to quantify a bunch of layman calling someone incompentent in their field, shall we:

<TABLE style="WIDTH: 397pt; BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse" border=0 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=530><TBODY><TR height=17><TD style="HEIGHT: 40px" class=style134 height=17 colSpan=8>5 YEAR AVERAGES</TD></TR><TR height=17><TD style="WIDTH: 25pt; HEIGHT: 12.75pt" class=style120 height=17 width=33>RANK</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 217pt" class=style121 width=289>Web Site / Publication</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 40pt" class=style120 width=53>5 YR AVG.</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 23pt" class=style120 width=31>2010</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style120>2009</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 23pt" class=style122 width=31>2008</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 23pt" class=style122 width=31>2007</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 23pt" class=style122 width=31>2006</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>1</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 217pt" class=style108 width=289>Rick Gosselin - Dallas Morning News</TD><TD class=style109>47.60</TD><TD class=style109>45</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>43</TD><TD class=style109>40</TD><TD class=style109>53</TD><TD class=style109>57</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>2</TD><TD class=style48>Jason Boris - Times News</TD><TD class=style109>44.40</TD><TD class=style109>44</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>44</TD><TD class=style109>37</TD><TD class=style109>47</TD><TD class=style109>50</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>3</TD><TD class=style48>Mel Kiper jr - ESPN</TD><TD class=style109>43.20</TD><TD class=style109>48</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>43</TD><TD class=style109>37</TD><TD class=style109>48</TD><TD class=style109>40</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>4</TD><TD class=style48>M. Abromowitz - The Football Expert</TD><TD class=style109>42.60</TD><TD class=style109>41</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>48</TD><TD class=style109>43</TD><TD class=style109>37</TD><TD class=style109>44</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>5</TD><TD class=style48>Robby Esch - The Huddle Report</TD><TD class=style109>42.00</TD><TD class=style109>45</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>43</TD><TD class=style109>45</TD><TD class=style109>36</TD><TD class=style109>41</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>6</TD><TD class=style48>Ryan McCrystal - Draft Ace</TD><TD class=style109>41.20</TD><TD class=style109>39</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>43</TD><TD class=style109>38</TD><TD class=style109>46</TD><TD class=style109>40</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>7</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 217pt" class=style108 width=289>Scott Wright - Draft Countdown</TD><TD class=style109>40.80</TD><TD class=style109>39</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>43</TD><TD class=style109>39</TD><TD class=style109>41</TD><TD class=style109>42</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>8</TD><TD class=style48>Al Fronczak - East Coast Sports</TD><TD class=style109>40.80</TD><TD class=style109>37</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>40</TD><TD class=style109>44</TD><TD class=style109>47</TD><TD class=style109>36</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>9</TD><TD class=style48>Chad Thompson - NFL Draft Line</TD><TD class=style109>40.40</TD><TD class=style109>38</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>34</TD><TD class=style109>34</TD><TD class=style109>52</TD><TD class=style109>44</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>10</TD><TD class=style48>John Clifford - Draft Board Insider</TD><TD class=style109>40.20</TD><TD class=style109>34</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>39</TD><TD class=style109>33</TD><TD class=style109>51</TD><TD class=style109>44</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>11</TD><TD class=style48>Pat Kirwan - NFL.com</TD><TD class=style109>39.00</TD><TD class=style109>37</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>42</TD><TD class=style109>39</TD><TD class=style109>41</TD><TD class=style109>36</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>12</TD><TD class=style48>Tommy Lawlor - Scouts Notebook</TD><TD class=style109>38.20</TD><TD class=style109>41</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>40</TD><TD class=style109>33</TD><TD class=style109>40</TD><TD class=style109>37</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>13</TD><TD class=style48>Matt Bitonti - Draft Daddy</TD><TD class=style109>38.20</TD><TD class=style109>40</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>36</TD><TD class=style109>41</TD><TD class=style109>35</TD><TD class=style109>39</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>14</TD><TD class=style48>Curtis Popejoy - Draft Board Insider</TD><TD class=style109>38.20</TD><TD class=style109>38</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>32</TD><TD class=style109>34</TD><TD class=style109>42</TD><TD class=style109>45</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>15</TD><TD class=style48>Jeff Mullen - NFL Draft Line</TD><TD class=style109>38.20</TD><TD class=style109>35</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>41</TD><TD class=style109>42</TD><TD class=style109>42</TD><TD class=style109>31</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>16</TD><TD class=style48>Matt Alkire - Scouts Notebook</TD><TD class=style109>38.00</TD><TD class=style109>40</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>37</TD><TD class=style109>35</TD><TD class=style109>37</TD><TD class=style109>41</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>17</TD><TD class=style48>Colin Lindsay - Great Blue North</TD><TD class=style109>38.00</TD><TD class=style109>38</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>35</TD><TD class=style109>39</TD><TD class=style109>40</TD><TD class=style109>38</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>18</TD><TD class=style48>Harry Away - NFL Talent Experts </TD><TD class=style109>37.40</TD><TD class=style109>39</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>37</TD><TD class=style109>33</TD><TD class=style109>43</TD><TD class=style109>35</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>19</TD><TD class=style48>Aaron Freeman - FalcFans</TD><TD class=style109>37.20</TD><TD class=style109>38</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>43</TD><TD class=style109>35</TD><TD class=style109>33</TD><TD class=style109>37</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>20</TD><TD class=style48>The Red Zone</TD><TD class=style109>37.00</TD><TD class=style109>40</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>33</TD><TD class=style109>37</TD><TD class=style109>43</TD><TD class=style109>32</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>21</TD><TD class=style48>Forrest Long - Fantasy Football Toolbox</TD><TD class=style109>36.80</TD><TD class=style109>43</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>34</TD><TD class=style109>32</TD><TD class=style109>41</TD><TD class=style109>34</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>22</TD><TD class=style48>Fred Jones - The Huddle Report</TD><TD class=style109>36.20</TD><TD class=style109>42</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>36</TD><TD class=style109>32</TD><TD class=style109>37</TD><TD class=style109>34</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>23</TD><TD class=style48>Glenn Bernardi - Draft Daddy</TD><TD class=style109>34.20</TD><TD class=style109>34</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>34</TD><TD class=style109>35</TD><TD class=style109>33</TD><TD class=style109>35</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

FYI: Walter Football wasn't even in the top 25.

Haroldthebarrel
02-06-2011, 03:23 PM
Clownish. Every draft analyst has busts. Hell, Bill Polian busts for the Colts and he is the best. But let's just try to sift though the BS and try to quantify a bunch of layman calling someone incompentent in their field, shall we:

<TABLE style="WIDTH: 397pt; BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse" border=0 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=530><TBODY><TR height=17><TD style="HEIGHT: 40px" class=style134 height=17 colSpan=8>5 YEAR AVERAGES</TD></TR><TR height=17><TD style="WIDTH: 25pt; HEIGHT: 12.75pt" class=style120 height=17 width=33>RANK</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 217pt" class=style121 width=289>Web Site / Publication</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 40pt" class=style120 width=53>5 YR AVG.</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 23pt" class=style120 width=31>2010</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style120>2009</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 23pt" class=style122 width=31>2008</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 23pt" class=style122 width=31>2007</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 23pt" class=style122 width=31>2006</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>1</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 217pt" class=style108 width=289>Rick Gosselin - Dallas Morning News</TD><TD class=style109>47.60</TD><TD class=style109>45</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>43</TD><TD class=style109>40</TD><TD class=style109>53</TD><TD class=style109>57</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>2</TD><TD class=style48>Jason Boris - Times News</TD><TD class=style109>44.40</TD><TD class=style109>44</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>44</TD><TD class=style109>37</TD><TD class=style109>47</TD><TD class=style109>50</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>3</TD><TD class=style48>Mel Kiper jr - ESPN</TD><TD class=style109>43.20</TD><TD class=style109>48</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>43</TD><TD class=style109>37</TD><TD class=style109>48</TD><TD class=style109>40</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>4</TD><TD class=style48>M. Abromowitz - The Football Expert</TD><TD class=style109>42.60</TD><TD class=style109>41</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>48</TD><TD class=style109>43</TD><TD class=style109>37</TD><TD class=style109>44</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>5</TD><TD class=style48>Robby Esch - The Huddle Report</TD><TD class=style109>42.00</TD><TD class=style109>45</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>43</TD><TD class=style109>45</TD><TD class=style109>36</TD><TD class=style109>41</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>6</TD><TD class=style48>Ryan McCrystal - Draft Ace</TD><TD class=style109>41.20</TD><TD class=style109>39</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>43</TD><TD class=style109>38</TD><TD class=style109>46</TD><TD class=style109>40</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>7</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 217pt" class=style108 width=289>Scott Wright - Draft Countdown</TD><TD class=style109>40.80</TD><TD class=style109>39</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>43</TD><TD class=style109>39</TD><TD class=style109>41</TD><TD class=style109>42</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>8</TD><TD class=style48>Al Fronczak - East Coast Sports</TD><TD class=style109>40.80</TD><TD class=style109>37</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>40</TD><TD class=style109>44</TD><TD class=style109>47</TD><TD class=style109>36</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>9</TD><TD class=style48>Chad Thompson - NFL Draft Line</TD><TD class=style109>40.40</TD><TD class=style109>38</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>34</TD><TD class=style109>34</TD><TD class=style109>52</TD><TD class=style109>44</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>10</TD><TD class=style48>John Clifford - Draft Board Insider</TD><TD class=style109>40.20</TD><TD class=style109>34</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>39</TD><TD class=style109>33</TD><TD class=style109>51</TD><TD class=style109>44</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>11</TD><TD class=style48>Pat Kirwan - NFL.com</TD><TD class=style109>39.00</TD><TD class=style109>37</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>42</TD><TD class=style109>39</TD><TD class=style109>41</TD><TD class=style109>36</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>12</TD><TD class=style48>Tommy Lawlor - Scouts Notebook</TD><TD class=style109>38.20</TD><TD class=style109>41</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>40</TD><TD class=style109>33</TD><TD class=style109>40</TD><TD class=style109>37</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>13</TD><TD class=style48>Matt Bitonti - Draft Daddy</TD><TD class=style109>38.20</TD><TD class=style109>40</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>36</TD><TD class=style109>41</TD><TD class=style109>35</TD><TD class=style109>39</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>14</TD><TD class=style48>Curtis Popejoy - Draft Board Insider</TD><TD class=style109>38.20</TD><TD class=style109>38</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>32</TD><TD class=style109>34</TD><TD class=style109>42</TD><TD class=style109>45</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>15</TD><TD class=style48>Jeff Mullen - NFL Draft Line</TD><TD class=style109>38.20</TD><TD class=style109>35</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>41</TD><TD class=style109>42</TD><TD class=style109>42</TD><TD class=style109>31</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>16</TD><TD class=style48>Matt Alkire - Scouts Notebook</TD><TD class=style109>38.00</TD><TD class=style109>40</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>37</TD><TD class=style109>35</TD><TD class=style109>37</TD><TD class=style109>41</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>17</TD><TD class=style48>Colin Lindsay - Great Blue North</TD><TD class=style109>38.00</TD><TD class=style109>38</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>35</TD><TD class=style109>39</TD><TD class=style109>40</TD><TD class=style109>38</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>18</TD><TD class=style48>Harry Away - NFL Talent Experts </TD><TD class=style109>37.40</TD><TD class=style109>39</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>37</TD><TD class=style109>33</TD><TD class=style109>43</TD><TD class=style109>35</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>19</TD><TD class=style48>Aaron Freeman - FalcFans</TD><TD class=style109>37.20</TD><TD class=style109>38</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>43</TD><TD class=style109>35</TD><TD class=style109>33</TD><TD class=style109>37</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>20</TD><TD class=style48>The Red Zone</TD><TD class=style109>37.00</TD><TD class=style109>40</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>33</TD><TD class=style109>37</TD><TD class=style109>43</TD><TD class=style109>32</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>21</TD><TD class=style48>Forrest Long - Fantasy Football Toolbox</TD><TD class=style109>36.80</TD><TD class=style109>43</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>34</TD><TD class=style109>32</TD><TD class=style109>41</TD><TD class=style109>34</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>22</TD><TD class=style48>Fred Jones - The Huddle Report</TD><TD class=style109>36.20</TD><TD class=style109>42</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>36</TD><TD class=style109>32</TD><TD class=style109>37</TD><TD class=style109>34</TD></TR><TR height=24><TD style="HEIGHT: 18pt" class=style107 height=24>23</TD><TD class=style48>Glenn Bernardi - Draft Daddy</TD><TD class=style109>34.20</TD><TD class=style109>34</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 24pt" class=style109>34</TD><TD class=style109>35</TD><TD class=style109>33</TD><TD class=style109>35</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

FYI: Walter Football wasn't even in the top 25.

Is that right as well? Most of those are guessing where the players will go and very few of them actually dare to guess on who will bust even when they are first rounders.
Gosselin for example only guesses, and greatly so, which team will take whom.

bronco0608
02-06-2011, 03:35 PM
Is that right as well? Most of those are guessing where the players will go and very few of them actually dare to guess on who will bust even when they are first rounders.
Gosselin for example only guesses, and greatly so, which team will take whom.

Every draft analyst does the same.

So lets break this down:

Which team will take whom?

These analysts are "guessing" where players go, correct? But if they are getting a majority of their board right before the draft, is it guessing? And if they pick the most first rounders, are they the idiot for putting the terrible player in the first round, or is the team (with their gang of scouts) the idiot for picking the bad player?

This is not an exact science. I love when people say, "Oh, you like Kiper? Ha."

Well, who in the hell do you follow? And if they are so great, let me know. But they can't. And when they do, the pick a clown as big as Kiper because they get more **** wrong then he does.

I'm still waiting for the draft analyst that had Jared Allen in his top five picks. I can't remember a draft analyst that said Tom Brady is the best QB in his draft and the Patriots got an absolute steal. Who was pimping Micheal Turner as the best running back in the draft? Which analyst was besides himself when James Harrison went undrafted?

YOU NEVER SEE THAT.

cutthemdown
02-06-2011, 04:18 PM
Kiper is pretty good at what he does, it's just he unlikeable. But he would school all the people on this board. People on this board are pretty funny. They call all these people that know 10 times the football they do stupid. It happens in the posts as well.

We need some football 101 and for some posters to listen more then talk when it comes to football.

robbieopperude
02-06-2011, 04:19 PM
I may be wrong here but I believe that quote towards the Colts had nothing to do with Marshall. Think the Colts had taken a DT or LB or something and left Dilfer on the board. Still a horrible call but nonetheless.....

And as far as the Al Davis talking...well nobody has been harder on the guy than me. That being said however I'll never understand oldsmack. It seems to me that geting old is inevitable for all of us, if we are lucky anyway.

Dude has made many questionable decisions over the last few decades, dont consider aging one of them.

I want to say the Colts traded up to take Trev Alberts a LB from Nebraska and Kiper just let them have it on ESPN. It was a memorable confrontation when the GM or President from the Colts fired back at him. Kiper ended up winning out however when Trev busted out a few years later with injury problems if my memory again serves me correct.

KipCorrington25
02-06-2011, 07:30 PM
I want to say the Colts traded up to take Trev Alberts a LB from Nebraska and Kiper just let them have it on ESPN. It was a memorable confrontation when the GM or President from the Colts fired back at him. Kiper ended up winning out however when Trev busted out a few years later with injury problems if my memory again serves me correct.

Yep exactly, it was Trev Alberts he ripped them for and he was totally correct.

Ugly Duck
02-06-2011, 11:08 PM
Folks were scratching their heads when Mr. Davis picked Asomugha at the end of the 1st round. Panned as a stupid, wasted pick... "cudda had him the 4th" kinda stuff. He was rated like the 10th best CB in a lotta places. Al was right in that instance.

WABronco
02-06-2011, 11:18 PM
I'd rather watch Kiper talk for 48 hours on draft weekend than, idk Torry Holt and crew on NFL Network. He's an interesting cat.

http://memegenerator.net/mel/ImageMacro/5593373/Haters-gonna-hate.jpg

cutthemdown
02-07-2011, 04:10 AM
thats wonderful, hows it relevant?

because someone mentioned he thinks al davis used to be smart but isnt anymore. I'm saying he still knows more about football then anyone who posts on this board.

cutthemdown
02-07-2011, 04:12 AM
Mel Kiper takes a stand on every pick though. Obviously he is a jerk but of course he will have some eggs. I think it's funny people on this board think they are so smart. You forget though I have been around to read all your takes.

That One Guy
02-07-2011, 07:01 AM
Folks were scratching their heads when Mr. Davis picked Asomugha at the end of the 1st round. Panned as a stupid, wasted pick... "cudda had him the 4th" kinda stuff. He was rated like the 10th best CB in a lotta places. Al was right in that instance.

Gallery was a joke at LT for a, what, #3?, Jamarcus a joke at #1, and Heyward-Bey has been a joke so far at #6 or #7?.

So he stumbles into things. It's the head scratching moves that leave him getting the criticism he does. Imagine if he took the Aso and Mcclain types and didn't have the Russels and Heyward-Beys in there. To take away the bad and focus on the good would make any talent evaluator look good though.

Dedhed
02-11-2011, 10:58 AM
For those who missed it, Kiper was just on ESPN saying that "no one would have a problem with the Broncos going with AJ Green at #2.

bronco militia
02-11-2011, 11:11 AM
For those who missed it, Kiper was just on ESPN saying that "no one would have a problem with the Broncos going with AJ Green at #2.

EXCEPT ME :gus::cuss:~Popps~:moody:

oubronco
02-11-2011, 11:18 AM
**** that this draft better be all about defense

Dedhed
02-11-2011, 11:26 AM
**** that this draft better be all about defense

Yeah, I think there are a few Denver folks who would have a problem with ay offensive player.