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cabronco
01-22-2011, 12:31 AM
Nice try retard ...
http://www.faillol.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/retarded-boy.gif

But considering Chuck Norris was born on March 10, 1940 I'm going with not a coincidence.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chuck_Norris


But thanks for trying ...



Why is that kid mocking Moreno's running drills machine ? Not cool kid !!

misturanderson
01-22-2011, 08:55 AM
No, you're trying to say that even though the Bears are in the NFCCG... Jay Cutler didn't do a damn thing to get them there. Reality? As bad as his O-line has played...and as many times as he's been sacked... it's surprising that he isn't on IR.

I guess haters gonna hate... even if the Bears win the SB.

So should he get some kind of award for only missing 1 1/2 games due to injury? That proves his valuable cointributions to the team? That he doesn't get injured for a whole season?

His o-line isn't any worse than it was last year, Martz's offense just takes longer to develop, leading to an increase in sacks. His offensive line has also been playing better than "worst in the league" for several weeks now.

None of that changes the fact that the bears' offense, and Cutler in particular, has changed very little since last year's 7-9 team outside of throwing less and having a slightly lower Int rate. His fumble rate has gone up significantly to counteract any gains he's made in the Int department. Still bottom half of the league as far as production, still about a 1:1 TD:turnover ratio.

The defense (most specifically Urlacher and Peppers) and specials teams is what separates the 2010 bears from the 2009 bears. Cutler has jack to do with it.

TonyR
01-22-2011, 09:10 AM
The defense (most specifically Urlacher and Peppers) and specials teams is what separates the 2010 bears from the 2009 bears.

I don't know why this is so hard for some people to understand, particularly since it's fully supported by statistics. The defense improved significantly year over year while the offense actually regressed slightly overall. Here's the stats once again:

Defense improved from 17th in yards and 21st in points to 9th and 4th, respectively.
Offense went from 23rd in yards and 19th in points to 30th in yards and 21st in points.

It can't be much clearer than that, folks. This doesn't take away from Cutler's strong play down the stretch. But it shows beyond reasonable doubt what propelled the Chicago Bears this season.

tsiguy96
01-22-2011, 09:11 AM
I don't know why this is so hard for some people to understand, particularly since it's fully supported by statistics. The defense improved significantly year over year while the offense actually regressed slightly overall. Here's the stats once again:

Defense improved from 17th in yards and 21st in points to 9th and 4th, respectively.
Offense went from 23rd in yards and 19th in points to 30th in yards and 21st in points.

It can't be much clearer than that, folks. This doesn't take away from Cutler's strong play down the stretch. But it shows beyond reasonable doubt what propelled the Chicago Bears this season.

forget the stats, it was cutler dude.

TheReverend
01-22-2011, 09:22 AM
I don't know why this is so hard for some people to understand, particularly since it's fully supported by statistics. The defense improved significantly year over year while the offense actually regressed slightly overall. Here's the stats once again:

Defense improved from 17th in yards and 21st in points to 9th and 4th, respectively.
Offense went from 23rd in yards and 19th in points to 30th in yards and 21st in points.

It can't be much clearer than that, folks. This doesn't take away from Cutler's strong play down the stretch. But it shows beyond reasonable doubt what propelled the Chicago Bears this season.

I don't think anyone is arguing this. It's pretty obvious their defense took serious strides this year from last.

1. Last year people were blaming Cutler for Chicago's defensive woes. Naturally, that isn't an option this year, so they're trying to completely remove from credit and saying he couldn't win big games. Well now he's in the NFCCG off a 4 TD performance, so where does the bar move to now?

2. We know he's attractive to defensive players and FA's and his presence helps them sign with the team. After all, Dawkins was quoted as citing that as a large reason for signing with Denver last year, this season Peppers did the same, and Urlacher can't stop calling him "awesome"

TonyR
01-22-2011, 09:32 AM
Well now he's in the NFCCG off a 4 TD performance, so where does the bar move to now?

That will all depend on how he performs tomorrow against a team that belongs in the playoffs. Again, that's not to take away from how well he played last week. Tomorrow is the biggest chance he's had in his career to silence the doubters.

TheReverend
01-22-2011, 09:35 AM
That will all depend on how he performs tomorrow against a team that belongs in the playoffs. Again, that's not to take away from how well he played last week. Tomorrow is the biggest chance he's had in his career to silence the doubters.

Well... he already beat the Packers, Jets and Eagles. Did those 3 teams also not belong in the playoffs?

TonyR
01-22-2011, 09:45 AM
Well... he already beat the Packers, Jets and Eagles. Did those 3 teams also not belong in the playoffs?

Yes, the Bears won those games but unfortunately that's now how it works in the court of public opinion. Colt McCoy beat the Patriots this year but we're not going to start the MPV bandwagon for him any time soon. Like I said, win tomorrow and play well and the doubters will have to concede a little more.

Cito Pelon
01-22-2011, 11:30 AM
Well... he already beat the Packers, Jets and Eagles. Did those 3 teams also not belong in the playoffs?

Did it all by himself, eh?

The MVPlaya
01-22-2011, 12:10 PM
Well... he already beat the Packers, Jets and Eagles. Did those 3 teams also not belong in the playoffs?

Mark Sanchez beat the Patriots AND the Colts in the playoffs...

Therefore Mark Sanchez > Cutler.

Miss I.
01-22-2011, 12:27 PM
So I found this editorial I guess you would call it about how Josh might be able to help the Rams and in particular the game of Donnie Avery, given how well Brandon Lloyd did with him in Denver. So what do you guys think, do you think Josh as OC will elevate Donnie Avery's game and help the Rams? Leaving aside his failure as a head coach, he does appear to have abilities improving QB play and WRs. I mean, Kyle Orton can probably credit his sick yardage to Josh and Brandon Lloyd would not be in a probowl if it weren't for these things. So will that translate to the Rams?
http://www.turfshowtimes.com/2011/1/21/1948589/what-can-josh-mcdaniels-do-for-donnie-avery

The MVPlaya
01-22-2011, 12:31 PM
So I found this editorial I guess you would call it about how Josh might be able to help the Rams and in particular the game of Donnie Avery, given how well Brandon Lloyd did with him in Denver. So what do you guys think, do you think Josh as OC will elevate Donnie Avery's game and help the Rams? Leaving aside his failure as a head coach, he does appear to have abilities improving QB play and WRs. I mean, Kyle Orton can probably credit his sick yardage to Josh and Brandon Lloyd would not be in a probowl if it weren't for these things. So will that translate to the Rams?
http://www.turfshowtimes.com/2011/1/21/1948589/what-can-josh-mcdaniels-do-for-donnie-avery

McDaniels can do something for the whole offense. The problem here in Denver was that he had to rebuild the trenches which is why it started out awfully slow, while still putting up respectable numbers.

Not sure of the St. Louis oline situation, I'm sure they're not the greatest, but I don't think it was as bad as here.

It's pretty simple, McDaniels takes what a player does very well focuses on it and builds on it... that's how you get the best out of someone.

Requiem
01-22-2011, 12:32 PM
I'm sure Avery and the others there will improve when McDaniels starts coaching. Hell, I wouldn't even doubt Julio Jones being their guy in round one.

The MVPlaya
01-22-2011, 12:39 PM
I'm sure Avery and the others there will improve when McDaniels starts coaching. Hell, I wouldn't even doubt Julio Jones being their guy in round one.

A couple mocks have put him there.

However it depends on what happens in FA (if there is one) too

broncocalijohn
01-22-2011, 12:42 PM
McDaniels can do something for the whole offense. The problem here in Denver was that he had to rebuild the trenches which is why it started out awfully slow, while still putting up respectable numbers.

Not sure of the St. Louis oline situation, I'm sure they're not the greatest, but I don't think it was as bad as here.

It's pretty simple, McDaniels takes what a player does very well focuses on it and builds on it... that's how you get the best out of someone.

Let me play devil's advocate here: What then happened to Cutler, BMarsh, Hillis and any others that played worse than when Shanny was here? He did it with Orton and I doubt most would not disagree with that. McD better do a great job as an offensive coordinator with a team that can only improve because his suckiness knocked him to the bottom. This is the start of his move back up the totem pole.

OABB
01-22-2011, 12:45 PM
Cutler didn't play with him. Bmarsh Played better with mcd including and NFL record setting game. Hillis played worse, but that was because he was too stupid to know where to line up.

TonyR
01-22-2011, 12:49 PM
Let me play devil's advocate here: What then happened to Cutler, BMarsh, Hillis and any others that played worse than when Shanny was here?

Unless I'm misunderstanding you here, you have a point with Hillis but Cutler never played for McD and BMarsh had a great year with McD.

Oops, orangeandblue beat me to it...

The MVPlaya
01-22-2011, 12:50 PM
Let me play devil's advocate here: What then happened to Cutler, BMarsh, Hillis and any others that played worse than when Shanny was here? He did it with Orton and I doubt most would not disagree with that. McD better do a great job as an offensive coordinator with a team that can only improve because his suckiness knocked him to the bottom. This is the start of his move back up the totem pole.

Marshall had his career high in TD's here, set the single game record of receptions, and had no fumbles for the season. I would say he put Marshall in a the position to succeed... and that was just Marshall's first year.

Cutler never played here. And the Hillis thing was an off field issue more than anything else.

A valid point though, would be someone like Eddie Royal... here you probably had a point. Eddie saw a significant improvement from year 1-2 with McDaniels though... however nowhere near rookie year.

Eddie is naturally a west coast WR imo, he said himself he had trouble learning how to run routes in McDaniels system and adjusting (this is even in the 2nd year)

Another issue was the oline, Eddie ran the same routes as Wes Welker, and some those routes take time for the WR to get open even though they're short routes.

Also, Orton's chemistry with him was ****ed up. He didn't look his way enough.. but when he did Royal did well (other than 3rd downs). Once Orton completes a pass to a WR he'll likely go to him again and forget about his other receivers.

TheReverend
01-22-2011, 12:55 PM
Yes, the Bears won those games but unfortunately that's now how it works in the court of public opinion. Colt McCoy beat the Patriots this year but we're not going to start the MPV bandwagon for him any time soon. Like I said, win tomorrow and play well and the doubters will have to concede a little more.

I'd like to know what it takes for people to finally concede he's pretty great. Where's the goalline? When he hit the probowl, you guys said he has a losing record. When he netted 2 first round picks, you guys said we really took advantage of the Bears. When he became a winning QB, it was all about the defense. When he won his first playoff game, handily and in post season record setting fashion, it was because it was Seattle and never mind that Seattle already beat the World Champs and Chicago earlier in the season.

So where's the goalline? What does he have to do? He's two games against teams he's already beaten away from literally having done it all outside of an MVP trophy.

Did it all by himself, eh?

Never once said that...

Mark Sanchez beat the Patriots AND the Colts in the playoffs...

Therefore Mark Sanchez > Cutler.

That has what to do with anything?

broncocalijohn
01-22-2011, 12:58 PM
Unless I'm misunderstanding you here, you have a point with Hillis but Cutler never played for McD and BMarsh had a great year with McD.

Oops, orangeandblue beat me to it...

I was mentioning those names as someone that couldnt get along with even before they played. As you know, I didnt blame McD for canning Cutler or BMarsh, just playing another side of MVPlaya's argument. As for Hillis, he failed miserably on that one.

OABB
01-22-2011, 01:01 PM
Cutler will have to stop throwing the balls directly at the hands of defenders 2-3 times a game before ill concede that he's good.

That and fumbling everygame too.

TheReverend
01-22-2011, 01:18 PM
Cutler will have to stop throwing the balls directly at the hands of defenders 2-3 times a game before ill concede that he's good.

That and fumbling everygame too.

Did you know that in considerably less games, "safe game manager" Kyle Orton has more lost fumbles?

OABB
01-22-2011, 01:20 PM
Did you know that in considerably less games, "safe game manager" Kyle Orton has more lost fumbles?

Cutlers oline is really good at diving on the ball. I think they practice it every week.

Gutless Drunk
01-22-2011, 01:21 PM
[QUOTETheReverend;3096907]I'd like to know what it takes for people to finally concede he's pretty great. Where's the goalline?[QUOTE]

19-0 with 50 TD's a 158.3 passer rating 0 Ints and 0 "almost Ints", which is a new stat developed exclusively for him.
If you don't think this is possible you should probably just give up this argument

Gutless Drunk
01-22-2011, 01:23 PM
Did you know that in considerably less games, "safe game manager" Kyle Orton has more lost fumbles?

or that Tom Brady had 5 picks dropped in two games during his record interception free streak (three by the Bears and two by the Packers) and yet his record is still considered legitimate. Blasphemy!

TheReverend
01-22-2011, 01:24 PM
Cutlers oline is really good at diving on the ball. I think they practice it every week.

stopped reading when you claimed his OL might be good at anything.

OABB
01-22-2011, 01:25 PM
stopped reading when you claimed his OL might be good at anything.

Lol. They can recover a loose ball though. I think it's because they are allready on the ground.

TheReverend
01-22-2011, 01:31 PM
Lol. They can recover a loose ball though. I think it's because they are allready on the ground.

Or because they haven't bothered blocking anyone so they can wait for a ball to pop out.

Miss I.
01-22-2011, 01:34 PM
I am beginning to think we should rename all threads to, hey let's talk about Jay Cutler again, even though this same discussion is being held in 37 other threads. I think it's just too long though (funny, never thought I'd say that). ;D

TheReverend
01-22-2011, 02:23 PM
I am beginning to think we should rename all threads to, hey let's talk about Jay Cutler again, even though this same discussion is being held in 37 other threads. I think it's just too long though (funny, never thought I'd say that). ;D

Broncos football is over. No new DC to discuss. Things will be slow heading into FA.

Meanwhile, the Bears are playing tomorrow.

This surprises someone? Imagine if they were playing Washington in the NFCCG?

Miss I.
01-22-2011, 02:26 PM
Broncos football is over. No new DC to discuss. Things will be slow heading into FA.

Meanwhile, the Bears are playing tomorrow.

This surprises someone? Imagine if they were playing Washington in the NFCCG?

It doesn't actually surprise me, but I was actually curious to see if the thread would go back to talking about the Rams - McD thing or just stay JayJacked. :)

The MVPlaya
01-22-2011, 03:03 PM
Did you know that in considerably less games, "safe game manager" Kyle Orton has more lost fumbles?

What? This year?

Orton has 4 lost fumbles Cutler has 6.

Did YOU know that Cutlers turnover ratio from last year and this year are nearly identical, considering he threw 26 ints last season?

baja
01-22-2011, 03:34 PM
Shanahan just flew in. I saw him at the farmers market. we talked over a sope.

baja
01-22-2011, 03:36 PM
Shanny offered to bet me Cutler will cost the bears the game in the fourth quarter but I said no bet.

schaaf
01-22-2011, 04:02 PM
Shanny offered to bet me Cutler will cost the bears the game in the fourth quarter but I said no bet.

did he bet his house?

If so I would have taken that bet if I were you

Tombstone RJ
01-22-2011, 08:39 PM
Broncos football is over. No new DC to discuss. Things will be slow heading into FA.

Meanwhile, the Bears are playing tomorrow.

This surprises someone? Imagine if they were playing Washington in the NFCCG?

Obviously you are imagining that game, kinda like a wet dream for you no?

HAT
01-22-2011, 08:58 PM
Broncos football is over. No new DC to discuss. Things will be slow heading into FA.

Meanwhile, the Bears are playing tomorrow.

This surprises someone? Imagine if they were playing Washington in the NFCCG?

Please....Like Mike Shanahan could get a team to the playoffs at this stage of his career.

TheReverend
01-22-2011, 09:17 PM
Obviously you are imagining that game, kinda like a wet dream for you no?

On the NFC side? Absolutely.

TomServo
01-23-2011, 01:11 AM
as to the original topic of the thread. the NFL is full of nepotism, cronyism, and most of all,lets never try anyone new with orginal ideas. how many joe bugels, dennis greens, norv turners, sherm edwards, etc. get HC jobs before owners finally realize they arent HC material?
in the future how many owners will give Mcd another try at HC? and do not point to mike S as a blueprint. anyone who coaches the raiders was never given a chance to succeed.
mcd failed and his only defenders seem to be on this message board. he has shown over and over hes not HC material and less of a trustworthy human being unless you kiss his bu tt.
even if it takes half his life to correct his character flaws, that means he'll be fine @ the year 2027.

TonyR
01-23-2011, 03:31 PM
So where's the goalline? What does he have to do? He's two games against teams he's already beaten away from literally having done it all outside of an MVP trophy.


Like I said, Rev, let's see how he does against a team that belongs in the playoffs. Didn't go well. Played poorly, moped around, and pulled himself out of the game. Caleb Hanie is out performing him.